Gramercy

I'm so glad to hear that Mr. Pitts Sr. became a Defy facilitator while in prison. Can you imagine all the men he encouraged and helped. I appreciate his  insightful recognition that Defy is not there to teach about entrepreneurship solely, but that the entire program is based first and foremost on character development...exercising those muscles of responsibility, forgiveness, and the ability to examine your motivations. It was because of this internal work that he was able to eventually voice his own admission that at the time of committing his crimes he was unable to see that he was lying to himself and blind to how his actions affected the lives of those he stole from. This type of self reflection can only come from a place of deep contemplation of the parts of yourself you typically prefer to hide or justify. 

I learned alot about the internal politics of prisons by listening to Bertrone's experience. I also appreciate how he advises people to vote by using statistics not emotion when it comes to issues based on the justice system. His warning of placing people in the prison system who are not genuinely deserving of that punishment needs to be heard by those with the capacity to make changes to that system. He has personally witnessed that too harsh of punishment actually achieves the opposite effect. It has the capacity to turn out more warped, more violent, more biased, and more prejudiced people than when they entered that system. Is that truly what we want?

Helen Keller says, "Character cannot be developed in ease and quiet. Only through the experience of trial and suffering can the soul be strengthened, ambition inspired, and success achieved." I think this approach to life is in step with Bertrone's life experience. Sometimes suffering happens to us, other times we create our own suffering. But despite the origin, character is built. May we all intentionally choose to develop our character for good...just as Mr. Pitts Sr has.

Bertrone's Quote: Treat others like you want to be treated.

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I know Kathy would never have chosen this path to intentionally walk down, but the lessons, friendships, and change of heart she gained while in prison were transformational for her. Our lives are but a series of small choices compiled together to form a cohesive whole. Every seemingly inconsequential act matters. They all form the basis of our character, our thought processes, and eventually our actions. 

After our conversation Kathy emailed me some more thoughts that she regretted not sharing during our interview. I'd like to share those at this time, in her own words, since I think they are very poignant and hold a lot of weight. She says, "before my incarceration I believed in the death penalty, I believed in 3 strikes law and leave without pay, and I believed in repeat offender enhancements. I was a tough on crime follower.I no longer believe in any of those. In fact, I am strongly against all of it.

We incarcerate too many people. I also forgot to tell you my best analogy about prison: I felt like the discarded garbage of society. Just as we put our trash out in front of our house to be picked up and taken away. We discard our prisoners. We don't care where, just not in our community, never to be seen or smelled again." 

How many of us can relate to these opinions? A change of heart happens because of a personal experience...either happening to you, or the opportunity to meet someone it's happened to. We would be wise to heed Kathy's lived experience and consider the incarcerated humans who need love, not trash that needs discarding.

Nelson Mandela is quoted as saying, "Our human compassion binds us the one to the other – not in pity or patronizingly, but as human beings who have learnt how to turn our common suffering into hope for the future." We all suffer...it's part of the human condition. May we learn how to better comfort those who suffer and see ourselves in the other so we can grow and walk in greater compassion...just as Kathy has.

Quote: Winston Churchill - Never, never, never give up.

Kathy's Business: State Issue

IG - @stateissue_apparel

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Ian's insight as to how the rest of society views and judges the incarcerated is spot on. I really appreciate his counter argument against that mindset. I love how he appeals to our humanity by reminding us that they are just people who were shaped by a certain set of circumstances which eventually influenced who they became. It's not an excuse, it's one explanation that helps us put the shoe on the other foot for a minute. What would you have done had you grown up in these set of circumstances? When we can see ourselves in the other, we tend to be less judgemental.

I love that Ian brought up the topic of how he saw the world and himself differently as he educated himself. That's the whole point of education - isn't it?! Oliver Wendell Holms, Sr. is quoted as saying, "The mind once expanded by the dimensions of larger ideas, never returns to its original size." This is exactly what happened to Ian. He couldn't go back to being the person he was before he entered prison. Education changed him.

I wanted to stand up and cheer when Ian said, "In life,  in business, whatever it may be, you don't know what you want until you know who you are." What wisdom that is! This is why we need to work on personal development and growth and self-reflection no matter who we are or where we are in life. I like how he said that Defy is in the business of human development. They are reinvesting in humanity and they are doing it through entrepreneurial education. George Washington Carver once said, "Education is the key that unlocks the golden door to freedom.” Ian found this to be true inside the walls of prison. Education helps bring hope, direction, purpose, and the freedom to break down the walls of our own mental and emotional prisons we create for ourselves. May we all continue educating ourselves to not only better our own lives, but to help better the lives of others...just as Ian has.

Ian's Quote: “My mission in life is not merely to survive, but to thrive; and to do so with some passion, some compassion, some humor, and some style” - Maya Angelou

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Who he is now seems incongruous with the story he shares of his early life. His transformation blows me away. He is kind, forgiving, and generous. He is open and vulnerable, sharing his fears and deepest sorrows. It breaks my heart hearing that he wanted to end his life so bad. Thank God for somebody seeing the good in him, having the courage to tell him and in doing so reignited his spark to continue living. I'm so thankful that spark of fire in him never went out and that he ultimately decided to help kids like the one he used to be. This giving of himself brought him back to life and filled him with joy - the contagious kind.

The power of being seen...the ripple effect of that ends up touching so many lives. One of the kindest things you can tell someone is that you see them - especially see the good in them. We all need that positive reinforcement. Nelson Mandela once said, "It never hurts to see the good in someone. They often act the better because of it." That statement couldn't be more true for Casey. It literally changed his life. I see you Casey. I see the good in you and how you spread it around to everyone you meet. May we all see the inner beauty of our fellow humans and acknowledge the good in them...just as Casey has.

Casey's Quote: Cherish the people in your ilfe now, the people that you love. You never know when they're gone.

Social Media:

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IG - @Casey.m.d

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Sandy is completely others centered. She genuinely cares and does everything in her power to help make life better for those around her be it her family, her community, or those she touches through her work. 

What a wonderfully unique vantage point Sandy brings to each situation she encounters. It was the positive influence of her community in her own life that taught her who she was and grounded her. She's witnessed the benefits of it in her own life and sees the lack of it in the lives of others and desires to cultivate that deeply held value. Speaking of values, I was deeply convicted by her courage and self-reflection in re-evaluating her own value system at the onset of her work with the incarcerated. This is what makes her so good at her job. She knows who she is and who and what she represents, so somebody's actions can't change that about her. Personally, I think it was the strength, love, and inclusion of the community she grew up in that ultimately led to these life convictions that everyone is worthy of respect despite where they are in life.

I really appreciated Sandy's favorite quote by Ghandi. But I also see Sandy's life being a beautiful example of something else Gandhi says, "In a gentle way you can shake the world." She certainly has with her unwavering love, education, and support of the EIT's in her care through her work with Defy Ventures. May we all find our place to shake the world as Sandy has.

Favorite Quote: The true measure of any society can be measured by the way they treat their most vulnerable populations

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Erik was not shy in naming his problem and the root of his choices...he cared deeply about what others thought of him. Haven't we all been in those same shoes? Yet ,at the time, he didn't have the tools to handle that fear and insecurity with mental clarity. How many of us would be so forthcoming in telling others where we lacked character and understanding in our youth...most of the time we prefer to chalk it up to stupidity instead of our own  ignorance. I'm deeply impressed by the level of character Erik shows now that he understands his mindset and the vastness of all it affects.

Erik certainly inspired me to look to the people in my life who have made me a better person and honor them the way he did. I love how he said, "I always thank my friends for giving me parts of them that I can instill into my character." Most of us want to take the credit for the good in us and blame others for the bad in us. Not Erik. His honesty and humility impress me. He's the real deal!

The Swiss  psychiatrist, Carl Jung, aptly advises that, "We cannot change anything until we accept it. Condemnation does not liberate, it oppresses." Erik took this advice to heart by calling out his past behavior without any excuses or justification. He sees clearly how he used to be a thief, a liar, a master manipulator. But no more. All of us need to do the uncomfortable work of recognizing our shadow selves because the sooner we acknowledge this part of ourselves we despise, the less power it holds over us. May we all learn to accept the good and bad in both ourselves and others...as Erik has.

Erik's Favorite Quote: "Be the change you want to see in the world." Gandhi

Social Media:
Instagram: @Erik928Andersson   
Facebook:  @Erik928Andersson

California Justice Leaders - Impact Justice Americorp - The Organization Erik works with

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When we sat down to talk, he had this awesome lion as his zoom background. He named him Wayne. After visiting with Chris, I learned that it couldn't have been a more perfect representation of who he is. It represents the strength of character and resilience he now possesses. Join me as Chris reveals with profound vulnerability the story of his life. 

Chris' insight into the human condition astounds me. He's so perceptive, intelligent, and humble. I LOVE how he said, "People have opened up to me about a lot of stuff, because I make myself safe for them." Right there. That's the key. There's no judgement. 

Chris brings such wisdom to our conversation. He's an avid reader and life long learner. And it shows in how he's educated himself. I was deeply convicted by his observation of  Schopenhauer's supposition that pride is having the conviction that you are something w/o it needing to be confirmed by anybody outside of you while vanity is trying to get to that conviction about yourself through other people. I just love how Chris spouts off such profound thoughts like it's nothing. We both share the same yearning for deep waters. I felt like we were geeking out together on all the great books we read and our shared love of learning.

There were two particular phrases Chris said (amongst the multitude he dropped on us), that really caused me pause and made me want to spend time meditating about, and they were: "The biggest courage is the acceptance of self and risking the rejection of others." And, "If the dissonance hits hard enough, you'll push past the shame into reconstruction." What impresses me is not only his recollection of quotes from what he reads, but how he created new quotes of his own from lived experience and observation. Man! Chris is a quote machine and an excellent teacher.

Chris, you have the courage of a lion now, my friend. St. Augustine says, "The truth is like a lion. You don't have to defend it. Let it loose. It will defend itself." May we all have the courage to speak the truth with as much clarity and humility as Chris has.

Chris' Quote:

A man who stands for nothing will fall for anything. - Anonymous

and

If everybody likes you, it's because you haven't stood for anything - Winston Churchill

Social Media:
Instagram: @xhrisjohnson7

Success Stories - the organization Chris now works for

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Quan works as the Senior Post Release Program Manager for Defy Ventures, a non-profit helping those with a criminal past transform their lives through the journey of entrepreneurship. After spending twenty-two years in and out of correctional institutions, Quan was paroled from a life sentence in 2015 and created his first company six months later. The following year, he received the Peace Fellowship Award for his work with the Alternatives to Violence Project. Quan has been featured in Entrepreneur, PBS Newshour, Talks at Google, and numerous other publications and podcasts.

Quan is genuine. He is the real deal. He did so much hard internal work and is intentional in how he lives now. His desire to give back, serve, and encourage is evident in his life. At the bottom of his email Quan has a quote from Khalil Gibran, author of The Prophet that succinctly describes how suffering can ultimately change us. "Out of suffering have emerged the strongest souls; the most massive characters are seared with scars."  May we all have the courage to see our past, current, and future struggles as gifts to our character as Quan has.

Social media:

FB, IG, Twitter, LinkedIn: @quanxhuynh

Quan's Website

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I'm so thankful you're joining me for another season of listening to and learning from those who have been pushed to the fringes of society.  This entire season was borne out of a book I read about one man's story. The book is titled, "The Sparrow In The Razor Wire"  by Quan Huynh. As soon as I finished reading it, I knew I had to meet this incredible man. I also knew I wanted to learn more about what it was like on the inside and listen to the stories of all the men and women who have endured this behemoth called our "justice system." 

I had never before considered the formerly incarcerated as a marginalized group. But the more I read Quan's book, I began to see it clearly. This is a group of people I need to meet and learn from. I wanted to know what traumas people endured inside and outside the system. I wanted to learn what influenced people to think the way they did. I wanted to understand what makes people resilient, what causes transformation, and how they find hope again.

Because of Quan's story, I learned about an organization called Defy Ventures and became enamored with their mission and purpose. On the homepage of their website it states: Defy’s entrepreneurial programs enable one of America’s largest forgotten communities to defy the odds. We equip them with new skills, new connections, and a new belief to match their new purpose, and succeed in their new life of economic independence." They actually believe and live out what Bryan Stevenson states so eloquently in his book, Just Mercy: "Each of us is more than the worst thing we’ve ever done."

Please keep that in mind as you listen to these incredible, heart-breaking, encouraging stories of people who have been to the bottom and yet have risen again as transformed humans ready to offer society their best. Again, Mr. Stevenson speaks so poignantly to this topic (so be prepared for a lot of quotes by him) when he says, " We are all broken by something. We have all hurt someone and have been hurt. We all share the condition of brokenness even if our brokenness is not equivalent."  

This season has touched the depths of my heart. Each person I met shaped me in new ways. This season you will hear from Defy Ventures employees, some of whom have also experienced incarceration. You will also hear stories of those who were factually innocent, yet still served time in prison. And you will hear the stories of those who knowingly committed crimes, did their time, and are now free from the shackles of their punishment and trying to rebuild their lives. Defy Ventures believes in the formerly incarcerated and helps provide the tools and hope for them to thrive outside the prison walls. 

Life After Prison taught me things I didn't know I needed to learn. It answered questions I didn't know I needed to ask. I hope it's effect on you is just as profound. After all, we're all stuck in prisons of our own making, aren't we?  Reaching out and helping each other and having someone believe in our value is often the difference between staying stuck within our confines or setting us free to love, serve, and encourage others. 

These episodes will be longer this season. Listening to people share their deepest vulnerabilities requires time and earning their trust. Afterall, these are more conversations than interviews and they take on that tone. True friends don't want to rush each other through a story in order to get to their own agenda. To genuinely see and hear others you must dedicate your time to listening. My ultimate goal during this season was that each person know that they are valued, seen, and heard by me, so I didn't rush through the stories.  I let them work through the memories, traumas, and events that led up to the incident that led to incarceration. But I was equally curious as to how they processed their time in prison and when and how transformation occured. Some guests were completely forthcoming in sharing the details of their crimes, others were more vague about events and timeframes. The emphasis of this podcast was not the crime, but how the person transformed and what life looked like after being released from prison. And their stories wouldn't be complete without learning how they put into practice all they learned and how they were able to restore their hope, their relationships, and their livelihood. 

To be sure, not everyone who enters prison leaves so transformed. These are the few that chose to do the hard internal work of dealing with their own demons and took complete responsibility for their choices and actions. Although you will hear many opinions about the state of our prison system and all its faults and inadequacies, this is not a podcast about prison reform. That's a political conversation for another day. Defy Ventures goes beyond the political constraints. They are not waiting for prison reform, they are showing up now and teaching strategies now and giving tools to those who are currently incarcerated so they can begin to believe in themselves again and find freedom within before ever finding it outside of the walls of prison.

And if you think you have nothing in common with the formerly incarcerated, you just might be mistaken. I was humbled to my core while preparing this season. Each guest brought me to my knees with their humility, ability to self-reflect, and authenticity. I simply request that you suspend judgement and the moral high ground while listening to each of these precious souls. Each of our lives are shaped by our circumstances, choices, Providence, and luck. Life is complicated. Some of us were fortunate to be in the right place at the right time. Others of us, not so much. The first step in learning is listening with an open mind and open heart. I think all of us can relate to and benefit from the Greek philosopher, Plutarch's words, "To make no mistakes is not in the power of man; but from their errors and mistakes the wise and good learn wisdom for the future." May we all grow in wisdom this season, just as each of my guests have.

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 This would be so much more fun in a community setting if we could each share our takeaways with each other and support one another in our growing and learning process. I gain so much from hearing your thoughts and experiences. Thank you to each one of you who have shared with me throughout the season. And finally, as much as I look forward to sharing what I've learned this season with you, I'm equally nervous. This is very personal. It's as if you found the key to my diary and are able to read my secret thoughts. I feel very vulnerable here. Please know that we don't have to agree, this is just where I am and what I've learned, what I'm confessing I didn't know, what I feel I need to do to improve. I have so far to go...but, thankfully this is a journey and I'm on the path forward. Thank you again for allowing me to share my journey with you.

So, what have I learned this season? More than I have words to adequately express. The main idea: we are all connected, what affects one of us, affects all of us. We are better, stronger, and more successful together. We need each other. I echo Holocaust survivor, Elie Wiesel's observation that, "if we want to achieve anything good, we cannot do it alone." Some concepts are still sitting on my heart, too raw to be put into words. Others have been ruminating these past few months and I have come to own these ideas as my own and am finally able to verbalize them. This is what I've learned so far from each and every guest I had the honor of conversing with. 

There are several overarching themes I gleaned from this season and they are: forgiveness, kindness, listening, dialogue, and giving the benefit-of-the-doubt. As Janice Bonsu from episode 10 so succinctly summed it up for us: "There is no small act of racism or discrimination." Every act, no matter how miniscule it seems, cuts to the heart. Some of the analogies used to describe racism were: the waters we swim in, a back-pack we carry, code switching, and an invisible wall. These helped me gain a better visual picture. There were also some extremely thought provoking metaphors several guests referenced, from Precious' butterfly effect, Crystal's dartboard friends, Chalmer's broken glasses, and Harold's government father. These brought broader dimensions of awareness and understanding to the sometimes narrow definitions of racism.

The first overarching concept would be to appreciate our commonality and celebrate our diversity. And to acknowledge that we can hold both ideals at the same time. This is how we build unity. This is how we show respect. Tribalism happens when we find our identity from only the things we have in common. Relativism occurs when we say everything holds the same weight and we gloss over our unique and distinguishing differences. There is a third way, a nondual way….holding the two in tension. And yes, it is tension because it is a daily choice. We are human and we feel better when we fit neatly into a group. But life is messy. We encounter and interact with people not like us on a daily basis. When that happens, we have a choice to make...we can recoil with disgust at the difference or we can open our circle to include the one not like us without giving up our own unique identity. That is the meaning behind...there is no them, just us.

My second observation is that there is so much fear. Sadly, many African Americans live in fear of being pulled over by the police and how the law can be manipulated against them. This fear is borne of experience and reality and is not to be discounted. Rather we need to listen and learn. How can we make it better? Just bringing up the topic of police reform sets off nasty tempers and commentary on social media. It doesn't have to be polarizing. We can't fix anything if we can't dialogue about it and come to some shared understanding. I agree with Myriama's question, "Why can't the lives of a police officer matter and my life matter?" Just because something might not be my reality does not mean I need to discredit someone else's lived experience. 

The sad and unfortunate truth is that in this country Black Americans live a different reality than White Americans do. We cannot judge their responses, fears, or reactions to police encounters the same way we judge a white American's. It is extremely evident given the disproportionate amount of Black Lives unjustly taken by American Police is a massive problem in our country. We are at a boiling point. We MUST listen to the Black experience so we can overhaul this system and have peace keepers working for the good, safety, and protection of ALL its citizens. It can be done, but it is going to take a deep dive into addressing the root of the problem, and that seems to be the biggest issue. Too often law enforcement feels self-justified in their actions and don't want to take a critical look at what can be done differently and/or better. This becomes highly evident to anyone who had the chance to read Officer Coleman's book about his experience in the police academy. African American citizens are suffering under the heavy hand of police brutality, but especially Black Americans and poor Americans. We can do better. We can be better. The more people that stand up against police brutality of any kind towards all people, the more it will force local, state, and federal governments as well as police forces to do the hard, uncomfortable work of self-evaluation, owning responsibility for their actions, and making amends. 

Another type of fear is that of the "other", the one not like me. The type of fear of someone like J. Kevin Powell from episode 14. Remember how he said that he knew people feared black men in a hoodie and that made him afraid to wear a hoodie until his 40s because he knew white people would fear him? Jonathan Saks in his book, The Dignity of Difference says: "Anxiety creates fear, fear leads to anger, anger breeds violence, and violence becomes a deadly reality. The greatest single antidote to violence is conversation, speaking our fears, listening to the fears of others, and in sharing of vulnerabilities, discovering a genesis of hope." Take some time and sit with that idea for a while to see if it rings true in your life. 

Just as white people find it absurd to think that we all experience the world the same way just because we share the same skin color, so do Black people. As Chalmer in episode 15 said so perfectly, "One person doesn't represent the entire race." This was a major theme repeated over and over again this season. Almost every guest, in one way or another said this phrase, "I'm not speaking for all black people here...this is just my experience." They are acutely aware because they've been put in that position too many times before.  Are there overarching generalities of both groups of people that are probably true? Yes, to some extent. But, sadly, because of ignorance, self-interest, or hate those are often quickly turned into stereotypes and then the norm. We have to fight the urge to lump large groups of people into stereotypical categories. Sadly, this is all too common. Here are some examples: Chinese people are all good at math, Indian people are all good at computer programming, Mexicans are best at manual labor, Black people make the best athletes, White people are all college educated.  Everyone who lives in the country is a redneck. Could these labels be true some of the time? Sure. But to assume any of these are always true, that is a racist idea. It is wrong to attribute one characteristic to an entire race, ethnicity, or geographic location. And that is precisely what I learned this season. Yes, all my guests were Black Americans. Yes, all my guests are infinitely more affected by racism th...