New Churches Podcast

I’m Trevin Wax. In October, I’m starting a new podcast called Reconstructing Faith that examines the state of the American church’s witness. For years now, we’ve seen the church rocked by sin and scandal and our credibility as Christ’s followers has been diminished. Reconstructing Faith avoids the simplistic knee-jerk reactions you see on social media and instead looks at the church the same way you’d look at your home after a natural disaster, say a flood. We’ll examine the foundations of the church that have stood the test of time, both here in America and around the world. We’ll also examine the rot in the church, the attitudes and practices that have sprung up over the decades like mold. While there’s been a lot of bad news, we’ve got to remember the good news of the gospel and work within the church to restore and rebuild its witness so that people experience the majesty of Jesus. I hope you’ll join me.

Find out more at ReconstructingFaithPodcast.com.

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Church planters and their teams are on the lookout for best practices in starting kids ministry. Host Clint Clifton talks with Danielle Whitley, author of a new free resource, “10 Steps to Developing a Kids Ministry,” which lays a great foundation for discipling young Christ-followers – for generations to come.

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This is such a critical point in a person’s life. As spiritual leaders of the church, we really want to take advantage of this opportunity God has given us to invest during these influential years. @Danielle Whitley

It’s critical for a church leader to be able to step into the space with volunteers and leaders with a sense of honor, optimism and joy that will be contagious among among your leaders. @ClintJClifton

There are so many things you can do, honestly in almost any given spot, to make it look fun and kid friendly when you follow these tips. @Danielle Whitley

Kids’ ministry, like church planting, is fraught with challenges and difficulties. But the fact you have an optimistic, positive, excited, encouraged outlook about the opportunity to invest in the lives of children is a game changer. @ClintJClifton

This type of attitude is going to create volunteers who will be excited about it. They’re going to be long-term leaders because they’ve caught onto the fact they’re actually investing in eternity by pouring into these children. @Danielle Whitley

We used this seminar in one of the residency sessions to actually train church planters. @ClintJClifton

With the seminar and the 10 basic steps, you are laying a strong foundation you’re going to be able to build off for years to come. You can apply it to really any ministry, including an existing church plant. @Danielle Whitley

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We often think of discipleship as a post-conversion process, but it also can be seen in a broader way. Host Ed Stetzer talks with Chuy Rodriguez and Catherine Renfro about disciple making as sharing the gospel, people responding to the gospel, growing in the truths of the gospel and then multiplying.

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The most effective churches I’ve worked with are translating academic education into practical implementation – complementing traditional tools with serving the community. It’s not just acquiring information but also putting it into practice so we grow in our walk with Christ. —Chuy Rodriguez

Oftentimes we talk about evangelism and discipleship as though it has to be one or the other. I don’t think you can have true discipleship without evangelism; I don’t think you can have evangelism without discipleship. Discipleship and evangelism go hand in hand. @CatherineRenfro

Discipleship is not follow-up. Discipleship is calling people to follow Jesus and the disciple-making journey starts at the even sharing the good news of the gospel with people, sharing what it means to follow Jesus. Disciple making includes conversion and spiritual growth and, ultimately, multiplication. @EdStetzer

We see one-on-one discipleship and group discipleship. I don’t think you can choose one over the other. Both are equally important. At the end of the day, I think relationships are the foundation of discipleship. @CatherineRenfro

As a new church grows, it takes on structure. All living things, when they become more complex, take on structure. We help people move from sitting in rows to sitting in circles, so they can have that life-on-life discipleship that makes makes the difference. @EdStetzer

A lot of times church plants, if they don’t grow in maturity, can become a mile wide and an inch deep. Church plants must have a disciple-making culture. @EdStetzer

You need a model of what it means to be a disciple and to disciple others. I’ve seen pastors who preach a lot about certain things but they are not the first ones doing it. I would say to most pastors, “Just be what you preach.” —Chuy Rodriguez

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Most, if not all, church planters aspire to start a multiplying church. Yet often that doesn’t happen because we have our missiology backwards. Host Clint Clifton talks with Vance Pitman and Trevin Wax about what they see as a more biblical approach.

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The starting point is wrong when we start with the church. The starting point is the city and gospel engagement. The Great Commission is to make disciples. Jesus never said, “Go plant churches.” @VancePitman

When when you take the gospel to the city, the Gospel doesn’t skip over cultures. One of the reasons we have so many homogenous churches in North America is we start with a church service. When you start with a church service, you start with a culture that attracts people like itself. @VancePitman

It’s wisdom for a church planter to spend the majority of discipleship time with the most mature in his congregation, helping them become really effective leaders. It’s not so much about if a person is new to faith in Christ or if they’ve been a Christian for a long time. It’s about their trajectory toward leadership. @ClintJClifton

You’re basically focusing on making disciples who will then make disciples. @TrevinWax

When we talk about multiplication, often we limit that to talking about multiplying the church. But if you’re going to see churches multiplied, you have to think multiplication at every level. That starts with multiplying disciples. @VancePitman

In the beginning it feels like you’re doing it poorly, but you basically have to make the choice to go ahead and do it, even though all your ducks, proverbially speaking, aren’t in a row. That’s a hard thing for a conscientious pastor to do. @ClintJClifton

Jesus focused more on succession than he did on success. He planned for succession. He planned for the generation beyond him. Unfortunately in the local church in America, we spend 99% of our time focused on success. @VancePitman

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Ministry wives face unique challenges, and fewer resources are produced to help them than their husbands. Co-hosts Ed Stetzer and Clint Clifton talk with Christine Hoover about her new NAMB podcast for ministry wives.

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Being a ministry wife often is a vocation without a job description. @EdStetzer

When we planted there were zero resources for me as a church planting wife. That’s what sparked my desire to serve and help women who sometimes feel unseen. They’re the unsung heroes of church ministry. @ChristineHoover

Ministry wives face unique challenges. We experience church very differently than our husbands, because it’s not our job. The dynamics can be really challenging. @ChristineHoover

The issue of ministry wives is a complex algorithm. You’ve got expectations and assumptions that come along with the faith tradition, as well as the unique personality of the wife. Those two things manifest themselves in so many different ways. @ClintJClifton

Pastors have a job description but one of the greatest challenges for pastor’s wives, especially within the first 10 years, is just figuring out who they are and what God has created them to do in their context. @ChristineHoover

The relational challenges are a big piece too – the blurred lines of ministry. It can be very confusing to know who you share things with, who you go to when you need help. @ChristineHoover

A big component is for the pastor to help his wife see herself, to see how God is using her. Sometimes it can be hard to see that in ourselves and so for the husband to say “I see God using you in this way,” that’s really encouraging. @ChristineHoover

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Church planters are thinking about financing permanent facilities, but probably no group of people is less equipped to go into commercial real estate transactions. Host Clint Clifton talks with Colby Garman and Ray Clark about the basics of financing church facilities.

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The easiest rule of thumb is to look at a church’s annual income and multiply it by three to four times. Probably 98% of churches can use that to approximate what they could afford in a facility. — Ray Clark

Church planters are notoriously optimistic about the the future of their work. That needs to be tempered a little bit when we’re talking about getting into a multimillion-dollar facility promise for what amounts to decades. @ClintJClifton

Making a big decision like getting into a mortgage impacts how you function in ministry going forward. Some of the freedom to think about multiplication and sending out church planters goes away by making that decision. @ColbyGarman

We put a fence around the possibility of over-extending ourselves financially and we said we’re going to keep mission and ministry our priority. @ClintJClifton

Every single decision you as a leader make has a financial ramification. Every time you say yes to something, you’re automatically saying no to something else. — Ray Clark

Sometimes Christians have really off ways of thinking about money that make these conversations really hard. Like, “Hey we’re supposed to just have faith and all this talk about details and financing is uncomfortable.” @ColbyGarman

The No. 1 thing we run across is pastors who are the “tip of the spear” leader who just don’t engage in this conversation at all. — Ray Clark

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Episode 698: Finding a facility for a new church is is one of the most challenging aspects of planting, particularly in an urban environment. Host Clint Clifton talks with Colby Garman and Ray Clark about why creative facility solutions are needed now, more than ever.

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Church planters will use just about any space they can gather a crowd in: school cafeterias or auditoriums, movie theaters, small concert venues, hotel ballrooms and conference centers. @ColbyGarman

When you’re in the throes of church planting and things get difficult, you start to believe that if you had a facility, it would solve all the problems. That’s not true. In some ways, it creates problems. @ClintJClifton

Rightly thinking about facilities as a tool for ministry is probably the healthiest place a church planter could could start. The facility just facilitates the gathering of the church. — Ray Clark

Churches can take body blows of difficulty when they have a facility. But a family that’s not well relationally doesn’t get better by owning their own home. @ColbyGarman

Many church planters who think they’re ready for that step aren’t ready for that step. @ClintJClifton

The first place to start is really understanding where you’re at and the only way to understand where you’re at is to is to actually track income and expenses. A good rule of thumb would be about 25% of your budget allocated to your debt payment. — Ray Clark

One of the beautiful things about alternative situations is additional cash flow, but often that comes with additional operation. As a pastor, you’ve got to protect yourself against capacity creep. — Ray Clark

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Episode 697: No planter goes in thinking it’s going to be easy, but none knows quite how hard it’s actually going to be. Host Clint Clifton discusses the incredible benefits of endurance in planting with Jeff Belcher and Amanda Hudson.

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I often tell church planters that the only way to ensure you won’t be a failure before you plant a church is to refuse to quit. Church planting is so challenging and if you have an escape hatch, the odds are when things are really intense, you probably will walk through one of those escape hatches. @ClintJClifton

We like the idea of being a consistent factor, a foundational person and a familiar face. It’s encouraging, especially for people who don’t take church life seriously, to see us always present. — Amanda Hudson

I look back at the seasons of difficulty as a gift now, where in the midst of them I saw them as the worst possible thing that could happen. If you stick it out when things are crushingly difficult, there comes a day you look back and say I’m so glad I didn’t quit. @ClintJClifton

Looking back is essential in the Christian life. When we remember past trials and we’ve seen the ways that God’s brought us through, that can definitely be powerful in moving us forward through the challenges in church planting. — Jeff Belcher

If you’re starting to wonder, “Did I do the right thing?” – the the answer is yes. Don’t don’t quit. Don’t give up. Church planting is difficult. We’re fighting for the eternity of people and so there’s a real adversary in the midst of that. @ClintJClifton

We refer to one another all the time as family, and families don’t quit one another. If we as planters come before our congregants and say we’re a family, then what does that say if we bail out when things get hard? That’s not the nature of the family of God. — Jeff Belcher

Walking away, like a father walking away from his family, is devastating. If when things get hard, we walk away, then that says a lot about the God we’re proclaiming to people. Commitment to church family is just foundational to planting. — Jeff Belcher

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Episode 696: When a church sends out a planter, the relationship hasn’t ended; it’s just begun. Host Clint Clifton discusses with Jason Robertson and Dannie Williams how Sending Church pastors can provide meaningful support to planters as they face their inevitable challenges.

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In the church I planted 20 years ago, we didn’t have a lot of meaningful encouragement outside of our church. It became a real lonely experience at times. @Jason Robertson

If they have a project early on, we participate in it. The journey is so serious but it can be fun, so just have fun with the planter. @Dannie Williams

Sometimes church planting spouses get the short end of the stick. They often are doing a lot of the heavy lifting for none of the recognition. It’s important to encourage church planting wives. @ClintJClifton

We did a retreat and one of the planter wives started crying with gratitude of how they had been treated like royalty. We just want to say to them, “We really do care about you. This is not just religious talk. It’s the real deal.” @Dannie Williams

One of our church planters got Covid and it ended up becoming pneumonia. He was in the hospital and we could not go in. His spouse could not be with him. We started every single day having a worship service and prayer meeting outside his hospital window. @Jason Robertson

It’s one thing for me to go to a random church that I don’t know and say, “Hey, will you support me?” It’s another thing for you to speak on my behalf with that pastor. @ClintJClifton

I think of it as if I were out there, what would God do for me? What kind of commitment would he have? He’s going to be motivating people to rally to the cause of kingdom advancement that you are part of. @Dannie Williams

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Episode 695: How you plant a church is shaped by missiology and what you end up with is shaped by ecclesiology. Host Ed Stetzer hashes through different approaches to both with Nathan Knight and Rivers Partin.

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The Christian understands that there’s more to this than trying to alleviate earthly suffering, but we have a deeper desire to relieve eternal suffering. @NathanKnightDC

My motivation is we see the kingdom of God breaking into the world. Part of our mission is to work to make the world more like Jesus would want it to be. “Thy kingdom come, thy will be done, on earth as it is in heaven.” @EdStetzer

We use very incarnational language: We’re the way Jesus shows His love to people in our neighborhood. We want to see people’s eternal destiny being changed. We also start with it’s an act of worship to serve and the results are up to the Lord. — Rivers Partin

It’s a kingdom work even if I don’t see someone repent that day, because we’re bringing about restoration in this place. We’re planting seeds and we’re allowing the Lord to to do the growing. — Rivers Partin

So much of the epistles are concerned about people not persevering and enduring. So when you think about the mission of the church, I’m going to front-load knowing so much of the work of the Church is to make sure and get the person to their deathbed still following Jesus under the power of the Holy Spirit. @NathanKnightDC

Your ecclesiology really matters. It’s one of the things that I think people don’t think about until there’s a problem. They think of ecclesiology as almost like the bylaws to use when we have a problem, but I think ecclesiology is a display of God’s glory that really matters. @EdStetzer

We spent most of our time just trying to understand what a church is and what a church does, what a pastor is what a pastor does, since that’s what we were endeavoring to be. As a consequence we front-loaded all that ecclesiology into the work of the church so that she would be set up to take in those new believers and then orient into our life together. @NathanKnightDC

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