Where's the best place to make money in podcasting in 2025?

In this episode of PodBiz, Norma Jean Belenky speaks with Dane Cardiel, Founder and Publisher of Good Tape, about the business, culture, and ethics of the podcasting industry. Dane shares his "two answers" to the question of where the money is, the crucial role of community, and his journey from being the first non-CTO employee at Simplecast to launching a physical print magazine dedicated to the craft of audio.

As he puts it:

“Podcasting... really is one of the only mediums a talent can actually have ownership over and really control their voice, their distribution, their monetization, sort of the full stack that other mediums really don't have any access to.”

Here are some insightful moments within the episode:

• Where Dane Cardiel believes the money is in podcasting—with a hot take and a deep dive into community-building.

• The "Autonomous" and "Participatory" community quadrants where financial success is located.

• The ethics and responsibility of the podcast medium, which allows talent to control their voice, distribution, and monetization.

• Dane's journey from being the first non-CTO employee at Simplecast to a VP role in ad tech.

• The one key mistake Dane observed in ad sales: the widespread lack of audience surveys.

• Why Good Tape, a physical magazine, was created to elevate cultural coverage and shift the industry to be more active in the broader "creator economy."

Dane Cardiel is the Founder and Publisher of Good Tape, an independent print magazine and creative studio dedicated to the craft and culture of podcasting. He previously held leadership positions at several podcast companies, including serving as VP of Creator Partnerships at Gumball and being an early employee at Simplecast.

Connect with Dane on LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/danecardiel/

Check out Dane's write up, Cashing In On Podcast Communities: https://offtherecrd.substack.com/p/cashing-in-on-podcast-communities

Episode Chapters

(00:00) The tea is hot

(01:07) Welcome to Podbiz & Introducing Dane Cardiel

(01:37) Where is the money in podcasting?

(02:18) The second answer: Community

(03:09) Dane's community chart and quadrants

(04:58) Discussing Good Tape and Dane's advocacy

(08:29) Podcasting as a double-edged sword and medium ownership

(11:07) "We're going to grow old together" and shared values in the industry  

(16:40) Dane's career trajectory: Simplecast  

(18:46) Selling air: the enterprise side of Simplecast  

(21:51) Transition to ad tech: Headgum and Gumball  

(23:38) What podcast categories sell in ad tech  

(25:41) The biggest learning in ad sales: the lack of audience surveys  

(30:42) The Good Tape journey  

(35:12) Key moves and mindset: producers and 'business-leaning' talent  

(37:00) The difficulties in the industry (layoffs, competition)  

(39:03) The future of audio-only and community  

(45:16) If starting over, what Dane would do differently  

(45:36) What Dane is most excited about: Creator Economy

Some Additional PodBiz Buzz…

“The ability to influence that ability to oscillate that that shared equilibrium of values like, to a center that I feel more comfortable with... that feels like it's within my control.”“We have to be in this like new entertainment space and be a contributor to that conversation, not just a passive recipient of it.”

PodBiz is the podcast about the business of podcasting. Hosted by industry veterans Norma Jean Belenky and John Kiernan, the show features conversations with creators, executives, and platform leaders to answer one question: Where’s the money in podcasting?

Each episode dives into monetization strategy, adtech, branded content, IP development, and audience growth. Guests include leaders from Acast, Captivate, Crooked Media, Buzzsprout, True Native Media, Podfest, and more.

Learn more: njbmedia.co | thepodhouseproductions.com

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