Are we losing the argument that climate change requires action and investment? Can we balance the need for affordable energy with the costs of decarbonizing hard-to-abate sectors like steel, cement and aviation? And how can we counter the spread of misinformation and populist narratives that undermine support for clean energy? 

This week on Cleaning Up, Michael Liebreich welcomes back Lord Adair Turner for a deep dive into the state of the energy transition at the end of 2024. They discuss the remarkable progress in technologies like solar, batteries and electrification, but also the political and economic challenges of driving rapid decarbonisation. Turner shares his optimism that we have the technologies to reach net zero by 2070-2080, but also his concern that the pace of change may not be fast enough to avoid significant warming. They explore issues like the role of nuclear power, the need for grid investment, and the complexities of climate finance and international cooperation. 

This episode grapples with the tension between technological progress and political realities - and how to navigate that divide to accelerate the transition to a sustainable, zero-carbon future as we move into the new year. 

Leadership Circle 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live. 

Links and more

• Adair's book, Just Capital
• The Energy Transitions Commission: https://www.energy-transitions.org
• How China Became a Green Finance Superpower - Ep160: Dr. Ma Jun 
• The Einstein of Energy Efficiency - Ep68: Amory Lovins
• The Solar Revolution - Past, Present and Future - Ep173: Jenny Chase
• ⁠Can Exponential Growth Save a Finite Planet? - Ep187: Azeem Azhar 
• The UK Energy Company Creating the Utility of the Future - Ep175: Greg Jackson 
• The Bridgetown Initiator - Ep145: Prof Avinash Persaud
• How To Win The Climate Argument | Ep172: John Marshall 
• Is It Ever OK to Promote Fossil Fuels?  
• TNO's Hydrogen Insights
  
   

Climate philanthropies are playing an increasingly important role in funding climate action. In 2023, an estimated $9-16 billion was spent by philanthropies on programs to mitigate climate change. But how do they choose how to spend it? And what role should philanthropy play in catalysing innovation? 

Bryony Worthington sits down with Greg de Temmerman, Deputy CEO of the Quadrature Climate Foundation, to explore these critical questions. As a former plasma physicist who worked on the world's largest nuclear fusion project before transitioning into philanthropy, Greg brings a unique perspective to the climate challenge. 

Greg shares his insights on the progress and challenges in fusion research, highlighting the importance of material science breakthroughs and the role of AI in advancing the field. He then discusses his transition from research to the think tank world, where he sought to provide a more science-based approach to climate solutions and address the growing anti-tech sentiment in France. 

The conversation delves into Quadrature's evidence-based, pragmatic approach to philanthropy, and Greg's views on the foundation's support for geoengineering research and carbon removal technologies. He emphasises the need to grapple with the complexities of the energy transition, including the social and political challenges of managing winners and losers, and explains why he thinks the climate fight is like ultra-running. 

Leadership Circle: 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live. 

Links: 

• Quadrature Climate Foundation
• Kelly Wanser on Geoengineering 
• Anand Gopal on Thermal Storage and Carbon Removal 

What was achieved at COP29 in Baku, Azerbaijan? Where will the promised $300 billion come from, and how will it be spent? And what reforms are needed to make the COP process more effective and impactful? 

This week, host Michael Liebreich sits down with James Cameron, an international climate lawyer who has been involved with the COP process since before COPs were COPs. James shares his insights into the challenges and dynamics of these high-stakes global talks, from the crucial role of small island states to the difficulties of bridging the divide between developed and developing nations. James and Michael explore the inner workings of the COP process - its successes, failures and the urgent need for reform. James provides a clear-eyed assessment of where the negotiations have fallen short, and outlines concrete ideas for how to make the COP a more effective forum for driving real-world climate action. 

Leadership Circle: 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live. 

Links:

1. Ya Basta: Stop the UN Climate Charade - https://www.liebreich.com/214-2/ 
2. James' previous appearance on Cleaning Up https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qn7GKiW5E4k 
3. Christiana Figueres on CU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4YSzUJ_nMV0 
4. Catherine McKenna on CU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kEP1SGL-DcA 
5. Amber Rudd on CU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZOokwqLaRc 
6. Laurence Tubiana on CU: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wpVmECce7R8

As we race towards a future powered by AI and data centres, how will the insatiable demand for energy impact the environment? With the richest companies ploughing billions into energy generation, might there be some unexpected upsides for the climate transition? And can exponential technologies address the climate crisis on a finite planet? 

This week on Cleaning Up, host Michael Liebreich sits down with Azeem Azhar, founder of Exponential View, to explore the complex relationship between exponential growth, climate change, and the societal implications of transformative technologies. Michael and Azeem delve into the promises and pitfalls of a future shaped by the rapid advancements in renewable energy, battery storage, and artificial intelligence.

Exponential View: 

Listeners of Cleaning Up can receive one year of complimentary access to Exponential View Premium, visit: https://www.exponentialview.co/cleaningup. Offer valid for 7 days starting November 27, 2024. 

Leadership Circle:

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, Alcazar Energy, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live.

Links:

• Azeem's website
• The Solar Revolution - Past, Present and Future | Ep173: Jenny Chase 
• Battery Recycling Is Here - But Where Are The Batteries? - Ep165: Hans Eric Melin 
• Separating Hype from Hydrogen – Part One: The Supply Side - Audioblog 3
• Separating Hype from Hydrogen – Part Two: The Demand Side - Audioblog 4
• Inside the World's Largest AI Supercluster xAI Colossus
• AI's $600bn problem

How can behavioural science and psychology be leveraged to drive meaningful change around climate action? What unintended consequences might arise from heavy-handed government mandates versus more subtle interventions? And in the face of the climate crisis, is it ethical to actively promote the use of fossil fuels? 

This week on Cleaning Up, Michael welcomes Ogilvy UK Vice-chair Rory Sutherland to explore the role of psychology and behavioural science in tackling the climate challenge. Rather than relying solely on policy, regulations, and technological solutions, Sutherland argues that understanding human decision-making and tapping into our innate psychological drivers could be key to catalyzing widespread behaviour change. 

From the power of "satisficing" and "psycho-physics" to the importance of signaling and subconscious hacking, Sutherland delves into the hidden forces that shape our environmental choices - both for better and for worse. The conversation also grapples with the ethical quandary of whether actively promoting fossil fuels is justifiable, even as a "messy intermediate phase" in the transition to clean energy. This episode challenges viewers to think beyond the conventional approaches to climate action and consider how a deeper understanding of human psychology could unlock more effective, and even counterintuitive, solutions. 

For those interested in data on which advertising groups continue to work with fossil fuel companies, please see: https://cleancreatives.org/f-list. Asked about WPP (Ogilvy’s Parent Company) and Ogilvy’s inclusion on the F-list, WPP commented: "WPP and Ogilvy have not commented publicly on the accuracy or validity of the F-List’s research. However, several of the contracts named on the F-List are wrongly attributed to Ogilvy. They are in fact relationships with an entirely different agency, OGR, formerly known as Ogilvy Government Relations. Other than ownership by WPP, OGR has had no connection to Ogilvy since 2011 and they rebranded last year to avoid historical confusion." 

Leadership Circle: 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live. 

Links: 

• Rory’s book, Alchemy
• Ogilvy UK: https://www.ogilvy.com/uk
• How Lily Cole Models Climate Solutions | Ep161 
• How To Win The Climate Argument | Ep172: John Marshall 

Is China's lead in clean technologies insurmountable? How will the Trump presidency shape relations with China? And when will China's emissions peak? 

Fatih Birol, head of the International Energy Agency, has said that 'almost every energy story is essentially a China story. But it's a complicated story that has been powered by vast supplies of coal. China's economy has grown rapidly, with per capita levels of energy consumption now matching Europe's, making it the world's largest emitter of greenhouse gasses. 

At the same time, China has increased the share of electricity and total energy to around 28% thanks to a rapid uptake of electric vehicles and increasing use of electricity for heating domestically. If it continues on its current trajectory, it is likely to peak its greenhouse gas emissions from energy in the next few years, if it hasn't done so already. China is also playing an increasing role beyond its borders: In 2023, 20% of the global EV export market belong to China, and it dominates the battery, solar and wind industries. 

This week on Cleaning Up, Bryony Worthington sits down with Professor Qi Ye, Director of Public Policy at Hong Kong University of Science and Technology, who's had a ringside seat during China's rapid shift towards a clean energy economy. Together they unpack the complex dynamics shaping the global energy transition in China. Discover the remarkable scale and pace of China's clean energy transformation, the challenges of international collaboration, and Professor Qi's vision for a new era of climate leadership.

Leadership Circle: 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit cleaningup.live.

Links: 

• How China Became a Green Finance Superpower - Ep160: Dr. Ma Jun
• The World's Preeminent Energy Economist - Ep133: Fatih Birol
• How Trump & Musk Will Reshape US Climate Action — Election Special

How will the Trump administration's policies impact the clean energy transition in the United States? What will be Elon Musk's role in shaping climate policy? And what are the geopolitical implications of the US withdrawing from the Paris Agreement? 

In this special episode of Cleaning Up, hosts Michael Liebreich and Bryony Worthington reflect on the implications of the recent US election results and the potential impact on energy and climate policy. They explore the likely policy changes under a Trump administration, including potential cuts to clean technologies like offshore wind and electric vehicles, as well as the potential for increased fossil fuel production and the relaxation of environmental regulations. 

Bryony shares her insights from her recent trip to China, where the expectation was that Trump would win and the general sentiment was that China could do business with him. Michael examines the perceived lack of a coherent strategy in Europe to compete with the US and China in the clean energy and technology sectors.

Leadership Circle

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live. 

Links and more

• How To Win The Climate Argument | Ep172: John Marshall 
• Could Trump 2.0 Roll Back The IRA? Ep181: Ethan Zindler

Could we save billions by simply reducing energy waste? How can we power the vast, energy-hungry growth of AI without sacrificing climate goals? And is Europe doomed to high energy costs and deindustrialisation? 

This week on Cleaning Up, Michael Liebreich sits down with Jonathan Maxwell, CEO and founder of Sustainable Development Capital LLP (SDCL), for the third time on Cleaning Up. Jonathan shares his perspective on the urgent need to address energy efficiency and waste, drawing from the themes explored in his book "The Edge." Jonathan and Michael delve into SDCL's innovative approach to providing on-site energy solutions that deliver cheaper, cleaner, and more reliable power to businesses, industries, and public institutions. 

Jonathan explains how their focus on distributed generation and decentralised energy systems is transforming the way organisations think about and manage their energy needs. Finally, policy. Jonathan and Michael discuss the impact of the Inflation Reduction Act in the US (and the potential turmoil from recent election results), the European Union's Green Deal, how these initiatives can be further strengthened by a greater emphasis on energy efficiency and productivity, and what the West needs to catch China. 

Leadership Circle 

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation, SDCL and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit cleaningup.live 

Links

• Cheaper, Cleaner, More Reliable - Ep14: Jonathan Maxwell 
• Checkpoint 2023: Energy Efficiency Investment - Ep113 Jonathan Maxwell 
• How China Became a Green Finance Superpower - Ep160: Dr. Ma Jun
• Metals Refining - From Mining to Brining: Ep 142 - Alex Grant
  
   

How difficult is it to power a boat just with electricity? Is an electric outboard as reliable as a fossil-fuel one when taken out to sea? And just how much better is an electric engine for reducing pollution and noise? 

Around the world there are tens of millions of small boats, from high-performance luxury craft to workhorse fishing vessels, nearly all of which run on fossil-fuel powered engines. But with the rapid advancements in electric vehicles, a small group of companies are now turning their minds to cracking the boating problem, inventing electric engines that are quieter, less polluting, and can deliver just the same performance. 

In Europe, perhaps the best known is the German company Torqeedo. Founded in 2004, they've sold a quarter of a million electric motors to date, and this year, were acquired by Yamaha Motors. Norwegian company Evoy have recently joined forces with Vita, a UK-Monaco based company, and Candela, another Scandinavian boat builder, are revolutionising engines and boats with their hydrofoiling concept. 

This week on Cleaning Up, Baroness Bryony Worthington speaks with Ben Sorkin, CEO and co-founder of Flux Marine, headquartered in Newport, Rhode Island. Flux Marine are hoping to take on the US market with their customizable electric propulsion systems and have a 40,000 square foot factory in Rhode Island. Bryony asks Ben how his electric engines compete on cost and performance, what Flux Marine’s scale-up plans are, and why it’s so much harder to electrify a boat than a car. 

Leadership Circle

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit https://www.cleaningup.live 

Links

• Flux Marine: https://www.fluxmarine.com 
• Is Shipping the Easiest "Hard-to-Abate" Sector? — https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=umPAonV20cM 
• Arc Boats: https://arcboats.com 
• Candela Hydrofoiling Boats: https://candela.com

Is the shift to electric vehicles really slowing down? Are people losing interest in EVs, or is there more to the story? How will changes in the global automotive industry impact the net-zero transition? And If no one wants EVs, why do we need tariffs?

This week on Cleaning Up, host Michael Liebreich sits down with Colin McKerracher, Head of Clean Transport at BloombergNEF, to unpack the latest trends and dynamics in the electric vehicle market from cars to trucks to two wheelers. They dive deep into the regional differences, the strategies of European automakers, the impact of tariffs, as well as the latest forecasts and predictions in BloombergNEF's Electric Vehicle Outlook.

Leadership Circle:

Cleaning Up is supported by the Leadership Circle, and its founding members: Actis, EcoPragma Capital, EDP of Portugal, Eurelectric, the Gilardini Foundation, KKR, National Grid, Octopus Energy, Quadrature Climate Foundation and Wärtsilä. For more information on the Leadership Circle, please visit cleaningup.live

Links:

• BloombergNEF's Electric Vehicle Outlook: https://about.bnef.com/electric-vehicle-outlook/
• The Debunker-in-Chief - Ep15: Auke Hoekstra
• The Solar Revolution - Past, Present and Future - Ep 173: Jenny Chase
• Slowdown, what Slowdown? The EV Revolution is Just Getting Started - Ep178: Dr Andy Palmer
• Could Trump 2.0 Roll Back The IRA? Ep181: Ethan Zindler