Long Now

Louis Hyman: The New Deal You Don't Know


Listen Later

Historian Louis Hyman's work focuses on the history of American capitalism. In his book _[Borrow: The American Way of Debt](https://www.amazon.com/Borrow-American-Debt-Vintage-Original/dp/0307741680/)_ , he examines in detail how the evolution of personal debt has not only changed the economics of this country but the culture itself. Capitalism in the short term appears dominant and inevitable. The machinations of markets and capitalist fortunes seem like they always have been; but that's very much not the case. Before examining a forgotten stumble of capitalism during the New Deal Era, Hyman gave us a multi-millennial economic viewpoint to put things in context.
In fact capitalism is an anomaly in the history of civilization: for millennia our world was accurately characterized by the idea of Malthusian Stasis: world GDP per capita essentially did not change in the pre-industrial age. Only these few centuries has the dynamism of capitalism spiked the hockey stick of economic growth. As such, maybe it's not surprising that a relatively young system like capitalism will stumble every few decades as happened in the Great Depression. And as Hyman says is happening again today.
Capitalism stalls when capitalists hold on to their money rather than putting it to work. And when banks and businesses are not being brave, not risking their money to make more money, the government can play a key role and fiscally encourage that potentially high-reward "risky" investment. Discussing the New Deal era, Hyman introduces us to key figures behind the scenes and to agencies, three-letter acronyms that you may not have learned about in US History class, that played pivotal roles in invigorating the economy during those years. He also draws comparisons with the current economic situation.
One missed lesson goes back to Hyman's area of expertise: consumer debt. Today's banks have loaned much more money to individuals than to businesses. Securitized consumer debt has become their main business rather than loaning money to new, risky, high reward businesses. As Hyman explains, "Those are supposed to be flip-flopped. That's how economies grow. They don't grow through consumer debt." The banks' money is sitting in the vault; it isn't out working in the world. $2.4 trillion is sitting in US banks that could be funding businesses.
There are also lessons to be learned from post-Depression technology investment. Specifically we need to find a new leading sector and break out of a technologically incrementalist era which Hyman says has gone on now for decades. He calls for crazy ideas--tech that sounds as far out as a self-driving car did a decade ago. Space elevators and “rocket boots” are what we need to jumpstart capitalism, get the money flowing, and move that graph further up and to the right.
...more
View all episodesView all episodes
Download on the App Store

Long NowBy The Long Now Foundation

  • 4.6
  • 4.6
  • 4.6
  • 4.6
  • 4.6

4.6

229 ratings


More shows like Long Now

View all
Freakonomics Radio by Freakonomics Radio + Stitcher

Freakonomics Radio

32,271 Listeners

The New Yorker Radio Hour by WNYC Studios and The New Yorker

The New Yorker Radio Hour

6,937 Listeners

The Tim Ferriss Show by Tim Ferriss: Bestselling Author, Human Guinea Pig

The Tim Ferriss Show

16,141 Listeners

99% Invisible by Roman Mars

99% Invisible

26,270 Listeners

Making Sense with Sam Harris by Sam Harris

Making Sense with Sam Harris

26,401 Listeners

Conversations with Tyler by Mercatus Center at George Mason University

Conversations with Tyler

2,457 Listeners

On Being with Krista Tippett by On Being Studios

On Being with Krista Tippett

10,241 Listeners

Long Now: Conversations at The Interval by The Long Now Foundation

Long Now: Conversations at The Interval

46 Listeners

The Atlantic Interview by The Atlantic

The Atlantic Interview

27 Listeners

Sean Carroll's Mindscape: Science, Society, Philosophy, Culture, Arts, and Ideas by Sean Carroll

Sean Carroll's Mindscape: Science, Society, Philosophy, Culture, Arts, and Ideas

4,170 Listeners

Interesting Times with Ross Douthat by New York Times Opinion

Interesting Times with Ross Douthat

7,266 Listeners

The Origins Podcast with Lawrence Krauss by Lawrence M. Krauss

The Origins Podcast with Lawrence Krauss

505 Listeners

Dwarkesh Podcast by Dwarkesh Patel

Dwarkesh Podcast

560 Listeners

Hard Fork by The New York Times

Hard Fork

5,574 Listeners

The Ezra Klein Show by New York Times Opinion

The Ezra Klein Show

16,495 Listeners

The Interview by The New York Times

The Interview

1,635 Listeners