As the Cards drop a heartbreaker to the Mets, Daniel (@C70) talks it over with Nate from Talking About Birds (talkingaboutbirds.com). The guys talk about some of the frustrations about the bullpen, rave over Brendan Donovan's start, and then get into some of the other issues of the day. What are the Cardinals doing with Nolan Gorman? What happens when Masyn Winn returns next week? Is having a "defensive closer" really what the club needs? The guys also talk about the rotation and the upswing of Jordan Walker. No Bens were used in the making of this podcast.

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