For the last fifteen years, Louisiana doom metal band Thou has filled eardrums with unsettling noise, and guttural screams. They are a magnificent group, one of the few sludge metal bands that gets accolades from music critics at typically-tame venues like NPR. However great this attention has been, the critics at NPR have failed to ask Thou one specific, but incredibly important question: Do they like ska? The answer is a little complicated. 

To help unravel this complicated question, Thou lead singer Bryan Funck and bassist Mitch Wells were kind enough to join us on In Defense of Ska. They promised to explain their positions on ska and go into detail about their personal connections with the genre. And it’s a fascinating journey. 

In this episode, Bryan walks us through the various ska-punk bands he was once a fan of back in the 90s. He even made us a two-hour ska-punk mixtape that included detailed linear notes! Mitch, on the other hand, gives us a glimpse behind the scenes of the awesome Bad Operation videos he shot last year during the pandemic. We also discuss Bryan’s affinity towards juvenile pranks, what Mitch likes to do to celebrate 311 Day, the infamous folder filled with unused touring connections that inspired a brutal Thou song, and which Operation Ivy songs they’d cover if they HAD to

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

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Los Angeles has one of the best ska scenes in the country. A huge part of that is because, in LA’s Latino neighborhoods, ska is really popular. Over the past decade, festivals like Los Angeles Skawars & L.A. Skacore Invasion have brought thousands of kids out to local parks and underground spaces to skank with all their might and sing along to their favorite bands. These festivals are strictly DIY and showcase mostly local bilingual ska bands, as well as groups from Mexico, and occasionally bands from the larger US ska scene. And at the heart of this vibrant ska scene is Clemente Ruiz. 

Clemente would rather not refer to himself as a promoter. He prefers to think of what he does as event production. Besides he does a whole lot more than just put on shows. He drums in the ska-punk band La Resistencia, and he’s involved with various sides of the music industry, like audio engineering, photography, and content creation. With the live shows, he never got into it to make money; it was born out of necessity. In the early 2000s, the LA Latino ska bands were playing backyard parties and random one-off spaces. When they’d approach big venues, they were told, “We don’t book Spanish rock here.” Rather than get discouraged, they built their own scene.

And what a scene it is! I visited Los Angeles Skawars in 2015 and was blown away by how much fun it was, and how fresh the music felt. I couldn’t believe that literally thousands of kids were at a mostly-local ska festival, and excited about it—in 2015! It gave me so much hope about the future of ska. 

On this episode of In Defense of Ska, we talk to Clemente about how this scene got started, and why it grew into such a healthy, consistent scene (as opposed to something trendy like what happened to ska in Orange County in the 90s.) We also talk about his ongoing working relationship with Travis Barker, The Deftones, Pepe Aguilar—and that one time he got to work with Post Malone. He also brings up that time he played drums with Stevie Wonder. 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

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The late ’90s were a busy time for Steve Choi. While he was playing drums in the punk band The Blockheads—a band that Lookout Records were considering signing—Mike Park invited him to join his new all-Asian ska-punk group The Chinkees. At the same time, he moved to Santa Cruz and filled in on various instruments with Slow Gherkin. Oh and somewhere in there, he played keyboards with The Specials for a tour. 

As a child, Steve was given a formal education in music. But ska and punk music allowed him to let go of all the complex training, and feel music on a deep, fundamental level. But eventually, he would learn how to bridge these worlds. That moment came when he joined Southern California ska-punk band RX Bandits in the early 2000s. 

As he joined the group, they were moving away from ska, and going into much more musical intricate territory. Steve was able to take his formal training, and apply it to punk. He helped RX Bandits forge a whole new identity, one that initially sparked a backlash amongst some of their ska fans, but would eventually find a fan base that had longevity as the years went on. 

On this episode of In Defense of Ska, Steve talks about his early days playing ska and punk. He also describes the philosophy that guided RX Bandits when he joined and talks about his time producing beats, most notably for rapper Lil Peep. We also discuss the physically demanding Plea For Peace bicycle tour he did, his process for creating content for his new podcast, The Musician’s Guild, and how he and Mike Park ended up creating a new Chinkees EP in 2020. 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

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In 1999, Long Island ska band Edna’s Goldfish got a few plays on MTV with the video for their ultra-catchy song “Veronica Sawyer.” Behind the scenes, the group was being courted by major labels wanting to “take them to the next level.” But the band’s indifference to label support and the changing tides away from ska in the mainstream ultimately flat-lined any of these plans. They broke up in 2000 with no record deal to hold on to. 

Our guest today is Edna’s Goldfish’s lead singer Brian Diaz, who would go on to form a few other bands after Goldfish, but in 2003, would make the transition to guitar/bass tech for prominent bands such as Fall Out Boy, Guns ‘n’ Roses, Primus and Motion City Soundtrack. Basically, Diaz has been on the road for a couple of decades now! Though this past year, with live music canceled, he’s been at home more than he can remember ever doing in this free time. That’s given him the free time to dig up and digitize old Edna’s Goldfish footage, something he’s wanted to do for years.

It also afforded him the time to chat with Adam and me about his ska past. We talk about the time Edna’s Goldfish toured with Link 80 on what was supposed to be a Buck ‘O Nine headlining tour. Buck left the tour after their bassist had a medical emergency, but Edna and Link 80 continued on regardless. We also discuss the story behind Veronica Sawyer, we reveal what ska band Patrick Strump (Fall Out Boy) loves, and what it was like to have Atlantic Records wining and dining Edna’s Goldfish over a plate of shark. 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

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Touring as an indie musician often leads to playing unexpected spaces. When my band, Flat Planet, toured the US in the mid-90s, we played skate parks, backyards, public parks, recording studios, trailer parks, and one time we played in the middle of the desert, thirty miles from Las Vegas with nothing but a generator and a few lights. Adam Davis, co-host of this podcast, also played a ton of DIY spaces while touring with Link 80 in the late 90s and early 2000s. Of all venues he played, one of his all-time favorite spots was “The Crack Shack,” an abandoned house in Tuba City, which is a small city on the Navajo Nation Reservation in Arizona.

The Crack Shack only lasted from 1999 till 2003, but it housed a raging punk scene that left an impact on Adam. Years later, Adam found one of the main Crack Shack promoters, Alex Begay, on MySpace. Alex not only promoted shows at The Crack Shack, but he played in the Tuba City punk band Downplay—at the time, the only punk band in town.

On this episode of In Defense of Ska, Adam and Alex reminisce on The Crack Shack days. And try to understand why oftentimes, it’s the punk rock venues in the least likely, most off-the-radar spots, that have the best scenes. Alex talks about The Crack Shack’s history, what lead to it being shut down, about the time he enjoyed Navajo Tacos with Vic Ruggeiro (Slackers), and we also discuss the time Glenn Danzig got socked in the face in Tuba City. That wasn’t at The Crack Shack though.

If you enjoy this episode, give it a share. Also, sign up for my newsletter for posts and podcast episodes sent directly to your inbox

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Brent Lawrence Friedman has seen all sides of the music industry. He’s booked tours and done marketing for various ska and punk band (MxPx, Goldfinger, Five Iron Frenzy, Mr. T. Experience). His current gig is “merch fulfillment” for Skatune Network, Kill Lincoln, and other ska groups. He also plays drums in the group We Are The Union. When he’s not doing any of those things, he’s frantically posting about ska on social media, and getting tagged in literally every ska meme—a role he’s come to embrace. His Instagram and Twitter handle is @pleasetagmeinyourskaposts. 

I first interviewed Brent (along with Jeremy Andrew Hunter) back in 2018 for my book, In Defense of Ska. We Are The Union were on tour with Reel Big Fish, and so I chatted with them backstage at their Reno show. I wanted to get both of their takes on what it’s like to be entirely identified for liking ska, to have everyone refer to you as a “ska person,” and to feverishly tag you in all online ska content. For Brent, his non-stop online ska talk started as a joke, but he saw that some people were genuinely appreciating his ska persona. 

“The ska thing is always a butt end of the joke. After a while it started annoying me to where I started defending ska on social media,” Brent told me. “I started talking about ska a lot. I became an exaggerated version of what these people thought I was. Then ska kids in bands across the country would tell me, ‘Man I love that you defend ska so hard.’ Apparently, this is making some people happy. I’m just going to keep f*****g doing it.” 

On this episode of In Defense of Ska, Brent tells us the full story of how he went from We Are The Union super-fan to being their drummer. He gives us some insight on the business side of DIY ska including a glimpse behind the scenes of We Are The Union’s Self-Care Kickstarter campaign, and how he came to book the infamous Jesse Michaels/Leftover Crack concert that was eventually covered in Vice. We also talk about how truly awful most ska jokes are when they come from ska-haters. Can’t they at least learn a little bit about the music and subculture first? 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Music critics love Joyce Manor’s blend of Jawbreaker, The Smiths, Guided By Voices and Weezer—and cite these influences with delight. But in every conversation music bloggers have about the band, they fail to mention the role that ska has had on Joyce Manor singer-songwriter Barry Johnson. 

Skaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!

As a teenager, Barry fell in love with ska. His introduction to indie rock even came from getting into Asian Man Records ska bands (MU330, Slow Gherkin) and then checking out some of the non-ska bands on the label. The first band of note he played in, Kid Gruesome, was highly influenced by Operation Ivy, making his first batch of songs he wrote ska-punk. He maintains that learning how to write ska songs, had a huge impact on his songwriting style. 

When I interviewed Barry for my book, In Defense of Ska, he had this to say: “Learning how ska works makes you a better songwriter,” Johnson says. “Like how a ska bassline dives in. The role of the guitar in a ska band is way different than a rock band…countermelody, dynamics. How to make a song move and be infectious. If you’ve never tried to write a ska song, you’re doing yourself a disservice.” 

Ska ska ska 

Barry was kind enough to let me and Adam interview him on the podcast. He breaks down his ska past in detail, including the story of the mysterious kid who wore all black and sang an incredible acapella rendition of The Aquabats’ “The Cat With 2 Heads.” Barry also talks about his ongoing creative relationship with The Impossibles’ Rory Phillips, and how Goldfinger’s John Feldmann almost produced a Joyce Manor record. 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

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Matt Bettinelli-Olpin was a founding member of East Bay ska-core band Link 80. The band members started playing together in 1993 while they were young teens. Their first album, 17 Reasons, was released in 1997 on Asian Man Records—the first official release on the label not including albums that were brought over from Dill Records. 17 Reasons is a truly unique ska-punk record that blends hardcore, street punk, ska and filters it through an abrasive Gilman vibe and has surprisingly loose grooves mixed in with its intense punk rock explosions. 

The group gained some notoriety for being the ska-punk band that romance novelist Danielle Steel’s son Nick Traina fronted, but this factoid was much less interesting than the band’s music, and who they were together as a group. They toured relentlessly and maintained a loyal cult audience, but never got mainstream attention. They also didn’t fit in with other ska bands at their time but would influence the sound of ska-core in the 2000s and beyond. 

Matt quit the band in 1998, but went on to a successful career in Hollywood, directing films. His next movie, Scream (also referred to as Scream 5), is set to release in January 2022. The film features much of the original cast from the original 1996 film. 

On this episode of In Defense of Ska, Matt talks about Link 80’s origins, what it was like touring with the band. He also delves into his friendship with Nick Traina, and answers the big question on everyone’s mind: Will there be ska Easter eggs in the new Scream film? 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

Santa Cruz, California is best known for its primo surf spots and as the location of the classic 80s horror-comedy The Lost Boys. You can still hear reverberations of “sexy sax man” Tim Cappello singing “I still believe” right there on the outdoor stage at the Santa Cruz Beach Boardwalk. But during the 90s, ask any local what band best defined the city, and they would without a doubt say Slow Gherkin. 

Though they never reach a large national audience, Slow Gherkin were local legends. Even when they throw together reunion shows, you can be assured they will pack the largest venues in the city. But it’s a shame the rest of the world never had Slow Gherkin fever in quite the same way. The group was one of the most original mid-90s ska bands out there, a time when many people felt that ska was oversaturating the market. Gherkin mixed New Wave hooks, syncopated Fugazi breakdowns, and sad indie rock laments with some of the most fun, cathartic ska of its era. 

In this episode of In Defense of Ska, Adam and I talk to three members of Gherkin: James Rickman, A.J. Marquez, and Phil Boutelle. We chat about their early days in Santa Cruz, the time John Avila (Oingo Boingo) approached them in New York to work on some tunes, and debate whether their 2002 album Run Screaming was a deliberate move away from ska or not. 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy

I met comedian Keith Lowell Jensen shortly after I moved to Sacramento in 2013. We first got to know each other when I interviewed him for the local newspaper, Sacramento News and Review, but soon became friends. Before the pandemic, we were getting wieners on a regular basis. (It technically started as hot dogs for lunch, but soon wieners became synonymous with hanging out)

Of the many things we bonded over, a mutual love for ska was high on the list, especially when Keith learned I was writing a book about ska. He insisted that I include him in the book with a chapter called “My Friend Keith Likes Ska.” That didn’t happen, but here we are a few months before In Defense of Ska releases and “My Friend Keith Likes Ska” is now a reality—as a podcast episode.

Keith always hires a clown for his birthday parties

In this episode, Keith talks about local Sacramento band Filibuster (Who Keith attempted to manage for a minute), his love for Fishbone (He was at that crazy Warfield show at the beginning of Everyday Sunshine: The Story of Fishbone), and a slew of other topics. One highlight this week comes by way of co-host Adam Davis, who revealed that his childhood church had a “No Skaw dancing” policy at their dances. Scandalous!

Check out Keith’s latest special Not For Rehire on Amazon Prime and leave a review.

Also be sure to pick up his book Punching Nazis and Other Good Ideas.

Keith also has a podcast. Make sure you listen to the episode when he brings on In Defense of Ska author Aaron Carnes.

Follow Keith on Twitter. His next book, What I Was Arrested For will be available for pre-order soon. It’s getting released by Clash Books—my book publisher! 

If you’d like to support us and listen to early access, ad-free episodes with bonus content, check out our Patreon! 

If you like our theme song, go download the EP Lives by Slow Gherkin. They wrote the opening and closing songs for our podcast. You can get both tunes from their Lives EP. Also, check out Dan P and the Bricks two LPs. They provided the mid-roll ad transition music. 

Support the In Defense host Aaron Carnes by purchasing a copy of his book, In Defense of Ska. The 2nd, expanded edition of In Defense of Ska will release in Oct 2024. 

Co-host Adam Davis has a band called Omnigone. Their latest record, Against The Rest released on March 31, 2023. 

The In Defense of Ska editor Chris Reeves runs a record label called Ska Punk International. They have new releases coming out all the time.

Support In Defense of Ska by checking out StubHub: https://stubhub.prf.hn/l/DLXVmMB

Advertising Inquiries: https://redcircle.com/brands

Privacy & Opt-Out: https://redcircle.com/privacy