Renowned Israeli historian Benny Morris joins The Winston Marshall Show for a piercing and provocative conversation on the origins of the historic conflict between Israel and Iran — and why the West still doesn’t understand it.

Morris dismantles the popular narrative that Zionism was a colonial project, explaining how Jewish statehood was born out of historical necessity, persecution, and repeated rejection by Arab leaders. He charts the trajectory from 1948 to October 7th, tracing a consistent refusal to accept Israel’s existence.

They explore the role of religion in the conflict, the enduring power of jihadist ideology, and the failure of peace processes built on Western illusions.

All this — Middle East myths, Hamas, U.S. naivety, and why history keeps repeating itself in the Holy Land…

See the extended conversation here: https://www.winstonmarshall.co.uk/

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Chapters

0:00 Introduction

2:05 Iranian Regime's Messianic Outlook and Historical Context

10:33 Islamic Conquests and Jewish Communities

15:59 Shia Islam and Relationship with Jews

20:05 Iranian Revolution and Relations with Israel

30:08 Development of Iranian Proxies

39:14 JCPOA Deal and Its Implications

50:57 Trump's Withdrawal from the JCPOA

55:26 Impact of the 2023 Conflict on Iranian Proxies

1:13:26 Future of Hamas and Palestinian Resistance

1:24:00 Netanyahu's Image and Israel's Conflict with Iran

1:26:33 The Hostage Situation and Hamas' Ideology

1:29:31 Hamas' Demands and Netanyahu's Response

1:30:56 Hezbollah's Weakened Position and Israeli Operations

1:33:30 Potential Outcomes of the War with Iran

1:36:20 Regime Change and Future Relations with the Islamic World

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