Pánsá Pánsá Podcast

On the 4th season of my discussion, I was fortunate to have met Professor Dialika Sall to start the 4th season of the podcast and our conversation paved the way for an upcoming discussion on the podcast. Professor Sall is an assistant professor of Sociology at the Lehman College-City University of New York. When I learned about her previous research work, I knew we would have a solid discussion about her research. I met Prof. Sall at The African Center in NYC during a book signing and community discussion. She was the moderator of a book event with Prof. Boukary Sawadogo on his recently published book Africans in Harlem an Untold New York Story.

It is customary on Pánsá Pánsá podcast conversation to talk about the childhood experiences of guests during their formative years, especially if they are children of immigrants. During our conversation, we discussed immigrant identity and black experiences and Prof. Sall’s childhood experiences growing up in the Bronx. She gave an insight into the benefit and challenges of being a second-generation African immigrants child. We further talked about her experiences navigating through sometimes diverse and predominantly white spaces throughout her schooling. Dr. Sall went to boarding school in New Hampshire for high school, attended Pomona College in California for undergraduate studies, and later completed her graduate studies at Columbia University. We talked about how these experiences sparked her interest in sociology and her area of racial and ethnic identity studies.

Prof. Sall's research focuses on the theory of assimilation and acculturation of African youth into the mainstream of American society. Most of our conversation centers on her research on children of African immigrants from low-income families. In her findings, African youth selectively acculturate into their American communities, and she highlighted three areas of selective acculturation: fashion, food, and language. We discussed biases and scant conclusions on previous research on African immigrants in the USA. We further discussed internalized anti-black messages that target other minorities based on ethnicity, religion, skin color, accent, food smell, etc. Dr. Sall gave a short preview of her upcoming book “Connecting Black: Second-Generation Africans in America, " based on expanding her research work.Dr. Sall is the author of the forthcoming book, “Connecting Black: Second-Generation Africans in America,” and has been published in several academic journals. Dr. Sall earned a Ph.D. in Sociology from Columbia University and B.A. from Pomona College. She is second-generation Senegalese, raised in the Bronx, NY. Learn more about her work at www.dialikasall.com

Chapters:

00:00 Introduction to Professor Jalita Sa and her background

02:15 Growing up in the Bronx and immigrant community dynamics

04:02 Challenges and benefits of growing up in an immigrant home

07:40 The importance of community, food, and cultural pride

10:24 Parental influence and motivation from immigrant success stories

13:00 Extracurricular activities and their role in development

16:52 Communication, identity, and cultural expression in immigrant families

20:02 Understanding racial and black identity in America

22:24 College experiences and navigating diverse social environments

25:59 The importance of diversifying social circles in college

27:51 Impact of home environment on academic and social confidence

32:03 Research on racial and ethnic identity among West African youth

42:08 Theories of acculturation and cultural engagement

44:51 Selective acculturation and success among low-income youth

50:17 Contributions of African culture and exchange in America

01:03:00 Future projects and ongoing research on immigrant youth

01:07:00 The evolving influence of African culture in America

01:11:28 Connecting with Dr. Sa and community engagement

On the 4th season of my discussion on the Pansa Pansa podcast, I wanted to change the gear by exploring the specifics of challenges we face at large as African immigrants abroad. As I continue to talk about the intergenerational relationship, I also want to discuss specific topics such as inequalities we experience in our community in the area of education, health disparities, language barriers, lack of applicable social services, biases, and discrimination. We experience these inequalities due to our countries of origin, language, religion, race, cultural background, etc. All these mentioned barriers would be interconnected with topics such as domestic violence, mental health awareness, acculturation, and social functionality as we adapt to life in America or elsewhere.  

I was fortunate to have met Professor Dialika Sall to start the 4th season of the podcast and paved the way for an upcoming discussion on the Pansa Pansa podcast. 

In early summer, I received an email from Chinedu Achebe introducing me to his recently published book The Miseducation of Obi Ifeanyi. I reviewed the synopsis and the e-book he attached to the email. The book reflects on the second generation of highly educated Nigerians trying to balance family life, career, and intergenerational relationships within the family and society. The plot of the story aligns with many discussions on Pánsá Pánsá Forum and on the podcast. Mr. Chinedu Achebe is a storyteller, writer, and author of The Miseducation of Obi Ifeanyi. His first book, Blunted on Reality was published in 2012 and he has also written articles for Huffington Post, Medium, and Bella Nigeria. 

As I regularly do with my guest on the podcast, we talked about Mr. Achebe’s family background, his identity as a son of a Nigerian immigrant family, the challenges, and the benefit of growing up in an African immigrant home. We further discussed balancing the two identities of his Nigerian background and his black identity. We talked about his college experience and his social circle during those early years. As a son of a Nigerian immigrant born and raised in the USA, Mr. Achebe shared some wisdom on how African immigrant parents can build better relationships with their children. 

The Miseducation of Obi Ifeanyi reflects on the second generation of highly educated Nigerians trying to balance family life, career, and intergenerational relationships. The book reflects on Obi's relationship with his parents. A father who steps in when he sees his son Obi, the main character in the book, struggling financially with his family. We further discussed the political, religious, and cultural belief that was generously injected into the dialogues among the characters in the book. It shows that Mr. Achebe is an avid reader of diverse subjects, and he confirmed it during our conversation. As I always said, “to be a writer, you must first be a reader.” 

As we discussed the male characters in the book, we also talked about the female characters.  Mr. Achebe accurately portrayed Nkechi as another strong character in the book. In Nkechi persona, he interwoven the challenges of motherhood and a stay home mother who continues to build her career and work on her ambitions. Nkechi was a self-assured woman who stated her opinions and had a strong personality, commonly attributed to many Nigerian women. The question is, can a woman of African origin do it all? Can a woman of this era balance traditional values associated with African women, such as motherhood, dutiful housewife to husband and the extended family, and modernity of navigating their career as well as climbing the ladder in a corporate world? You must read the book to find out. 

I could not resist discussing the character of Sade, who was campaigning for political office as a woman of color. Sade felt she had to defend her blackness to black people simply because she is half Nigerian. The question is, who is black enough in America? If only one of your parents is African American descendant of an enslaved person, your blackness would be challenged. If you were born in America to immigrants of African descent, or/and Asian descent your blackness would be challenged. (Kamala Harris, United States Vice President). If you are biracial born in the USA and one of your parents originates from Africans in the diaspora, your blackness would be challenged (President Barack Obama). The book is a page-tuner, and there was no dull moment.

The Miseducation of Obi Ifeanyi is available on Amazon both in hard copy and eBook. I really appreciate Mr. Achebe introducing me to his publications and for coming to the Pánsá Pánsá podcast to have a conversation with me. I know this book could be a source of open discussion within the community to openly discuss the uncomfortable conversation. 

Since the launching of Pánsá Pánsá Forum, part of the mission has been to engage the diversity of the African immigrant community in conversation about their experiences. Before starting my podcast, I held forums in Bronx, NY, which always included the diverse first and second generations of our African immigrant community. When I decided to move the conversation online to start a podcast, the idea had not changed, and I have continued to engage our diverse population members of our community both in the USA and abroad. I came to know Mr. Abdoulaye Cisse through Dr. Kelechi Lamberts, who was enthusiastic about our meeting and working together on a community project. Even though I have been working in the vicinity of the south Bronx for many years, I never knew about BABA and the incredible and selfless work the organization has been doing within the community. Mr. Abdoulaye Cisse and I recently collaborated on a community conversation with Dr. Kelechi Ibe Lambert of My Black is Transnational and on the experiences of African immigrant parents and their children. The community conversation, which took place in three different parts, focuses the discussion on the experiences of African immigrant parents and their children as we try to balance between two worlds. The event was a success, with many members of our community, both in the USA and in the diaspora, joining the conversation on zoom. 

During my conversation with Mr. Adboulaye Cisse on this podcast episode, we discussed his childhood experience growing up in an African immigrant home and the extended community that contributes to who he is today. We discuss his identity as it relates to his African heritage and black identity. We talked about the challenges parents and children face in America as they try to balance between worlds of African identity, race relations, and navigating through the unknowns of American society. The second part of the conversation was dedicated to discussing his organization BABA. Mr. Cisse talked about what prompted his interest in starting the organization and the target population, the organization, intended to serve. He spoke about the project the organization has worked on in the past, what they are presently working on, and their future projects. We talked about community outreach and how BABA is also connecting with other organizations working with the youth within the locality. I am grateful for Mr. Abdoulaye Cisse coming to the Pansa Pansa forum to have a conversation with me and for the outstanding work BABA is doing in community engagements. 

Biography 

Abdoulaye Cisse, a son of Guinea-Conakry and a representative of the growing member of the West African community in the Bronx, is a well-connected community leader who advocates and mobilizes Black immigrants, the greater Black diaspora, and the greater Islamic community in NYC. His outreach and organizing skills culminate in a four-year education in marketing, a seven-year sales experience, and a life-long passion for serving his community.

 Abdoulaye’s passion and proven track record have been recognized with a proclamation from New York State and an honorary plaque from Black People Rock Honors.

 BABA Inc, an organization he leads, has hosted dozens of programs that primarily serve the Black diaspora. BABA’s mission is to call for unity and provide culturally tailored educational and social support services that build skills, promote self-efficacy, and improve the quality of life for individuals and families in the Black diaspora community. BABA Inc currently has a board of five influential people, a staff of two people, and a volunteer group of close to 50 people. The organization has built a global network in less than a year while empowering its local grassroots community.

For WNYC story log on https://www.wnyc.org/story/radio-rookies-reconnect-incarcerated-parent

Folashade Olatunde just graduated from Lehman College with her bachelor's degree in journalism with a double minor in sociology and Africana studies. Folashade was born and raised in the Bronx, and she is one of the youngest in her family and a first-generation graduate. She loves reading, researching, and watching documentaries that challenge her and make her want to be a better person. One day, Folashade intends to write a book about her life and travel the world. She would also love to host her own podcast. Folashade lives in Mott Haven, in the south Bronx, with her mom and a puppy named Miracle.

I became aware of Folashade Olatunde’s story while listening to WNYC Radio Rookies, where her story was featured. Radio Rookie is a WNYC radio program where teenagers and young adults are allowed to work and build experiences in journalism. They are provided with resources, mentorship, and training to tell their stories and stories of the world around them. Folashade was one of the young adults who was afforded the opportunity where she tells a powerful story about her family. Folashade was mentored by Jami Floyd, a lawyer, and a well-respected anchor in the field of journalism. On Radio Rookies, Folashade shared with listeners the challenges she has been going through trying to rebuild her relationship with her Nigerian father. Her father has been incarcerated since she was two years old. When I heard her name, I was sure that one or both of her parents must be from Nigeria, and I thought about reaching out to Folashade.

Folashade grew up in the Bronx and attended Morris Academy for collaborative studies in the south Bronx, located in a poor neighborhood. According to a CNN Business article, Morris Academy is different in its teaching approach and achieves a high graduation rate of students who would eventually go to college. Many public schools within the south Bronx have a high truancy record rate, which often results in poor graduation rates. Other challenges facing students in a public school in the Bronx include unmanageable classroom size, bullying, and lack of technology. Family factors include poverty, homelessness, and lack of access to resources to address behavioral and mental health challenges students may be experiencing. Her determination, her mother’s support, and dedicated school staff, such as the teachers and other administrators, contributed to Folashade's excelling academically in high school and college. Folashade graduated from Lehman College (CUNY) with Honors, and she wants to still further her education beyond her Bachelor's degree.

As we talked, I could not leave out Folashade’s story of being featured by CNN Business as the first to graduate college in her family and her meeting with Michelle Obama during her senior year in high school.

On the family front, Folashade’s mother is African American, and we briefly discuss her two heritages, African American and Nigerian. With Folashade’s approval, we dived into the conversation about her relationship with your father, who is serving time in prison for an illegal drug conviction. She talked about her relationship with her father and her efforts to connect with him and get to know him. She spoke about how life experiences taught her about overcoming obstacles, self-discovery, and self-love, which is a powerful message and would inspire listeners. I appreciate Folashade for coming on the Pánsá Pánsá podcast to have a conversation with me to talk about her high school and colleges experiences. She was courageous and kind in sharing her experience growing up in the US as a daughter of a Nigerian immigrant father and a loving mother of African American heritage. Thank you, Folashade Olatunde, for your generosity and vulnerability in sharing your experiences with me and those you can empower with your story. 

I came across Ibironke Otusile’s impressive video, which was shared on social media, calling on Yoruba leaders and the Yoruba people in the diaspora to unite. I was impressed by her excellent articulation of the Yoruba language and the core message she presented. Otusile’s core message on the video was a call for unity of Yoruba people in the diaspora. It is extraordinary impressive that the younger generations in the diaspora are taking pride in the Yoruba language, culture, and unity of our people in the diaspora. After watching the video, others who also saw the video asked that I invite Otusile for a conversation on Pánsá Pánsá Forum for discussion. I was enthusiastic about such a suggestion, but how could I contact her? And someone advised me to look her up on social media. I was able to send a message to Otusile through her Instagram page. She eventually replied and agreed to be a guest on my podcast. There was no dull moment throughout our conversation. She was energetic, funny, and passionate about her heritage.

Otusile grew up in NYC when it wasn’t cool to be African is especially a common belief among the children of African immigrants born in America or those who came to America at a young age. Before we talk about the video and the fantastic work she does in promoting the unity of Yoruba people in the diaspora and her impressive articulation of the Yoruba language, we discussed African immigrant identity and black experiences. We discussed balancing the two worlds of growing up in a Nigerian immigrant home and black identity. I was impressed by Otusile’s pride and passion for the Yoruba language and the influence her parents played in fostering such appreciation. We talked about the benefits and challenges of growing up in immigrant homes. We discussed Otusile’s social and academic life in college and if growing up in an immigrant’s home influenced how she interacts with her professor and the diversity of students on her college campus.

For our audiences, who may be curious about the video she presented on social media on Yoruba in the diaspora, Otusile talked about the video message and what inspired her to speak about the subject. She expresses her desire to save our ancestral Yoruba nation for the sake of the younger generation and those whose ancestors were brought here during slavery. Those who may want to connect to their heritage. Otusile is presently working on a new project by traveling across Africa, and she creates video content for her YouTube channel.

Ibironke Otusile is a first-generation Nigerian-American born and raised in New York. Her parents hail from the Yoruba ethnic group in Nigeria, West Africa. Growing up in a time when it was not cool to be African, Ibironke created her own lens to understand the diaspora from a Yoruba and American viewpoint. Ibironke holds a Bachelor’s degree in Molecular Biology & Biochemistry and a Master’s degree in Biomedical Sciences. In her spare time, she enjoys traveling across the African continent and creating content for her YouTube channel titled “Ibironke Otusile.”

Primary goal:

Educational

Keywords:

African immigrant, identity, culture, Faith novel, Nigerian American, diaspora, intergenerational trauma, community, storytelling

Key topics:

Dual identity and cultural navigation

Impact of upbringing in predominantly white neighborhoods

The significance of faith and heritage

Intergenerational trauma and communication

The role of community and storytelling in identity

Sound bites:

"We need to listen to our children more"

"Failure is part of growth and success"

"Storytelling can bring us back home"

Chapters

00:00 Introduction to the African Immigrant Experience

01:50 Itoro Bassi's Background and Education

04:05 Growing Up in a Predominantly White Neighborhood

06:51 The Role of Nigerian Culture and Food

11:05 Navigating School and Peer Pressure

14:50 Parenting, Communication, and Cultural Silence

19:05 Living in Nigeria and the Diaspora

22:47 Challenges of Identity and Belonging

27:00 College Experience and Cultural Integration

29:46 Reflections on Moving to Nigeria

33:54 The Inspiration Behind 'Faith' and Its Themes

39:07 Intergenerational Trauma and Cultural Legacy

43:01 The Future of African Immigrant Stories

Summary:

A few months ago, I received an email from May Davis, the marketing manager at Malarkey Books, who reached out to me about new author Itoro Bassey and her new publication Faith. Even though I was not aware of the book or read the book, she provided me with a synopsis of the book, and upon my review of the abstract, the “Faith” storyline relates to the many discussions on the Pánsá Pánsá forum. I could not resist but to invite Itoro Bassey to my platform to have a conversation about the book, her experience growing up in an immigrant home, her college life, and her decision to relocate to Nigeria.

Itoro Bassey is a Nigerian-American writer, journalist, and storyteller. She was born in Houston, Texas, and raised in New England. She has received writing fellowships at the Vermont Studio Center, the San Francisco Writers Grotto, and The Edward Albee Foundation, among others. Her short story, To the Children Growing Up in the Aftermath of Their Parents’ War, won third place in the Glimmer Train Short Fiction Award. Some of her famous pieces of writing are ⁠Running⁠, ⁠Anti-Blackness and the African Immigrant⁠, and ⁠A Visitor in My Homelands. ⁠

Faith is a coming-of-age tale about Arit Essien, a first-generation Nigerian-American woman born and raised in the U.S. who resettles in Nigeria. The novel reflects four generations of women riff on ideas of faith, expectation, identity, and independence. It's a heartbreaking conversation between the dead and the living, the past and the present, and a young woman struggling to find her place in it all.

As we dive into conversation on “Faith” we discussed previous essays written by Bassey, including Running, Anti-blackness and the African immigrant and A visitor in my homeland. The articles emphasize trying to balance between two worlds of identity as a daughter of Nigerian immigrant on the immigrant experience and black identity in America and being seen as different or an outsider to those in Nigerian a place she calls home. She discussed how these essays inspired her to write “Faith”. We also talked about how Faith may also reflect on intergenerational trauma focusing on the mother and daughter’s relationship during the dialogue. As I said during our, when the traumatic experience of a parent is not recognized and addressed, it could be passed to the next generation. Sometimes traumatic experiences could lead to imposing rigid cultural values or religious values or implementing a toxic belief that “failure is not an option” could be rooted in the family foundation.

resources

Resources:

Faith by Itoro Bassi - https://www.amazon.com/Faith-Itoro-Bassi/dp/XXXXXX

Pansa Pansa Forum - https://pansapansa.org

Itoro Bassi on Twitter - https://twitter.com/etoroflower

Malarkey Books - https://malarkeybooks.com

I came across Blessing, aka Ibukun, after watching her impressive YouTube Yoruba lesson. I found it remarkable that the younger generations in the diaspora are taking pride in our language and our culture. I could not resist but invited her to the Pansa Pansa podcast to be a guest. I was grateful when she accepted my invitation. Ibukun was born in Nigeria, but she spent most of her formative years and adult life in Britain with her Nigerian parents. I wanted to know if growing up abroad influenced her passion and appreciation for the Yoruba language and how her parents influenced such love and supported her career choice even though she possessed a law degree. It was such a joy meeting Ibukun. Her kind-heartedness and her passion for the Yoruba language and culture reflect in the growth of her business. It has led her to become a full-time instructor in the field. From watching her YouTube video lessons on Yoruba and my conversation with Ibukun, she has the potential to inspire her students to learn the language and learn other aspects of the culture.

Before we get into the conversation about the Yoruba lesson and the fantastic work she is doing teaching our rich Yoruba culture and language to the world, we explore her review on identity as an African living in the diaspora. For African immigrants in the US, black identity and African immigrant struggle and how we navigate through a racialized world with our immigrant experience could be challenging. I have always been interested in conversing with Africans in Europe about their struggles in navigating through the European system as Africans. I wanted to know what it is like for people of African descent in England to navigate through such worlds. We talked about her social college life and how she adjusted to fit into the predominant culture on her college campus, especially coming from an African immigrant home.

Regarding Yoruba lessons, Ibukun and I discussed how the courses or the teaching are designed starting from beginner class, intermediary, and advanced class. We talked about the diversity of the student body. Some students come from parents of Yoruba origin, and others from different backgrounds, mainly from America. The Yoruba language cannot be separated from Yoruba culture. We also dive into teaching cultural traditions such as naming ceremonies, traditional greetings, wedding ceremonies, etc. Ibukun is also hosting a travel group to Nigeria where the participants would have the opportunity to visit historic sites and museums, dine and wine Nigerian food and experience the culture.

Blessing Kayode is a Yoruba teacher, creating dynamic Yoruba content to make the Yoruba language and culture easily accessible to those in the diaspora or those who have not had a chance to connect with their mother tongue or wish to learn Yoruba as a second language. She creates weekly detailed Yoruba videos on Youtube and short informational content on Instagram. She also generates resources/materials to support language learning. Listers can always connect with Ibukun through these links.Youtube: Blessing Kayode

Instagram: yoruba_lessons

Website: Www.yorubalessons.com

Dr. Boukary Sawadogo is an Associate Professor of Cinema Studies and Black Studies at the City College of City University of New York in the department of media and communication arts. Originally from the West African nation of Burkina Faso, he is an academic, author, filmmaker, and African animation film festival founder in Harlem. He has published extensively on African cinema. In 2020, Dr. Sawadogo launched the first animation film festival in the U.S. called Harlem African Animation Festival, devoted to animation films and series from Africa, whereby technology innovations were used to bring traditional African stories to the world. Recent trends of his work concern the new African diaspora—immigrant communities in Harlem—featured in his new book Africans in Harlem: An Untold New York Story (Fordham University Press, 2022). Dr. Buokary Sawadogo and I first met in Harlem at Kente Royal Gallery, owned and managed by Dodji and his wife, Phyllis. Dodji invited me to do traditional African storytelling for the opening night of one of the shows at his gallery. Dr. Sawadogo was among the audience, and he approached me after the story to introduce himself. At the time, Dr. Sawadogo talked about the project he was working on, and he asked if I could do traditional African Storytelling at the event. The event was scheduled to take place at the same time COVID-19 crippled the world, and as a result, the event was canceled. Early in March 2022, I received an email from Dr. Sawadogo about his forthcoming book titled African in Harlem: An Untold New York Story. I immediately sent Dr. Sawadogo an email to ask him to be a guest on the Pánsá Pánsá podcast, and I was grateful when he accepted my invitation. As I indicated during my conversation with Dr. Sawadogo, Harlem has been a manifestation of the black renaissance since the 1920s, which was not only limited to the revival of African American culture in music, dance, and theater but intellectually and political movements. I was interested in this particular subject as many new African immigrants, primarily francophone speakers, have taken home in Harlem. I was also interested in African immigrant businesses in Harlem and illuminating African immigrants' contributions to the development of Harlem economically and culturally. I wanted to know if African immigrants were given the due respect they deserved or recognized for their contribution. Dr. Sawadogo is an associate professor of cinema studies and black studies at City College of New York. Before we dived into his book, we talked about his area of teaching at the college. The discussion led me to ask about his view on African cinema, which includes the authenticity of African cinema and the influence of Europe and the western world on the image we see in African films today. During our discussion, the animation project he launched in 2020 was not left out. In discussing his new to-be-released book, Dr. Sawadogo gave a concise description of the book and the inspiration that led to this book project. What sometimes inspires us to work on a specific project may also encourage self-reflection to gain some clarity on how we see ourselves. We talked about African immigrants' experiences, black identity, and struggles in balancing both worlds. We discussed the tension between African immigrants and African Americans as a thousand-pound gorilla in a room that is often not addressed. African immigrants have contributed to the revitalization of Harlem economically, culturally, and socially, but the positive impacts were hardly recognized. He documented African immigrants' experiences and challenges in Harlem since the 1980s. The book includes the personal stories of a diverse group of African immigrants in Harlem, which is not limited to the traders but the restaurant owner, cab drivers, white collar workers, and immigrants from different works of life. The story of African-born immigrants and their fundamental contribution to Harlem