Out There

When David Klebosky was out in the desert earlier this year, he ended up being shot at. The gunfire wasn't malicious, but there were bullets coming at him.

Yet David didn't freak out.

This kind of response is typical for David; he always seems to remain calm in the face of stress.

On this episode, producer Max Wasserman delves into David's past and explores what makes some of us so unflappable.

As a marine biologist, Colin Howe sees diversity as an indicator of health: the more diverse an ecosystem, the more likely it is to thrive.

But while scientists work hard to preserve diversity in the wild, they often fail to achieve it in the workplace.

Colin is one of just a handful of Black biologists in the United States. On this episode, we talk with him about pursuing his passion in a predominantly white field. And we discuss what the oceans can teach us about the benefits of diversity.

When KC Cheng decided to hike the Camino de Santiago, she imagined it as a kind of therapy. She wanted to feel young and adventurous again, in charge of her own life.

Like so many other thru-hikers, she saw a long-distance trek as an opportunity for an emotional reset.

But what does a solo adventure really do to a person? Does "getting away from it all" change us in a fundamental way?

On this episode, KC shares the story of a surprising realization she made as a result of her pilgrimage.

If you attended a predominantly white college or university, there was probably an outdoors program on campus. And it was likely composed of mostly white people.

If you went to a historically Black college or university, chances are, there was no outdoor program. And you probably grew up hearing that the outdoors was for white people.

On this episode, we talk with outdoor adventurer and educator Ron Griswell about his efforts to close the adventure gap. We share the story of how Ron became a leader in the outdoor industry; we discuss the barriers that keep many people of color from engaging in outdoor adventures; and we talk about the ways that Black joy can help combat racist narratives.

What does "Black Joy" mean to you? Send us a voice message here, and we might air it on the show!

Everyone suffers. Sometimes it's obvious; other times it's less visible. But it's inevitable that we'll suffer at some point in our lives. And typically, we hate it.

But what if hardships serve a purpose? What if the struggles we try so hard to avoid could actually enhance our lives?

On this episode, Megan McLaughlin takes us from Big Bend National Park to the forests of Arkansas, and explains how she has found sweetness, both in miserable outdoor experiences, and in a cancer diagnosis.

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Growing up in an emotionally abusive household, Meg Atteberry yearned for her parents' approval. But no matter how hard she tried, the message was always the same: you are not enough. The emotional scars from her upbringing lingered long into adulthood.

Then one day, Meg took a dangerous fall while rock climbing.

The brush with death resulted in fresh trauma. But in the aftermath of the accident, something surprising started to happen.

On this episode, Meg shares the story of how a freak accident changed her relationship with climbing, and with her parents.

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Dierdre Wolownick is the oldest woman to have climbed El Capitan in Yosemite National Park. She's also a teacher, a musician, a marathon runner — and the mother of renowned rock climber Alex Honnold.

On this episode, we talk with Dierdre about what it was like raising a kid like Alex.

We discuss her efforts to keep Alex safe as a child, without stifling his love for climbing. We talk about the difference between risk and consequence. And we explore Dierdre's own journey to becoming a climber, and how learning about her son's passion changed their relationship.

Black Lives Matter.

The events that have been unfolding over the past few weeks have made it very clear that all of us need to be doing much more to actively fight racism. One of the ways that Out There can help is to use our platform to amplify the voices of Black, Indigenous and People of Color.

The outdoors should be a place where anyone can go, without fearing violence, harassment, or discrimination.

On this episode, we talk about what we, as a podcast, commit to doing, to become part of the solution rather than adding to the problem.

The events that have been unfolding across the United States over the past weeks have driven home once again that simply existing carries risks if you have dark skin.

Many of us like to think that nature is an equalizer — a place to escape the injustices of society. But it's not so simple.

On this bonus episode, producer Jackie Sojico bring you a story that first aired several years ago. It's about ornithologist and birder Drew Lanham and his quest to pursue his passion outdoors as a POC.

Amber McDaniel lives on the road full-time. She and her partner are both freelance writers, so working remotely isn't a problem for them. And they love the freedom to spend their days in America's most beautiful natural places.

But what happens to van lifers when a pandemic hits? Where do you go, when campgrounds and public lands start to close?

On this episode, Amber joins us to talk about "staying home" when you don't have a home.

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