What does the "pursuit of happiness" really mean? It’s a question we often skim over, but the Founding Fathers had a very specific idea in mind—one deeply rooted in classical virtue and self-mastery. In this episode, Matthew Brogdon sits down with Jeff Rosen, President and CEO of the National Constitution Center, to unpack this phrase from the Declaration of Independence and its implications for personal and political life.

Rosen shares insights from his latest book, The Pursuit of Happiness: How Classical Writers on Virtue Inspired the Lives of the Founders and Defined America, exploring how figures like Jefferson, Franklin, and Adams connected happiness with moral improvement and self-discipline. From Aristotle to Cicero and beyond, we discuss how ancient philosophy shaped the Founders' vision of a flourishing life and a well-ordered republic.

What lessons can we learn from the Founders’ emphasis on virtue? And how do we reconcile their moral aspirations with their glaring contradictions, such as the perpetuation of slavery? Join us for a thought-provoking discussion on how the pursuit of virtue can inform our understanding of happiness, freedom, and modern democracy.

In This Episode:

• (00:03) Introduction to the podcast
• (00:15) Purpose of the episode
• (00:43) Overview of Jeff Rosen’s book, The Pursuit of Happiness
• (01:02) How the Founders viewed happiness and virtue
• (02:25) Key classical virtues: temperance, prudence, courage, and justice
• (03:45) The role of self-mastery in personal and political governance
• (05:20) Jeff Rosen’s COVID-era experiment: Reading Jefferson’s inspirations
• (08:10) The habits of lifelong learning and deep reading
• (10:35) Virtue is both a personal and civic duty
• (12:00) Examples of virtue and hypocrisy among the Founders
• (15:40) The moral contradictions of Jefferson and other Virginian enslavers
• (18:30) How figures like Frederick Douglass embodied virtuous self-improvement
• (20:25) Reconciling freedom and virtue in a democratic society
• (22:15) Jefferson, religious liberty, and freedom of conscience
• (24:50) Lessons from ancient Stoic philosophy for modern life
• (27:05) Virtue as an answer to modern political challenges

Notable Quotes

• [00:01:02] "For the Founders, the pursuit of happiness meant not feeling good, but being good." — Jeff Rosen

• [00:05:20] "I spent a year reading Jefferson’s favorite books. It changed my life by making me a deeper thinker and better citizen." — Jeff Rosen

• [00:15:40] "Jefferson recognized the evil of slavery but lived like a Caligulan emperor, surrounded by enslaved labor." — Matthew Brogdon

• [00:27:05] "The Founders believed personal self-government was essential to political self-government." — Jeff Rosen

Resources and Links

Matthew Brogdon

• https://www.linkedin.com/in/matthew-brogdon/
• https://www.uvu.edu/ccs/people/matthew_brogdon.html

   Jeff Rosen

• Keynote address at UVU CCS Fall Conference: https://bit.ly/3ARulwg
• https://constitutioncenter.org/about/board-of-trustees/jeffrey-rosen
• https://x.com/rosenjeffrey?lang=en
• https://www.law.gwu.edu/jeffrey-rosen