Relationship As Medicine

Jean and I explore the complex terrain of visibility and invisibility - what it's like when your internal experience doesn't match how the world sees you, and the cumulative harm that misperception inflicts over a lifetime. We talk about masking not as a moral failing but as a protective, sometimes life-saving skill, grounded in the sobering reality that disabled people face dramatically higher rates of violence, dismissal, and harm.

Together we unpack:

• Ableism: from structural and medical systems to the internalized beliefs we all carry, including how white wellness culture repackages suffering as a "gift" and turns symptoms into personal failings.

• The difference between trauma and neurodivergence: how they overlap, how they differ, and why practitioners should stop promising that "treating trauma" will make someone more neurotypical.

• What healing actually means: building capacity to be with what is, getting "weirder" and more authentic, and why a regulated nervous system can still feel rage when the situation calls for it.

• Herbal medicine: how plants like motherwort hold space for anger, turn down the volume on pain, and expand our capacity to experience the fullness of ourselves.

This is a conversation about staying with discomfort, honoring the mask, and trusting people as the experts on their own experience. It's for anyone who has ever felt unseen, and for the practitioners who want to do better.

Jean Madrone Lynch-Thomason is a clinical herbalist and Somatic Experiencing practitioner in Olympia, WA, which is traditional Squaxin territory. Their practice and teaching is focused on supporting chronically ill and disabled people, neurodivergent people - especially later diagnosed autistic folks and ADHDers, and queer and trans folks. They are informed by their experience as a trans-masc, nonbinary, multiply disabled queer parent with all the ADHD. Their work with people explores what it means to live in systems that harm while honoring agency, community, and authenticity. 

You can find Jean in these places:

www.jeanmadrone.com

IG: @wild.river.apothecary.somatics

For more on Shelby and her current offerings:

Autism & ADHD Assessment

If you're interested in assessment with Shelby, you can find out more here:

⁠shelby-leigh.com/autism-and-adhd-assessments

Neurocomplexity Group

A 6 week guided group for neurodivergent adults (whether you have a diagnosis, self-identify, or are curious and exploring) for self-understanding, nervous system tending, and living more ease-fully inside your own complex wiring.

The October groups are full, but if you’re interested please join the waitlist for the next groups in February.

Click here for more.

Embrace

Back for the third time, Embrace is an 8 month, neuro-affirming, trauma-informed group + 1:1 program for people who have done a lot of healing and feel it’s time to shift their focus away from endlessly ‘facing discomfort’ and move towards thriving.

Embrace offers space to slow down, soften the edges, tend to your nervous system and meet yourself with profound kindness.

Click here for more.

Shelby’s website:

www.shelby-leigh.com

What happens when two completely different nervous systems try to build a life together?

In this episode of Relationship as Medicine, we explore the complex dance of couples navigating neurodivergence, trauma, and different communication capacities.

We discuss how to "uncross the wires" and learn your partner's unique language without making either person wrong.

We also explore how intergenerational trauma impacts modern love, and how family constellations can help us untangle past family history from present relationship conflict.

Tune in to discover how the relationship itself becomes the ultimate space for healing. 

Luana Rose is a neurodivergent affirming Nervous System and Relationship Specialist with a seasoned expertise in Somatic Experiencing® and childhood (developmental) trauma resolution, who has helped 2000+ people in 40+ countries worldwide with a variety of mental, physical, emotional and relational problems, supporting her clients to feel safe and at home in their bodies and relationships.

Luana has a free workshop coming up in September - find out more and sign up here:

https://luma.com/xcsa76pl

You can also find Luana in these places:

Website: thegoodhumanacademy.com

IG: @thegoodhumanacademy

FB: @theluanarosecoaching

Shelby's offerings:

Autism & ADHD assessments:

⁠shelby-leigh.com/autism-and-adhd-assessments

Neurocomplexity Group:

Beginning in October, I am offering a 6 week guided group for neurodivergent adults (whether you have a diagnosis, self-identify, or are curious and exploring) for self-understanding, nervous system tending, and living more ease-fully inside your own complex wiring.

shelby-leigh.com/neurocomplexity-group

Embrace:

Back for the third time, Embrace is an 8 month, neuro-affirming, trauma-informed group + 1:1 program for people who have done a lot of healing and feel it’s time to shift their focus away from endlessly ‘facing discomfort’ and move towards thriving.

Embrace offers space to slow down, soften the edges, tend to your nervous system and meet yourself with profound kindness.

shelby-leigh.com/embrace

Shelby's website:

www.shelby-leigh.com

In part two of my conversation with Nyck Walsh, we continue exploring what it means to approach neurodivergence, therapy, and healing through a more relational, non-pathologizing, and deeply human lens.

Nyck is a somatic psychotherapist, counselor educator, and author of Neurodivergent Somatics in Therapy, and this conversation moves through so many important questions: What do we actually mean when we talk about safety? Who gets to define it? What happens when neurodivergent expression is misunderstood through trauma-only or pathology-based frameworks? And what does it look like to support people in ways that are collaborative, affirming, and rooted in curiosity rather than correction?

Together, we talk about safer space, trust, masking, diagnosis and self-identification, ableism in therapeutic spaces, the harm of being missed or misunderstood, and the profound freedom that can come when someone is finally able to understand themselves more clearly. We also touch on therapist self-care, power dynamics, and why this work asks all of us to keep learning, unlearning, and listening more deeply.

About Nyck

Nyck Walsh (he/they) brings a whole person, anti-oppressive, intersectional somatic lens to working with Autistic and KCS/VAST (more affirming language for “ADHD”) folks. A white, Autistic, VAST, queer, and trans counselor, Nyck is the director of the Nyck Walsh Counseling & Training Center and creator of the Neurodivergent Somatics model.

He curates reparative experiences for late-identified Autistic and KCS/VAST people to connect with their innate wisdom, dismantle ableism, be supported through challenges, and make meaning of their misunderstood neurodivergent experiences. His counselor education programs have attracted an international following, with both neurodivergent and neurotypical counselors alike reporting that they feel deeply supported and validated by his approach.

While being human brings no shortage of complexity, Nyck delights in frolicking in nature and living among the trees with his four-legged bestie in the mountains of what is colonially known as Colorado.

Find out more at his website: nyckwalsh.com

And you can find his new book, Neurodivergent Somatics in Therapy, An Anti-Oppressive Model for Whole Person Care, via the links below.

For US orders, use this link (it includes a 20% discount and free shipping):

https://wwnorton.com/books/9781324082910?promo=WALSH20

For orders throughout the UK, Europe and Asia, please use this link and discount code (which includes 30% off):

https://wwnorton.co.uk/books/9781324082910-neurodivergent-somatics-in-therapy

And the discount code is WN357

You can find Shelby via her website: www.shelby-leigh.com

If you're interested in assessment with Shelby, you can find out more here:

⁠shelby-leigh.com/autism-and-adhd-assessments⁠

This episode is a re-release, as it is the perfect entry into Season Two of Relationship As Medicine.

What does it mean to choose a wholeness paradigm instead of a pathology lens when it comes to neuro-affirming care? In this episode, I sit down with the brilliant Nyck Walsh to explore what happens when we bring compassion, authenticity, and somatics into the conversation about neurodivergence. Together, we touch into the radical permission it takes to be fully human and to rest into identities that have often been misunderstood or pathologized.

We explore the relief, grief, and even terror that can arise with late-in-life neurodivergent identification—and the profound sense of liberation that can come with finally having language for who we are. Nyck shares what it means to honor authenticity beneath masking, to unpack internalized ableism, and to reconnect with innate wisdom that has always been there, waiting to be trusted.

Our conversation also weaves in the intersections of privilege and oppression, the deep longing for belonging, and the all-too-common question: “Am I ___ enough?” Together, we name how neurodivergent folks often carry both tremendous courage and tremendous vulnerability as they navigate authenticity, safety, and connection in a neurotypical-dominant world.

You’ll also hear about Nyck’s pioneering model of Neurodivergent Somatics, his international counselor education programs, and his forthcoming book with Norton Professional Books, Neurodivergent Somatics and Therapy: an anti-oppressive model for whole person care (March 2026).

This is a conversation filled with tenderness, truth, and courage – an invitation to see neurodivergence not as something broken or deficient, but as whole, wise, and worthy.

About Nyck

Nyck Walsh (he/they) brings a whole person, anti-oppressive, intersectional somatic lens to working with Autistic and KCS/VAST (more affirming language for “ADHD”) folks. A white, Autistic, VAST, queer, and trans counselor, Nyck is the director of the Nyck Walsh Counseling & Training Center and creator of the Neurodivergent Somatics model.

He curates reparative experiences for late-identified Autistic and KCS/VAST people to connect with their innate wisdom, dismantle ableism, be supported through challenges, and make meaning of their misunderstood neurodivergent experiences. His counselor education programs have attracted an international following, with both neurodivergent and neurotypical counselors alike reporting that they feel deeply supported and validated by his approach.

While being human brings no shortage of complexity, Nyck delights in frolicking in nature and living among the trees with his four-legged bestie in the mountains of what is colonially known as Colorado.

Find out more at his website: nyckwalsh.com

And you can find his new book, Neurodivergent Somatics in Therapy, An Anti-Oppressive Model for Whole Person Care, here: wwnorton.com/books/9781324082910

You can find Shelby via her website: www.shelby-leigh.com

And, if you're interested in an assessment with Shelby, you can find out more here:

⁠shelby-leigh.com/autism-and-adhd-assessments⁠

This episode is a re-release, as it is the perfect entry into Season Two of Relationship As Medicine.

After a season of quiet integration, Shelby returns to the mic to share a powerful evolution in her work: the weaving of neurodiversity-affirming assessment into her trauma-healing framework.

In this intimate and thoughtful episode, she explores what it means to recognize, affirm, and support neurodivergent and neurocomplex individuals within the healing relationship.

Shelby offers grounded definitions of neurodivergence, neurocomplexity, and related terms like AuDHD and giftedness—explaining why this language matters, especially in relational and therapeutic contexts. She reflects on how trauma healing shifts when we stop trying to pathologize difference and instead create space for the many ways nervous systems move through the world.

Listeners will walk away with a deeper understanding of:

• What it means to be neurodivergent or neurocomplex

• Why so many clients have felt unseen within traditional trauma frameworks

• How affirming assessments offer a different kind of mirror—one rooted in compassion, nuance, and belonging

This episode is an open door into a more inclusive, affirming, and trauma-informed healing space.

You can find Shelby via her website: www.shelby-leigh.com

Introducing Season 2 of Relationship as Medicine, hosted by Shelby Leigh.

This season expands the conversation beyond pathology and into a more compassionate, empowering and honest exploration of healing, connection, nervous systems, neurodivergence and the many ways relationship can become medicine.

Hosted by somatic psychotherapist, educator, writer, and neuro-affirming autism and ADHD assessor Shelby Leigh, Season 2 offers a refuge for therapists, coaches, practitioners, and kindred souls who are curious about their own inner worlds, neurotype, and unique way of being. Through trauma-informed conversations and fresh perspectives from the field, this season reimagines what it means to be in healing relationships that are truly supportive, connected, and empowering.

This is a space for those of us who may look like we are doing pretty well on the outside while carrying so much inside. A space to slow down, welcome all parts of ourselves with compassion, and explore healing in ways that feel more whole, relational, and alive. Here, connection itself is the medicine, and fixing is never the goal.

What does it mean to choose a wholeness paradigm instead of a pathology lens when it comes to neuro-affirming care? In this episode, I sit down with the brilliant Nyck Walsh to explore what happens when we bring compassion, authenticity, and somatics into the conversation about neurodivergence. Together, we touch into the radical permission it takes to be fully human and to rest into identities that have often been misunderstood or pathologized.

We explore the relief, grief, and even terror that can arise with late-in-life neurodivergent identification—and the profound sense of liberation that can come with finally having language for who we are. Nyck shares what it means to honor authenticity beneath masking, to unpack internalized ableism, and to reconnect with innate wisdom that has always been there, waiting to be trusted.

Our conversation also weaves in the intersections of privilege and oppression, the deep longing for belonging, and the all-too-common question: “Am I ___ enough?” Together, we name how neurodivergent folks often carry both tremendous courage and tremendous vulnerability as they navigate authenticity, safety, and connection in a neurotypical-dominant world.

You’ll also hear about Nyck’s model of Neurodivergent Somatics, his international counselor education programs, and his forthcoming book with Norton Professional Books, Neurodivergent Somatics and Therapy: an anti-oppressive model for whole person care (March 2026).

This is a conversation filled with tenderness, truth, and courage - an invitation to see neurodivergence not as something broken or deficient, but as whole, wise, and worthy.

About Nyck

Nyck Walsh (he/they) brings a whole person, anti-oppressive, intersectional somatic lens to working with Autistic and KCS/VAST (more affirming language for “ADHD”) folks. A white, Autistic, VAST, queer, and trans counselor, Nyck is the director of the Nyck Walsh Counseling & Training Center and creator of the Neurodivergent Somatics model.

He curates reparative experiences for late-identified Autistic and KCS/VAST people to connect with their innate wisdom, dismantle ableism, be supported through challenges, and make meaning of their misunderstood neurodivergent experiences. His counselor education programs have attracted an international following, with both neurodivergent and neurotypical counselors alike reporting that they feel deeply supported and validated by his approach.

While being human brings no shortage of complexity, Nyck delights in frolicking in nature and living among the trees with his four-legged bestie in the mountains of what is colonially known as Colorado.

Find out more at his website: nyckwalsh.com

For the transcript of this episode, please visit (you will find it below the episode description):

www.shelby-leigh.com/podcasts/neurodivergent-somatics-with-nyck-walsh

And, if you're interested in an assessment or 1:1 work with Shelby, you can find out more here:

⁠shelby-leigh.com/autism-and-adhd-assessments⁠

⁠shelby-leigh.com/one-on-one-healing-support⁠

If you’re a therapist or coach, you might like to check out Shelby’s Body of Work program - open for enrolment for another week - 9 months of support for practitioners to bring their whole, human selves, not just the professional persona.

shelby-leigh.com/body-of-work

After a season of quiet integration, Shelby returns to the mic to share a powerful evolution in her work: the weaving of neurodiversity-affirming assessment into her trauma-healing framework.

In this intimate and thoughtful episode, she explores what it means to recognize, affirm, and support neurodivergent and neurocomplex individuals within the healing relationship.

Shelby offers grounded definitions of neurodivergence, neurocomplexity, and related terms like AuDHD and giftedness—explaining why this language matters, especially in relational and therapeutic contexts. She reflects on how trauma healing shifts when we stop trying to pathologize difference and instead create space for the many ways nervous systems move through the world.

Listeners will walk away with a deeper understanding of:

• What it means to be neurodivergent or neurocomplex
• Why so many clients have felt unseen within traditional trauma frameworks
• How affirming assessments offer a different kind of mirror—one rooted in compassion, nuance, and belonging

This episode is an open door into a more inclusive, affirming, and trauma-informed healing space.

What happens when (as is the focus in most western grad school programs) we emphasize diagnosis and prescription over the therapeutic relationship and holistic healing?

We might end up with excellent theoretical knowledge and clinical skills, and while those things are important, they’re only one piece of the support that’s needed to facilitate effective and lasting healing and growth.

So how do we start (or continue) to shift the focus of therapeutic work towards a more integrated, accepting and holistic approach?

Join Silvana Espinoza and I as we explore what it takes to decolonize therapy and coaching practices. We discuss why the process starts with decolonizing ourselves—examining the values, biases, and systems we’ve unconsciously absorbed.

Listen in to discover what grad school didn’t teach you about reclaiming your own healing medicine and approaches that honor community and right relationship, as we envision a future of healing that resists the mental health industrial complex and centers authentic connection and liberation.

Through our conversation, you will find some actionable steps and thought-provoking insights for creating a practice rooted in justice, equity, and genuine care.

Silvana Espinoza Lau is an embodied liberation and decolonization consultant and coach for therapists, healers, and service providers. Silvana coaches therapists and healers who want to incorporate decolonized, liberation focused and anti-oppressive values in their practices in an embodied way and consults with mental health agencies that want to center therapy seekers with minoritized identities. She also consults with mental health agencies on how to incorporate decolonial mental health practices.

Silvana is an LMFT in private practice in unceded Kalapuya territory (Oregon), and a clinical supervisor and consultant to both licensed and prelicensed clinicians with a focus on anti-oppressive and decolonized therapy practice.

You can find Silvana in these places:

IG: @decolonizeyourpractice

FB: www.facebook.com/decolonizeyourpractice

Linkedin: www.linkedin.com/in/silvana-espinoza-lau-906498233

In this episode of Relationship As Medicine, we explore the power of intentional relationships and the ripple effect of our actions. Topics include the pitfalls of spiritual bypassing, the necessity of rest and reciprocity, and how to create a bigger impact by doing less. We also dive into decolonizing coaching & healing relationships and building authentic relationships. I hope this conversation acts as an invitation to you to reflect on how your small ripples can lead to meaningful waves of change.

Emily Anne Brant is an Indigenous writer, speaker & mentor working at the intersection of personal development and decolonization. She is Turtle clan, from the Mohawks of the Bay of Quinte First Nation. Emily is on a mission to decolonize the personal development and coaching industry and works with coaches, leaders and all types of therapists and healers to create more inclusive spaces. At the heart of it all is fostering communities where everyone feels seen, safe, and truly supported so that we can grow and rise together!

You can find Emily in these places:

Emily’s Website:

www.emilyannebrant.com

Emily’s Instagram:

www.instagram.com/emilyannebrant

FREE E-BOOK:

www.emilyannebrant.com/decolonize

The Round Table Replay Box:

https://www.emilyannebrant.com/the-round-table-replay-box