This week on Babel, Jon Alterman speaks with Max Gallien, a political scientist specializing in informal and illegal economies and North African politics. He is a research fellow at the Institute of Development Studies and the International Centre for Tax and Development at the University of Sussex. Together, they discuss the political, social, and economic functions of smuggling economies in North Africa. Then, Jon continues the conversation with Martin Pimentel and Will Todman to discuss what factors lead Middle Eastern states to ignore, or even condone, smuggling by their citizens.

• Transcript, "Max Gallien: Black Markets of the Maghreb," CSIS, December 10, 2024.