Next Level Agents: The Kevin & Fred Show - Interviews with the best and brightest minds in the real estate industry

You're busy. You're closing deals. You might even be making great money. But are you actually building toward freedom — or just building a faster treadmill? Kevin Kauffman sits down with returning guest and real estate veteran Chris Bowers for a raw, no-fluff conversation about what it really takes to get to the next level in both production and building residual income through recruiting at eXp Realty.

Chris has been chasing a specific goal for six years — $50,000 a month in passive income — and he's getting close. But what makes this episode hit different is the moment he realizes mid-conversation that it was never about the money at all. It's about time. And that distinction changes everything about how you approach your business.

Key themes from this episode:

The difference between flexibility and actual freedom — and why most agents are lying to themselves about which one they have

Why the number of no's you get in recruiting is directly tied to the income you make — and how to get emotionally ready to handle more of them

How clarity on your "one thing" makes tactics irrelevant — and why the agents who win aren't necessarily the smartest, just the most focused

The ego risk of building at eXp vs. the capital risk of traditional brokerage ownership — and which one is actually harder to swallow

What happens when you hit 200 agents in your organization and realize what got you there won't get you to the next level

Why vision without daily action is just daydreaming — and how to close the gap between the life you want and the one you're actually living

If you've been telling yourself you don't have time to recruit, this episode is a direct challenge to that story. Chris and Kevin break down why recruiting isn't a separate business — it IS the business — and how 30 focused minutes a day can change your financial trajectory more than another year of grinding production.

Ready to learn more about what building at eXp could look like for you? Head to⁠ nextlevelagents.com/exp⁠ to get the full picture.

What if the thing standing between you and a bigger team isn't your budget, your leads, or your market… it's a 15-minute phone call you keep skipping?

Houston team leader Shahin Naghavi went from 12 agents to 55 in roughly six months. No fancy funnel. No expensive recruiting company. Just a phone, a few seconds of video, and a willingness to do the one thing most team leaders hand off: actually talk to the people who want to work with him. He breaks down the exact ad spend, the speed-to-lead system, and the recruiting call framework he uses every single time.

Here's what you'll want to steal from this one:

The 10-second video ad that pulls agents in: film yourself, say you need licensed agents, run it for $100 a day, and let the volume do the work

Why speed to lead wins recruiting: the moment a lead comes in, Shahin or his sales manager is on a group text within minutes, and the agent gets to see the actual team leader show up

The "spend it now" testing philosophy: instead of waiting six months to see if something works, front-load the money and find out fast

The 15-minute recruiting call framework: splits first, value prop second, one simple requirement to join (be hyper supportive)

The hard truth about who belongs on your team: every agent you bring on should move your business forward, not just give you someone to help

If you've been telling yourself you can't recruit because you don't have the leads, the budget, or the time, this episode flips that excuse on its head. The real question is whether you're willing to be the person who picks up the phone.

Ready to build a team that runs without you and a business that takes you to your next level? Come see what we're building at eXp: https://nextlevelagents.com/exp/. Want to connect with us live? Check out the events tab at https://nextlevelagents.com for our upcoming virtual and in-person masterminds.

Connect with the guest:

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What if the thing holding your business back isn't your lead gen, your market, or your systems? What if it's the version of you that's showing up every day? That's the question Kevin Kauffman puts on the table in this episode, and it changes everything about how you approach growth.

Most agents don't have a knowledge problem. They know they should be making more calls, recruiting, posting more, following up better. The information is everywhere. What's rare is transformation, and transformation requires an identity shift that most people avoid because it's uncomfortable. This one is all about closing that gap between who you are today and who your future requires you to become.

What you'll take away:

Your future business is waiting on a future version of you. If this one hit, go listen to the full episode, then come find out what becoming that person looks like inside our community at nextlevelagents.com/exp. Want to connect in person or virtually first? Check the events tab at nextlevelagents.com for the upcoming mastermind calendar.

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The market always changes. The mistake most agents make is believing whatever market they're in right now is permanent. It isn't. The agents who got licensed in 2020 rode low rates and easy appreciation, then watched a shift expose every weak habit they'd been able to hide. So how do you build a business that still works when everything changes?

In this one, Kevin Kauffman walks through eight principles to market-proof your business. These aren't tricks or tactics for one season. They're operating standards that hold up in every market, easy or hard.

Here's what gets covered:

Does it make the boat go faster? Filter every decision through one question and stop confusing activity with progress

Double down and narrow your lead gen. Winners do two or three things exceptionally well, not twenty things halfway

Master conversion. Most agents don't have a lead problem, they have a conversion problem, and conversion is a learnable skill

Be visible and communicative. Silence creates anxiety in uncertain markets, and most agents disappear when things get hard

Seek more accountability and mentorship. Hard markets expose isolated people, so don't pull away from the rooms that keep you sharp

Ready to find the room where this kind of thinking is the standard, not the exception? That's exactly what we've built at Next Level Agents. Come see what it looks like to grow alongside agents who refuse to coast: https://nextlevelagents.com/exp/

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What if the reason you're stuck has nothing to do with the market and everything to do with the stories you keep telling yourself? You don't need a new CRM, a new lead source, or one more class. Most of the time you need fewer distractions, more focus, and the willingness to do the boring work long enough for it to pay off.

This one is simple on purpose. No hype, no shiny systems. Just seven lessons from a mentor early in my career that shaped how I think about business, leadership, and the life I'm trying to build. They've stuck with me for years, and the older I get the more true they feel.

Here's what we get into:

Pick one lesson. Find where you're out of alignment with it. Then make one change. One new standard, one new habit, one courageous action. Small shifts repeated consistently are what create the big outcomes. If this one hits, share it with another agent and come see what we're building. Start at nextlevelagents.com/exp and check the events tab at nextlevelagents.com for our next virtual and in-person masterminds.

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Most agents think transformation is a moment: the big win, the award, the closing that changes everything. It isn't. It's the quiet, daily work nobody claps for. In this conversation, Brandon Snyder and Erik Kelly get into what it actually takes to become the person your goals require, and why the standards you hold (for yourself and the people around you) shape everything else.

If a problem has been hanging around in your business for more than six months, this one's going to sting in the best way. Brandon and Erik unpack integrity, accountability, and the kind of legacy you build in the moments when nobody's watching. Not the stage, not the trophy, the Tuesday-afternoon version of you.

What you'll take away from this episode:

Ready to surround yourself with people who hold a higher standard? That's exactly what we're building. Learn how to plug into the team and the bigger vision at nextlevelagents.com/exp. Want to connect in person? Check the events tab at nextlevelagents.com for upcoming virtual and in-person masterminds.

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Every agent hits a season where nothing seems to work. Confidence is low, the business feels shaky, and the future looks blurry. The hardest part isn't even the struggle itself — it's that while you're in it, you can't see what any of it is producing. You think you're losing. But here's the pattern hiding in plain sight: right before the breakthrough, there's almost always a breaking point.

This solo episode digs into one of the most uncomfortable truths in business and life — that your greatest growth rarely comes from your wins. It comes from the moments that humbled you, broke you down, and made you question whether you'd make it. Those are the exact moments quietly building the next version of you.

Here's what you'll take away:

If you're in a hard season right now, this one's for you. Don't interpret the silence as failure. Your roots might be growing deeper than you can see. The only real requirement is that you don't give up on yourself. When you're ready to surround yourself with people who'll push you to your next level, come see what we're building. Learn more about joining us at eXp here: https://nextlevelagents.com/exp/ — and check out the events tab at https://nextlevelagents.com for our upcoming virtual and in-person masterminds.

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Overthinking disguises itself as intelligence. It feels strategic. It feels responsible. Meanwhile, somebody else made a decision in six minutes that you've been sitting on for six months — and they're already on version 10 while you're still trying to perfect the launch.

In this solo episode, Kevin breaks down a concept he picked up from his friend Dustin Runyon: underthinking. Not recklessness. Not carelessness. Just shrinking the gap between idea and execution so you can actually build the business you keep planning to build.

What you'll take away from this episode:

Ready to take it further? If this hit home, the next step is finding the right environment to actually execute on what you just heard. Head to nextlevelagents.com/exp to learn more about what we're building at Next Level Agents, or check out the events tab at nextlevelagents.com for the next virtual or in-person mastermind on the calendar. The leaders who win in this market aren't the ones with the best slogans — they're the ones willing to execute consistently. Come join a room full of them.

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Every agent says it eventually: "I just don't have enough time." But the agents crushing it in your market have the exact same 24 hours you do. So what's the actual difference? In this solo episode, Kevin breaks down a conversation he had with Chris Suarez from PLACE that reframes the whole "time" conversation and exposes the real culprit behind most agents stalling out.

This one is about the decisions you're making (or avoiding), the difference between busy and productive, and why so much of what feels like work is actually just emotional relief in disguise. If your calendar is full but your pipeline isn't, this episode is for you.

What you'll take away from this episode:

Ready to stop tweaking and start scaling? If this episode hit home and you're craving the kind of mastermind that actually moves the needle on your business, head to⁠ nextlevelagents.com/exp⁠ to learn what it looks like to plug into our community. Or check out the events tab at⁠ nextlevelagents.com⁠ for our upcoming virtual and in-person masterminds — the same kind of room where this conversation happened.

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Most successful people aren't doing something secret. They're just executing faster than everyone else. In this solo episode, Kevin unpacks 10 controversial truths about leadership, production, and personal responsibility — inspired by notes he's revisited multiple times from Alex Hormozi's "24 Controversial Truths About Success and Failure" on the Modern Wisdom podcast.

This isn't a soft listen. Kevin gets direct about the leadership trap most agents won't admit to, why preparation is often procrastination in disguise, and the difference between keeping the peace and keeping the tension. If you lead a team — or you're trying to build something meaningful in a market that keeps exposing weak habits, weak standards, and weak culture — this one's worth your time.

What you'll take away from this episode:

Why speed of execution beats perfect strategy every time

How consistency outperforms intensity (and why the sprint-and-burnout cycle is killing your momentum)

Why the hard conversation you're avoiding is the one that matters most

The uncomfortable reality that your organization is a mirror of you

What it really takes to fall in love with the climb, not just the rewards

Ready to take it further? If this hit home, the next step is finding the right environment to actually execute on what you just heard. Head to nextlevelagents.com/exp to learn more about what we're building at Next Level Agents, or check out the events tab at nextlevelagents.com for the next virtual or in-person mastermind on the calendar. The leaders who win in this market aren't the ones with the best slogans — they're the ones willing to execute consistently. Come join a room full of them.

Please leave us a review at ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://ratethispodcast.com/nla