What if the real reason your team isn't thriving isn't them—it's you? In this episode, Ashok sits down with Sel Watts, founder of Wattsnext and a trusted advisor to growth-stage executives, to talk about the blind spots that derail team performance. Sel shares why leaders often overengineer HR systems while neglecting the basic needs of their people—and why getting back to the fundamentals starts with brutal self-honesty.

They explore why traditional job descriptions are outdated, how to rethink role clarity using "outcome profiles," and why consistency beats charisma when it comes to leadership. Sel also shares candid stories from the field—including one about a CEO who had zero emotional intelligence but ran a surprisingly stable company—and explains how tools like behavioral profiling can be powerful when used correctly (and not just shelved after a team offsite).

Inside the episode

Why leadership starts with self-awareness, not structure

The “outcome profile” approach to defining roles clearly

How to tell if someone’s actually underperforming—or just misaligned

What happens when leaders care more about process than people

The surprising upsides of being consistent, even if you're not "warm"

Why behavioral profiling tools are often wasted

One-on-ones, All Hands, and rituals that only work when leaders believe in them

Rethinking hiring decisions by starting with the org chart, not the title

The cost of skipping reflection before replacing a team member

A real-world example of a team where mutual accountability actually works

Mentioned in this episode

Wattsnextpx - https://www.wattsnextpx.com

Extended DISC - https://www.extendeddisc.org/

AcuMax - https://www.acumaxindex.com/

Myers-Briggs - https://www.themyersbriggs.com/en-US/Products-and-Services/Myers-Briggs

Predictive Index - https://www.predictiveindex.com/

Entrepreneurs' Organisation (EO) - https://eonetwork.org/

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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What if the key to building better teams and products is hidden in our brain chemistry? In this episode, Brad Nelson joins us to break down the neuroscience behind motivation, happiness, and productivity—especially for Agile teams. From dopamine and serotonin to stress hormones like cortisol, we explore how brain science can inform leadership, team culture, and workplace habits. Plus, we connect these insights to practical Agile practices like pair programming, retrospectives, and sustainable velocity.

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

• The four key brain chemicals that drive motivation and happiness

• Why a lack of control is the most stressful thing at work

• The neuroscience behind agile practices 

• How to use gratitude, movement, and breaks to boost productivity

• The connection between stress, cortisol, and sustainable team performance

• Practical ways leaders can create high-performing, engaged teams

• The surprising link between happiness, mastery, and continuous learning

• Dan Pink’s work on autonomy, mastery, and purpose - https://www.ted.com/talks/dan_pink_the_puzzle_of_motivation?podconvergence

• DC and Ryan - https://www.apa.org/members/content/intrinsic-motivation?podconvergence

• Shawn Achor - https://www.shawnachor.com/?podconvergence

• Positive Psychology  - https://www.psychologytoday.com/us/basics/positive-psychology?podconvergence

• Upward Spiral by Dr Alex Korb - https://www.amazon.com/Upward-Spiral-Neuroscience-Reverse-Depression/dp/1626251207?podconvergence

• Hawthorne studies - https://www.library.hbs.edu/hc/hawthorne/01.html?podconvergence

• Maslow’s hierarchy of needs - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Maslow%27s_hierarchy_of_needs?podconvergence

• Meik Wiking and the Happiness Research Institute - https://www.happinessresearchinstitute.com/experts/meik-wiking?podconvergence

• HarvardX: Managing Happiness: https://www.edx.org/learn/happiness/harvard-university-managing-happiness?podconvergence

• Book: The High 5 Habit by Mel Robbins: https://www.amazon.com/High-Habit-Take-Control-Simple/dp/1401962122?podconvergence

• TED talk on The brain-changing benefits of exercise by Wendy Suzuki: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BHY0FxzoKZE?podconvergence

• Book: The infinite game by Simon Sinek: https://www.amazon.com/Infinite-Game-Simon-Sinek/dp/073521350X?podconvergence

• Peter Senge’s “Learning Organization” - https://infed.org/mobi/peter-senge-and-the-learning-organization/?podconvergence

• Brad’s favorite product: Nvidia Shield for streaming content: https://www.nvidia.com/en-us/shield/shield-tv-pro/?podconvergence

• Brad’s podcast Agile for Agilists: https://www.agileforagilists.com/?podconvergence

• Brad’s LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/bradgile/?podconvergence

• Places to get started on finding a therapist: 

• Psychology Today - https://www.psychologytoday.com/?podconvergence

• Better Help - https://www.betterhelp.com/?podconvergence

• Talk Space - https://www.talkspace.com/?podconvergence

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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Some of the most successful technology companies—like AWS, Stripe, Twilio, and GitHub—have built platforms that developers don’t just use but genuinely love. So, what sets these platforms apart from those that developers avoid? In this episode, we break down three key trends that make a platform indispensable: deep customer empathy, an iterative approach to product management, and a culture of empowerment. 

Through real-world case studies, including stories from Integral’s work with automotive and commercial vehicle clients, as well as insights from industry leaders like Stripe, GitHub, and Netflix, we explore what it takes to create platforms that drive innovation and efficiency.

From GitHub’s early days embedding in developer communities to Stripe’s hands-on support of its first users, and Netflix’s culture of autonomy and accountability, we uncover the strategies behind their success. 

Whether you're building an internal platform for your company or a developer-focused product for the market, these lessons can help you increase adoption, reduce friction, and build something that developers truly love.

• Why platforms like Stripe, GitHub, and AWS succeed while others struggle

• The three trends that define highly adopted developer platforms

• A case study from Integral: building a flexible payments platform for an automotive company

• How GitHub revolutionized version control by embedding in developer communities

• Stripe’s hands-on early approach to supporting developers—and why it worked

• The role of iterative product management in successful platform adoption

• Netflix’s "Freedom and Responsibility" principle and how it drives internal innovation

• Practical tips for increasing platform adoption in your own organization

• Netflix Culture Deck: https://jobs.netflix.com/culture

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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Building effective platforms and structuring teams for success is no small feat, especially in large enterprises. Henri van den Bulk joins the show to break down the intersection of platform architecture and team topologies, sharing insights on how organizations can create systems that enable innovation without introducing unnecessary friction. He and Ashok discuss strategies for balancing standardization with flexibility, managing dependencies, and ensuring platform teams are solving the right problems.

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

• What defines a platform, and how "systems as a platform" creates value

• The concept of the value line and how it guides platform decisions

• Avoiding the pitfalls of platforms making applications obsolete

• The role of product management in platform teams

• Strategies for managing dependencies between platform and product teams

• Standardization vs. innovation—how to strike the right balance

• How team topologies and organizational design impact platform success

• Practical approaches to handling technical debt in large enterprises

• Lessons from real-world platform transformations

• Team Topologies

• Dunbar’s Number

• Wardley Mapping

• Conway’s Law

• Zenni Optical

• Henri’s LinkedIn

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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Most people are barely scratching the surface of what generative AI can do. While some fear it will replace their jobs, others dismiss it as a passing trend—but both extremes miss the point.

In this episode, Ashok Sivanand breaks down the real opportunity AI presents: not as a replacement for human judgment, but as a powerful tool that can act as both a dutiful intern and an expert consultant.

Learn how to integrate AI into your daily work, from automating tedious tasks to sharpening your strategic thinking, all while staying in control.

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

• Why so few people are using generative AI daily—and why that needs to change
• The two key roles AI can play: the intern and the consultant
• How AI can help professionals streamline research, analysis, and decision-making
• Practical prompts and frameworks for getting the most out of AI tools
• The dangers of "AI autopilot" and why staying in the driver's seat is critical
• Security and privacy concerns: What every AI user should know
• The best AI tools for different use cases—beyond just ChatGPT
• How companies can encourage AI adoption without creating unnecessary friction

• AI Tools: ChatGPT, Claude, Perplexity, Gemini, Copilot, Grok
• Amazon’s six-page memo template for effective decision-making: https://medium.com/@info_14390/the-ultimate-guide-to-amazons-6-pager-memo-method-c4b683441593
• Ready Signal for external market factor analysis: https://www.readysignal.com/
• AI prompting frameworks from Geoff Woods of AI Leadership: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HToY8gDTk6E
• Andrej Karpathy's Deep Dive into LLMs: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7xTGNNLPyMI 
• Books by Carmine Gallo: The Presentation Secrets of Steve Jobs & Talk Like TED: https://www.amazon.com/Presentation-Secrets-Steve-Jobs-Insanely/dp/1491514310

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts—including video episodes on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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Artificial intelligence is radically transforming software development. AI-assisted coding tools are generating billions in investment, promising faster development cycles, and shifting engineering roles from code authors to code editors. But how does this impact software quality, security, and team dynamics? How can product teams embrace AI without falling into the hype?

In this episode, AI assisted Agile expert Mike Gehard shares his hands-on experiments with AI in software development. From his deep background at Pivotal Labs to his current work pushing the boundaries of AI-assisted coding, Mike reveals how AI tools can amplify quality practices, speed up prototyping, and even challenge the way we think about source code. He discusses the future of pair programming, the evolving role of test-driven development, and how engineers can better focus on delivering user value.

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Inside the episode...

• Mike’s background at Pivotal Labs and why he kept returning

• How AI is changing the way we think about source code as a liability

• Why test-driven development still matters in an AI-assisted world

• The future of pair programming with AI copilots

• The importance of designing better software in an AI-driven development process

• Using AI to prototype faster and build user-facing value sooner

• Lessons learned from real-world experiments with AI-driven development

• The risks of AI-assisted software, from hallucinations to security

Mentioned in this episode

• Mike’s Substack: https://aiassistedagiledevelopment.substack.com/

• Mike’s Github repo: https://github.com/mikegehard/ai-assisted-agile-development

• Pivotal Labs: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pivotal_Labs

• 12-Factor Apps: https://12factor.net/ 

• GitHub Copilot: https://github.com/features/copilot

• Cloud Foundry: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cloud_Foundry

• Lean Startup by Eric Ries: https://www.amazon.com/Lean-Startup-Entrepreneurs-Continuous-Innovation/dp/0307887898

• Refactoring by Martin Fowler and Kent Beck https://www.amazon.com/Refactoring-Improving-Existing-Addison-Wesley-Signature/dp/0134757599

• Dependabot: https://github.com/dependabot

• Tessl CEO Guy Podjarny’s talk: https://youtu.be/e1a3WuxTY-k 

• Aider AI Pair programming terminal: https://aider.chat/

• Gemini LLM: https://gemini.google.com/app

• Perplexity AI: https://www.perplexity.ai/

• DeepSeek: https://www.deepseek.com/

• Ian Cooper’s talk on TDD: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IN9lftH0cJc

• Mike’s newest Mountain Bike IBIS Ripmo V2S: https://www.ibiscycles.com/bikes/past-models/ripmo-v2s

• Mike’s recommended house slippers: https://us.giesswein.com/collections/mens-wool-slippers/products/wool-slippers-dannheim

• Sorba Chattanooga Mountain Biking Trails: https://www.sorbachattanooga.org/localtrails

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Learn something? Give us a 5-star review and like the podcast on YouTube. It's how we grow.

As we put the final touches on our Season 2 premiere with Mike Gabbard, we’re bringing you a replay of our conversation with Farhan Thawar, VP of Engineering at Shopify. Shopify has been a power user of AI coding assistants, gaining early access to GitHub Copilot before its general release. This episode is packed with insights on Shopify’s culture, leadership, and how they leverage AI to ship better software faster. If you missed it the first time, now’s the perfect chance to catch up—especially as it sets the stage for next week’s discussion with Mike Gehard on AI-assisted product development. Enjoy, and we’ll see you next week for the Season 2 premiere!

--

In this episode of the Convergence Podcast, host Ashok Sivanand welcomes Farhan Thawar, the Vice President of Engineering at Shopify. Farhan's journey to Shopify came through the acquisition of Helpful, a company he co-founded. With a rich background in leadership roles at Microsoft, Trilogy, and as Vice President of Engineering at both Extreme Labs and Pivotal Labs—where Ashok had the pleasure of collaborating with him—Farhan brings a wealth of experience in building high-performing, engaging technical teams. This episode explores how Shopify, under Farhan’s leadership, operates like a colossal experiment, constantly pushing the boundaries of experimentation and research and development across the company, not just within the product and engineering teams.

Listeners will gain insights into Shopify's innovative use of generative AI to enhance customer and team experiences, the integration of tools like Copilot for pair programming, and the effective cultivation of a culture that fosters simplicity in code and robustness in product delivery. Farhan's approach to leadership has not only scaled to accommodate hundreds, if not thousands, of team members but has also maintained a strong focus on recruitment, attracting what he terms "F— yes candidates." The conversation also covers how Shopify's leadership remains deeply connected to their work and maintains technical sharpness, driving a culture where both the product and the people behind it thrive.

Inside the episode...

1. The learning mindset at Shopify. 

2. Code isn’t the artifact. The learning is the artifact. 

3. Complexifiers versus simplifiers 

4. Increasing leverage as an engineering leader

5. Leaders should be involved in recruiting.

6. How to get the best leverage on your time, and how to bring the support teams like HR and finance along to work like with an R&D and product mindset

7. Pragmatic framework around process

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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Discover the strategies and stories behind the most innovative product teams of 2024, where intentional leadership and a vibrant culture are the foundations of success. This special episode features insights from renowned tech leaders and product visionaries, including Ben Foster, co-founder of Prodigy Group and former Chief Product Officer at a leading fitness wearable company, who emphasizes the power of communicating an inspiring product vision to unify and energize teams.

Farhan Thawar, Head of Engineering at Shopify, shares how writing and critical thinking drive alignment and scale in one of the most cerebral and innovative organizations. Janice Fraser, a veteran of TaskRabbit and Netscape, introduces actionable leadership frameworks like the "two-meeting model" to foster durable decision-making and team commitment. Jose Moreno, former Netflix engineer, sheds light on the company’s "context over control" philosophy and how it empowers teams to deliver billions in value. Deepika Yerragunta, Head of Platform Products at PepsiCo, shares her unique approach to hiring product managers, emphasizing the importance of curiosity, active listening, and ruthless prioritization, while revealing how her fresh perspective as an outsider has driven transformative innovation in traditional industries.

Whether it’s structuring communication, hiring and training exceptional product managers, or building an empowering culture rooted in collaboration and diversity, this episode offers powerful lessons to help entrepreneurs and product leaders level up their organizations. Don’t miss the chance to learn from the best and apply these transformative strategies to your own product teams.

In this episode...

• How to communicate inspiring product visions that energize teams
• The role of writing in driving alignment and innovation
• Leadership frameworks for making durable decisions
• Expert tips on hiring and training top-performing product managers

Mentioned in this episode...

Shopify’s engineering playbook: https://shopify.engineering/running-engineering-program-guide

Netflix Culture Deck: https://jobs.netflix.com/culture

Barbara Minto's SCQA Framework: https://modelthinkers.com/mental-model/minto-pyramid-scqa

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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From Intel's engineering labs to Silicon Valley's unicorns, OKRs (Objectives and Key Results) have transformed how tech companies translate vision into measurable outcomes. But what separates successful OKR implementations from failed experiments? And how can technology leaders avoid the common pitfalls that derail even well-intentioned rollouts?

In this episode, we dive deep with leaders who've shaped OKR practices at some of tech's most influential companies. Our guests Josh Seiden, Holly Bielawa, and Deepika Yerragunta share battle-tested insights from their experiences at Intel, Amazon, Google, and beyond. The episode compiles the best segments around getting started on your OKR journey, de-risking and iterating your rollout, and our guests’ tips on self-checking the health of your OKR implementation. 

Whether you're launching your first OKR initiative or iterating on an existing framework, you'll learn practical strategies for cascading objectives across teams while maintaining strategic alignment. Our conversation includes war stories from the field, as well as intuitive insights on what actually works: fostering genuine collaboration, maintaining human centricity, and achieving the elusive balance between ambition and accountability. 

Watch full episodes with Josh, Holly and Deepika here: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL31JETR9AR0FGx2A9HQbq2e1Xywkqb6BQ

Inside the episode...

• Why OKRs are a powerful alternative to traditional goal-setting frameworks.

• How OKRs promote collaboration and alignment across all levels of an organization.

• Best practices for implementing OKRs: starting small, iterating, and setting clear priorities.

• Tips for integrating OKRs into your product teams using human-centered design principles.

• Differentiating between business OKRs and product OKRs to avoid organizational misalignment.

• How to set and measure strategic objectives with actionable, customer-centric key results.

• Lessons learned from failed and successful OKR implementations, including war stories from the field.

• The role of product operations in making data accessible for measuring OKR progress.

• Why tying OKRs to compensation or promotions can derail the intent of the framework.

Mentioned in this episode

• Measure What Matters by John Doerr

• Outcomes Over Outputs by Josh Seiden

• Escaping the Build Trap by Melissa Perri

• Continuous Discovery Habits by Teresa Torres

• Who Does What by When by by Jeff Gothelf, Josh Seiden

• User Story Mapping by Jeff Patton

Convergence Episodes featured 

• Building Customer-Centric Teams: Josh Seiden on OKRs and Agile

• Agile and Beyond Conference 2024: The Latest in A.I. Innovations and Product Development Strategies (features the interview with Holly Bielawa)

• Driving Cultural Change: PepsiCo's Deepika Yerragunta on Customer Obsession and Product Mindset

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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We compiled our favorite clips on developer tools and developer experience (DevX). We discuss why DevX has become essential for developer-focused companies and how it drives adoption to grow your product. Learn what makes developers a unique and discerning customer base, and hear practical strategies for designing exceptional tools and platforms.

Our guests also share lessons learned from their own experiences—whether in creating frictionless integrations, maintaining a strong feedback culture, or enabling internal platform adoption. Through compelling stories and actionable advice, this episode is packed with lessons on how to build products that developers love.

Playlist of Full Episodes from This Compilation: https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PL31JETR9AR0FV-46VR4G_n6xi4WdXEx-2

Inside the episode...

• The importance of developer experience and why it’s a priority for developer-facing companies.

• Key differences between building developer tools and end-user applications.

• How DevX differs from DevRel and the synergy between the two.

• Metrics for measuring the success of developer tools: adoption, satisfaction, and revenue.

• Insights into abstraction ladders and balancing complexity and power.

• Customer research strategies for validating assumptions and prioritizing features.

• Stripe’s culture of craftsmanship and creating “surprisingly great” experiences.

• The importance of dogfooding and feedback loops in building trusted platforms.

• Balancing enablement and avoiding gatekeeping in internal platform adoption.

• Maintaining consistency and quality across APIs, CLIs, and other resources.

Mentioned in this episode

• Stripe

• Doppler

• Heroku

• Abstraction ladders

• Developer feedback loops

Unlock the full potential of your product team with Integral's player coaches, experts in lean, human-centered design. Visit integral.io/convergence for a free Product Success Lab workshop to gain clarity and confidence in tackling any product design or engineering challenge.

Subscribe to the Convergence podcast wherever you get podcasts including video episodes to get updated on the other crucial conversations that we'll post on YouTube at youtube.com/@convergencefmpodcast

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