What has COVID-19 taught us about science advice? How have different countries responded to evolving evidence during the pandemic? Have some science advice models performed better than others in terms of public health outcomes? Can science advice really help much when evidence is partial or controversial, and decisions are needed at high speed?

Sir Peter Gluckman discusses these questions with Toby Wardman of SAPEA. We also discuss where to draw the line between evidence and democratic decision-making; whether scientists should air their disagreements in public or keep them behind closed doors; scientific hubris vs humility; and the emerging phenomenon of the celebrity science advisor.

Sir Peter is president of the International Network for Government Science Advice, president-elect of the International Science Council, director of Koi Tū: the Centre for Informed Futures at the University of Auckland, and the former Chief Scientific Advisor to the government of New Zealand.

As always, the opinions expressed in this episode are those of the speakers and not necessarily those of SAPEA or the European Commission.

• INGSA's evidence-to-policy tracker: https://www.ingsa.org/covid/policymaking-tracker-landing/