Alex Delgado, a security engineer at the Gremlin chaos testing service, points to the disconnect many enterprises have. It’s not that the developers aren’t building with the newest technologies like Kubernetes and microservices. It’s just that security and compliance haven’t even heard of these things. And it's increasing risk.

“You can’t secure something that you don’t know how it works,” he said, on this episode of The New Stack Makers, where Delgado reflects on his past at a security and defense enterprise and his present at scale-up Gremlin. He began his career in customer support and then remediation of customer concerns. That put him in an interesting but often frustrating position as he moved into security, which had him throwing code over the wall that was released maybe three months down the line.