Equipped for Life Podcast

Josh and Rachel discuss the common pro-choice phrase, "consent to sex is not consent to pregnancy" in greater detail than we covered in our recent video on the "Abortion as Self-Defense" argument. There is a version of this argument that is so strong, Rachel says she would use it if she were pro-choice!

There are both strong pro-life responses to that argument, and there are also some really cringey ones, and we want to help you avoid the bad ones so you can change more minds!

To see a shorter and more shareable video refuting this argument, click here: https://youtu.be/ynPtsK9r0ks

Watch the full "Abortion as Self-Defense" video here: https://youtu.be/B2TakKSUawA

More resources on responding to bodily rights arguments: https://EqualRightsInstitute.com/BodilyRights

"Consensual Pregnancy: The Moral Permissibility of Abortion" by Maya-Frost Belansky (PDF)

Secular Pro-Life: "No, I Am Not Interested In "Punishing" Women for Having Sex" Texas Trial Lawyers Association: "McDonalds' Hot Coffee Case - Read the Facts NOT the Fiction"

Sophie Lewis Interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jMGptJXz618

Blood Donation and Bodily Rights Arguments: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmBrUcpOxDw

Josh and Rachel share several observations they've recently made about what is REALLY going on when pro-choice advocates bring up the topic of rape, they may completely change the way you think about those discussions! They also include why Josh makes sure that he covers that topic in speeches in front of mixed audiences, as well as some thoughts for church youth leaders on the topic. You don't want to miss this one.

Related Links:

Source for the "Rape accounts for roughly 1% of abortions" stat: Alan Guttmacher Institute: "Reasons U.S. Women Have Abortions: Quantitative and Qualitative Perspectives" See tables 2 and 3

The Best Way to Expose Logical Fallacies: Don't Call Them by Name Get the Common Ground Without Compromise Book

Responding to the Question of Rape with Wisdom and Compassion Ben Shapiro's Response to Abortion in the Case of Rape

Video: Why I Hate Responding to the Question of Rape

Relating to Relativists Effectively Responding to Moral Relativism

Will Smith's Indefensible Moral Relativism

***Reposting this podcast with fixed audio. We had a glitch when we rendered this one in Premiere Pro where it sounded fine in the program, but the rendered file had a terrible audio echo. Josh missed it because he was in a hurry and didn't check the rendered file before uploading, and then went on sabbatical. Sorry about that! Now we know to not skip that quality control check. Because of the nature of the problem we couldn't make this a perfect mix, so it's a little worse audio than usual, but the echo is gone so it's way easier to listen to now. Thanks for your patience!***

Josh Brahm and Rachel Crawford dive deeper into the pro-choice argument regarding back-alley abortions than we ever have before on ERI. Topics include understanding why this argument is particularly persuasive to pro-choice people, the most persuasive responses, several bad pro-life responses, and how some pro-abortion-choice advocates lied about this before Roe vs. Wade.

A good question to ask: "Do you think like I do, that abortion is an unjust act of violence against an innocent person? If you don't, that's okay and we should talk about that. But I do, and so it affects the way I think about these questions. Can you think of one other example where we should keep an unjust act of violence legal to make it safer for a perpetrator to do it anyway?"

Mary Anne Warren: "The fact that restricting access to abortion has tragic side effects does not, in itself, show that restrictions are unjustified, since murder is wrong regardless of the consequences of prohibiting it." Source: "On the Moral and Legal Status of Abortion," in The Problem of Abortion, Joel Feinberg, et al, Wadsworth, 1984, p.103

Mary Calderone: "Abortion is no longer a dangerous procedure. This applies not just to therapeutic abortions as performed in hospitals but also to so-called illegal abortions as done by physicians . . . Second, and even more important, the conference estimated that 90 per cent of all illegal abortions are presently being done by physicians, trained as such; and many of them are in good standing in their communities. They must do a pretty good job if the death rate is as low as it is." Source: "Illegal Abortion as a Public Health Problem," American Journal of Health 50 (July I960): 949

Afred Kinsey source: Cincinnati, Ohio: Hayes Publishing Co, 1988), 169.

Dr. Bernard Nathanson: "It was always '5,000 to 10,000 deaths a year,' I confess that I knew the figures were totally false, and I suppose the others did too if they stopped to think of it. But in the 'morality' of our revolution, it was a useful figure, widely accepted, so why go out of our way to correct it with honest statistics? The overriding concern was to get the laws [against abortion] eliminated, and anything within reason that had to be done was permissible." Source: Aborting America, New York, Doubleday, 1979, 193

Dr. Christopher Tietze, chief statistician for, among others, Planned Parenthood and the CDC at the time: "Some 30 years ago it was judged that [illegal abortion] deaths might number 5,000 to 10,000 per year, but this rate, even if it was approximately correct at the time, cannot be anywhere near the true rate now. The total number of deaths from ALL causes among women of reproductive age in the U.S. is not more than about 50,000 per year. The National Center for Health Statistics listed 235 deaths from abortion in 1965. Total mortality from illegal abortions was undoubtedly larger than that figure, but in all likelihood it was under 1,000." Source: Scientific America, volume 220 in 1969

Related Links:

We referenced a graphic image of Gerri Santoro's body, who died because of an illegal abortion in 1964. Then picture is circulated in textbooks today, and it was also published in Ms. Magazine in 1973. Here's a link to the Wikipedia article about her, that includes the famous picture. Graphic picture warning, both for blood and for nudity: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerri_Santoro

Abortion Images: A Case for Disagreement without Division Podcast: Should Women be Punished if Abortion Becomes Illegal? Podcast: Response to Pro-Choice Propaganda Bodily Rights Arguments Necessitate Extremism

Is Abortion 14 Times Safer Than Childbirth? Video Version: https://youtu.be/LI7Zdggb8kY Fetus Tunnel Vision: 4 Reasons Pro-Lifers Need to Stop Doing This

Back Alley Abortion Arguments in 5 Minutes

Josh, Rachel, and Elijah Thompson from Dank Pro-Life Memes discuss the various ways pro-life advocates tend to define the word "abortion," and how this can be confusing to pro-choice people. They also talk about tips for responding to life of the mother cases, and explain how some pro-choice advocates mean something completely different than we think when they ask about that.

Related Links:

"Abortion is Healthcare": A Misogynistic Non-Argument

This audio comes from a training video available on the Equal Rights Institute YouTube channel.

Sources: Sophie Lewis Interview: https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=1&v=jMGptJXz618&feature=emb_logo

Maternal mortality rates in the United States in 2016 according to the CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/maternal-mortality/pregnancy-mortality-surveillance-system.htm#ratio

Appendectomy Statistics: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/27535664?fbclid=IwAR0_4Mj8SomiMwLXi-j9c-fUGguNtwLaxfhf3BGgfiEmWdTp_1dMh9d7REY

Ghana maternal mortality rate: https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/GHA/ghana/maternal-mortality-rate#:~:text=Ghana%20maternal%20mortality%20rate%20for,a%201.54%25%20decline%20from%202014.

New York Times article "Pregnancy Kills. Abortion Saves Lives.": https://www.nytimes.com/2019/05/21/opinion/alabama-law-abortion.html Maternal morbidity data from the CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/reproductivehealth/maternalinfanthealth/severematernalmorbidity.html

Live births for 2014 according to CDC: https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/data/nvsr/nvsr64/nvsr64_06.pdf

The Comparative Safety of Legal Induced Abortion and Childbirth in the United States (Raymond and Grimes study): https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22270271

Is Abortion 14 Times Safer Than Childbirth?: https://blog.equalrightsinstitute.com/is-abortion-14-times-safer-than-childbirth/

Reasons U.S. Women Have Abortions: Quantitative and Qualitative Perspectives: https://www.guttmacher.org/journals/psrh/2005/reasons-us-women-have-abortions-quantitative-and-qualitative-perspectives

Josh and Rachel interview Elijah Thompson from Dank Pro-Life Memes to compare and contrast his messaging with ERI's. Topics include the potential value of snark, whether it's possible to make memes that aren't strawmen, whether Dank Pro-Life Memes feeds people's vice, and Elijah even responds to a question from a pro-choice follower who is critical of Dank Pro-Life Meme's work.

00:00: Introducing Elijah Thomson.

2:52: The history and goals of Dank Pro-Life Memes.

7:06: How mocking and snark affects DPLM's goals

18:38: Can a meme be made that isn't a strawman argument?

25:49: The time and place for snark.

33:01: Elijah responds to a critic of Dank Pro-Life Memes.

43:19: Are you feeding people's vice by mocking stupid arguments?

59:07: Renee asks "Why don't you call out bad pro-lifers more?"

1:06:01: On that burning IVF lab...

We reference bodily rights arguments and "the Violinist" in this episode, but we didn't explain what we meant by that. Learn more about this category of pro-choice arguments here: https://EqualRightsInstitute.com/BodilyRights

Related Links:

Dank Pro-Life Meme's Facebook Page

The Fetal Position Podcast

John Oliver's Lies about Abby Johnson and Crisis Pregnancy Centers

"Abortion is Healthcare": A Misogynistic Non-Argument

Video: "How do you respond to infighting over strategy and other things within the pro-life movement?"

Four Practical Tips for Responding to the Burning Fertility Clinic

Fetal Position Episode 42: The Burning IVF Lab Analogy

ERI Website

ERI Blog

Equipped for Life Course

Sidewalk Counseling Masterclass

This is the audio from a 3-part video series we recently released on scientism.

Read the article versions:

• Part 1: Scientism: the Self-Refuting Argument that has Contaminated Abortion Dialogue
• Part 2: The Limitations of Science in the Abortion Debate: Why You Need Philosophy
• Part 3: Scientism is Not Only Self-Refuting, but Dangerous

Sources:

• Find "Scientism and Secularism" by JP Moreland on Amazon: https://amzn.to/2W3YYaA
• Biologists on When Life Begins: https://quillette.com/2019/10/16/i-asked-thousands-of-biologists-when-life-begins-the-answer-wasnt-popular/
• When Fetuses Feel Pain: https://jme.bmj.com/content/46/1/3?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=jme&utm_content=toc&utm_term=15012020
• Bodily Rights Argument Responses: https://blog.equalrightsinstitute.com/bodily-rights/
• "Abortion is Healthcare": A Misogynistic Non-Argument: https://blog.equalrightsinstitute.com/abortion-is-healthcare-a-misogynistic-non-argument/
• Sex-Selective Abortion: https://www.newsweek.com/sex-selection-abortion-rife-us-447403
• IVF Screening: https://www.aacc.org/publications/cln/articles/2014/january/preimplantation
• CRISPR Technology: https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2018/11/crispr-bombshell-chinese-researcher-claims-have-created-gene-edited-twins
• Synthetic Biology: https://www.thehastingscenter.org/who-we-are/our-research/selected-past-projects/ethical-issues-in-synthetic-biology-2/

FTC Disclosure: If you purchase the J.P. Moreland book from that link, ERI will get a small percentage of that at no cost to you.

After the entire ERI staff watched the "AKA Jane Roe" documentary, we processed our thoughts together and in this nearly unedited discussion, Josh and Rachel offer their analysis of the film, including:

• Why this story is relevant to pro-choice people and shouldn't be brushed away by pro-life advocates;
• A video editor's take on whether the documentary was deceptively edited or merely biased;
• Why getting paid speaking fees or through "benevolence gifts" doesn't prove that your statements are entirely insincere;
• How the labels "pro-life" and "pro-choice" are adding confusion to this particular discussion;
• What we believe is the most plausible explanation for Norma McCorvey's statements in the documentary;
• Considering several alternative explanations and why they seem less plausible to us;
• Responding to some of the other pro-life and pro-choice reactions to the documentary;
• A few lessons that pro-life advocates should take from this situation.

"AKA Jane Roe" can now be seen on Hulu.

Josh's analysis of a different pro-choice documentary that was very deceptively edited: https://blog.equalrightsinstitute.com/reversing-roe-exposing-bias

The 1995 Nightline interview Norma McCorvey did shortly after her conversion that we reference several times: https://youtu.be/tOcRxz3PT6Q

We reference a quotation from Fr. Frank Pavone to the CNA that you can read here: https://bit.ly/2zshJMa

We reference multiple of Fr. Pavone's tweets, especially these two: https://bit.ly/2TzOeyS and https://bit.ly/2XjV8tg

Josh references this tweet thread from Dawn Goldstein: https://bit.ly/2TAkh1T

Josh references this tweet from Rebecca Kiessling: https://bit.ly/3ghRXek

We reference our first Facebook post with two example dialogues for pro-life people regarding this topic, which we published on 5/20/20, two days before the documentary came out: https://bit.ly/2APJ77e

Josh Brahm interviews Isaac Saul, political journalist and founder of Tangle, an independent, ad-free, non-partisan politics newsletter that offers both sides of the biggest news stories every day.

They start by discussing Isaac's background and the experiences that led him to attempt to create a truly non-partisan, fair, political newsletter. They then talk about common problems in the media, how to avoid confirmation bias, and how easy it is to fall into the game of snarky tweets, including Isaac admitting that he had published a snarky tweet from his personal account that morning, which they then analyze. Finally Josh asks Isaac for a list of his favorite sources from both sides of the political aisle for people who want to subscribe to at least one source from the opposite side.

Subscribe to Tangle: https://tangle.substack.com/about

ERI Video: "Should We Be Open-Minded About Abortion?" https://youtu.be/ovxAxJUyZA4

Isaac Saul: "You're Not Agnostic, You're An Atheist" https://bit.ly/2yDKoO3

Karol Markowicz piece on Andrew Cuomo that Isaac referenced: "Andrew Cuomo owes a genuine back-to-work plan to New Yorkers" https://bit.ly/2SK0UTv

Isaac Saul's favorite sources from both sides:

David French: Twitter: https://twitter.com/DavidAFrench Author page: https://bit.ly/2YH8n9P

Jonah Goldberg: Twitter: https://twitter.com/JonahDispatch Author page: https://bit.ly/2YORdXJ

Noah Rothman: Twitter: https://twitter.com/noahcrothman Author page: https://bit.ly/3dyDuZr

Coleman Hughes: Twitter: https://twitter.com/coldxman Author page: https://bit.ly/3dtr2Ka

We the Fifth/The Fifth Column: Twitter: https://twitter.com/wethefifth Podcast: https://wethefifth.com/

Karol Markowicz: Twitter: https://twitter.com/karol Author page: https://bit.ly/3dtbqq9

Matt Fuller: Twitter: https://twitter.com/MEPFuller Author page: https://bit.ly/2YMxtEm

David Brooks: Twitter: https://twitter.com/nytdavidbrooks Author page: https://nyti.ms/2YKurjD

Adam Serwer: Twitter: https://twitter.com/AdamSerwer Author page: https://bit.ly/3fsqypL

Mehdi Hasan Twitter: https://twitter.com/mehdirhasan Author page: https://bit.ly/35IkggW

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ERI Website: https://EqualRightsInstitute.com

ERI Blog: https://Blog.EqualRightsInstitute.com

Equipped for Life Course: https://EquippedCourse.com

Sidewalk Counseling Masterclass: http://SidewalkCounselingMasterclass.com

Rachel Crawford interviews Jacob Nels from ERI's Sidewalk Counseling Masterclass. Topics include:

- Should sidewalk counselors talk about adoption with abortion-minded women? - How to accurately keep track of lives saved vs. "hopefuls"; - How there is no silver bullet or "perfect words" that work for everybody.

Sidewalk Counseling Masterclass: http://SidewalkCounselingMasterclass.com

The "9 Myths of Sidewalk Counseling" webinar Rachel refers to is available as a bonus in both the Sidewalk Counseling Masterclass and the Equipped for Life Course.