Relationship Dish

What happens when two people show up to a first date with plenty of emotional baggage—and decide to put it all on the table? This week, Iona and Pam welcome a very special couple to Relationship Dish: their producer, Jenn, and her partner, Michael! Visiting from the US for Iona's book launch party, Jenn and Michael share the story of how they found each other after painful breakups, what they learned from relationships that didn't work, and how they're building something different together.

Their first date might sound like a therapist's dream—or nightmare. They spent the first hour talking about their past relationship trauma, emotional baggage, and complicated living situations. But here's the distinction: they weren't simply dumping their pain on each other. They were also reflecting on what had happened, recognizing their own patterns, and talking about what they wanted to change. That willingness to take responsibility for their histories helped create something essential from the start: a sense of emotional safety.

Michael opens up about a previous relationship in which conflict could lead to days or even weeks of silence, leaving him responsible for breaking the impasse and trying to repair things. Jenn shares how a relationship that worked well in everyday life became unsafe when her partner's unresolved anger and drinking escalated into emotional abuse. Though their experiences were different, both came away knowing that love alone isn't enough—and that you cannot make things work by yourself. A healthy relationship requires two people willing to be stewards of the relationship, not one person carrying the whole thing.

So what does doing the work look like in practice? Jenn and Michael discuss how past experiences have made them hyper-aware of each other's moods, sometimes interpreting a partner's bad day as a sign that something is wrong between them. Michael's solution is their "reset button": a way to recognize the pattern, step back, and stop treating each other as the problem. Iona and Pam explore how naming a pattern helps couples become a team against the conflict itself, why resolving arguments creates the conditions for intimacy, and how individual therapy and self-awareness support healthier relationships.

Ultimately, so much of our relationship behavior comes back to two fundamental questions: Am I lovable? And are you trustworthy? We may bring old wounds into our relationships, but we don't have to let those wounds run the show. When both partners are willing to reflect, take responsibility, and keep learning—individually and together—the past can become a source of insight rather than a blueprint for the future.

• Get Iona's book, Happy for the Long Haul: ionamonkcouplestherapy.com/book
• Learn more about Jenn's work: copilotpublishing.com

Ever have a relationship that's been going really well, only to have an old issue suddenly rear its head and make you wonder, "Wait… haven't we already dealt with this?" Iona and her husband Steve recently had one of those moments—and in this episode, Iona and Pam put their therapists' hats on and take a close look at what happened, what went wrong, and how they found their way back to each other.

The disagreement started innocently enough: a garage sale, two lamps, a dog walk, and Steve taking a phone call from his dad while walking ten feet ahead of Iona. But that ten feet hit an old trigger, and before long, they were lobbing the "tennis ball" of an argument back and forth. For Iona, it was a chance to recognize that her tone wasn't what she wanted it to be—and also to recognize that her tone has gotten dramatically better over time. So how do we hold both truths at once? We can still fall into old patterns and acknowledge how much we've changed.

Pam and Iona talk about why every relationship "blip" happens in the context of real life: exhaustion, distraction, stress, work, and everything else that comes along with being human. As Iona puts it, therapy doesn't magically mean you're "past" something forever. It's more like peeling an onion: each round of therapeutic work removes another layer, bringing you to a better place—but sometimes you discover there's still something underneath. The goal isn't never having the problem again. The goal is getting better at what you do when it happens.

And that means repair. Sometimes you need time apart to cool down and come back "clean." Sometimes being the first to offer goodwill can change everything. Sometimes you need to recognize that your partner will falter—and trust that they'll get better at repairing afterward. Iona and Pam also explore the difference between deserving something from your partner and recognizing that, sometimes, people simply fall short; how to share what you feel and what you need; and why inviting your partner to check your assumptions can prevent an entire story from taking over. Healthy marriage isn't about never dropping the ball. It's about coming back to pick it up together.

SPOILER ALERT! This episode is all about The Invite, Olivia Wilde and Seth Rogen's new movie—and if you haven't seen it yet, you may want to watch it before listening. Iona and Pam are joined by licensed therapist Zach Brittle, host of Marriage Therapy Radio and author of the forthcoming book, Nothing Changes if Nothing Changes, for a lively, therapist-on-therapist dissection of the film's troubled couples.

And wow, is it uncomfortable. All three therapists found themselves squirming as they watched Joe and Angela's marriage deteriorate on screen, because there's something painfully familiar about watching two people who are deeply unhappy—and who keep doing absolutely nothing to change it. Iona even turns the movie into a game: "What are all the things you can name that these couples are doing wrong?" From branching arguments into completely different fights, plowing through each other's boundaries, and dragging unresolved personal struggles into the marriage, the problems pile up fast.

Although the movie features ethical non-monogamy, Zach argues that the real issue isn't non-monogamy at all. It's truth-telling. The turning point comes when Penelope Cruz's character, Pina, finally does something therapists don't always do: she tells the blunt truth about what she sees. When she says, "This marriage is over," she doesn't necessarily mean the relationship has to end. She means this version of the marriage is over. Whether Joe and Angela can build something new is up to them—and it will require both people to actually do the work.

So what do you do when a couple walks into therapy carrying years of resentment? Zach's answer is surprisingly simple: You don't have to stay married. But if you want to, you can make the decision to do the work. Because without the willingness—or the will—to change, the therapist is fighting your battle alone. They also talk about how people "outsource" their problems to alcohol, weed, work, affairs, and even therapy; why communication tools can't compensate for a lack of foundational trust; and why Zach literally said "Okay" out loud when he saw the movie's ending. Spoiler: he felt hope. Learn more about Zach and listen to Marriage Therapy Radio: https://marriagetherapyradio.com Pre-order Nothing Changes if Nothing Changes: https://www.amazon.com/Nothing-Changes-Relational-Recovery-Relationships/dp/1645475875

What happens when ADHD walks into a relationship? In this eye-opening episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona welcome Natalie Wiseman, a Vancouver- and Florida-based counsellor who specializes in working with couples affected by ADHD, to explore how this neurodevelopmental disorder can shape everything from household responsibilities to intimacy.

Natalie explains why ADHD can be mistaken for laziness, carelessness, or a lack of commitment—and why understanding the difference between intent and impact is so important. They talk about time blindness, forgotten promises, unequal responsibilities, impulsivity, interruptions, defensiveness, and the frustrating parent-child dynamic that can develop when one partner chronically over-functions for the other.

They also explore the ADHD "hyperfocus" that can make a new relationship feel intensely passionate in the beginning, rejection sensitive dysphoria, and why diagnosis can be such a game-changer. As Iona puts it, understanding ADHD can transform "Why are you doing this to me?" into "Oh… this is what's happening."

Natalie shares practical strategies for creating systems that put responsibility back where it belongs—from automatic bill payments to phone alarms and structured routines—and explains why the ADHD partner, rather than their spouse, needs to own those systems.

ADHD isn't an excuse, but understanding it can open the door to compassion, accountability, and real change. It's not try harder. It's try differently.

More about Natalie's work: https://therapycures.com

More about Melissa Orlov's work: https://www.adhdmarriage.com

Ever wonder why a vacation can either bring a couple closer—or make them want to kill each other? In this episode of Relationship Dish, Iona and Pam explore what happens when you take a relationship out of its everyday environment and put it under the pressure of travel, logistics, limited escape routes, and way too much togetherness.

Iona shares how a recent vacation with her husband Steve went better than any trip they've taken before—and why she believes it's a reflection of the work they've been doing in their marriage. She's become better at tolerating who Steve actually is rather than needing him to be different, while Steve has grown more proactive about initiating and planning. Their vacation became a kind of relationship litmus test: the things that work away from home are often the things you've been practicing at home all along.

They also talk about the unique challenge of shifting between couple mode and co-parent mode, the push-pull between anxious and avoidant partners, and why travel leaves very little room to hide from the state of your relationship. Along the way, they explore the difference between discussing a problem and simply discharging your feelings, the importance of repair, and how embracing the parts of ourselves we might prefer to hide can reduce resentment.

A good relationship isn't about never disagreeing; it's about trusting that you'll find your way back to each other. And sometimes, the best thing you can say is: Here's what I feel—and here's what I need from you.

Ever feel like the moment you start changing, the people around you push back? You're not imagining it. In this eye-opening episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona explore the concept of homeostasis—the predictable emotional balance every relationship and family system naturally tries to maintain, whether it's healthy or not.

They unpack why even positive changes can feel threatening to those around us, how loved ones can unintentionally pull us back into familiar patterns, and why changing one person inevitably changes the entire relationship dynamic. Pam reflects on the "honeymoon homeostasis" in one of her marriages and why trying to preserve it ultimately created distance instead of connection, while Iona shares stories from her therapy practice that illustrate how easy it is for couples to dismiss each other's need for growth.

Together, they discuss why every relationship must continually recalibrate as life evolves, and how resisting change can quietly erode communication and intimacy. They also explore the difference between merely surviving as a couple and consciously choosing to build something that allows both partners to thrive.

Healthy relationships don't stay the same—they learn how to change together.

What happens to a marriage when your child is struggling with addiction? In this powerful and deeply moving episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona welcome author Elana Epstein to share how she and her husband of 32 years navigated while trying to help their son through addiction and recovery.

Elana opens up about the early warning signs she sensed, the temptation to protect both her son and her husband by keeping secrets, and how quickly a family crisis can create distance between partners. She explains how children struggling with addiction may play parents against each other, and why presenting a united front became one of the most important protective factors in their family.

Together, they explore the tension between compassion and consequences, the role of attachment styles in parenting decisions, and the humbling realization that the best path often lies somewhere between "too soft" and "too hard." Elana also shares how recovery work transformed her own people-pleasing patterns and ultimately strengthened—not weakened—her marriage.

When fear threatens to separate a family, honesty, teamwork, and the willingness to learn can become the very things that hold it together. Get Elana's book, Today I Will Be Fearless HERE. Follow Elana on Instagram: @elanaepstein

Is everyone who hurts you a narcissist? In this fascinating episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona welcome licensed therapist and author Carla Litto—whom Iona affectionately calls "the anti-narcissist extraordinaire"—to separate internet myths from clinical reality. (CLICK HERE to order her book, Outsmarting Egomaniacs!)

Carla explains the difference between everyday narcissistic traits and true narcissistic personality disorder, why the term narcissist has exploded in popular culture, and how labeling someone can sometimes distract us from examining our own patterns in relationships.

Drawing on decades of experience working with survivors of narcissistic abuse, Carla shares why she focuses her practice on empowering the victim—not changing the narcissist. She discusses how learning to set firm, non-combative boundaries often transforms not only the relationship, but also how clients see themselves and their partners. In many cases, once people find their voice, they discover they no longer want to stay.

Together, they also explore whether narcissism is nature or nurture, why children raised by narcissistic parents don't all follow the same path, the challenges of co-parenting with a narcissist, and why narcissists are often quick to accuse others of being narcissistic themselves.

The goal isn't to become better at diagnosing people—it's to become better at recognizing unhealthy dynamics, protecting yourself, and building relationships rooted in respect.

What if your feelings weren't a problem to solve, but a signal to pay attention to?

In this episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona explore boundary-setting through a lens that many people miss: your body's own warning system. They discuss how anxiety, irritability, sadness, overwhelm, numbness, and even physical sensations can be clues that you're moving outside your window of tolerance—and that a boundary may be needed.

Pam shares how years of suppressing her feelings in marriage eventually led to eruptions of anger, while Iona tells the story of a man who spent so long ignoring his own needs that his body finally shut down altogether. Together, they unpack why so many of us—especially women—have been taught that setting boundaries is selfish, controlling, or unkind, when in reality the opposite is often true.

They also explore the importance of "clean boundaries": holding firm when others push back, recognizing that boundaries can be both kind and direct, and learning to respect your own limits as much as you respect everyone else's.

Boundaries aren't walls. They're acts of self-respect, honesty, and intimacy. And the sooner you learn to hear the music when it's quiet, the less likely you'll be forced to listen when it's blaring.

How quickly do you turn someone into a one-dimensional version of themselves? In this deeply personal episode of Relationship Dish, Pam and Iona unpack a real interaction between the two of them—one where judgment, assumptions, and anxiety quietly shaped the way they saw each other, until vulnerability changed everything.

They explore why we often flatten people into simple stories when mixed feelings feel too uncomfortable, and why learning to hold contradictory emotions—love and anger, closeness and disappointment—is essential for healthy relationships.

Pam and Iona discuss how easily we can begin assigning the least generous interpretation to someone's behavior, how anxiety often disguises feelings we're afraid to express, and why vulnerability may be much simpler than we think. Sometimes, it's just naming the feeling.

Along the way, Pam opens up about how these patterns played out in her marriage, uncovering—in real time—the complicated mix of sadness, love, resentment, and grief that still exists.

Real intimacy begins when we stop telling stories about people—and start telling the truth to them.