Jonathan Schecter is joined again by senior Buddhist teacher, musician, and author David Nichtern for a wide-ranging, deeply reflective conversation.Together they explore how presence and practice intersect with modern expanded states — from breathwork to psychedelics to the possibilities and limitations of AI as a spiritual teacher.

You’ll hear insights on:

✅ Why presence can’t be grasped

✅ The concept of the “fourth moment” in Buddhist practice

✅ How breathwork teaches surrender without substances

✅ The risks of spiritual bypassing in psychedelic spaces

✅ Whether AI can embody consciousness or wisdom

✅ The role of humor, humility, and formal practice

✅ How Buddhist wisdom can evolve to fit modern culture

✅ David's upcoming Mindfulness Meditation Teacher Training

This is an honest and inspiring dialogue on integration, wholeness, and the real work of transformation.

00:00 Intro

05:00 Walking out of time — presence & fourth moment

12:00 Surrender in breathwork vs psychedelics

18:00 The God realm & spiritual bypassing

25:00 Can AI become a spiritual teacher?

34:00 Blind spots, feedback, and the human ego

42:00 Buddha nature & somatic healing

51:00 What do we most need as a collective?

56:00 Basic goodness, genuine sadness, and activism

1:02:00 Dharma Moon teacher training & modern culture

1:10:00 Final reflections — carrying the teachings forward

Dharma Moon Links:

🌐 Dharma Moon Meditation Teacher Training: https://www.dharmamoon.com/mindfulness-meditation-teacher-training

📚 Awakening from the Daydream & Creativity, Spirituality & Making a Buck — available wherever books are sold

Connect with Jonathan & Blue Magic Alchemy:

🌐 https://www.bluemagicalchemy.com

🌐 https://www.skool.com/bluemagicalchemy

💌 Subscribe to the Pathways & Portals newsletter: https://bluemagicalchemy.substack.com/