Isaac Orr researches and writes about environmental issues, mining, and energy for the Center of the American Experiment, a think tank based in Golden Valley, Minnesota. In his third appearance on the podcast (his last was on July 12, 2022) Orr talks about the impact that Senate File 4, a new law that mandates Minnesota utilities be delivering 100-percent carbon-free electricity by 2040, the NGOs that pushed the legislation, why it will cost ratepayers an additional $300 billion, and why it will likely lead to blackouts and leave Minnesota in a “reliability hole.” (Recorded on February 22, 2023.)