Cas Holman (Playful: How Play Shifts Our Thinking, Inspires Connection, and Sparks Creativity) is a toy creator, play designer, and author. Cas joins the Armchair Expert to discuss creating modular ecosystems of play in her toys, studying in the rainforest as a Banana Slug, and her gender-bending appearance on Maury Povich. Cas and Dax talk about learning how to both fabricate and tell a story in design school, instilling ideals with her adventure playground, and the twelve different play types for adults and children. Cas explains why the subway is such a safe space to cry, how great innovation comes from play, and that continuing to play is also a powerful form of resistance.

Follow Armchair Expert on the Wondery App or wherever you get your podcasts. Watch new content on YouTube or listen to Armchair Expert early and ad-free by joining Wondery+ in the Wondery App, Apple Podcasts, or Spotify. Start your free trial by visiting wondery.com/links/armchair-expert-with-dax-shepard/ now.

See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.