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A big, defining topic for the Cardinals' future and their development of a big, defining hitter needs a jumbo-sized Best Podcast in Baseball.

For more than a decade, the Cardinals have had to go shopping for their middle-order hitters -- either by trade (Paul Goldcshmidt, Nolan Arenado, Marcell Ozuna) or, rarely, by free agency (Carlos Beltran, Willson Contreras) -- but during this "reset" year where offense has been a major part of their success, the Cardinals seem closer to having homegrown hitters in the middle of the order to build around. Brendan Donovan, currently hitting No. 3, leads the league in doubles and hits. Candidates to climb up to cleanup include Ivan Herrera.

There is the catch.

Herrera's bright future as a hitter seems clear. Less so, is where he fits at catcher.

Kevin Wheeler, host at KMOX/104.1 FM, joins the Best Podcast in Baseball to discuss all of the ramifications of this question: Can the Cardinals develop the middle of the order for a contending team? It's a question thick with implications. With St. Louis Post-Dispatch baseball writer Derrick Goold, Wheeler discusses Herrera's fit as a potential cleanup hitter, what it means that the Cardinals have an advancing group of catching talents in the minors, and whether Herrera needs to be flanked by a fellow prospect for the Cardinals to have a strong lineup. The cost of surefire middle-order hitters is only going up, and increasingly all teams need both lightning and thunder to come from within the house.

This BPIB discusses whether the Cardinals need to have Jordan Walker and/or Nolan Gorman join the middle of the order for their development summer to be a success, and where Alec Buleson, JJ Wetherholt, Lars Nootbaar, and Masyn Winn best fit into the lineup of the future.

The Cardinals, with 10 different players who have at least 15 RBIs, are cranking out the hits this season and they've won 18 of their past 23 because of the depth of their lineup. Is that what the future holds as well -- not one or two hitters that are the fulcrum of the lineup but a depth that goes all the way to the speed at the bottom?

The answer could be the key whether the Cardinals contend in the years they're looking toward as well.

The Best Podcast in Baseball, sponsored by Closets by Design of St. Louis, is a weekly production of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, StlToday.com, and Derrick Goold.