Spirit of the Deal

Erin McCullough is a thought leader, an in-demand speaker and an international teacher that helps people create IMPENETRABLE JOY so that they can be calm, have peace of mind and meaning in their life, NOW! Erin had an Anxiety Disorder that had her holed up in her home for nearly a year. Through that experience she learned how and why that happened and developed strategies to overcoming and preventing it, which is what she now teaches. Erin vowed that when she found solutions to overcoming and preventing anxiety, she would do whatever she could to make sure that no one had that experience, so that has been her mission. Erin spent a decade studying the Mind/Body connection, Visualization and ways to still the mind. Over the decade she has created simple strategies to Overcoming and Preventing Anxiety, Stress, Worry and Overwhelm so that all her clients live a life intentionally in Joy. She has been an entrepreneur for 21 years and consulting businesses and business leaders for 16 years. If you question who you are and what you are meant to be doing in this life, let Erin help you discover your own path to joy.

Connect with Erin at https://www.erin-mac.com/

The transcript below is machine-generated and unedited.

Brandon Handley 0:41 Hey there spiritual dope. I'm on here today with Erin McCullough. She is a thought leader in the main speaker and an international teacher that helps people create impenetrable joy so that they can be calm, have peace of mind and meaning in their life. Now, Erin had an anxiety disorder that had her holed up in her home for nearly a year, through that experience to learn how and why that happened and develop strategies to overcoming and preventing it, which is what she's now teaches. and vowed that she, when she found solutions to overcoming and preventing anxiety, she would do whatever she could to make sure that no one had that experience. So that has been her mission. There's been a decade, studying the mind body connection, visualization and ways to still the mind. Over the decades, she's created simple strategies to overcoming and preventing anxiety, stress, worry and overwhelm so that all her clients live a life intentionally enjoy. She has been an entrepreneur for 21 years and consulting businesses and business leaders for 16 years. If you question who you are, and what you're meant to be doing in this life, let Erin help you discover your own path to joy. Erin, thanks for your work in through the technical difficulties. As a as I told you, I'm working on this newer platform. But thanks for thanks for joining today. How you doing?

Erin Mac 2:05 Oh my gosh, thanks for having me. I'm wonderful. How

Brandon Handley 2:08 are you never been better. My whole life has led up to this point. So you know, here we are. Here we are. So I like to start these off with the idea that we are deal sources. We're talking about like a little bit before we got started here that we are all our source and that the universe speaks through us. And that right now in this moment, the universe is speaking through you to one of the listeners today. What do you have to tell that listener?

Erin Mac 2:36 Well, first and foremost, I believe it is our birthright to be predominantly in joy all day, every day. And if that's not the experience you're having, then keep listening. We're going to talk about all the things strategies, and you know why we're here what we're meant to be doing. You know, all the things,

Brandon Handley 2:59 all the things all the things that I love, I love that you kind of chose joy had to go out and I had to go out and grab my, my joy mug. Oh, no. It's actually like pretty much one of my favorite mugs right as the idea of what you kind of see out first thing I pick up and I carry around, I see I get to see the word joy everywhere I go when I'm drinking out of the mug. So definitely enjoy it. definitely enjoy the word joy and glad that we have the opportunity to talk about it. And I'm also going to be very honest with you. Before I went in, I checked you out a little bit more I was like what kind of fit is this? Right? What kind of fit is this? Because, you know, being a you know, more of a thought leader and all this I suppose like what's the spirituality fit me and you know, so in your mind, though, like the work that you do is spiritual, you know, the the personal development is spirituality work. Is that set? Right? Is that fair? Yeah. Well, let's talk about let's talk about the journey, right, let's talk about breaking through anxiety. Let's talk about, you know, how you found yourself in an anxious position and kind of some of the things that you did to work your way through it.

Erin Mac 4:06 Awesome. So you know, my story has kind of like three moments, defining moments, if you will. The first started with the anxiety disorder that you spoke about. It actually came about in talk therapy. I was going to a couple's group counseling with my husband at the time. And in that first session, I had a panic attack and I never had one before so I had no idea what it was. And the counselor picked up on it right away she explained all you know what it was and first she told me what it was she didn't really exactly explain what it was. I figured that out later, but she told me that's what was happening and and from there, you know, she said something's obviously coming up for you. Would you like to do some individual work and In that individual work, you know, I was telling my trauma story over and over and over again. And what my body decided to do was put up the defense mechanism of anxiety. And so it got so bad that as you said, I hold myself up in my home. You know, it didn't, it wasn't an overnight thing and happened gradually, panic attacks, more panic attacks, then, you know, I had one was running, and I was training for a race at the time. And so I felt like I couldn't run anymore, at least temporarily. And so I stopped running. And then I stopped teaching, I was a teacher at the time. And so it happens that way, you know, slowly, it's not just one, you know, wake up, and, and no candu. After about nine months of that, she referred me to a homeopathic psychiatrist, who gave me a remedy after a three hour interview, that in 20 minutes basically cured me from the experience of anxiety. That's the physical chemical piece, right? And I thought, wow, I have a new lease on life, you know, I can go and do all these things. But because of that experience, I was afraid, right. So I decided to move to Hawaii, and move to a small town and have a simpler life, right? Thinking that, you know, then I would never get triggered. And I would just live my life happily ever after in paradise. And unfortunately, while the chemistry piece was handled the mental emotional spiritual piece, not so much. And so I was still there. So in that simpler life, of course, I created anxiety, stress, and all that. So I moved to Hawaii. Immediately, in the first 24 hours, I started a business and I had a client. Within 18 months, I had 20 employees, multiple six figure contracts. And, you know, I was on my way to stress and anxiety. And the second thing that happened that really rocked me to my core was I 10 years into my business of just being frantic and crazy, stressed all the time. A client called in the morning, she was upset, and I would just get so frantic about clients complaining, they got in my car, raced over to a friend's house, backed into a driveway to drop my daughter off, and I sideswiped her husband's car or her his truck with my car. And come to find out later, when I came to pick up my daughter, that her husband was under the truck working on it while I hit it, and he thought it was gonna land on him. And that just rocked me to my core, I thought, This is ridiculous. Like, this is no life, you know, running around like a crazy person all the time. And so then I dove, you know, into self development, got involved with a seminar company did all their seminar staff for them, and started to see that there was a different way to be in this world, and starting to make some changes, that we're having an impact on my life and other people around me. And then about five years later, I

found myself in the middle of a divorce. And for whatever reason, it just leveled me, I was in a dark place. And I thought, you know, I'd spent 10s of 1000s of dollars on seminars, reading all the books, you know, trying to do this other life, but I didn't really have any legit strategies to doing life differently. So then a series of things happened. I picked up the book, maybe you've heard of it, the Course in Miracles, and was about a month and two reading. It's a daily passage for about a year 365 passages. And nothing I was kinda like, this is interesting, but not really rocking my world. Then all of a sudden, month two, this crazy thing happened where the word started, like popping off the page. It was like the path is joy. The answer is joy, joy, joy, joy. And I was like, finally after a couple weeks of that, I was like literally threw my hands up in the air. I was like, I got the answer. How do I get there? And a series of things happened. I got an email from a gentleman I met. He was teaching a seminar in a wahoo and I thought I'll fly over for that. I have no idea what it is doesn't matter just need something positive. And I went and it was a day long seminar on a visualization process that he teaches. And I was so excited by it. I came home and I started using it immediately called my broker who had had my business for sale for like nine months with no bites. And I was like look, I just want to let you know my business is going to sell by the end of the month and there's going to be a bidding war. And it was like, okay, and long behold a week later That's exactly what happened. And then I went back and trained this gentleman that I had gone to that seminar, he was having a seminar, to train people to teach his main seminar. And I went and trained for a week I came home, put on my first seminar, and I stood in front of this group of people, and I ditched my notes, five minutes in, because I had this crazy experience where like, everything that I had ever learned, all of my life experience, everything I had ever read, just came together, like at one moment, I went, Whoa, like, this is what I'm supposed to do. Like, I'm supposed to teach people how to find their joy, cultivated daily, and live the life that they're meant to be living now, without waiting for all the things or the, you know, whatever they think they need to have in order to have that, like, that's available now. And I happen to also during that few week period, meet the love of my life in these very random circumstances, which I don't believe in random anymore. And, and so it just all lined up. And that's what I've been doing for the last almost four years.

Brandon Handley 11:11 That's awesome. I mean, and it's interesting, right, that you came, you kind of came out of a, from what I gathered was more of a business oriented kind of thing versus this pursuit of joy, right, are you that you're doing now? And I think that I heard you say, on another podcast that, you know, maybe some of this is Woo, but if it is, woo, it's working out for you. And and you're okay with it, right?

Erin Mac 11:39 I mean, that's the thing, you know, people always say, Oh, that's kind of woowoo. For me, I'm like, I'm looking at woowoo people, they look pretty happy as all I can say. Something too, and

Brandon Handley 11:50 it's pretty amazing. The idea to have, you know, just try some of these things out for the first time. Very go into a very skeptical, right, this vision process that you're doing that you're thinking about, while it seems pretty cool. But then you you go and you try it. And then things start working out. Right. I mean, talk to me a little bit about that. So how did that have that come? And like kind of manifest itself? What was some of your initial reactions when you saw, were even calling it the universe? And what were you calling it? Well, like, what was your know, kind of how, how was that for you?

Erin Mac 12:30 You know, it's kind of crazy, because you know, how it's like life. I mean, again, it's like life unfolds slowly. And you don't recognize exactly what's going on. So you look back and go, Whoa, like, look at all these things that happened. That's crazy. It took me a while to even recognize how much I knew that I was feeling better that I knew. And honestly, you know, I just, I thought I knew what joy was, I thought I knew what happiness was. The thing was, is I was on this, like, roller coaster ride of things, right? It was just like I was so 100% bought into the idea that if I had all the things, you know, a stack of cash, and the house and the car and the successful business, and all the things that we're told is gonna make us be happy. I had all those things, and I was so miserable, right? But I didn't even know that it was possible to experience joy. Do you know what I mean? Like I really just didn't even know what was available.

Brandon Handley 13:39 So I think it's really interesting that you bring it up, right? I think there's this, you know, Tale of Two Cities type of thing, where you went, and you got all these things, and you did all the things because this is what we're taught. But that's been my experience is like, hey, go through all these things. Because this is what you're taught. Right? And you're not doing it maybe with the same intent that some of these other people are doing it right, you're doing it to a mass and acquire and to be happy and to have status versus what you're doing now, which is to implement, purpose, intent, and service, right, and the outcome that you're headed towards now. Right? If you haven't, I'm sure you've already achieved. I mean, listen, if you landed in Hawaii has some clients on the first day and you know, whatever, you know, a mask pretty quick like that, you know, whatever it is that you're doing right now, I'm assuming is successful, in one way or another, right? And but now it's aligned to who you are with your purpose and there's fulfillment and joy in that and the rest of it just kind of comes naturally, right? It comes as a byproduct of that intent and that purpose versus if you could compare To the way that you are running life before, right? You were miserable. You were like, anxious and you know, knocking people's trucks over on him. Right? And now I'd like you're doing maybe the same work, I don't know. But what's the effort feel like, compared to what you're the effort felt like before.

Erin Mac 15:21 I mean, you're, you hit it right on the head, like I am 100% in service of people and myself. And while that may sound selfish, it's, it's, it's kind of where you got to be when you're in service to people in this way, you know, and it's a whole different experience, you know, before it just felt like I was grinding, grinding, grinding all the time, you know, like, it took all these things in order to make success, like I really, you know, there are these ideas that we have from a young age, you know, success looks like this formula. It's right. It's like, it's like, hard work plus luck, right, you know, like this, you know, formula of success. And I was 100% bought into that, too. And now, it's not like that, it's like, it doesn't seem like work. It's not a four letter word anymore. For me, it's 100%. Like, like, when I give to clients, I give to myself, like, it's such a win win. Whereas I definitely didn't function that way in my life before 100%. And now it's like, you know, while I still have to negotiate, you know, time, you know, balance the things out in my life, this never feels like something I've have to do. Like, I'm excited to do it all the time. I feel called to share what I know, because it's had such a profound impact on my life.

Brandon Handley 16:51 I think it's interesting to how, you know, on your first seminar, you kind of tossed off to the side and everything you ever knew, kind of fell into this framework. Right, and you were able to just let it freely flow. Right? I mean, what, what looking back, what would you say happened there?

Erin Mac 17:15 Oh, I, I was, you know, I think we're guided all the time. I think we have support all the time, from all the things, you know, universe, energy in general, you know, I mean, scientifically speaking, energy cannot be destroyed. So every person who's lived, their energy is here to you know, and, you know, that's why people talk to loved ones that have passed, and, you know, like, they still the energy is still hear it's exist, so why not tap into those things? I think, you know, it happens to me all the time. And I'm not gonna lie, it was freaky. You know, because it's, you know, for somebody who's like a recovered control freak, you know, a bunch of people and all of a sudden, just free flowing. And not to say it was just random all over the place is still stuck to, you know, we had a workbook and things but, you know, to go off the notes, I still do that. And I just, and I, and I recognize, I mean, even sometimes when I'm on podcasts, like, I'll just, I'll wake up in the middle of it and go, Oh, like I, you know, I wouldn't say it's me, I want to say channeling, but it's like, it's taking energy that exists. Like what I'm telling what I tell people and how I'm in service to people and the information that I share with people. Like it's not new to me, like I didn't make this stuff. Right. Right. Right. This is a real learning. Right, right. And when I'm teaching, I see it in the students, it's like, they can hear me on a deep level, even if they're not consciously aware of what I'm saying. They're feeling on a deep level. And that's coming from not me, you know, I mean, I hear it and I can disseminate that information, distill it down. But it's, it's exists, we're all connected to it one way or another.

Brandon Handley 19:06 No, 100%, right. Truth resonates. And that's the kind of that that's the experience and you're talking to somebody else. And you're in a room with with these people and and you're having a truth session on the value column, right? It's your truth, this is kind of coming through you. And you're like, I don't even know, I didn't even know I could do that. Right? But then, but then the rest of the room is resonating with you. And to me, that's kind of what it sounds like as happening. And you know, call it channeling. It's funny too, because, like we we still have our limitations on what we'll call it, right? Like, I don't know that. Yeah, I don't know, I call it channeling I don't know, you know, whatever. But you know, what you're doing is you're at least letting yourself open to, to it, whatever, whatever it is, to come through and to to and through you. Right as a kind of a receiver translator as it were.

Erin Mac 19:59 That's it. receiver for sure, yeah, yeah. And yeah, and I think we're all we all have that ability.

Brandon Handley 20:07 I mean, it's an eight, right. And so, I mean, I don't know how old your kids are, you know, I've got my, my nine year old. And it's so and and my older child to 11. But you know, it's so obvious just how like innately in tuned. The children are, right as as as it is and, and then you can kind of watch it literally be kind of like almost a brainwash, but brainwashed out of them, right, like, you know, just kind of have those senses gold and like, you know, go through like this other thing, and you just kind of watch it, you're like, wow, that's crazy. Because we go through this relearning experience later in life. Are you an Alan Watts fan? I don't know who that is. Oh, my gosh, come on now. All right. Alan Watts. Yeah, Alan Watts. You know, he's a kind of philosopher made. Popular lies, Zen Buddhism. And in the West, West, it's like in the 60s 70s, right? English guy, you really enjoy him. One of the things that he talks about those, it's like, it's like, we're like salted beef, right? We get all salted and you got it. You got to desalinate that beef. And then you're like, you're back to your natural state at a certain point. And that's, again, sounds to me. I like the way you're the way you're going. Right? You're feeling into it. The what was the cure? I mean, because you had the homeopathic guy, right comes and gives you the cure. What was it? Do you recall? Was it like, a miracle pill? You know, help me out here.

Erin Mac 21:51 Now Now what? homeopathy is so interesting. It's so distilled down the amount of whatever the substances may come in. Have you ever taken it before? That's like little tinctures, tablet. They're little pills. Yeah, no, tiny, tiny little granules. And, and they taste like sugar. And they have just, I mean, it's almost like they have essence of the thing. And it really is for the purpose of sort of writing your own self, right? So you introduce it to the body, and the body goes, Oh, that's right. We use a function fairly normally, in this stage. Here's the thing that I need. And interestingly enough, when she gave me the remedy, she told me what it was called. And she said, I don't want you to research it. And this is pre internet. It's not pre internet, but it was definitely internet was not a thing. Really. This was like 99, there was no Google. Yeah, it was not, there was no verb called Google it. And so, you know, she was just like, I don't want you to research this. And, you know, just see what happens or whatever. And, you know, and I, I mean, I almost don't want to say what it is because I don't want people with anxiety to think that that's the cure all it's not the cure all, it was just the thing that made me feel better enough to get on the path to recognizing that the work is internal, emotional, spiritual, and then the body follows.

Brandon Handley 23:29 It's so interesting, though, right? Because we, we've, we believe the other way around, right? Because we see the things that everybody's doing, but we can't see the inner work, we can't see how they're thinking, functioning, or directing themselves internally to get to that point. So we're like, Alright, well, I'm just gonna go do all those same things. Right? And it doesn't it doesn't work out, right? Because we're not we're not aligning all three of those pieces of ourselves together. We're just like, we're hammering on one at a time. Right?

Erin Mac 24:02 Yeah, I mean, I think you know, you see people they have you know, I work with a lot of people who have cancer and other diseases because that's mental emotional, spiritual two, I believe were three equal parts you know, mind body spirit. And if any of those are out of alignment or out of balance, it's going to show up in the other ones right and in a negative way or and that not wanted way. And often we can, you know, we can skip past mental and spiritual right we can we have all kinds of ways to not feel and acknowledge and, you know, the obvious ones are drugs and alcohol, the less obvious ones are things like being super busy, not ever having any stillness in our life, you know, being helicopter parents, you know, the SWAMI we spend all day every day Trying not to feel any. And, you know, and so you can imagine, and we've done it from a young age, like, it's not really our fault. It's, you know, we've grown up to this idea that we're not supposed to have emotions, we're not supposed to feel those things, only very controlled and in very specific ways, depending on the environment, you know, like, can't cry in a business meeting, you know, you know, are you crying out to lose it? No crying in baseball.

Brandon Handley 25:32 I know, my first, my first go around, like in the podcast room and coaching space was fatherhood. And a big point of what you're saying there's is especially as Western civilization, men, emotions, come on now. You know, yeah. That's it. I mean, and that's a brilliant question too. Because we don't know, we don't know, one of the one of the tools that I use, often is the blue check wheel, right? Just just has the emotions kind of listed out, I hand it to my clients, I'm like, you know, go through it. You know, take a look at this every day, if you don't know what this one means. Or if you if you think that you do, go double check the definition of that and just see kind of how you're applying it in your life and how you can use it to, you know, acknowledge your situation, because we don't we, I suppose I was like, 40, or something I didn't know, I didn't know. I was, I guess, like, you know what, because I had a, I had a coaching friend, he goes, because Brandon, I'm not hearing anything emotional, or there's nothing emotional. I was like, Oh, let me go check that out. I was like, Well, I

Erin Mac 26:32 mean, unfortunately, our society, especially for a man, like you really only allowed to anger is the only like, standout emotion and now, that's just as tragic. But that's changing slowly, as

Brandon Handley 26:45 well. You know, I like to call kind of where we are right now in whatever culture like a hippie 2.0 situation. Right? Right. We're kind of like a hippie 2.0 situation where like, okay, like, maybe if we don't deal with all the drugs, it'll work out better this time, right, like, cut it out on like, the illegal substances. And, you know, we can still get to this place, mentally and spiritually, right. And, and, and since we're seeing that, there's, there's the actual benefits are being seen and heard, and, and I think that the pandemic had such a huge influence, because nobody was spared. Right? If anything good came out of level, it's like, it's like, level set everything. So, so for the, you know, for the CEO, or business leader that could normally like hop on a plane and do everything that like, his employees couldn't, he was stuck at home to with the kids having to deal with the zoom meetings. He wasn't getting a you know, he wasn't getting a free ride out of it. Right. And so his mental, her mental health was impacted as well. And they're like, Oh, shit, everybody's gone through this, we'd better do something. Right. So we see, right? I mean, so I think there's some benefit out of this whole COVID situation to huge, right, right, the right mental health space of people, spaces, places and things. So if I am coming to you, and I am like, the client type I am is who you were before you got to this choice spot, right? Um, you know, I've got success, not like, you know, I'm not Whoo, kind of guy, my calendars, you know, tight and all this stuff. What are you what are some of the first things that we're gonna do together?

Erin Mac 28:39 First, we're going to acknowledge and begin to make some separation between the story that's been running your life, you know, the story of all the rainbows and sunshine, a story of all the, you know, the yucky, the fit, the unfair, the unjust, the abuse, trauma, all those things, not for the purpose of wallowing in and you know, it just to acknowledge where we started, and maybe what's affecting some of the ways that we see this world, how we perceive people and circumstances, and then take that story and recognize it for what it is the gift that it has been, and will continue to be in terms of showing us where healing and growth can take place. And you know less about all the things all the details in terms of, you know, who and what happened and all of those things. It's really more about what did you decide about you because of that story. Those are the beliefs and then when we recognize some of those beliefs, then we can understand that, you know, that's been playing out in the background, that's the wallpaper so to speak of our lives, you know, where we make decisions from and a lot of the decisions are fantastic. We need not mess with those, but the ones that aren't serving the future that we want to create. Those are the ones we want to take a closer look at. And so then, from there, I have people do a day, I have them write out a narrative of the day in the life of everything they ever wanted to create in our life, you know, all outcome based, you know, all you know, all the fields, you know, touch, taste, see, smell the whole deal. So exciting, you know, ever, like literally for a moment, wake up until moment go to sleep one day with everything in it, all the people, all the circumstances, all the outcomes. And then they use that in a visualization. And they start their day, because that's where I found my joy was in that visualization. Understanding a day in the life now, is it about manifesting? Not exactly. It's really about elevating the emotional experience, because you have that at your disposal at all times. And so we learn that we can our body doesn't forget things. So when I'm in my visualization in the morning, like, My arms are in the air, I'm like, super excited, like, yes, that just happened. And then yes, that happened to and I mean, tears of joy streaming down my face. I mean, it's all the things, I'm 100%. And on every level, I've raised my emotional experience. And then, like I said, the body doesn't forget. So when you have that experience, you can recall it at any time. So when you're going throughout your day, things start to go south, you can put yourself Take a moment, close your eyes, put yourself back into that moment, refocus and move on, versus what most people do is go out, this thing's not working out. And then there's all these other things that aren't working out, there's that thing, and then there's another thing I didn't like, and then this other person, and then you know, and so just got to read the brain and just, it loves to do the same stuff over and over again, and act like it's new.

Brandon Handley 32:08 Yeah, it's not. I mean, I think the idea of the brain, right, it's, uh, likes to be an efficient piece of machinery, right? consumes so much energy, the more efficient it can be. And so let's just keep doing this thing, because it's just, you know, hasn't killed us in the past? Right? If we just keep doing this, we will die. And we may not be enjoying our lives. But you know, it, you know, hasn't killed us before. So I enjoy I enjoy the visualization. And and I think that there's a big piece of what you're saying there that a lot of people when you're doing these exercises, don't hammer home, I think, quite enough. And that's something I think you're touching on is the idea of the feels. Right. So my guess is that this is kind of a writing in the present tense exercise. Right?

Erin Mac 33:00 Yeah, preferably, you know, again, outcome base, so you want to say in gratitude, right, because of high vibration, it's, you know, I'm so grateful that, you know, all these things are happening in my life, you know, as though they've happened already, as they exist in the now. Right. And they will, in your visualization, they exist as already taken place, and done deal.

Brandon Handley 33:25 Right. And I think that, that the idea is that I'm just, I'm just feeling your words now. Because I heard you saying earlier today, the idea is that, you know, what wants to give us the idea that right, so if I can feel it right now, then what's that doing for me?

Erin Mac 33:42 Yeah, that's creating, so I can't tell you how to get all the things. I mean, I think, you know, for me, they've come by being in that elevated state. And so, you know, I, what I help with is changing the experience of life, you know, and I think that's a heck of a lot more important than amassing things, you know, if, if I could show you how to change your experience in your life to joy, right now, by doing this visualization, that seems more valuable to me than, you know, telling you how to make six figure seven figures, whatever, you know, to me, other people, you know, they have other ideas, and that's wonderful. And, and I don't proclaim to, you know, claim to be able to help with those things. But I know how to find joy and I know how to cultivate it so that you can have that experience. And that's, you know, that's the first step is to recognize that you are responsible for your experience and when you know this, not in like fault blame shame kind of a way, in an empowering way, then you can just choose and choose and choose. Just keep choosing that thing that makes you feel good now, it doesn't change anything, have goals, do all the other stuff, too. That's amazing. But, you know, given that we only have this moment here, guaranteed why not make this one enjoyable? You know?

Brandon Handley 35:16 Yeah, no, agreed, agreed. And, you know, if I'm, if I'm, if I'm a law of attraction guy, if I'm, you know, in that space, right, this is how I would, you know, kind of liken it would, and I don't know who it is, there's plenty of them out there. That's like, you know, the happiness doesn't kind of come later comes now, right. And if you can be happy now, and whatever the circumstance, like you're talking about, then you can make that choice. Again, like you're talking about all the time. You can find joy all the time, and anything and all you've got to do is again, like you're saying, If I go through the morning, and I had this visualization, I'm like, Well, I'm feeling the feels. It's all there for me, everything's great. Ah, and then like, you know, late in the day, I'm not so feeling the feels. And I'm like, Well, wait a second. early in the day, I was feeling the feels. And this was like that kind of anchor point. Right? Let me get back to that for a second. Because I created that moment for myself. Right, versus kind of letting something outside of me create that it was me who did that Creator of all these things, then, here I am. I'm always like, kind of high vibe. And I'm always like, buzzing, right. And then, you know, you're basically sending that out into the universe, right? Like, just kind of this this high vibe. And, you know, if we act as if the universe is a force multiplier, right? We know that like anything, you'd come out and throw out, there's coming back at you like, Well, I better stop, throw a monkey poo, right, like and start the things that I could really use in my life that I want in my life. And then you know, and visualize that and see it, feel it and release it right. I think that's important, too, is kind of just like, release it and not hang on to the idea that it has to happen, right? You're talking about the people that are like, well, this, Aaron, I tried this for three days, and it didn't show up. My life did not change the way you said it was. And I've you know, I've been doing all the things you tell me to do. But I mean, the idea, again, is to go through those fields, have them do the visualization. And release it because again, you're creating your own, you're creating your own space, please in time, let's face that, right.

Erin Mac 37:25 Yeah. And I got two things to say about that. One is I want to talk about the difference between happiness, his idea of happiness and joy, because they're different. And I forgot what the other one is. But I'll talk about the happiness, the joy, that one the rest will come. Right. So to me the difference between happiness and joy is that happiness is fleeting, right? It's you get the new car, it's amazing. Eventually, it's just a car, right? It gets you from A to B, and this game of, you know, getting the things to make you feel good, it feels good for like this amount of time, right. And I only know that because I did all those things. I had the houses and the cars and the successful business and the time flexibility, all the things that everybody would want. And I literally kept like going over finish lines. And going, yay, hooray. I'm happy right now. And then, like, when I was doing trap all the stuff of go across the finish line, I would go home after celebrating for like five minutes. I mean, maybe like half hour or whatever, go home and find another race that I could either crush my time in that was longer hard or whatever. Like there was no end to it, like a couldn't win that race ever. Joy, on the other hand, encompasses some of the you know, the exuberance and all of that Not always, but it can include those. But it also has these nuances of like stillness and peace of mind, which is not thinking all the time thing. Or overthinking and calm. Right. And so those nuances are available and so rich, you know, they're either things I didn't know existed. I had no I mean, maybe I'd heard those words before, but I didn't really understand them on a deeper level. You know, and so, those differences are important, because the one you just can't win out. So yeah, get all the things and be super abundant and all the ways just recognize that the journey inside is the one that has purpose and meaning the one on the outside where we collect things. Those are super cool and fun too. They just don't. They don't fill you up as a human

Brandon Handley 40:01 I think that I think that those are important distinctions, right? Happiness quick and fleeting, right? and joy is a little bit more kind of like a long lasting coal and Ember of warmth, right? Yeah. But a state of being. Yeah. So let me see here. Two things, two things. So I liken this, what we're doing here is like spiritual speed dating, right? Like somebody's gonna, somebody's gonna tune in, they're like, you know, I'm looking for my next spiritual date. Right? And, and this could be you. So I'm gonna ask you at least one kind of, you know, question is that, uh, you know, let me see here, whoa, yeah. Why are so many people depressed?

Erin Mac 40:47 Okay, so call it depression, call it anxiety, call it whatever you want any low level experience, which is anything that doesn't feel good stress, overwhelm, worry, all those lovely words, they're the same thing. They are the experience of the human wanting to control people and circumstances to fit in how they want them to show up, or they don't feel good. And the unconscious recognition at the same time that it is impossible to control people and circumstances and events to fit into your agenda. And so you can see where that those two things butting up against each other would create some confusion. And so that confusion looks like anxiety, depression, you know, all the it's, we have this new, we've touched on it before the belief thing, right? So it's foundational, we made up everybody has them. I've not met anybody yet, who does not have these very core ones that are things like, I don't deserve, I'm not worthy, I'm not good enough. I'm not lovable, you know. And they're all basically the same thing. Like, I'm not good enough. And so those are underlying all of our decisions and how we're feeling about ourselves. And then we interact with other people. Based on those beliefs, we have decided what's right and wrong. So that's how people are supposed to show up for us, and how circumstances are supposed to show up for us. And so we got into this habit of we learned this piece about when this person says something or the circumstance doesn't turn out how I want, then somehow it's their fault, right? So if that person said something, and they're rude, instead of that person said something triggered something in me that did not feel good. What is that? And why is that there? When we look at that with wonder and curiosity and go interesting, because I guarantee whatever is triggering, you is not triggering me. So that's how, you know, it's all you.

Brandon Handley 43:06 It's true. Um, you know, if if I was spiritually looking for a date, then then I would say, Hey, what's up? I'm good. And I agree, you know, I don't think there's a piece in there that I disagree with. So So thank you, I think that's a great answer to to it, right? Everybody's still trying to control the outcomes in some way, shape, or form. And when they're not turning out the way they want them to. They're not they're not accepting it. Right? They don't see it. And I think that the idea of approaching these triggers with wonder and curiosity versus like, kind of anger and angst is also really why is this can trigger still here. Right? So it makes sense. And I love it. So and what else I know that we talked about, you know, you're doing the work that you're doing now, but you've got a new endeavor, what are you, you know, what are you leaning into next?

Erin Mac 44:00 Oh, my gosh, I'm so excited. I'm working with couples right now. I just finished doing my pilot course, on partnership. And the reason I'm so excited about it is, well, first of all, I truly believe we are here for spiritual development, or you call self development or whatever you want to call it consciousness. And when we recognize that that's why we're here and that all these you know, challenges that come into our life are for the purpose of our growth, then we can, you know, grow and heal and enjoy ourselves, right? Well, what happens when you bring two people together, that understand that there's a process to healing and growing and understand that same process in a way where, you know, in couples, it's like, it's easy to see how escalation can happen because it's like, especially when I've just told you what's going on. Right. So You said this thing, it made me feel bad, you know, right. So instead of, you know, we do this responsibly, so then we go, Oh, you said this thing, I feel bad. There's nothing that you can do to make me feel better, I'm in charge of making me feel better. And then they can support you in that, right? And then instead of escalating it's support, right? So it's not, you made me feel this way. It's, I feel this way, and it doesn't feel good. And, you know, support me in that instead of like, get your beliefs and you know, the things in your life that aren't working out and escalate, escalate, escalate, it's like, no, this is mine, I own it, it doesn't feel good. And then the two of you work together in that capacity. And it's just amazing to watch couples, it's exponential, because not only is their relationship so much better, but think of the impact that will have on their kids, the rest of their family, when they can see two fully functioning adults coming together, helping support each other in their spiritual growth. It's phenomenal. And so that sounds awesome. That

Brandon Handley 46:15 sounds awesome. So where does, you know? What, who's your ideal client? Like in this space? Right? So I think we got two types of ideal clients, you got the partners, ideal clients, and then you've got your, your, your standard practice clients, what is what are they?

Erin Mac 46:30 So ultimately, you know, being an entrepreneur for like, 21 or two years now, entrepreneurs, like me, for some reason, because I get their craziness, I understand that they are under the gun and responsible for a lot of things. And those, typically, and leaders to write just people have a lot of responsibility. That, you know, like to make all the things work out, you know, like to control all the things, those are the people that I ended up working with, because I get them, I was them. And I still have nuances of that, of course, you know, so working on me, and all that all the things. And then couples who are recognizing that, you know, especially when you're coming together as maybe two, what do they call that the set called the two families come together to blend in? Yeah. Like, I've noticed quite a few couples that are interested in working with me, that have that situation, because it's, you know, it's already challenging being in partnership, but then you bring in the kids and just escalates all the things. And so, you know, any couple, of course, who's having an issue, wanting to communicate in a deeper way or, you know, deepen their relationship in some way. Fantastic. And, you know, it's super challenging when you're bringing in, you know, other kids and into the mix and all that. Yeah, it's

Brandon Handley 48:05 hard enough with your own, right. Yeah, for sure. So and where then, where Then should I send people to come and find you, if they're interested?

Erin Mac 48:18 I think probably the best place to find me is on Instagram. My handle is Aaron, er, I N m A C LLC. And I post like a weekly video on some sort of strategy or something to think about. And I put like, inspirational memes and my stories. And my website URL is in the profile as well. It's a good way to interact with me, you can DM me, you can private message me or whatever. You know, and I always whenever I'm on a podcast, I offer a free I call it step one to joy call to just get you on the path, you know, maybe I you know disseminate the, the visualization process a little bit further so that you can get started on that and your life or whatever that looks like. And if afterwards, you still want to hang out with me and learn more than great if you don't, no strings attached. It's just my way of being in service.

Brandon Handley 49:21 Awesome. And thanks so much for being on today. Thanks for what you do, right? You know, being able to help people make that transition from a Bumble of nerves into something, you know, a little bit more usable and functional in society. I mean, there's the there's a reason why that's your calling. So thank you for being of service and doing that for everybody out there.

Erin Mac 49:47 Oh my gosh, thanks for having me. And thanks for having these platforms. It's really important to have these conversations, giving people hope and strategies and just something to think about that's, you know, positive I appreciate the opportunity. Thank you so much. Absolutely.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Brandon Handley 0:02 party people, party people used to get you going, right? You'd be, you'd be out there.

Unknown Speaker 0:09 You'd be dancing all night

Brandon Handley 0:11 long. And it's a party for party people. I knew they were talking to you. He knew they were talking to you. And you were like, I am a party people,

Unknown Speaker 0:22 people, Hey,

Brandon Handley 0:24 what's going on? I live in jujitsu, right now in Brazilian jujitsu. And I just want to see if I can convey a little bit about something that I learned recently, don't do a whole lot of research into the deep, deep origins of Jiu Jitsu, Brazilian Jiu Jitsu, to be specific, other than the fact that I know that there's a Japanese version, and there's a Brazilian one. Suffice to say, I've been doing it for the past couple, four years. Mine is a COVID year. And it is something that is right in line with this whole spiritual journey that I've been on soul journey, period, physical, emotional, number of whatever, whatever you want to call it, the whole the whole thing, the whole kitten caboodle. And the idea is,

Unknown Speaker 1:30 What's the idea?

Brandon Handley 1:31 The idea is that it has been something that while taking jujitsu and going to Jiu Jitsu, there's certainly more confidence in being able to defend myself or, or my family if I had to, and, and in certain situations, it has given me the opportunity to be part of a community to Jiu Jitsu community, to me is simply all about you working to get better. And then you working to help someone else get better. This morning, as I was leaving jujitsu, you know, everybody over there's pretty good, right? Everybody there's think, on the same skill level, or above or slightly below. And, and so we all, we all have some pretty good, pretty good roles. And if there's anything that you've ever heard about Jiu Jitsu is like doesn't even matter, you know, I'm going up against the black belt, who can certainly demolish me, but even even even he is able to learn something from me, either, maybe he refined something that he already knows, on me, because I've given an opening that maybe nobody else has ever given him before he's able to apply it in a scenario, or is just able to practice his craft on a live body. And that in of itself is to me invaluable. The same way that talking with somebody in person is so much better than anything you could possibly do through zoom through digital. So there's nothing nothing replaces doing something live and with a person. In real, in real There we are. Right? I don't care how augmented reality gets, I don't care how virtual it gets. And I don't care if we are living in the matrix. This is just

Unknown Speaker 3:41 what I'm saying

Brandon Handley 3:42 right now. So nothing, nothing beats that. And so we all we all learn from each other and we're all there also to jitsu as a community to help each other improve. And as I was leaving this morning, I'll just say okay, that's okay. So thanks, everybody, for being how's it. Thanks, everybody for being here. You're all you're all better because of me today.

Unknown Speaker 4:05 And half

Brandon Handley 4:06 joke half not and we all move out. We all got a chuckle right. Simply because it's true. I'm improving because of them. I guarantee it. And that that's that's part of the community of Brazilian jujitsu. The idea though, is that jujitsu apparently and I couldn't be wrong, but I was listening to Swami Safari or Peri and Nanda Swami Ji. And he was bringing up the idea that anytime you put like the jitsu part of it, it means fighting. However, when you when you turn it into, though, like Judo, jujitsu becomes Judo, it becomes the A way which becomes a spiritual path. And I was not aware of that. However, I can guarantee that this has been, for me my way, and he was talking about that with, with swordfighting. Right. kenjutsu becomes kanjo. And something about, I don't know, become a keto, the deal is, is that these martial arts that while they are certainly amazing for physical activity, they have this the spiritual capacity as well, where, for me, it puts it puts me into just all kinds of different scenarios and breaks down the ego. So, so well, especially, I can recall, when I first started kind of competition, I think I had like, maybe my third or fourth stripe, I don't know, maybe even just my second stripe, I forget on my white belt, and I thought it was some hot shit, right. And, and I had to go up against this other guy who had no stripes on his belt. However, he, like, he was a super strong, I think he's about 10 years younger than me. And he just choke the shit out of me. And I just, you know, I wasn't prepared, I let my guard down. And at the same time I was I just I was humbled. And so it's a sport and practice that is the super humbling, suffice to say just so everybody knows, that guy went on to win the competition and white belt, inclusive of inclusive of what they call open. Absolute, that's what it is absolute. And so he was pretty good. I'm still I'm still humbled. And it's just eradicates this ego, of, I'm better than you and you're better than me versus this thing where we're all in this together.

And it really just kind of makes a creates a different space for for you and your, your, your own practice. And I think that this, this spills over for me into so many other different areas, especially takes it into work, takes it into my job, takes it into my home life, takes it into the community in general, where whereby even if I hadn't already had this this point of view. And I can't say that I absolutely did. I was certainly more of me centered and completely all about myself. Only for for quite a number of years. And well, I'm certain that I made it through and did just fine. The way that I feel now is and the way they act now is more from a place of of community. Self Service, self sufficiency as well as service, how can I be of service and jujitsu? I think brought a lot of that out of me. Well, I think that it was always there. It just hadn't been, hadn't been. hadn't been tapped, right that just just a resource that hadn't been tapped. a resource that maybe I didn't feel like was worth sharing. As in I think even even just most recently last night I did the Marianne Williamson posts, where it's the idea that you're not afraid of, it's not the darkness in you that you're afraid of. It's the light and you that you're most afraid of and your greatness that's inside, and how playing small doesn't serve anyone. And that whole idea the idea of like playing small means that maybe you've got some ideas that you think may make a change or may make a situation that you're in better, something that could improve where you are. And you don't say anything because you're afraid that someone may not understand you're afraid you may not get the idea across. There's a whole number of reasons why you may not share it. And the other reason may be like you just don't feel like you're ranked high Why would they listen to me? They never listened to me or something like that. And you put your you put this in your head. And so you you don't, you don't share it out. And, and again, I think going through jujitsu and the past few years of coaching and all this other stuff have brought me to a place where I feel confident and comfortable that even if it's maybe not the best idea, we can talk through it right? The same thing will happen again. And this becomes just an inner practice, right listening to your intuition or recognizing the spaces internally. That becomes the way for you just the same way that jujitsu doesn't always have to mean that this is a fighting art it is a fighting art, but it can also be transcended into the spiritual practice and drive you innately

Unknown Speaker 10:58 so

Brandon Handley 11:00 just thought that I would share some of that with you as I'm as I'm leaving jujitsu and very I thought that hearing that was pretty awesome you know, I had no idea myself that these martial arts translated into spiritual practices even though like I always felt like they did anyways there was this kind of here was this definition of when you go from you know, this fighting are into a spiritual space to spiritual practices a certain way. Then you find yourself in a different space and applying applying some of this stuff internally. And it's, it's a

Unknown Speaker 11:43 whole

Brandon Handley 11:44 it's a whole it is a whole nother universe. It is a whole nother space and just implore that you find something for yourself, right? That anything you're doing on the outside think you can do on the inside, right. And vice versa as the inside is what is reflected on the outside anywho hope y'all are having a fantastic day, morning, evening, wherever you are, whatever you do. I hope that it's great and this has been your hit the spiritual

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

The Goal of Positive Television is to generate publicity for the many individuals and organizations already making positive change and to assist developing groups and individuals flourish. Prabhat's belief is that there are already many positive things being done all around the world, so creating programs and events will serve to inspire more people to get involved. Prabhat has said, "People have a fascination with all aspects of celebrity life, so I wanted to create a network that focuses on the giving done by celebrities and use that celebrity power for the highest good."

Connect with Prabhat at https://positivetelevision.org/ or, if you have an idea, or enjoy this podcast, pick up the phone and give him a call @310-872-0669

Transcript below is machine generated

Brandon Handley 0:00 4321 Hey there spiritual dope. Today I have with me Prabhat Gautam and you know, I'm gonna deviate a little bit, I'll definitely let you know that for both comes from, you know, to me from positive television. That org it's a positive television is something that provides has created himself and he connects with a ton of ton of different people and organizes lots of awesome events. But you know today I just want to I want to take a little bit of a deviation from just kind of doing the biographical statements I just wanted to say, you know, Rob came to me, by way of, you know, just kind of like a random introduction, you would you had introduced Kiko Ellsworth to the podcast, and I just wanted to reach out and say, thank you for that. And then it turned into, you know, kind of, you know, getting on the podcast, and I just thought that was really cool. Because you never know whose life you're touching, right? When you do these podcasts and who you're reaching out to. And, you know, even before we got started today, you're you're sharing that? Well, you know, you still listen to a podcast or two. And it's always great to hear that, that what's being sent out is being heard. So thank you for that for being a listener, but also for, you know, being a connector and also for the work that you do in the space that you are in, which we'll certainly talk about, and for being on here today.

Prabhat Gautam 1:31 But thank you so much, Brandon, and thanks for creating this amazing platform. And, you know, when I heard episodes, I just I wanted Chico to be on there. Because, you know, Chico, last year did this amazing conference. And he's looking for opportunities to talk about his spiritual journey. And I was like Brandon's the guy, because the reality is what you're doing with the whole spiritual junk movement and what you're doing with your podcast. It's really getting spirituality, I think, to a next level, or it's real for people. And I think during our time today, we'll talk about how you're making it real for people. And it's not just, you know, as we heard many times of your podcast, this out there thing that people aren't practicing every day, you're making it a practical thing. What you're doing

Brandon Handley 2:19 now, thank you. Thank you. And I'm glad that that's coming through, right? Because that's absolutely the intent is how do we make this practical and less nebulous, and more of something that is in your life every day all the time? Right, there's no separation. So since you have listened, then then you should know, right, the next piece is that the universe speaks to us. Right? And, and there's somebody out there today that you know, is going to be tuned into the podcast. And there's a message that is being delivered to and through you that that listeners are going to need to hear what is that message today.

Prabhat Gautam 2:57 I really deeply believe that. I want people to find what they're just what they're driven to do. And it may not need to be your occupation. But live more of that. If you're a painter and you love painting, I'm not saying you need to quit your job and become a professional painter. But make time every week in your life to do that. If you love going to the beach, because it brings you joy, go once a week, once a month, like take your vacations there. So we know deep down what we're drawn to like where there's a magnet, we know what we're getting what we feel deeper than we need to be around. And I think for the truth is, for a lot of us, it's good people. It's inspirational programming. So go find that stuff. So that's what I hope people will do is, is do more of this stuff that really nourishes you and fulfills you. Because when you do that amazing, wonderful things open up in mostly you open up.

Brandon Handley 4:00 That's awesome. So the I mean, the idea that the idea that simply do more of what you love, right, and it doesn't have to be this doesn't have to be the this thing where you throw everything away and just do this thing, right? Like you always hear people talking about burning bridges and let it all go right. But just just to find time and and make that time to to go do it. And the idea, I love the idea that it's going to nourish and fulfill you, right? Yeah, I mean, just I mean talk a little bit more about what you mean by nourishment and fulfillment, right? What's that mean to you?

Prabhat Gautam 4:42 Yeah, what it really means is it my three favorite analogies are always sports, dating and food, right? Those three things and they like when you think about when, when you're in those worlds if you meet somebody you like them. You want to spend more time, right? There's like this, this magnetism if you'd like somebody in sports, you do all this time to practice every day, because you're preparing for the game. And if you go into a game, and you've never practiced your level performance, it's just not gonna be the same level as your, as your competitors, and your teammates. And then obviously, in the food world, we've all done this, we're all guilty of it, I'm still guilty of it, sometimes, you have this pack day, we have so much you have to do, you look up at two o'clock, you haven't eaten anything, you haven't drank juice, you haven't, like, you know, you've not you've, you've basically gone through a 568 hours a day, with no nutrients, often no water, and that's gonna affect your ability, like, it's gonna affect your brain, it's gonna affect your effectiveness. And the reality is, it's gonna affect your mood, you're not going to be as loving, as nurturing as thoughtful a person. So for me, everything comes back to, we know what nurtures us, we know what fills us. So when you know, in you what you need to be nurtured. And I know for me on the food level, I love quick snacks, like I love snack bars, I love to have juice in the morning. And that's how I like to run my day. So if I'm not doing that, or not taking care of my basic nutritional needs, it's going to impact what I'm going to be able to do for other people. I think you know, this brand, and even with your podcast, you might do multiple podcasts in a day. But if you're not making any time for you, and your loved ones, it's gonna affect your podcast, like you're going to feel it, your energy levels is going to be a little lower, you're going to be a little tired, you're not going to have as much focus. And you're doing this all the time. I think at a high level, I think you're doing amazing work. But the truth is, can we all do things at a higher level? And how much are we holding ourselves back? When we're not nourishing ourselves?

Brandon Handley 6:54 Yeah, I mean, that's powerful. Right? Can I mean just, yeah, just the idea of, can we be doing something at a higher level, by by nourishing ourselves, right, by by adding the element of making sure that we're taking care of ourselves, and that's inclusive of taking care of our families. And, you know, as as, as, you know, look as a family, man, right? I can, I will definitely feel thrown off balance, if I'm not having that family time. Right. And it will definitely show up in everything that I'm doing, just like you're saying. So what, you know, one of the cool things, I mean, you know, the, I know you through right, is the positive television piece, right, which you shared with me. Well, let's talk a little bit about that. And how you got that spun up and organized. And what took you there?

Prabhat Gautam 7:42 Yeah, so for me, I grew up on the MTV era, right, in the, in the 90s. And I remember when I, I just loved it, you know, loved music videos, and just loved sort of it was this pop culture phenomenon. And I think, you know, getting out of college as like, Well, what do I want my life to be? And I went, and I did an internship with Amnesty International, but I thought my life would be putting these reports together about what's happening internationally, and fixing, you know, atrocities, and how do we change the world? And then right before I finished college, I interned with the Vice President, the University, University of Oklahoma, and then I started writing out what would my dream world look like? And how would I want to be part of it? And I felt like media has this incredible power, to motivate, inspire, and get people to take action? So I thought, Well, okay, media can do that when they tell stories. And this is, you know, 1999. I thought, well, what if you're actually intentional with your media? What if it's not like, oh, there's 29 minutes of local news. That's depressing and terrible, and you're scare? And the last 30 seconds are, you know, somebody saved the cat that went up a tree? What did we actually just did all positive stories, while we're being realistic, that there's a lot of terrible things happening in the world, but it's always solution oriented. And that's really sort of the impetus of what positive telogen turned into. So I moved out to LA in 2000, to create this television network. And again, I was young, I didn't know what I was doing, which I honestly believe is the best place to be at when you don't know what you're doing. You just take steps step step. And you might take a wrong step, but it's a learning step. So again, right? What I love to use words like failure and wrong, because I think so often people view those as negative. And I feel like if we own Hey, I failed, hey, I don't I've made the wrong choices, then it's like, Okay, well, then I know there's a right choice to make. I know there's a chance for success. So for me, you know, I believed in this world moved to Los Angeles to try to create this television network. And the next thing that happened is Tesla events. I've met all these people that I thought would help me build this network, and I ended up producing events and now 21 years later, I've produced 800 events in Los Angeles. with, you know, huge celebrities, usually super wealthy people. And and now when I look back in 1999, and 2008, a cable TV channel, but I saw a world where there's no commercials where you're just telling stories. And the reality is, there was no YouTube, there's no Facebook, there's no Google in 1999. Like, none of that existed in the way it exists now. So sometimes when you're early, it's really difficult because you think the world doesn't believe in what you believe in. And later, you realize, like when I listen to podcasts now, and you watch YouTube videos, and you see Netflix, Amazon, there's so much content that's inspirational. It was like 1% of the content and 9099. Now, if you want to be surrounded by positivity all day, you can live in that positive bubble as much as you want. Which I think realistically, we need we need. After you've had a family member that's passed, or something sad happened, you needed to be lifted up, and you need to be in a place of all positivity. And then when you come back to the regular world, where there's some negative, some positive, you can start at 20 9010, you could really, you can curate your positivity in one of the podcasts that you did random that I loved was with Mr. Youngblood and you talked about Wish I love you said, if somebody finds a spiritual community, that doesn't work for them, it's not an indictment on that community or on you, it just isn't a fit. So go seek out other communities. Because once you find your community, you'll you know what you feel it. And sometimes the search isn't the first door. It's four doors, it's eight doors, but every door taught you your resilience, and how bad you want to find your try.

Brandon Handley 12:00 Yeah, 100%. And thanks for that. Right. The idea is,

Unknown Speaker 12:05 I think once

Brandon Handley 12:06 you start to feel that spiritual pool, there's kind of no stopping you. But there is, there's the opportunity to find a community that you don't really know identify with, or feel like you fit in with and you can keep moving again, like you're saying beyond to to the next or the next word, there's so, so many, so many places that you can go right now. That is just, it's just amazing. And to your point, right? You know, we didn't have YouTube, back in the day, we didn't have Facebook, we didn't have all these communities, we didn't have all these things open to us, that we that we've got available right now. But I love the idea of what you're saying too. And that kind of fear. If you're a visionary, right? If you're ahead of your time, you may feel like people aren't believing in you, or you start to maybe doubt like your own vision and, and kind of what you're going through. And it's not that the world isn't ready for you. It's it's getting ready, right? It's like It's like, it's like getting dressed for the prom, right? It's just gonna take, so it's gonna take a little bit longer than you expected.

Prabhat Gautam 13:09 And I think too, sometimes it's, I remember in college, but I just was flipping channels. Late at night, I saw the story about missing kids. And I said, Why are we not finding these kids? I never knew any kid that's missing. I just saw this story. And it just impacted me. So I started writing letters to Oprah and Rosie O'Donnell and CNN and said, We need to like find these kids, like don't show photos of them. Let's incorporate it into your programming. And I remember getting all these letters back where they're like, Oh, yeah, you know, we tried to dress it. We're doing this, we're doing that. I remember, I did a mock up of what I thought that look like. And it was this television network where all the commercials would be little ads at the bottom, there'd be no real commercial just be like, you know, it's basically what's a banner ad on and, and the internet now. And I remember kind of writing everything up and saying I think the future is going to be a ton of content like you know, when john f kennedy was killed you see the the story with a reporters telling you know, Walter Cronkite tells the story. I want to watch the whole news coverage before that last minute where he says that, so we're gonna find that archival footage, and I thought eventually there'll be a video outlet somewhere where you find out archivable news footage. I had no idea what YouTube would be would be silly videos and, you know, cat videos or whatever else. But it's also what you were saying. It's highly educational, Facebook, YouTube, Instagram, all these things. They can suck up your day and 19 hours are wasted. Or it can be inspirational. You're growing, you're learning you find your community of people, so many wonderful friends who live in that social media space. They work in that space. They're there in you know, they're influencers, that space. They have people that they know every aspect of their life. They're friends with that they Never met face to face. And I think, isn't that a beautiful thing like you're creating pen pals all over the world that you're connected with. And for me, I in social media, where I, you know, I like to put stuff out, I don't spend a lot of time interacting on social media. But again, I think that's, that's a product of my age, I think that's sort of, I come from a world of AI Still, if there's somebody is doing something cool, like what you're doing brand or something, something, Hey, you guys should know about this person. I cold call people. I've done that for 30 years. And I think, you know, when I meet these Gen X, Gen Z kids, they're like, what's called calling like, you find somebody that's doing something that's really amazing. You send them an email, or a phone call, or you just pick up a phone, and you call them and say, Hey, I love what you're doing. This is why I love it. And sometimes divided, it can be a reason why you are going to work together, you're just telling them, Hey, I respect what you're about. And sometimes those things lead to amazing friendships. You know, you can work with those people. At the very least, they got encouragement, I think, you know, we're in a world of we all love being encouraged. We love positivity. But I think part of that equation is we need to put that out, we need to be encouragers. So when you see somebody say something positive, that's really, you know why I'm so excited about this world of this guy, I think it's a whole new media phenomenon where, where it's not four channels is that you know, four channels that dictate to you what you learn, you get to pick what you want to learn every day of your life. And if you don't want to learn what I remember, in 2003, I had a good friend who is Episcopalian, and she would do lat so I said, I want to do let you know, I my backgrounds, cultural anthropology, so I gave up all TV for a month. Well, it happened to coincide with the first with the the Gulf War, the 2003 Gulf War. And I remember thinking, I'm so lucky, I missed that. Because how negative was that seeing bombs thrown on people and death and, and just sort of be in a constant state of fear, where you know, just happen to coincide with the time I, it's the only year I ever did lab. But that LED will always be memorable to me, because I grew up, you know, when you're in Ramadan. I'm not trying to be Catholic or Episcopalian or Muslim. But Ramadan, I said, I want to see what this journey is for people that do that. And I learned so much understanding for what people go through, that really don't eat for the day. Because they don't have access to food, I get to do it as a chance for me to grow. And, you know, try to see what a billion people in the world are doing. But realistically, there are people who don't eat a meal a whole day, there's children that don't eat. So if I can grow as a person and can walk in their shoes, or if even it makes me a better person,

Brandon Handley 18:02 right? No, I love that. I love the I love the idea of, you know, just trying to walk in somebody else's shoes for for a period of time, you know, going through, I've never done land. I've never done Ramadan, right. And one of the things that I certainly encourage my family to do with my children is to research other cultures, right? Go research other cultures outside of America. And you know, what, what did they do? What do they celebrate? What does that celebration? What are those kids eating this week? Right? What does that look like for them? And this is something that I took from one of my history teachers way back in the day is like, why something like some type of food that that culture makes? And let's, let's eat that. Let's make that meal, right? Like, what goes into that? And kind of where does it come from? And the background of it. And so, definitely love that. One of the things that, you know, I don't think that we really hit upon you do events, what type of events the Do you know, with with these 800 events? What kind of events are they?

Prabhat Gautam 19:03 Yeah, so it's really it's a charity space. So it's, it's a ton of fundraisers. So in 2008, I did a fundraiser for group called kind kids in need of defense. So undocumented children that are that are picked up by ice angelyn it's one of Angelina Jolie's charities. So that was amazing. And she wasn't there. So we didn't get to get married. So I'm still sad by that. I think she was a bad dad at the time anyway. But But you know, I guess put that together. I've done so a lot. First stars with foster kids. That's something I'm passionate about. And then a bunch of the animal charities gentle barn, Farm Sanctuary, Humane Society, like there's just so so it's really my sort of focus is what's the group that doesn't have a voice and then how do we give them a voice? So it's animals, it's people, it's it's people abroad, right. Like, I think even people here you know, it's women and domestic violence. They don't feel like they have a voice. It's Kids. So that's so much of it. So I'd say the majority is, is definitely fundraisers. And then along with that, what I love is doing documentary launches, doing book launch events, restaurant launch events, like the whole thing of getting people there to celebrate. I just I love that. So that's really what I looked back at 21 years and 800 events. But there was one month, September 2007, I did 30 days of events. So I just because I'd never done that, I said, I want to challenge myself, I'll do an event every single day that I produced. And we'll never do that, again, probably. There's a lot of time. But But definitely, it was amazing, because I teamed up with all these other people and said, Hey, I'm doing this month of events come up with a really fun idea. And there's a woman she she made, you know, a little vegan baked goods, and she wanted people to rollerblade I don't work. But now I see that she made these big guns, she gave him away for free. people showed up there probably the weather. And says like, that's fine, you know, and there's some fundraisers obviously during that month, but a lot of it's just, I think my passion is how do you help people figure out their community? How do you grow community that how do you use community to do maximum good in the world. And I think what we all know is we all have, you know, whether people have the financial resources to help, or they can just share a video share a story, there's just we have, we have the ability to help raise awareness, and you know, sign up people, my friend, she metal has a whole movement called raising their vibration, who I'm definitely going to introduce you to Brandon, you know, she has a whole radio thing with la talk radio, but that's her whole thing. It's like she does, you know, public events, how do you raise vibration in the world? So, to me, it's that all comes back to it's, it's just bringing more positivity and, and I'm an obsessed connector. So how do we connect people, and then get them to do more good, because, you know, once I meet people like, hey, Brandon, I'm a kid, this person has a great podcast, who are the people I know beyond that, then if I meet somebody that's a chef, and they went out there doing a cookbook? Well, who do I know, there are photographers to help them with their books. So I'd say so much of my work is people reaching out to me, because they have a project, and they don't know how to move it along. And then I help them make it happen.

Brandon Handley 22:25 That's awesome. And I love that, you know, it's kind of like, you've got this, you know, gift of being able to see kind of what's good and everyone and to be able to connect the goodness as it is. Right? And, and to help them to, to scale that out is what it sounds like, right? You know, if somebody doesn't know, you know, they've got a great idea, or they, you know, and they just want to give to the community, and then you're able to help them kind of put that together in some way, shape, or form. And really, what you're doing is raising vibration.

Prabhat Gautam 22:58 But thank you, I mean, some things I'm excited, you know, people need for like helping with a documentary Forks Over Knives. They're really the documentary game changers, I helped introduce those producers, to some funders, they'll pay for it. And it's a lot of people that are pieces of puzzles, I just saw people just really honest with and they just say, Hey, this is our budget, you know, we would love to hire you bring you in to help us do this event. But you know, we also need to raise funds for the project. So we're strategically, what do you think we need to do? And I can sit down with them, and I'm honest with them, and I say, you know, these steps, and you know, this is what, from my experience of 21 years of events, where I think you're gonna have the best opportunity. So much of what I talk to people about is go to friends and family first, when you have an idea. I know a lot of times, our family's not encouraging. And that's why a lot of people get into these spaces where they want to help. But I think give them a chance to say no, because if you don't go to them, it's a no, if you go to them, and they say yes. And I've met with people, they say, Oh, well, my best friend's father is a multimillionaire, but you know, I don't really want to go to them to help. But I have this idea, but I have no funding. And I would say to them, go to your friend's father, because maybe he won't give you a million, maybe they give you 5000 10,000. But if he gives you 10 or 20,000 for your project, well, then you start it. And once you started, it's just the philosophy of take a step every step you take, because what I've seen over and over and over again, is when people are the idea phase, we're still used to people talking about ideas, and it doesn't turn into anything. But when you take action, people don't want to hear Oh, I want to go from Los Angeles to Washington DC. They're like I bought a ticket to go from LA to DC. I don't know what I'm gonna do when I get there. I don't know how to you know, there's a whole environmental movement that happened a couple years ago where people went out there, but once you bought the ticket, people are more likely to be on board and I'm not Use your savings to buy that ticket. But if you don't take that first action step, people don't believe you're, you're really going to do it. But once you take that step, that leap of faith, people feel like, wow, this person's committed, what can I do to help them? So I think, give people opportunity to help you. But it starts with what's your action step? And I tell people all the time do Kickstarter do Indiegogo do don't fund me, again, you may only raise 2000. That's 2000 more than you started. But what's gonna happen is you're now putting it out to everybody. You know, this is what I care about. This is my passion. And now, that person that's your friend for five years, who is going to be able to donate, but their friends friends friend has XYZ that you need to help with your project. Will you just why do we need money? We need money to move things along. Right? It's a currency, right? Right. It's right, it's water. So if you if you have the raft, you go out to the water and you know how to swim. It's important. You know how to swim, swimming lessons, then get out there and be with other persons cool. They're there after swimming. But what are they swimming for? Like I remember years ago to get friend, she had to do a walk from LA to Washington, DC to raise awareness about a bunch of issues. And I said, Okay, that's good. Are you serious that I want to do is about children's issues or health issues. Next thing you knew my friend Peter Samuelsson, I tell him about, he said, He's trying to raise awareness about homeless issues. He said, Well, can he push this portable homeless cart at his organization? He darn EDR everyone deserves a roof as part of my job is to help push it. Next thing in the process is the owner the Philadelphia Eagles. Jeffrey Lurie. Yeah, here, we got Jeffrey Lurie on board and Phil are the Eagles doctors, we're going to be her personal doctors on our wall. Wow. And it all became real. And then she's like, wow, am I really going to do this. And obviously her family got scared. She and in the end, she ended up deciding to go to the grad school route versus the walk across the country for a few months. But for her, she needed to know people believed in her. And, and she's this amazing activist. And sometimes what you need is not what you believe to happen to happen. You need to know people believe in you. I think for her, she was in tears. She's like, Peter got Whoopi Goldberg on board. He said, Well, we're doing this event in Philadelphia, why don't you instead of kicking off in LA kick off in Philadelphia. And then let's have Whoopi Goldberg announced your walk, and you start in Philadelphia. And she was like I said, you have Whoopi Goldberg, you have the Philadelphia Eagles owner and their doctors on board. You don't need to raise $5,000 or $10,000. You raise awareness. And through that awareness, you're gonna be able to raise a bunch of money.

And you're gonna raise so much awareness for these causes. So I just tell people, let everybody in your circle know what you're doing. Right? And if they feel like it's authentic and genuine, don't you know this rant like doors, open doors always.

Brandon Handley 28:11 It's so true, right? Just like you're saying, as soon as and as soon as you take that first action, like you're talking about take that first. That leap of face is like, I call it like the signal to the universe, like, Alright, I'm doing this thing. Or like the fallback thing, I'm gonna need you to catch me, right, like I'm taking, I'm putting this foot down, I'm gonna I'm gonna head in the direction that I told everybody I was gonna head in. I'm gonna need like universal backing, could I go ahead and get that and, and it shows up. And it shows up in such amazing and powerful ways. I mean, I still like kind of well up about I mean, even connecting with you and connecting with all the people that I've gotten to connect with on this podcast and all the other podcasts. It's, it's just so amazing. What will open up if you're willing to, like you said earlier, open yourself up to it. Right? So absolutely.

Prabhat Gautam 29:06 All of these things. Yay. Right? Like we were newly friends, right? Friends forever now. And now it's like who the amazing people that are going to be inspired by your podcast, but I'll send you an email, Hey, bring that up. person's cool. I'd love to connect with them. Yeah, and then vice versa, right. like Nike goes through me. Now Kiko is gonna hopefully tap you in his network about the book, but his conference in the next year when he does a live conference, you know, last year, he did a virtual one, but he does a live one. Well, I'm sure he's gonna want you to be part of it. So it's like, you just see that these are the beginning of relationships that are for your life. And again, we're all in different cities, but it's an the paradigm has shifted in such a profound way that we don't need to be next door neighbors in the same block, but we can literally be anywhere in the world and communicate and connect people to want to Now that are in all these amazing things out and I mean, I, I really am just such a strong believer in when he said to the analogy of somebody falling backwards, fall backwards, it's good to know at least one person will catch you. But all you need is one, if one will catch you, then that means there's two, there's 10, there's 100. And there's 100, people don't catch you. You don't need to fall backwards. Now you're all moving forward together, you're all running, you're walking, you're running your you know, walk, jog, run, and then now you're the marathon. And now you're raising all this awareness consciousness about all this dollies, right? Like, and I tell people all the time, I don't care what your passion is, I really don't like my passions. I don't care what your passion is. Just figure it out, find it. If I can help you find a quicker, I want to be part of that. And a good friend years ago, she said, If you met somebody that want to be a hairdresser, you do everything to help her start her hairdressing salon. I said, Yes, I would. And I don't have any desire to go to hairdresser. But I think if you see people's passion, you want to help nurture that you want to be part of that. And, and to me, it all goes back to I in the world of business, right? They'll say, Oh, you just introduction to this, will you get a cut of the deal? I want, I don't want 10% of people's joy. I want 1,000% of their joy like to know you help somebody find their passion and you're part of it. You don't need them to tell you that you don't need plaques, just to see their life, see them excited to know you are part of that journey. And everybody they're ever going to talk to you are part of that. And vice versa. They're part of your joy. What's that worth? That's bazillions. Like that, that's such a higher level value than any amount of money.

Brandon Handley 31:46 Now 100% you I mean, you can't you can't buy that, right. And it's, it's it's a challenge to instill that in someone who doesn't have it too. But even though it's already there, right, you can see it for them. And like you want to help them to see that in themselves. Right? Like you're talking about that light, getting them to explore it and maybe needing that encouragement like is that somebody says they want to be a hairdresser. You're like, Yeah, let's go right? Like, you all you need is just that little, I always think about like the tiny seeds in the in the cracks of cement and sidewalks, right? They there's like nothing around them, which is about just the tiniest amount of nurturing, right? nutrients, it gets them to blossom and grow in that in that place, which you know, to me, it speaks to us as well, right? As humans, it's just a little bit of encouragement to go do that thing you said you wanted to do. And I bring this up because some of my first podcast came about right, I had a coach and, and I told her I want to do a podcast and I was expecting I was expecting her to say, well, that's a dumb idea you really shouldn't deviate from from doing doing that. And instead, she's like, Alright, well, what can I do to help? And I was like, What? Yeah, right, it's just and that's all you need is just a little bit of that type of encouragement to, to go and find and do the things that you love, but to have the support with other people with you. That's, that's, you know, that makes it tenfold and beyond. So the other piece that we were talking about before, we figured out our technical challenges today was the idea that, you know, you know, I think you seem to be in a pretty good spiritual place, you know, seem like you're, you're feeling pretty happy. You've got like, you know, your light that you shine to help other lights shine. But you talked a little bit about like a lot of these people that you help with these events that are sad. Right. And and let's talk a little bit about that, since you brought it up earlier.

Prabhat Gautam 33:46 Yeah, so yeah, you know, years ago, you know, I met Andy dick, who's, you know, pretty known for his drug and alcohol addiction, right? So we became friends. And then then we had, we had a gallery in Hollywood together. And I remember, you know, just seeing that world of fame, and how so many people like they want to seek that out, right? They want to, and like in any other ad, his brother dies, get a relapse and got back into drinking. And I remember when

I was like, 3am, one night, and I said, Ken is what your legacy to be. Because as far as we know, right? We're all going to be gone one day, what's your legacy? And he said, I want to prevent people from the hardships I had. I said, Andy, what does that look like? Is that a bug? Is that a toward you? When I speak to college kids, so they'll never get it? He said, love to do that. I said, so you know, I'll send them encouraging text still on that end. We got to that book, because he wants to help get people out of the pitfalls he got into. And I think so often in the world of celebrity, no, I I interviewed Jim Greenberg. He's donated 40 40 million to charity. amazing person, right. And he's always in a place of giving and high level celebrities, you know. And what you realize is people think they want to have these people's lives and they miss that. Jim is talks about when you're a philanthropist, he said, every day of my life, people are pitching projects that they need funding for. And I have to think, who do I find them utilized often, and whoever I don't find, they may not be able to get the help they need. And he said, I only have limited resources, no matter how much money I have, I still can't find everything you said the majority of his time is on the phone with other donors trying to get them to help fund projects. So you know, he figured out the areas he wants to focus on, he tries to encourage more people as they're growing their wealth to give the money away. And I think we look at it from an outside like, oh, when you're famous, or when you're rich, your life's gonna be easy. And you're cater to one of the people misses. There's a loneliness a lot of people with wealth and fame have. And there's also this world where, when people come to them, they always need something. And so, you know, I remember when when Jim moved into his house in Los Angeles, the first week he moved in, I brought I brought over Amy's soups, who are on his, I said, Jim, you're worse cook than me, I want you to have easy since he does warm a lot, you know, and I've been vegan since 1999. He's vegan plant based, now for a while. So I'd say these are easy soups, you throw them in the, you know, you heat them up on the stovetop, that's good. And, and I said, he doesn't need me to bring him soup. He's a super wealthy person. But I said, we're legitimately friends, I would do that for any friend, whether they have $1 or a million dollars. And and I think we just got to be in a place of, of not having this idol worship. And I think you know, what I love about what you're doing your podcast, Brandon is, it's, it's making spirituality real for people. Because I think too often, they think the pastor is amazing at their church, they think the spiritual teacher of this yoga practice is amazing. Well, what happens to that person is a scandal, which they do. So when the person you look up to is flawed? Do you throw out your whole spiritual practice? Because they're a flawed individual? Or do you say, okay, they were trying to teach something good, but they themselves didn't even get the fullness of what the lesson is. So I think, you know, I think I said to a good friend recently, these are systems, religion is a system, right? These spiritual practices systems, that people can be bound within the system. And there's a group of people who see outside of the system, and the system can still help heal, you can help you grow. I say all the time. If somebody has a drug addiction, alcohol addiction, they've been through a lot of trauma. I want them to find organized religion, if that's going to help them do it. I think there's deeper beyond that. And maybe I'm wrong, but I think there is. So I think whatever you need to break, whatever is holding you back and do that. But ultimately, I want people to find just, I think there's a direct pathway for people, when when you find good people find them. When you find encouragement, buying them. However, people want to describe these things, energy, God, whatever, you know, atheist, it's like it's love. It's goodness, I think it's inconsequential. The the labels we put on stuff is me coming from a cultural anthropology background, there's different words for everything. There's cultures, they have no word for snow, so to snow, because it is the smell of those those communities. So snow exists, the fact that they don't have a word for it doesn't mean that they're lesser or they're devoid of smell, you know, I think we get so caught up in the semantics, the word the word games, and, and people are so busy trying to convert to their one segment of their view. Or really, I think the real work is encourage people to find what is working for them, be loving, be nurturing. And if they're in a path, you don't like that they're on delay, they'll find their way. And I think there's, I think there's an element of people, where there's a missionary element where they want to convert everybody to the one practice. But what happens when you grow your practice, you brought all these people to practice that doesn't even work for you anymore. So instead of trying to bring them to your practice, tell them what works for you. Be honest about it. Tell them any sort of issues you ever had in your journey. And be honest about it. And then if they find this in practice, great if they don't, you being honest, is so genuine. You know, I think for me, for me being vegan for 21 years, I tell people that there's some of those vegan cheeses, meats I didn't like at the beginning. I don't sell it as Oh, everything's great here. I'm like, these are the things I like these are the things I didn't like. This is why I liked it. And this is where, you know, my vegan role is improved. And I think a lot of people resonate with that more because it's a real commentary on my journey. And I think the same thing for for you, Brandon, what are you talking about is you know, you've gone through the podcasts you revamped, you changed and stuff, you learn you, you didn't wake up one day, and you're the next year, Rogen, you woke up one day and started it, modified it live life, modified it live life modified it, where you're at today, maybe different the reaction years from now, but where you're at today is where you feel drawn to be at. So to me, that's your journey, you're supposed to be doing what you're doing. Right? You see it, you feel it?

Brandon Handley 40:41 Yeah. And so it's impossible not to. Yeah, right. Once you, once you once you, once you do be in the field that draw that pool into where you're going, I always say to the, if I'm still talking the same talk, and saying the same things in 10 years, and something's probably wrong, that I'm not learning, maybe, right. Like, I'm like, I always, you know, I throw that out there. And then I'm going back to kind of earlier in the conversation just in the in the whole idea of, if you don't know how to do it, start doing it now. Right? Because you, it's almost better that you don't know anything, right? And you just start to do it and you start to do what feels right for you. I love I love what you're saying about the whole idea of, you know, in this, you know, I was certainly you know, against here, initially, you know, kind of falling into the spirituality spaces like, Oh, you got to do this way you do that do this, this is this is the way, right and it's not right. If that was my understanding of my path at that time, you have your very, very, very own path. And it's up to me to encourage you to follow your path, share some of the practices, like you're saying that that I have found that have worked for me, and they're called practices for a reason, right? Because I'm practicing them and I'm practicing, you know, implementing them in my life. And maybe one day, I won't use these same things anymore. And

Prabhat Gautam 42:11 then I remember when people talking to me about yoga, I was like, it's just still I can't do it. I'm like, I'm gonna fall asleep. But I had a good friend who she said to me, meditations, whatever you want it to be like, when you're on a train, if you if you're closing your eyes, you're listening to music, and it gets you in a calm state, that's your meditation. And really, it broke, for me the rigidness of it all. And I realized, like, we want people to find calm and peace within. And especially in a world of this hustle bustle you're running around all day. So if you close your eyes to three times a day, and it's calming you and you know, if you're, when you're in the shower, you close your eyes, or you just enjoy the water, or when you're in the morning, right having a bowl of cereal or you're like you're having whatever you're having. And you're like watching, you know, YouTube videos, if your favorite singer, if it brings you joy, and it's uplifting you, I always say my life philosophy is the Sheryl Crow song, if it makes you happy, it can't be that bad. Because I think people should seek out what makes them happy. And then when they realize it's empty, then you need to pivot. And be really honest with yourself, I tell people all the time that they want to be a loan and make as much money as they can make, go out and go on that path. And then when you find that it's empty for you, you realize, okay, you need to make money to live, it's good to have money. So you can, you know, take a trip you have as good as some savings. You know, that's, that's that'll make your life easier. But this pursuit to be the richest, most famous, the most everything person is getting ended up where you're not going to be that one day, you know, be the richest, prettiest, smartest, everything is famous this person. And then once you lose it, you're like, well, who am I? And then you realize that's a question should ask a lot, who am I and find that, and then let all the other things sort of take care of themselves. And I mean, one thing I definitely, you know, when I listen to your podcasts that stuck out to me that I was like, I got to talk to Brandon about this. Because either you're it's gonna resonate with me, or resonate with you? Well, we're gonna have a really good debate. I hope for the latter, but I think it's going to probably resonate is my critique of sort of this new world of spirituality, whatever the last 2025 years, is, it's too much of a multi level marketing plan. You gotta sign up 10 friends, and they're going to sign up to France, we're all going to become really wealthy, and we'll get a piece of it, which really, I think the way it should be is just to live your life, live your life, be who you are. And when that happens, you're not going to sign up 10 friends, you're gonna sign up one person is going to see what you're doing. They're gonna be inspired by it. They're going to go find 1000 people, they're going to find whoever and the reality is there is no Hey, you're going to get a percentage. This is it. We're not selling a product. We're Trying to uplift generations to come. You're trying to, you're trying to create light in the world and created a positivity for generations, well beyond where our lives. So if that happens, there's no scorecard, like, you know, if you're inspirational, you know, when people reach out to you, right? And they tell you, oh, your podcast inspired me. Oh, for me, I got the word people like, here, that was so amazing. I got to meet some of the most amazing people. But people have said to me, they're like, because, again, my events, I, during events, all if I think, oh, wow, this person's here, that person's there, they need to know each other. So all of you in person introductions, I'll say, this is why I think you need all the email introductions of people person, any person via this, why I think you guys should meet each other. But when you know, they end up creating amazing, wonderful projects together. Do you get that inspiration in you? So I think sort of my critique of sort of this

new spiritual world or last 30 years of spirituality or what's presented is there's I do think people, there's nothing wrong with selling products, making money, doing coaching, all that stuff's good. Like, I think it's we need people to like to live in their their spirituality every day of their life. But I think when it ends up being, well, you got to be happy every second of the day. No, you shouldn't be if somebody close to us passed away, and you feel no sadness. I question your real journey. You should feel sad, when somebody close to you says, they just went through a breakup or they were in a domestic violence relationship. Your reaction should be how do I help you? Oh, I feel terrible for you. Have you gone to counseling? Do you need a place to stay? What are actionable steps to help you? And you should, you should feel their sadness? And again, you know, in that moment, maybe you're not crying, but you're figuring out action steps. But I think real humans are not happy 24 hours a day, real humans? You know, question? Am I doing what's right? I think checking in with yourself is so important and saying yourself, Is this the right thing for me to do? And something that you did for I remember, I was in college, and University of Oklahoma, I did a cable television show for four years. And it was so much of my identity. And one day, I was like, This feels like work to me, I'm not enjoying it anymore. What do you think what changed is because I knew I was going to leave college, I needed to leave to start my life somewhere else. And no, it's Los Angeles in 1998 99. I just knew I was gonna leave. And I think you start preparing yourself. And again, this many years later, I've been involved by documentaries. So that television world has been part of my life. But it needed to change I needed to leave. You know, it's always like, you got to close some doors to open new ones. And one of my philosophies that I'm obsessed with is, is is owning the word quitting. You have to quit relationships, it to quit jobs, you have to quit things that are not the most fulfilling thing for you with the belief that something more fulfilling is going to happen. And I think so often people leave relationships, when they meet the next person, they quit a job because they found the next job. It's like, one of the best things ever did is I started working part time at a job I was in for four years, because I knew I was ready to leave. And that allowed me to transition into all the advanced stuff that I've gotten into. So I think preparing yourself without fully knowing what the next thing is, and taking that step in like freeing up the time thing that's so important

Brandon Handley 48:41 that I think that we're doing something right being okay to let go being okay to let go of that thing. Because you know, it's no longer fulfilling and knowing that and hoping or at least, it at least shot the thing that's no longer fulfilling, right? Just drop that like it, just go do something else, there's, there's going to be something else that that will take that space for you. Right energetically or whatever. And, you know, to your point I want to I will definitely want to jump in on the the the spiritual MLM spray and the idea. Listen, when I first you know, I don't know, when I first started podcasting, I always say that I started for the wrong reason. It was like that, right? I started it for the wrong reasons. But as I grew and evolved or you know, change whatever happened throughout that podcast, I would say that, you know, I did the right things for the wrong reasons. But through that time, like my heart, you know, I was like myself to the Grinch. My heart grew two sizes too big to the process. Yeah. And you know, I just really understood more about what it was that I was trying to give. I understood more about the idea that, you know, I want to just give this freely as I can for right now because if I do it, and I attach what it is I'm doing to you Kind of for monetary gain, or at least, you know, monetary gain in the sense that it has to be done. There's desperation behind that feeling right. And I couldn't just do it naturally and just be like, this is this is what's really coming through me now. And and there is no. And people like, you know, kind of what's your endgame was like, I don't know, this is this is just what I'm doing right now. And I'm connecting with amazing people. And I'm getting to hear amazing stories from other people. And it's my hope that there's somebody else out there that, you know, the next robot is the provocateurs listening today, right, that says, hey, you know what, I want to get involved in the communities the way that you have, I want to, I want to, you know, find my way forward the way that you you have, and then that person is inspired right to follow similar footsteps, right for themselves, but like, be led by you to that place. And just by virtue, you and I are having a conversation, and it's possible, and that's why I love to do what I do.

Prabhat Gautam 51:02 So beautiful. I think what you said is, is the reality of like, like, it's all a journey for everybody. And, and at the time, you knew you needed to get in this work. I think there is a thing, okay, well, there's production cost, there's gonna take time, right, early podcast, I mean, you're buying super expensive microphone, like all that stuff. It's like, well, I'm putting money out well, how can I make that money back? And I think in you know, and it really is that whole world where people tell you like what we do this? Well, you gotta like really an easy more ad based needs to be destiny, like everybody transit advice, and 99% of the people I tell you their advice, they're not making money off what they're getting advice for. Like, it's, it's I almost feel like it's a world full of single and recently divorced people giving dating advice, like, it's what do we do? Like, we need, like, I want to talk to the person who's been happily married for 30 years, about the struggles they've had off and on for the 30 years, but they're like, every day I wake up, and no, there's no other person I want to be with and this person. And during that day, that maybe a few minutes were like, there's no this person I don't want to see in the next five minutes. But then they go back to there's no other person on the view, like the reality of what their journey is. I think that's just a beautiful real thing. But I just think so much of the spiritual MLM world is oh my gosh, do this do this. Like my friends friends cousins, friend made $10 million off of an insight can meet your friends, friends, cousins, friend, because so often these are like their their stories that are just to get more people signed up. And it's sort of the carrot. It's like, if you have really good water, let me try the water because I want we all want good water. Yeah. To this great plains, ever, it is like detergent, that's chemical free. Let me try it. Like, like, I have friends for years, like, well, you should get in a world of where you sign people up. I'm like, No, if I like it, I'm gonna buy it, I'm gonna give it to my friends that they want to buy and get if they don't, that's fine. Like, just give me good stuff that you think's gonna, like, uplift my life. And then you guys can sign them all up under you. But I'm and I their friends for years, they're like, Oh, we have such a great network, you're the perfect person to be in whatever it is like real estate or sales or like, you know, you can, there's so much money, you can move here, they're like, I don't have any, I want to move money into making a difference. That's what I want to do. That's, to me, I've been able to do that in the charity space. So it's like, that's what I want my life to be. And if other people meet these amazing people at events that I do, and they can figure out how to monetize it will get and when you monetize it, hopefully you remember where you met them, and then give some of that money to the charity. That was the event that you had. And if you don't do well, hopefully you have a really good life and you're happy and he raised amazing kids like I look at it as I this don't fixate on what are your treasures before your, your buried, I look at your treasures are with the people that you interact with every day. And in the end. The goal is, you know, I mean, I just tell people, right, your goals at your funeral to have all these lives that got changed. I remember a lady I met Jeanette the boss when I was in college, and she told me this amazing story. Jeanette was probably in her 60s, she was the cable station that I did my white college cable show up and she said when her mother passed away, so many people came up to her at the funeral and said, you know, your mom helped us this time. You know, your mom, let us stay at our house. You know your mom, we struggle financially. She did this. She's like, I didn't know my mom did 10% of that stuff. My mom is so much more incredible person I realized. And she in Jeanette was amazing, incredible person. But it's like you see you see that? What she was like and that's like that's what you should want your funeral to be where everybody's like, wow, Brandon's amazing. He did all this stuff. And you know, when he was He was doing stuff when there was no parade, you know, own didn't do a show around. Before he was big, he was helping people. And then he got big and he's big time he wouldn't return your calls. But that's

Brandon Handley 55:12 what a jerk. What a jerk.

Prabhat Gautam 55:14 Always be there for people. But I think it's like, it's who you are them I say like who you are when nobody's looking? Right? That's your character.

Brandon Handley 55:22 Right. Rob real quick, what, you know, how did you know that this was the path for you? Like, where was like, where did it like dawned on you that like, this was your heart song that this was what you needed to do for the rest of your life? Up until now, at least.

Prabhat Gautam 55:40 So I would say you always like I think when you're a kid, and you just want to help kids in school, or there's just something in you that just says a helper spirit, like you feel it that I think, really what all happened was from 1993 to 2001. That eight years was my journey. So my father died of a heart attack when I was 16. And that's a big experience for a child. And then, you know, a few years later is in Oklahoma, Oklahoma City bombing happened. That's a hugely traumatic event. They started thinking through Okay, now I want to help I want to give back, how do I help make the world better. And then in the year 2001, that's working for a startup in 99,000. in debt, making really good amount of money as a 2423 24 year old, I moved out to Los Angeles to create positive television. And then that next year, I became a bone marrow donor and the girl that was a donor for Anka, I tell him all the time, I met President Obama, I met all these celebrities and billionaires. But being a donor, nothing compares. That's the greatest experience of my life. And so I was her bone marrow, her bone marrow donor, October 3 2001. And then a year and a month later, she passes away. I'm devastated because I'm like this child, I was supposed to give her my at her wedding, I was supposed to see her have kids, like, I written out a story of how the stranger was going to be like my adopted daughter is, you know, she was a stranger, I didn't know her, like, you know, I sign up to the national marrow donor registry, and mdp.org where people could sign up. And it's the greatest gift I ever got to be her donor. And then, you know, that really took me on this trajectory where I was like, I have to be, because I think, you know, when you're 2324, you're making a lot of money. It's easy to get caught up in distraction. And I think what happened was, you know, I was in I lucked out, I was in New York on 911, fly back from New York to LA on 911. So having all that sort of tragedy in my life, from 93, to 2002, just kept me on this path, where I didn't get detour and I didn't get into drugs and alcohol, like I, you know, I was dating 1000 people, you know, to one committed relationship. It's like, you know, I think, you know, you meet somebody breakout, you meet somebody new, but I was on this, like, I think, for me, all the tragedy just kept me super hyper focused. And it kept me optimistic, because for sure you feel sadness after tragedy. But it also, what I learned is, after every major tragedy, people step up after 911, after Oakland City Bombing, after my father's passing after anchors, passing, you see families, community all show up for people. And then my question is still to this day, why don't we do that all the time? Why does it take tragedy? Right? I'm sure you know, you've been in funerals, even lost loved ones. When that happens, we feel like how will Why don't I connect with these people? Well, this person was going through a tough time, why didn't I know about it? And I said, Well, how can we be more present one of the best documentaries, I recommend all your listeners to watch, it's called the bridge. And it's about how the Golden Gate Bridge is the leading place for suicide in the US. And this was probably 10 years ago, 24 people a year, we would jump off the bridge, and they had cameras set up. And anytime somebody had to jump off, they would send people in to try to stop them. And one guy was jumping, and he ends up surviving, so you get to hear his story. But in that I was like, and one of the people tells the story of like, you know, when he jumped, he did end up jumping in the end. Luckily, surviving that tourists didn't even realize that he was depressed and suicidal. And it really got me to a place where it's like, I want to be present with people. If you see somebody crying filter and say, you know, are you okay? Is there anything I can do for you? Can I, you know, get you a coffee. If you see somebody that looks shaken like check on people, they say I think we're our natural instinct is to be caretakers to check on people. And then people will tell you, I will don't check on those people that could endanger you. They could be a massive setup to get you killed somehow. I just don't think that's, that's one 1,000,000,000th of 1% of the time those things happen. Just be present for people because when you're present, that person needed to know so Nobody cared. Like, I remember I was in a train in Los Angeles, there's a woman who, you know, some guy was bothering or you heard upstairs, she comes downstairs, I'm like, Do you need anything? Are you okay? You know, do you need me to call the police? And she said, Oh, no, somebody else did that. And I was like, Okay, I'm gonna be here near you, if you need me on here. And I thought, Okay, well, those are words, that sounds good. But what if he really comes back downstairs and tries assaulter? What is on here for you really need? Does that mean? I'm going to go fleeing or I'm really going to like be the gap The, the boundary between her this person. And I made sure like, I watched her and I made sure she on the train, she was going a different direction, and I was going, and the guy luckily never came downstairs. But I think if he did, I think once I told her, I'm here for you, I have an obligation to be there. And if he kills her, then he needs to kill me too. Because if I said, I'm gonna be here, I have to be here. And so for me, I feel like, you know, there's that whole thing of like, Who is your brother? Who is your neighbor? Who's your sister? Who's your daughter? Are these people your blood tie to you? Are the people that you regionally now? Or is it every person in humanity? So I think we all determine that for ourselves. And then once you make that determination, I just think you you view people differently, and you view people to view everybody is connected to you, then you realize, both the person hurting, that's trying to hurt this woman is connected to you, and both this woman that is potentially dangerous connected you. So your job is to be loving, as loving as you can be in those moments. Agreed?

Brandon Handley 1:01:39 I think that the the idea, I mean was, you know, love, love thy neighbor as yourself or something like that, right? I mean, yeah, it and once you kind of understand what that means. And you start to apply that and other places, it takes on a whole different level of kind of compassion, like you're talking about, like you're saying, we're all connected, and how do you how do you show up? Or more in that way? Right? How do you how do you make sure you're showing up in that way? Alright, quick one for you for so, you know, I've come to believe that this is kind of like a spiritual speed dating show, right? Where now like, you know, somebody tune in to like, you know, I'm looking for my next spiritual date. And so I've got a question for you. That is from our spiritual speed dating, question pool. And it's going to be what is the greatest quality humans possess?

Prabhat Gautam 1:02:39 Oh, that's a great question. I mean, I think it's the greatest quality humans possess is love for those that they have no direct connection or benefit from, I think, when given an opportunity, and people can be of help, and they believe their help, will legitimately help. They will step up. I think we see it every day. We see it all the time. I think they just they just have they have to know that the canal is I think when it's like, oh, well, there's homelessness is a problem. How do I help? But it's everybody's like, your friend needs a place to crash for a few weeks to get on their feet, like, well, I'm gonna make space for you. Thank you think it's so that's what I'd say.

Brandon Handley 1:03:26 I think that's awesome. Right? And I mean, that's what you're doing right? With your with your kind of like, what's your life? And I think that that's, I think that that's really cool. Because there's, there's not that many people willing to do that all of the time. And that is something that i think that i think that that's one of the things that I admire about you and your story, right, you're always giving and you're doing it in a way where you don't expect to return you're doing it for the love of what it is that you do. And I think that that's that's very, you know, it's it's really cool to be able to see that provides, where should I send people to come find out more about you.

Prabhat Gautam 1:04:05 So they can get a positive television.org. And they can see all the content that we put out. And then I tell people all the time, I'm not a social media person, so call me, I'm gonna give them my number. Because I'm still old school. I love human to human. So if you're working on an amazing project, or you just are like, hey, I want to be of service. I want to do this to help people. One of my favorite things to do I tell me all the time, it's like talking to somebody who has an AI world changing idea, a community changing idea, or personal life changing idea, I'd love to talk to him, then connect them to a redneck come to so I'll give you my numbers 310-872-0669 that's 310-872-0669 Feel free to text me or call me and and I always try to be honest with people. It may not be a project that I can help you with or maybe I don't know the pieces, but if I don't know that He says, I'm going to try to help you figure out what are the pieces to get you a step further, because I want every single person to be closer to what? They're, they're passionate. So if I can get you a step further great, if nothing else, I get to meet another great person in the world. So I'm happy to take that call.

Brandon Handley 1:05:17 Awesome. Thanks so much for being on here today.

Prabhat Gautam 1:05:20 Thank you, Brandon. I look i get i want to say I love a spiritual joke is about Everybody, please encourage your friends to, to follow by and share and then also tell people to listen to the episodes that inspire and inspire you guys because if you love an episode, that episode, if it resonates with you, that it's gonna resonate with your friends. And you know, don't just send them the Hey, just go check it out, send them to a specific episode that really inspired you because we need to get people on this journey to find you know, their own personal healing so they can help heal the world.

Brandon Handley 1:05:53 I appreciate that. Thank you so much.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Link to the mindmap: http://www.xmind.net/m/Za6NDz

Check out the CPM course: https://theraoinstitute.com/

Brandon Handley 0:00 Alright, guys, we are going to finish up. This book took a little bit longer than I had intended. And I guess that's just what life is about sometimes. The key thing here for me anyways, is that, go ahead and finish this up, I think that I did this with what was the other book I did. What was the other book I did, um, besides getting rich, took me a while to finish it. And it was really just a matter of sitting down to do it, finding the time making the time to do it. So we're gonna finish this up, We're on chapter nine of Are you ready to succeed, where's the book, there it is. I will also post the video of this to YouTube and put a link here as well. So you can follow along with the mind map. And I'll say the mind map as well. And you can download the whole thing and take a look at it if you want, if that's something that you would like to do. So just as what I'm choosing to do on Father's Day, finish this up. It's important to me and just kind of making that time and it's like, if you don't finish these things, you've always kind of got this open tab in your mind this open loop that never got closed. And that's just me finishing this up. I was always enjoyed getting something like this finished up as well. And this one's pretty important. It's a pretty important chapter that I feel like I'll share with you. And we'll work we'll work our way through it. So as we're looking here, and we'll work our way through it, We're on chapter nine of Are you ready to succeed, unconventional strategies for achieving personal mastery in business and life by Sreekumar. Ralph. And, you know, I'm also taking his course, with creative and personal mastery and taking the course in person with people after having gone through this several times already. It's it's a, it's a whole different world as well. So chapter nine is you create your world from what is inside of you. And the intro starts off with the whole idea that most of the models that you currently have in your life, they don't serve you well, are they serving us? Sure every model serves you, right, every story that you're telling yourself and everything that already exists, is serving you in one way or another. For better or worse. The idea is that you can't simply adopt a brand new model and just say, Yeah, well, that's my new model, and I'm gonna use it. The the key of it is to find evidence of it at work. For example, right now we are in the class going through the section of creating our new realities, determining what we want that new reality to be or that new model, and then looking for evidence of that model at play in action, and writing down and capturing that and saying, Hey, here's where I see that evidence of it, jotting it down. And it's when you do that, that you reinforce the idea. And that's really what what he's talking about here. And then the the whole idea is there's going to be he's going to give us a general purpose model as we go forward here. And I'll also liken that to framework right, here's the framework of something, here's the outline of something that you can use the model is an outline, and you can kind of fill it in as you see fit and ways that work best for you. So what's inside of you? You know, pretty sure I've talked to this a couple times. And I think I just did it recently, where I talked about the idea of Wayne Dyer talking about the oranges and orange juice is the only thing come out of orange juice because that's all that's inside of it. Sreekumar Rao uses this rasa gola, which is a traditional Indian sweet to round and white about size of a ping pong ball. And inside of it is a sweet sweet syrup. No matter how hard you squeeze it. That's all it's kind of come out because that's what's inside of it. The thing is, is that what's inside of us is currently or most often

Unknown Speaker 4:30 not,

Brandon Handley 4:31 not sweet, syrupy, and not just orange juice. We've got all these other things that are inside of us that are we he calls, it's going to be guilt, depression, envy, worry, unhappiness, shame, sorrow, nervousness, jealousy, hate, fear, embarrassment, or frustration. Because that's, that's what our mental models have created within assess that mental chatter that when we started this process, that's what we kind of that's what we do. developed. And it reminds me of the stories that people call a news story or other stories and the the idea of you've got two dogs that are always fighting each other. Right? And the two dogs are always getting bet on by random people in a dogfight. And the person who is the person who's leading that right the in the story, like it's a grandfather, Indian who's who's doing this, and he always bets on the right dog, he never loses. And so one day his grandson asked some because why, how do you know which one of the dogs is gonna win? And he goes, Well, that's easy. It's the dog that I fed all week, right? So whichever, and this is like, the, you know, whatever you give your attention to is what grows. So whatever you tie up in your mind, and your mental chatter, that's, that's what grows, whatever model you give the most attention to, that's gonna be the one that quote unquote, wins, whether or not that's the quote, unquote, winning model for you, it's still going to be the model that gets the most energy still going to be the model that takes precedence in your life. So that idea of what's inside of you, you can cultivate, you can cultivate that. He says here, that transformation begins and ends with mental models, right? You keep the ones that build and nourish you, like I'm talking about here with the idea of you feed the dog that you want to win. And then you remove the mental models that are filled with poison and content. With what's an example this, think, I mean, trying to think of it earlier. Even myself in this past week, I was like, how could you do I forget what it was I'd done. I was like, how that was stupid, or, and I caught myself like talking, talking down on myself or saying something about myself or sometimes getting caught and worry, that doesn't make any sense to get caught in because the future is never kind of certain. Right? And why waste your time focus on these these worrisome moments that may never happen and most likely never happened? and waste your energy there. Where Where? Where else? Could you be using that thought, energy, that powerful creativeness of yours, right? You will, because you're using your creative energies, to create something that's just awful and shitty. And you could use that same energy to create something really awesome and beautiful, right? Or amazing or at least beneficial to you. So leverage, leverage a model a mental model that is beneficial to you, because regardless of whether or not you

Unknown Speaker 8:07 are,

Brandon Handley 8:10 God create you, regardless, regardless of you creating something, he may as well create something that is useful for you. So he recommends this benevolent universe model and this is one that I know that ever since I first have seen it, it's something that I've been able to implement in my life. And it's, it's been wonderful serves me wonderfully. I'll read a little bit about reading from the book here it says the universe is conscious of benevolent entity, it always acts in your best interest and always brings into your life exactly what you need at any instant. And if the idea is to you know, just really look for those instances and I can I can look at you know, when I got let go of, from Cisco when when they, when they eliminated the job, right? They didn't let go of you, they've eliminated the job and then went into real estate for a couple months. And then as the pandemic was coming into full swing, somebody reached out to me, too. See if I was interested in another job, and I said sure, yeah, absolutely interested in it and think it'd be a great fit perfect almost for me. Exactly where I believe I need to be right now. It was it was like almost a perfect role for me. As you know, who I am and where I am at this point in my life. And then, right, the week that I'm and here's the deal to like, I mean, you know, kids are home from school. pandemic's going on. And this was a job working from home, great benefits, all the things. And then they stopped hiring that week that I was hired, right. So this like, again, the idea that it always acts in your best interest always brings into your life exactly what you need, at any instant, right? Right when you need it. That was, you know, that was how I saw, you don't have to sit, that's, and here's the thing, you have the opportunity to see this as you like, you don't have to see it. The thing is, if you're going to step into this model, you have to start looking for the evidence of it in action for you, so that you can support the model that you would like to implement. And there's been countless and several other times that I have seen this at play in my life. Since since picking up on this model, that wasn't the only time there's definitely several other times, but I just want to use that as the example because even though real estate people killed it this past year, in real estate, and they're and they're still doing really well. I don't know what would have happened, if I would have had to have stayed in real estate would I've gotten sick, but I've got somebody in the house sick, you know, would something else have happened? And, and there would have been a lot of worry and frustration at home in the family life, if I'd stayed in that so that the universe provided this, this other option that was perfect for me and my family at that point in time. And, you know, once you start seeing stuff like that, it's really kind of hard to stop or turn back. So the idea too, is that it inspires if you're able to do this, if you're able to begin to pull this type of model into your own life is is it as bad as the whole idea of heaven on earth? Right? Because now, like, you've got the universe actually working for you and your own benefit? And it is it becomes again, like heaven on earth? And the idea to is, is where's the time to think, you know, that is this? Is this real? No more so than any other model. Right? But the thing is that all the other all the other models are just as false as as this one. So, again, what if it's really true, though? What if, what if it really does work out this way? And then you know, what does that mean for your life then. And

I've been able to, again, implement these into a point where I believe it, and I see it. So he also mentions here that all the exercises within this book, have basically led up to this convergence point, giving you the exercises to test out to be able to see the universe is working on your behalf. And now it's like, okay, now you just may just come out and say it right. But this is, and you can look back, if you've done any of the exercises in this book, if you take many of its courses, and you've done a lot of it even to the lightest, lightest varying degree, then then you'll you'll be able to say, oh, shoot, the universe really was working on my behalf. And and now you know, there's, there's something amazing going on for me. So he's gonna hit back again on the idea that our beliefs cannot be forced. So you simply cannot force yourself to accept the proposed model. You may recognize it intellectually, and that it's a good idea, but you can't just automatically accept it. You can't believe it all once. And I liken this to the idea of who's the guy who wrote the book PLOS sees time mahalik go look for small things that you can believe then instead of trying to take it all in at once, if it's you know, if it's too much at one time to say yes benevolent universe, and bla, you're like, Fuck that. The thing is, then take something small that you can work with and then start looking for how that is beginning to show no small pieces of benevolence from the universe towards you. So whatever you believe now, small pieces and then just each time something a little bit beyond that initial point. So small increments outside of the known at the time and then over time, it will become massive over time. It will become This this piece of the universe that that is with you. And it's going to become very difficult and challenging to refute. At a certain point in time, just just like any of your existing models, like you've got models, right now you're like, they are totally true, this is always happening. And this is how it is blah, blah, blah. So if you can, however, begin to accept this, this, this model for yourself, and begin to implement, excuse me begin to implement it, you will, you'll, you'll start to see benefits almost immediately, again, I'll go to the current exercises that we're working on where we create, we have a current reality, we're like, this Dahlia thing is not ideal in my life and where I'd like it to be. And then you reshape that to say, you know, this reality is totally serving me, and here's how it serving me, and then you start looking for evidence that it is serving you. And that's what he talks about here. And the exercise of building up the level of universe is real similar, it says, a look through your history for areas that may seemed awful, but eventually lead you to a better place. Right? Look, I mean, the pandemic, I think the pandemic has led a lot of people to do some inner work that they, you know, hadn't been willing to face. And now, there's this mental resilience that I think is happening all over the world that is playing a big part and, and in who we are, I think it's also hit corporate, pretty hard. So that now our corporations are really seeing how people as people, as they should have, all the time and are really doing what they can to improve the mental stability of their, of their workers. And I think that I think a big portion of that is genuine right now versus a lot of it in prior had been lip service. And now, and now I think they I think it seems like it's more meaningful.

So you look for look through your history of where something seemed bad. And then you also look for areas where Hidden Hand played a role in getting you to a better place. I'll use the example I think I was in fourth grade and California, Northern California, it was the mid 80s. And we were moving again. And I was pretty upset that we're moving. However, I think a week or two after we moved. Like there was a ginormous flood from the Russian River literally wiped out the neighborhood where we'd lived. So within weeks of us leaving, where we'd lived have been wiped out who knows what would have happened, right? It could have been completely hideous and awful. But there's an area where Hidden Hand played a role, basically kind of saving our lives. So you've got something maybe not so drastic and dire that's happening in your life every day. So you want to look for ways of maybe something, maybe something that impacted your day. It seemed kind of shitty for a moment, but like you're like, what good can come out of this? What What did I learn from this, where's the benefit to me in this or my family or my job or anything like that, and you write that down a look for you look for a way that the universe is being benevolent for you like at least once a day. So and then you just you write it that hand write it down, I can't stress that enough. I really believe that that makes all the difference in the world by handwriting it versus anything else. So there's also going to come a point to where you feel like you're slipping back, you may feel like you're slipping back into your old models. But this is where you double down. You've put all this effort in and you don't want to risk losing the ground that you've gained. So and that that can easily happen. Because we've had our default models for most of our lives, right, it's really, really, really easy to fall back into that pattern. I used to be a smoker I used to smoke. And whenever you quit smoking near maybe you're smoking like one to two packs a day. The idea is that when you go back to it, you don't go back to one to two pack there. If you don't go back to a couple cigarettes a day you go back to where you left off. Same thing, same thing is applicable here. You're gonna go back to whatever dirty nasty habits you had before in your way of thinking versus this new way It is much more beneficial to and end your life. So he also, this is the way he gets it. So I feel, you know, when you get to the end of the book, and you've been doing all these exercises, it's just like I'm saying you kind of start slipping back into your mileage to so much work so much effort. Most of the times I've gotten through this book I don't always make it a point to go read these good stories right about Special Olympic where's the Shaka fellows who had just read about this was the first time in four years I went look this guy up and read about, you know, kind of what he's brought into the world. And then there's, you know, go and there are these there are these incredibly inspiring stories that you can go read and see what's possible for for just about anybody, given any conditions and conditions for some of these people can be absolutely horrendous but it's it's overcoming those those conditions that is what makes the stories awesome. And then there's a business people who snap back from bankruptcy. So that's one that I did look up and go through. Let me see if see if I say that yet. Like people like Milton Hershey, right, Hershey's candy, this guy, you know, he, he faced bankruptcy, George Foreman, he was bankrupt. And now he's got an estimated wealth of over $250 million. Who's another couple people I thought that were that were Henry frickin Ford, you know, bankrupted himself in 1903. You know, he tried failed again and kept on going until his dream becoming a reality with today's net worth estimated at is that like, I don't know, 188 billion, right? 188 billion. Today Walt Disney is another one who was bankrupt. And Abraham Lincoln So here you go through and he like you're worried about you know, these failures. Have you ever worried about like going bankrupt or anything like that think about some of these people and and what happened after their bankruptcy who they became even though at one point they were bankrupt, and start to apply this benevolent model, university yourself.

So coping with senseless tragedies is another piece that he's gotten here as we talk about, like these benevolent models, and we talk about everything else going on there. There are certain things that are going to happen in our lives were like, you know, loss of a child loss of a loved one that super close to you. Yeah, God, I was talking to a gentleman the other day, I was very upbeat, very kind doing his daily job. And he was in Florida with his child who's had who was a twin and his, his, his bones were all jacked up from the from the bottom, which call it the sack, you know, the, the prenatal sack that they're born in, and it opened up in 12 weeks. And so when he came out of the womb, he was twisted up like a pretzel. The doctors have had to work on his bones his entire lives, kids only nine years old, gone through all this stuff, getting his legs, broken ligaments, like, cut and spliced in so that he can walk, feet reset all these things. And this is a nine year old kid, a dad going through it. I was like, holy shit, man. The idea that you're even upbeat and going through all these things, and you still have this good sense of being was really impressive to me. But this is a type of thing that's kind of like a senseless tragedy. It doesn't make any sense. Why would this happen to anybody in it in this this benevolent universe, right. And the thing that struck Morales saying here is that you've got to do all the work that came before in this book before you can start to cope with these senseless tragedies. And the idea is that the universe's intervening in your life that is Ziering you around the pitfalls and bringing you what you need over to bringing you the help that you need. When you feel overwhelmed leading you to bounty in different guises and always looking after you in a myriad of ways. You have to feel this way to a very deep level before you can use the strategy of you saying take a look at the idea of a forest fire right when the forest fire happens. It's just like, it burns everything out of its way but it's also necessary for for the forest to go through that. History talks about he talks about the idea of leveraging you know maybe some of these things that are paying you or suffering you to take maybe maybe you got to take some Measure to lessen it, you do it consciously. Maybe you can, I don't know, bring awareness to it right, y'all you see that often I was another gentleman I saw that almost died last year of a blood clot in his leg. And now he's helping to bring awareness to it right, he's in a, he's got a role in his life where he's able to take this, this thing that's happened to him and apply it and bring awareness to to blood clots. By leveraging again his his status in the world, and share out with some people and some ways to prevent it and what you can do if it does happen. You know, again, here's the idea to right, did it uh, he says it's wonderful, liberating to live in this world, this world where the universe behaves as if it were specifically designed for you and actually give you exactly what you need a world where you can accept it. What you want is not always what you need the child. This is good, too. The child may want to tell advice, cream, but a wise parent provides fresh fruit and vegetables. He says, Are you kidding that the universe looks like this? Yes, you absolutely are. But you're also kidding yourself, if you think that the universe is the way that it is now. So you again, you have to you have to make this choice. Right that? Do you want to dwell on a peaceful abode with a sense of fulfillment and purpose? Or do you want to wander around the corridors of a House of Horrors where, you know, ghastly apparitions appear without notice? It's your choice and all your choice and it's far better choice to live in the bosom of benevolent universe. So I mean, that that kind of closes it up, right? It's, it's it is your choice. To live in this benevolent universe, it's your choice to go ahead and build out this model is your choice to support this model, I just always your conscious choice to build out any model. Because that's, that's exactly what you're doing. Anytime that you're, you know, you're beating yourself up, you're, you're, you're, you're supporting that other dog, but we talked about the dog that always wins. So

I hope that you've enjoyed already ready to succeed a little bit of a deeper dive into it. And I hope this inspires you to either pick up this book or try somebody exercises yourself or excuse me do some of the work yourself to to just dive into it in the back of this book too. As Sreekumar Rao has a some reading list, I'll see if I can go ahead and direct you to it or post a couple of it not only does it give you the Reading List of gives you a one year reading list, which is pretty cool. But then he has his other supplementary reading list where he will give you the levels of the book, he puts it under different headers, Business and Management. What's another header here? I don't know. Anyways, like plant plenty of plenty of plenty of other you know books. Here's one mind over matter. One of the first ones here I'm just gonna give you an example. Mind over matters the type of book you know, Dwayne wire. Wayne Dyer, you'll manifest your destiny. Popular speaker author Wayne Dyer has other books you may wish to explore. This book is good manual on how you can and he gives you a little synopsis good manual on how you can use metaphors to screen a physical reality. It contains good tips on how to harness the power of subconscious mind. And the whole has explicitly spiritual underpinnings was quite common in this genre reading level number one, right so you know check out this book if that's something that you're interested in. If you're interested in trying to get yourself into a mental model that just says hey, the way my life has been going not the model I want to use and really appreciate Brandon you sharing Sreekumar browse models sounds like something I could be interested in using and applying in my own life. Anyways, take care guys that's going to come bombed on Oh, god, I'm done. Like I said, I'll share out the I'll show this mind map. So you can kind of see the the map here of how I kind of wrote it out and you can pick up the book yourself. Try it out yourself. The book resonates with you. I highly suggest checking out the course. The live course if you can. It's called creating personal mastery. I'll share a link with that in the notes as well. Until then, we'll decide what our next little adventure baby take care of

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Big thanks to Shianne for joining us in this shorter than average episode, there is a lot packed into this one and I know that you will enjoy it!

Please connect with Shianne over at https://www.shiannedoucette.com/

Brandon Handley 0:40 4321 Hey there podcasters How's everybody doing? Today, we've got cyan to set on with us today. she communicates with light energy by allowing source energy to flow through her surpassing energy. surpassing society's definition of a psychic medium, her approach is to show others that they too can access their own souls connection to source energy for healing of self and humanity. Her work is ongoing in the field of soul energy awareness and human of Oh, Lucian Sam, what's going on? Thanks for joining us say hi. Thanks, Randy. So, um, you know, I usually like to start us off with the whole idea that we are right, we're connected with Source Energy all the time, and that, you know, the divine speaks through us. And the idea that there's going to be somebody who's listening in today, that is only going to get like this message for them through you. What is that message today? So, I

Shianne Doucette 1:48 it's funny, I had something planned to say that in when you're asking this question, but source has a funny sense of humor, I actually have a message for someone very specific. And you'll know who you are. I have a gentleman coming through who would have been in the 70s work with either Time Magazine, or Life magazine, really amazing photographer using old school, school photography. She was well traveled kind of looked like a Robert Redford back in the day, you'll use very specific, he was given a lot of awards for his photography, specifically one watch. That is like, you see those big faith watches that everybody kind of wants to have now, he had one of those before they were popular. And it was I feel like it was an award. There's also a map in the home where he would have raised his family that had like pin marks on the map of all the places that he travel. There's also a connection to the next generation, somebody does something with satellite. So I am going through this really fast because it's just kind of like coming in really quick. There's something about code named snowflake, I don't know what that means. It'll mean something to somebody. It's, I don't feel like it's a spy COVID snowflake, I think it's like a family member member that it was a joke that it was like a snowflake would be the nickname for somebody. But there is a connection to someone in this generation that works with the satellites. So I flew through that really quick. What I was going to say is that my my message that I would give to someone out there and I think that this might actually be connected to that person. I feel like this could be this person's grandson. It may not be the person listening the grandson, but it might be someone in the family who would know who the grandson was. No one ever loses their divinity no matter what they've gone through. So even if you hit rock bottom bottom, done some terrible things, or have had terrible things happen to you. You never lose your divinity, your connection to your soul. And also that connection to the higher, higher higher source of all, it's always there for us. Just waiting. So

Brandon Handley 4:34 I hope I didn't rattle this cool, right? Like semi it's interesting, right? So you've got this idea of this person that you're talking to specifically, whether it's that person from the 70s with the watch or not, or that person is grandson or grandchild.

Unknown Speaker 4:52 Yeah. That person from the 70s would definitely be on the other side. I can feel him very strongly with me so

Brandon Handley 4:59 that that meant is coming through you from him to like the grandchild, right? Yeah. So and what I like, what you're saying here too is even though maybe you've done terrible things, or terrible things have happened to you. One of the things that I've done in the past, you know, this year was to like, an email journey, right? spiritual journey of just kind of like, we'll just call it spiritual potpourri. Right? And one of the things that I landed on was the idea of these saints, you know, that were sinners before they turn into saints, right? So I mean, to what you're saying to even if they've even if you've done some things that you would you that that person, you were isn't the person that you are. And that's what I think a lot of people let that let that shame hold them down or keep them away from, like, you're saying that divinity that's always available to you and always within you is that, you know, kind of what you're saying there though, right? Yes. So that's sweet. I love that. Yeah. So give us give us a little background, like, where are you? Where are you working? What are you doing? You know, what do you what do you want to hit on today?

Unknown Speaker 6:10 Well, I've been been got it too, to do some videos on just sharing the some of the guided meditations I do with, with some one on one clients. And then also some of the ones I do in group reading that public events. Just really strong push to share that because it's there for everybody. I find when I am doing a reading, there's just a strong message that everybody has access to this, this wonderful connection that is that is I see it as the soul. And that when we, you know, be here on Earth, there's so much going on, especially right now, there is a lot of healing going on. But there's a lot of gunk kind of coming up to be released. And then we're all in the middle of it. So yeah, those videos I hope to have out in the next six months, and they're going to be available for everybody. I've also written a book, I'm Fingers crossed, getting that out there soon. And yeah, I kind of pull back a little bit on the one on one readings, just because I need a little break right now. We've got some family stuff going on with a member of our family not doing too well. So just kind of balancing the self care in there, too.

Brandon Handley 7:40 That's important, that's really important that you everybody always refers to the airplane, you know, mask, right? The mask falls down. First things first do is take a little bit for yourself, and you make sure that you stay alive so that you can help somebody else survive. So how, you know, what's, what's the title of the book? And what's that going to be about?

Unknown Speaker 8:04 The book title is a small glimpse of everything. And it was kind of came to me because that's what I see why I didn't always clearly see a soul and I did a reading. I felt it kind of had an awareness of it. The more I tested my energy, the more I opened up to the connection that I had, personally, I was able to see it in others and just have this awareness of this all of this connection that we have. And actually Well, the way it works for me is it's almost like a video or an audio projector overtop of someone like if I was reading you right now. And I think we talked about that, when it's just this beautiful light ribbon of life that comes down through and it's safer for everyone and different. Just like almost like a rainbow or have a fingerprint combined. And two, I call it a small glimpse of everything's, it's kind of like a small glimpse of the universe. So that's, that's, and it starts with my story of how I started working with energy. Some of the weird things that happened to me growing up and how I pushed it aside, and then leading up to some of the stories that I have permission to share from some really incredible people who've had some life changing moments in readings. So that's that's what the books about.

Brandon Handley 9:35 That's great. So what what what got you into it right, what got you into this energy work? And how did you find yourself in this space? And you know, how have you been able to move it forward for the benefit of yourself and others?

Unknown Speaker 9:50 Well, it started out quite randomly with a theme. I think the universe was pushing me I mean, I think that there's some things that you just kind of can't turn or turn away from, and then you, you get the choice of whether you want to go all the way. I just, you know, like first was a yoga class where the teacher I thought I was going to like go to like an aerobics class where, you know, less less work and more results. She started talking about fan scripts and, and connections to this whole other ideas that I never experienced, because this would have been back in the early 2000s. And you know, I'm in a little small city we really hadn't, it wasn't really something I was exposed to very much.

Unknown Speaker 10:42 And then

Unknown Speaker 10:44 after that, it was just the learn, more and more things are opening up. And then I was getting massage treatment from someone. And she had a brochure on in our work area, talking about this thing called oneness, which was out of India and I went, and it was crazy. The force of energy that I felt, and I think that was kind of like the door opening was like, wow, we are so much more than I thought we were there's much more than trying to you know, climb the corporate ladder, there's much more than getting the great car and having the nice house and it it kind of like poke the hole in the whole idea that I was searching for something always outside of me. And here it was inside. And that's that's what it started with. And just learning to work with energy starting off there and being drawn to different modalities and just got like a real hunger to learn everything there was about energy

Brandon Handley 11:52 work. Yeah, that's I mean, that seems to be the my wife, my wife hates the line, like the process, right. But that seems to be kind of the process, the process seems to be kind of the idea of finding this more than your sense of self. And I think that in, when you thought about for the podcasts, you'd put in there, the idea that everyone has the soul, and it's their choice to use it. Which I wish I can agree with. But I think the challenge is to identify that that situation, right? And then, and then accepting that that's true, right? And then it's when you get to that point, that you realize that everyone has a soul and it's your choice to use it. That's when that's when you make that choice. Right? is out. And so it sounds to me like that. So that happened to you, when you were in India, you is that you went out?

Unknown Speaker 12:48 No, it was a woman who brought the teachings event from India back during that, like that was my first real experience with energy work. And then she taught a workshop on how to how to do that. And it took off and then there was Reiki and so

Brandon Handley 13:05 that's the other piece though not to talk over you but like the other pieces, right? So now they want you to decide to use the soul. She views like that is just like this. There's like this black pit of knowledge desire, like to learn more about it and you know, get closer to it and be a part of it, and then share it out with everybody is that kind of been what your journey has been like?

Unknown Speaker 13:29 Yeah, and honestly, I mean, I get it so asked backwards, and I fell down on her so many times, because when I saw this, like, you know, experiences working with energy, and then it was like, wow, I want to learn how to do this, I want to learn how to also share it with someone else. So that energy is going through me. And at the same time was was not connecting to my own self and using that and harnessing that. And it was a journey to learn that part of it and to trust that part of it. And the funny thing is, is that when you start going along and you're you've got these ups and downs and you're, you're learning how to work with your own energy and you're seeing the miracle of it working on someone else. There's almost like the swelling, you know, they talk about the present moment. There's this calmness that comes in. It's almost like this. The Iraqi answers this calm feeling that comes in it's like, man, I don't get in this lifetime. So what are the nice final one after that? So it's it's kind of hilarious being a human being down here when you really think about it. So

Brandon Handley 14:41 yeah, our time is, is is so seemingly finite. But uh, you know, the idea is really that we are eternal, right? And here we are. We're like grasping, kicking and clawing to do everything that we can with this seemingly limited amount of time and it's really just I don't know if you're watching Old 80s movie, the gods must be crazy, right? Is just just just, that's what it really kind of boils down to the gods must be crazy because here we are running around like crazy. And for what? To what? And so Cheyenne, I know usually there's a little bit more time for us but like so I've got a couple questions I'd like to ask on towards the back end here. And almost like a spiritual speed dating thing that you and I talked about. And just so everybody knows real quick here, like Cheyenne did an awesome reading on me, had a great time. And really, you know, you do the medium work in general, you're not doing the one on one so much right now because of family stuff. But like, it was great like, and it's it was an It was a great experience. And I don't think that this is my second medium reading from a different person. But it was a little bit different. And it helps you in different ways. And so I appreciate what you did for me, and I thought I thought it was really excellent. So as as I'm getting on to this next question for you, though, I just I just thought it would tell people to reach out to you because it's a it's a great experience. So either the coursework, or just trying to get a hold of Cheyenne to see what's up. I highly recommend it. So I'm only gonna have time for one quick question is a spiritual speed dating. When is war justifiable? It's an easy one, right?

Unknown Speaker 16:25 So from a higher perspective, I've asked this question myself, so I'm going to give you the higher perspective that they gave me because to me, it's never, it never made any sense. But then at the other side of it, it's like, but what if they have this and they're taking the rights away from these people, and then we go with. So I was explained it this way that there is nothing here to find a boat, but we'll always find something to fight about, until we connect to that, which we are until we start remembering what we really are. So we're always going to find a justification for war until we all evolve. I hope that makes sense. Do you want more clarification on that?

Brandon Handley 17:13 Also, so in the idea of evolution, I think that that's the challenge, right? We're, we are constantly seeking to be more, because I'd like so we're looking to evolve. But what is there to evolve? What really needs to evolve is the understanding of who we already are. Right?

Unknown Speaker 17:33 Yeah. And I think you're, we're, if you look at it, again, I mean, I always ask to see the higher perspective, even though my human brain can always make total sense of it. When I say evolve, I mean, involving the human experience, because again, there's a piece of each you like, what I do, when I ask to see the higher perspective, it's almost like that little cores in every living thing, and also connected to that, but like, like, almost like meridian lines, that that anything here alive or even beyond that. wouldn't be here, if it wasn't connected to that source energy. And it's almost like we've been coming. There's like a separation from source energy. And as it's coming back with that source energy remembers, and the experiences that we have here, coming in with that memory of what we are. So we've always been evolving as humans and from what my understanding is, this is not the first time it's been done in so many different ways. When you get into like the quantum of it, like it's mind blowing. So really, it's again, it's that stepping back and realizing Well, for this year, having a human experience is nothing here is real, what are we so worried about? But at the same time, when you bring in that soul connection, there is that piece in that memory and when you you know when you're connected, because and if it's only for a few seconds, I mean, you take this takes, there are people out there who get this and they've got it 24 hours and I mean, I might have it for during a reading because I've meditated for like a good half an hour an hour beforehand. And I've put the ego aside the inner child aside, but still, I mean, if I go out in the traffic and somebody you know, cuts me off, there I go again, I'm human, and I'm kind of pulled away from the soul self. So yeah, so as a as a as having a human experience. Without the soul connection. You're always going to find a justification for fighting for arguing because you're constantly suffering.

Brandon Handley 19:46 Now you're right, that that means that makes 100% sense. So unfortunately, yeah, we don't have a whole lot of time today and I do have to move on to the next piece. But so what you know, where's your We send people to connect with you shine.

Unknown Speaker 20:04 You can follow me on Instagram. Cheyenne Doucet, you can follow me on Twitter. Again Cheyenne, Doucet Facebook page Cheyenne to set I think that's the shine does that psychic medium. Also have a webpage try and do stuff. And again, watch the videos. I hope to be getting those out there soon for everything. Awesome.

Brandon Handley 20:23 Thank you so much for joining today. Thank you. It's a pleasure, Brandon. Thanks a lot guys

Unknown Speaker 20:28 enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dove podcast. stay connected with us directly through spiritual dove co You can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual and Instagram and spiritual on discord go. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email to Brandon at spiritual dove Co. And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This includes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don't forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time week on your zone and trust your intuition

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Brandon Handley 0:00 What is going on? Good morning, good day, we are coming from jujitsu this morning. And I wanted to get to this before I forgot, it's a it's been a year. Solid. It's been over a year, a little over a year now since the beginning of spiritual dope, and wanted to, you know, thank you for being there for be supportive for being on for, you know, reaching out. And, and just being a part of the podcast. And you know, it's really been interesting, because I can still remember reaching out to a friend of mine after having kind of the idea. And he pressed me a little bit. Allen Allen pressed me a little bit on whether or not I thought that I was just having this kind of like, hey, wouldn't it be nice if, and you just go ahead and you know, just kind of on being distracted. And, you know, the next shiny thing. And I told him, I said, Man, now this is this is it? This is, uh, this is my jam. Good morning, ma'am. That's bright neon, you're wearing? pretty slow. That's not spiritual? Or is it? Who knows? Um, so the, the idea is, uh, he, he was like, rah, you know, be sure. And and I told him, I said, Absolutely, you know, I just kind of, I had a vision kind of thing. And it's ever since then ever since opening this up. You know, Father, for the rest of us was pretty good. I think that had a really nice run, and it opened up fairly well as well. But this, this podcast has, has opened up and this in a way that certainly could not have predicted, I wouldn't have been able to tell you that. Uh, you year later, I would have interviewed some amazing people I had on, you know, one of my favorite teachers out there, one of my favorite teachers out there Sreekumar Rao, where he lives on the, on the books. And I'm currently in creative personal mastery course that he has with no real live people, which is fantastic, enjoying enjoying the hell out of it. But, you know, the deal is, I wouldn't told you a year ago that he was going to be on the podcast, I was I would have been able to a year ago that I would have had on Emmy Award winning actors wouldn't have been able to tell you a year ago that, you know, Anthony mine dough would have been on Hell, I don't know that I would have been able to tell you a year ago that I was going to be able to find enough guests to come on and share their stories. It's easily been I don't know that I've missed a week. So it's easily been, you know, 52. And, you know, and more interviews that have been done with people that have found spirituality in one way or another, and been able to implement it into their lives and been able to integrate it. And I think that that's the most important part of this whole thing is that

Unknown Speaker 3:58 you,

Brandon Handley 4:00 in order to function with the rest of society, you have to be able to, and that's if you want to, you have to be able to implement this in such a way that you feel good about everything that you're doing that you're in alignment with, what you deem as spirituality, and how it can benefit you and others at all times. versus trying to keep it separate. Trying to keep it separate. I use the I use the image of when Neo goes in and he gets pulled in for the first time before he gets pulled into the out of the matrix before he meets Morpheus and they play. It's the it's the security guys, right? They come in and they are they tell them to say hey, in one life One area you're, you're Mr. Anderson knew your clean cut, you come to work, you do your nine to five. And that's, that's great. That's, that's what's expected out of you. And the other than they say, hey, the other person, they pull off this huge stack of, of papers on them say that this other guy that does Neo is a, somebody that we don't approve of. And you can make a choice right now and kind of say, you know, which which one of these differ to be? Do you want to help us? And do you want to stay in your your? Do you want to keep doing your nine to five and keep being the good boy? Or do you want to do want to go and be this this other person where evidently you spend more time to begin with. And that's really where I think a lot of us find ourselves and myself included, which is why the podcast, right, which is why you go when you find others that are doing what you would like to be doing and you and you interview them, and you talk to them and share their stories out. I've certainly found more way more and more ways to implement it in my own life and have implemented and integrated spirituality. In my life, then when I started because it was really keeping them separate often. And to me that was challenging. And, and so this podcast aims to do that for you as well. How can you integrate all this stuff into your own life? How can you make this part of the fabric of everything that you do? And, you know, I was talking to you, I was talking to somebody else yesterday about the idea of Einstein, you know, of course, I bring them up all the time and the line of either everything is a miracle or nothing is a miracle. And the other pieces, I think I heard, you know, Swami is very apparent or pre Nanda, say, from the vedantic, Vedic society, Vedanta society, of New York, and he brings up the line that either everything's God or nothing is God. And when you start to think along those lines, when you start to think along those lines, it changes the dynamic, it changes, few changes, change, you change the way you think, and you what you see changes. And it's really, it's really interesting, When, when, when that starts to happen. And you start to see the impact that you can have on your own reality just by changing your own thoughts. And, and, to me, that's the pure essence of spirituality, that whatever's inside of us is what comes out within the spirit of, right how many times I remember, when I was working for Cisco, we would always be doing, doing these big deals, and then something kind of like would fall out of that deal. And the line would be alright, well, listen, we don't really need to go through all the rigmarole all the finances all that everything that that went into the first creation of this deal, we're gonna do this in the spirit of the deal. Right? So TD spirit of the deal. So when you're when you're doing something, anything, it's the spirit of view, it's it's it's your spirituality, what's inside of you. is absolutely what's going to come out. The other story on that is Wayne Dyer, has has the story of an orange. And he's talking to his audience. And, and the idea is, you know what, the orange only thing come out of an orange is orange juice. Right? whatever's in there is all it can come out.

Sreekumar Rao does it with a Indian dessert. That's the story on that one, whatever's inside is what's going to come out. So whatever's inside of you is what's going to come. So whatever you keep putting inside of yourself, right? Because that's the other thing that that's super important that I've learned over this past year. And I'm sure that you know, you hear your entire life, but you just kind of you kind of dust it off. And you think to yourself, Well, this isn't for me, this is for some other son of a bitch, or some motherfucker. It's not for me. And then, you know, it turns out that it absolutely is for you. So whatever you put inside of you is absolutely what's going to come out. And one way you can. One way you can see this for yourself is I don't know if you still listen to a lot of music or you watch a lot of shows. But pay attention to some of the things that you're saying. Because here's the here's the thing, it doesn't come from you comes from what you put inside of you. So do you, you know, listen to a song and then, you know, a couple days later, you're singing that song again? Did you watch the show and a couple days later, those are the words that are coming out of your mouth that will work for books and work for movies. Whatever goes, whatever you consume, especially mentally is 100%, what's going to come out of you? So, anyways, it's been, it's been a hell of a year. I think that I'm really excited for where it's going, what what's happened with it, and, you know, some of the connections that I've made and the people that I've met, and the ability to, to do it is been, to me, it's been awesome, right? I've got it, you know, a huge thanks to mag for connecting me with guests for being supportive of the podcast for the children being supportive, as well, you know, without my family being supportive of it really makes it a challenge to do. And without your support as well. I wouldn't, I wouldn't keep doing it. So thank you. For for the, for the support. 100%. Thank you for being you. And I you know, I hope that hope that some of these, I hope that some of these people that have been on have have been able to help you as well. They've been able to just help guide you and get you to a place where you're you're able to integrate spirituality in your own life. And that's gonna be it. Yeah. Happy, Happy anniversary.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

The Rev. Dr. Marcia Ledford's ministry is in Southwest Detroit's Latinx population—an international port with an aggressive regional ICE director. Dr. Ledford is a civil rights attorney representing society's most marginalized. An Episcopal priest, she holds a Master of Divinity from the Church Divinity School of the Pacific. She earned her Doctor of Ministry in political theology from Pacific School of Religion. Dr. Ledford founded Political Theology Matters, LLC, to help the faithful develop public theology mission and broadcast messaging for greater social justice. She is trained for community organizing through the Industrial Areas Foundation and volunteers with Michigan United.

Connect with Marcia here https://www.politicaltheologymatters.com/

Insta: https://www.instagram.com/DocLedford/

FB: https://www.facebook.com/politicaltheologymatters/

Twitter: https://twitter.com/DocLedford

YT: https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCvIgWMtYhhL51H9rtvjnObw

Brandon Handley 0:43 321 Hey, there's spiritual dope. Today I am on with the Reverend Dr. Marsha Ledford, who is a civil rights attorney representing society's most marginalized. Her ministry is in southwest Detroit's Latinx population and international port with an aggressive regional ice director. Yeah, I think I could what that is an Episcopal priest she holds a master of divinity from the church Divinity School on the Pacific of the Pacific. She earned her doctorate of ministry in political theology from Pacific School of religion. Dr. Ledford founded political theology matters, LLC to help the faithful develop public theology mission for greater social justice. Marsha teaches speaks and preaches about political theology and very forums. Marsha, so glad to have you here with us today. How are you?

Marcia 1:33 I'm good. And I'm delighted to be with you, Brandon. Thank

Brandon Handley 1:36 you. Absolutely. So I always like to start these off with this, this kind of idea that we're we're vessels for source creative energy, the divine right, as it were, and you know, as it is, you and I are having this conversation, but somebody on the other end is listening in and they're gonna get a message that just, I don't know, lights up that divine spark within them today that's going to be delivered through you. What is that message today?

Marcia 2:06 That we can work for the greater good, even though it seems like our problems are super complex, because we can tap into our spirituality to empower us.

Brandon Handley 2:17 I love that right? The idea that I'm tapping into our spirituality, I think it's um, and I'd love to get your perspective, especially as you said, you come from a marginalized population. Hmm. I feel I from my perspective, anyways, our spirituality is just vastly over neglected. Right. And we don't look at it as this resource that can help propel us to this divine space. Right, right. So in this community that you're serving, how do you? What are some of the tools or ways that you're teaching them to tap into that source?

Marcia 3:00 Well, and it's really not just a parochial ministry, my full time work is teaching everybody how to tap into our spirituality of resistance. So you know, it's, like I said before, it seems like it's super complicated, but in some respects, it's not, we just have to do some inner work. And we have to join voice forces with others to do this work. So and I apologize, I kind of lost your question.

Brandon Handley 3:37 It's quite alright, so the idea, right, so sorry, you know how so? Yes, connecting to that divine right, so that they can, yeah, leverage that source for themselves? So when you say do some inner work and join forces with some others? What's that look like? Right?

Marcia 3:53 That's a great question. And so Roger Gottlieb, who is a professor of philosophy, and is active in his Judah ism, wrote a book called The spiritual spirituality of resistance A few years ago, and his primary focuses on creation care, climate change us, you know, stopping that. But the techniques that he has written about I have really embraced. And essentially, there are two things. And when you when you do this, you can apply it to any issue that is important to you. So it's not limited to climate change or anything else. So you do the inner work, you spend some time with yourself, do some reflection, take some take a course on meditation. Write down what's important to you. That sounds like overly simplified but when you listen to the news every day, you know What really gets sticks under your craw, What makes you say to yourself, I've got to do something about this. And then incorporate that into your meditative practice and listing out things that concern you and that you want to work a list out your skills and abilities. Take a personality inventory, like Myers Briggs or something, doing a Nia Graham, there are lots of resources out there for you to do some of this inner work that I call it. And the other there's another inventory type of inventory that you can do, which is conflict, like, what is your threshold for conflict? Because I get questions, sometimes people will say, Well, you know, I can't be out on the front line of a protest, I am just super uncomfortable doing it, it's not my thing. And my responses, you know, there are all kinds of activities that are required to pull off a protest, or to testify in front of a governmental body or start a ministry or whatever it may be. So there's a place for all of us, we all have gifts that complement one another. Then the second part of doing spiritual resistance is finding a group of people that want to work on issues that are important to you, and bring those skills to the table. We're so much more powerful in numbers. And we know when we know what we're good at, and what's important to us, that makes us even more powerful. And we can join forces with others who can do things that we can't, and we can do things that they can't. And we work together primarily, my recommendation is through community organizing, I think it's the best way for a spirituality of resistance,

Brandon Handley 6:56 right? I think that, um, you know, normally with spiritual spirituality of resistance means it means

Marcia 7:08 two things happen to us, when we live in such a complex world, we either try to avoid what's going on, or we try to deny it. So the spirituality of resistance, takes that head on, and says, I'm not going to avoid stuff, and I'm not going to deny that it's happening, I'm going to lean into the needle as it were, which is a pretty nice analogy right now. Because even if you're afraid of needles, you got to lean into that. That vaccination, in order that we get this pandemic wrestled to the ground once and for all. So you lean into that, which bothers you. When we avoid things, Gottlieb has this is his expression. And so I'm going to credit him, but he talks about how we have a tendency to put stuff that bothers us or we don't like under the floorboards of our consciousness. Okay, so when we are going to stop avoiding things, we pull that stuff out from under the floorboards and we start dealing with it, and we name it, that's a very important part of the spirituality of resistance. To name What is wrong, because as soon as you do that, you take a little bit of its power away. And then as you continue to work to eradicate whatever this wrong is, obviously, over time, it becomes even more disempowered. So that's avoidance. That's when like, pretending that stuff is not as bad as it is or that, you know, pretending it's not there. And the other thing about avoiding stuff is it takes a lot of our energy that we could put into positive forces positive works. So when we spend a lot of time doing this, and pretending we're wasting our energy and our gifts and talents, does that make sense?

Brandon Handley 9:17 It does make sense. So okay. And what I wrote down there tos is the idea of when we avoid these things, or deny them either way, we have an awareness of them. Yeah. Right. And it's the idea of our brains being kind of like computer programs in the sense that if or I think other people refer to it as like, your browser having too many tabs open. Yeah, right. And so you've got all these tabs up, right? You've got all these tabs open and but like, I'm not gonna go back to that page. I'm not ready for it yet. So that tabs like sitting there, sucking up resources that like if you go back over to it, and if you label it as you're saying It takes its power away. But it also says to that this, this has now been identified, right? You've categorized it, you've identified it. And now once it's got a label or a category, you've got the, hopefully, right, you've got some tools that you can leverage with, with those labels and categories, right? So you, right? Or, or you could at least go to somebody and say, hey, look, I've got a couple of these things. Can you help me with this? Because I think another thing that you mentioned is this whole idea of community, building it, or being a part of it, or leaving it was Western societies all? I've got to be the hero in every movie, right? And every scene, if I don't do this all myself, then did I do it at all? Right. Right. And so, you know, I think that when, when you're talking about this person who says that they've, you know, they don't see themselves on the forefront of the line? You know, what, and they think that that's the only way it can be, but you're saying that they can get involved in so many other ways? Oh, yeah.

Marcia 11:02 Right. Okay, you know, maybe your speech, or maybe you write great speeches, maybe your graphic designer, and you know, you, whatever project you're doing, need some outreach material. And so you can, you can participate in, it's just as important, as you know, the extroverts out on the front lines, the, the, you know, the the background stuff, the preparation is just as important. I was on a show recently with a really interesting and insightful young man who's a disability advocate, and he's on the autistic spectrum. But I was talking to him about when you're doing the group work, you have to do a power analysis, and you have to study and prepare. And he immediately went to the rope, a dope example with the Frazier Ali fight in 1974. And, you know, at the time, foreman was knocking people out before the fifth,

Unknown Speaker 12:00 fifth

Marcia 12:03 round. And so Muhammad Ali studied the film, and he realized that while he delivered these thunderous blows, he got tired fast. And so he just barely decided he was going to just go to the ropes and observe some abdominal blows, and just kind of wear him out. And it worked. He knocked him out. And I'm not a huge fan of boxing. But I think the analogy is really important, because it's about studying your opponent together doing power analysis, which is a very specific community organizing activity, figuring out who maybe are the decision makers, because that's where you've got to go. But, and in that sense of persistence in resistance, where you just keep working until you wear them out. And that's all a part of the spirituality of resistance as well. Now, I mentioned denial. We have seen this in this country, we have seen a degree of denial that is really goes beyond description. You know, 80 million people denying that the election was legitimate. a president that lied 33,000 times in the course of a four year term, half of which occurred last year. You know, we have developed a very strange and foreign relationship with the truth. And so when people deny that things are happening, we create an alternate reality. And we absolutely have seen this happen this this past year, and it's strangely enough, still seems to be having some steam to it, even though as the months roll on a beat these conspiracy theories and fantasy assessments of our culture are being proven wrong. So you see the power of denial, and what it can do in terms of undermining good social change.

Brandon Handley 14:24 Right. And I think that that's, you know, your your application of the spiritual resistances for social change. Is that, you know, kind of way Yes. Right. And so, let's talk a second about how do you go from practicing kind of, I guess I'll call it a material law. Right. I mean, I don't know what I know, the standard law. Yeah. spiritual law. Right. I think this is an interesting, it's an interesting shift. You know, talk a little bit about kind of the differences and how they kind of you know, how they align

Marcia 14:59 for you. They're actually aligned very easily. So when I was coming out in the late 70s and early 80s, first, I sensed a call to ordination, when I was about 15 years old. But of course, back then I wasn't seeing a whole lot of women at the pulpit or the altar. So I decided to become an attorney because I wanted to work to help people. And so I became a civil rights attorney. But that call of the Holy Spirit never left. And in fact, started getting louder as I got older. And I got frustrated, because you can't really argue the gospel of compassion and mercy in a court of law and expect to have a successful legal career because it doesn't really work that way. So, you know, there's, there's no precedent for the gospel. So I decided to go to seminary in my late 40s, along with a lot of other women who experience the same thing because of our, you know, or our common age. And so, when you are an attorney, you read texts, sometimes you write them, you write persuasive arguments, you interpret the law, you do all those things. You do the same thing. As a priest or pastor. It's all about reading texts, and interpreting them and preaching or teaching whatever it may be. But, and, and I, Martin Luther was a lawyer before he became a priest, I am in no way comparing myself to Martin Luther. But you know, that's a famous example of somebody.

Brandon Handley 16:55 It's interesting, you put it that way. And I think just as you're saying it, you know, it's kind of dawning on me that Yeah, exactly. Right. It's because I think I did like all maybe three months of business law. And I was like, this is for the birds. I was like, because it's not logical. Yes. No, there's no real logic in it, you really have to have an understanding of a whole bunch of other pieces. Yeah, to be able to interpret it. And I was like, I don't have time for this right now. Yeah.

Marcia 17:25 To is really so subject to interpretation.

Unknown Speaker 17:29 Right? Yeah. My God, it was mind boggling. I couldn't I couldn't, I did. I'm sure I could have if I really cared enough to, but I didn't.

Brandon Handley 17:38 So one of the things that we were talking about, too, was the idea of, um, you know, Christianity and and spirituality. Are they really separate? Or are they, you know, how do they How do they, you know, kind of walk hand in hand, because I hear people always separating religion from spirituality. I'm like, I don't, you know, helped me out there.

Marcia 18:00 Well, I think that's a really interesting and excellent question. I think most religions have a component of spirituality in and of course, it's going to vary depending on what that tradition is. Christianity is a very spiritual tradition. And in fact, you know, going back to the Old Testament, and the prophets, having conversations with God, having, you know, this direct relationship, and then seeing Jesus continue that. And as a matter of fact, often the disciples would lose track of him because he went off somewhere to pray. And we see this particularly in the Gospel of Luke, which is, I think, a very spiritual gospel. Jesus is off praying very often. And he's helping, so he goes and prays, and then he goes, and he helps somebody. So Christianity, as a tradition, I think, is very, very spiritual. Unfortunately, and this bothers me a lot. And it's one of the reasons that I started political theology matters, is to underscore that to look back to the Gospels of Jesus and what he did, he prayed and healed. And he challenged unjust systems, and then he healed somebody. You know? That's not what we're seeing in the public square right now. And Christianity is looking is melded, if you will, say to January 6, you know, there's all these flags waving Jesus saves as people are storming the capital of the United States of America. that bothered me greatly, greatly greatly. So it's, it's really important that we bring this idea of spirituality back to the fore I think the American American people, I'm going to make a very broad based statement here, this is my opinion. But I think the American people are just parched for spirituality, they're parched for reconnecting with their Creator, the divine being this, you know, whatever it is that you call it. We don't respect that in public in society. And we should,

Brandon Handley 20:28 I'm going to, I'm going to agree with you. And I think that we're seeing a lot of that research. And since I could, it could be, of course, that I've just gone through myself in the middle of all of it. And that's the only people I talked to pretty much outside of outside of work, you know, because but the other thing is, we're seeing it in the workplace. We're seeing, you know, wellness, we're seeing meditation, we're seeing yoga, we're seeing breathwork, we're seeing all this other stuff show up in the workplace, you know, without calling it specifically, you know, you know, reconnecting with source or anything, right. But the surge of people that are running towards it, and embracing it. That's, That, to me indicates that, that what you're saying is 100% true, right? The idea of that the idea of this thirst for it, it exists right now. And of course, it always makes me think of, and I don't know, the Bible for nothing. But you know, it makes me think of makes me think of the line of, you know, I've got bread that are meats that you know, not have, right, that's the nourishment that yes, we're seeking the spiritual nourishment and right that that, you know, will feed us to sustain us that, you know that that's, that's why we're parched. Right. That's why we're hungry, because we haven't been. And we're banished.

Marcia 21:53 There's a in the fourth chapter of john, the gospel of john, there's one of the most amazing stories in the whole Bible, and it's when Jesus is at the well with the Samaritan woman. And he says to her, I will giving I'll give you a living water, and you will never thirst again. And of course, she wants this water. And she's taking him much more literally than what he's talking about. But I think that when people and then by extension individuals and by extension of community are more tied into the spiritual, mystical, you know, part of life, I think our regard for other human beings will go up. One of the reasons I think we're seeing these, this episode, we are in a pandemic of police shootings. And I think one of the reasons that we are seeing this is because instead of connecting spiritually, and praying and recognizing that we're all children of God, there's just a lot of fear and power plays. And that's not spirituality, spirituality is getting in touch with our Creator, and by extension, the folks that we share this planet with and in creation.

Brandon Handley 23:15 And would you also say that we can eliminate some of that fear if we have some faith? And in our Creator? Of course, I would say that, yeah. You know, but it you know, it goes, it goes to the brain up all the time, it's, you know, it's this, this this kind of idea of let go and let God it releases a lot of these fears. Yes, right. Yeah, you can, you can look at that. And I, I put it into a bunch of different frameworks. But I think that, once you make that statement work for you, and you see in action, there is my book, salming surrender effect was the thing that you feel, and you're like, why haven't I've been doing this all my life, right? Because, you know, there's this resistance to the institution of church and religion. I think that that's what's that's what keeps a lot of people from trying to make that way forward. So, Marsha, we were down to, we're down to kind of get into the end here. We've got political theology matters, right? Yeah. I want to know, a couple of questions. We're gonna do like a couple of spiritual speed dating questions. Okay, so this is like, you know, hey, you and I are at the table. I want to date you, but I'm not quite sure if you're the right spiritual as a line person, for me. And so you know, what's let's take a let's take a couple, take a couple of these questions and see if we can come up with okay. To do what is wisdom and how do we gain it?

Marcia 24:52 Well, I think wisdom basically is knowing right and wrong. I think it just boils right down to that, you know, having a moral through line in your life that guides you in terms of your thoughts and conduct and the decisions that you make. And, and we, I think we acquire this as we live longer for a reason. Because as we experience life, it helps us understand what our moral through line is, and should be even greater as we age.

Brandon Handley 25:27 Like that. You know, I was always a wise ask growing up as a kid, right. But that wasn't the wisdom that it served.

Marcia 25:36 wasn't always asked is different than wisdom, who, you know, you

Brandon Handley 25:39 still still put the two in there? Yeah, put the two in there. I was

Marcia 25:42 the wiser as to so there you go. That's just a bit. This

Brandon Handley 25:45 is part of the journey. Right? I'm going from thinking that you know, everything to knowing that you know, nothing. Yeah. Right.

Marcia 25:53 humility, that's part of wisdom. For sure.

Brandon Handley 25:56 Yeah. Is current religion serving its purpose?

Marcia 25:59 No. Tell me more? Well, yes. And no. I think we're seeing it, I'm going to talk about Christianity, because that's what I know, I really have no business talking about any other tradition. But Christianity has lost its way, and is much more concerned, at least certain corners of Christ's vineyard are more concerned about power than they are about people, and about judgment, and damning people because they're this or that, or they're not this or that. And dictating the terms of that individual's relationship with their Creator, which I think is crazy. And I quit doing that, we got to stop this horizontal stuff. Alright, you did this. So you're bad, you're going to hell, or whatever, like anybody really has the right to say that to somebody else. Our relationship needs to be like this. You know, we need to dictate a relationship with our Creator, or we need to craft it and follow our tradition, and our Creator, and not let society get in between. And I think that's really bad. I think that's where Christianity is failing. The most. Are there any

Brandon Handley 27:27 churches, groups, communities and Christianity that you feel like are doing it right, right now?

Marcia 27:34 Well, of course, I would have to put in a plug for the Episcopal Church. I am a priest ordained in the Episcopal Church. And I'm, I'm a lesbian. So I didn't have a lot of choices outside of mainstream Protestantism, to become ordained. But I'm still really glad that I'm where I am. Because we have an incarnational theology, which means that God chose to send Jesus to walk the earth with us to understand our lives and to understand what we go through, in order to reach out to us and invite us into the reign of God. And so I, that really works for me, we are very inclusive, we are dating, obviously, we are dating LGBT people. As a matter of fact, we specifically passed a, you know, a resolution a few years ago at our general convention to ordain trans people. So we're on the cutting edge of the LGBTQ issues. But we're also very active in lobbying for greater social justice. reconciliation, racial reconciliation, climate care, you name it, and we are involved on the progressive and of Christianity, and I'm very proud of that. I wouldn't be an Episcopal priest if I was a

Brandon Handley 29:01 class. Fantastic. And you know, it's it's great to hear, you know, called sex they called branches. I don't know what they're called. denominations. That's what they are. Right?

Marcia 29:10 Yes. denominations. And several that are in company with us. It's not just us, but

Brandon Handley 29:16 right right now, but it's great to hear that. There's this kind of release of judgment. Right. Yeah. And there's this acceptance of calm as you are, right? Because, I mean, that's kind of what it's supposed to be about. Right? Come as you are, you're accepted no matter who, what, where you are, right, what you've done. who, you know, you feel like you've wronged I mean, you know, as a parent myself, right. And I can only imagine like, as you know, you know, you know, God, Jesus, whoever, whoever, you know, the creator is that's our eternal parent, you know, doesn't want us to, like, you know, sit their misery over the fact that I don't know yeah, you know, if you Have cause an accident, like by running into a car like that. That doesn't mean you're damned to hell, you know? Like, hey, you made a pretty shitty mistake, right? But go ahead and come on in, we're gonna we're gonna work through this right? Let's talk about this. Let's know, let's, where can we go from here,

Marcia 30:15 there's, in my opinion, way too much emphasis on being strictly sinful create creatures of constant failure. And, you know, disappointment. God created us, we're told, because God didn't want to be alone and wanted to be with us in community. And Jesus was all about community. And I think that we have to remember that we are also children, a God created in God's image. And so what we can do then is stop focusing so much on how faulty we are all the time. Recognize that we are children of God, but also recognize that Jesus created avenues for us to seek and receive forgiveness so that we could stay in relationship with God. And that's just incredibly important with that.

Brandon Handley 31:08 I mean, I've heard some people call that the way, right there's like, Yeah, right. Yeah. So, so, so much fun to have you on today. Thanks for thanks for stopping on. Really appreciate it much.

Yeah. Appreciate it. Where can people go to have more Marsha?

Marcia 31:24 Okay, so my website is called political theology. matters.com. I know that's kind of long. We'll put it in the show notes. You can email me at Marsha m AR c IA at MMI. PTM. PTM for political theology. matters.com. So that's the shortened version. Marsha, at my PTM calm. Thank you so much for being on today. And oh, more. Would you like me to send you info when the book drops? Absolutely, absolutely. So yeah, you've

Brandon Handley 32:01 got you've got a book coming out. You're working on it. And you're expected to come out this year?

Marcia 32:05 Yeah, at the end of next the end of this year. And I'll be sure that Brandon knows when it is. And you can get more information. It's about it's a book about how to do faith based advocacy for social justice.

Brandon Handley 32:19 That's great. And I love it. Thank you so much for being on today. Marsha, my pleasure.

Marcia 32:22 Thank you, Brandon.

Unknown Speaker 32:23 We really hope you enjoyed this episode of the spiritual dove podcast. stay connected with us directly through spiritual dove co You can also join the discussion on Facebook, spiritual and Instagram and spiritual underscore go. If you would like to speak with us, send us an email there Brendan at spiritual dove calm. And as always, thank you for cultivating your mindset and creating a better reality. This includes the most thought provoking part of your day. Don't forget to like and subscribe to stay fully up to date. Until next time, make on your zone and trust your intuition.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

Unknown Speaker 0:01 Oh,

Brandon Handley 0:01 all right. All right. All

Unknown Speaker 0:03 right.

Unknown Speaker 0:04 That's funny.

Brandon Handley 0:04 I like to start these things off. Like that, like that.

Unknown Speaker 0:11 This morning,

Brandon Handley 0:13 I'm on my way to work. And I thought I'd share something

Unknown Speaker 0:17 with you,

Brandon Handley 0:19 as spiritual dope continues to do what is really anything I've ever done in terms of podcasting, and creating Facebook groups and all this other stuff. We, I have, I don't want to lump you into this. I have certainly gone ahead. And many times, and as many times as I've heard somebody say, don't focus on the metrics. Don't focus on the you know, how many likes you get, and all the people that are in there with you and engage with you. And by the way, it's a different mic. And I'm driving MiGs. Next vehicle the Jeep right now. So we'll see how the audio comes out. If it's awful, and the message is

Unknown Speaker 1:15 great,

Brandon Handley 1:16 chances are you'll hear it if it is a audios, okay, and the message is great, you'll hear it. Hopefully though, we can make the audio

Unknown Speaker 1:27 pretty good. It's pretty good

Brandon Handley 1:29 given that is a straight recording on to the phone, and is really actually the genesis of what a podcast was just a recording on mobile device, ie the

Unknown Speaker 1:46 iPod

Brandon Handley 1:50 metrics, vanity metrics, the idea and they call them vanity metrics. And as as spiritual as I am, as aware as I am of all of these things, that doesn't mean that I can't, and don't get caught up in them. I'm not a saint, I am 100% human, I am 100% susceptible to great marketing, good advertising. And the idea of all of these, all of those is, is to really separate you where you are right now. And ask you a question. The question is Where Where would you like to be? This is marketing one on one, this is really sales one on one. And this is I think everything that we do in the world that creates value, everything that we do in the world that creates value is the idea of Okay, here's where you are today, you're telling me you would like to get here, I have that tool that can help you get there. So that you can get to market sooner, you can make more money, you can lose the weight, you can be muscular, and all of these things as martiny that's my that's the world. Entire world. And marketing is the marketing tools. And marketing. advertising is the is it's that on steroids. So if you didn't already know I'm pretty sure most of you already know that. And just because you know, doesn't mean that you're not susceptible to it doesn't mean that it doesn't work on you and me, right and it still works on me as much as I know even about the psychology of it all. There's a threshold and there's a desire and there's you know, what, what are you willing to part with in order to get what you desire? What are you willing to do in order to get what you desire? And I desire to have more people listen in to spiritual dope, I desire to share the messaging out of spiritual dope. I desire to not even you know, to to have other people tune in as well. to aspire to have amazing guests that that I feel would be a benefit to you To listen to I feel like the guests are huge benefits myself as well as, as the other the other piece of of kind of life is, you know, in mentorship, we we look for those who have what we want, or, you know, on the on the outset that they look like they've accomplished something we're trying to accomplish. And we asked them questions that help us to fill the gaps. We have this diatribe that says, hey, let's, let's, let's Converse so that I can understand Are you truly where I believe I would like to be? And if so, how did you get there. So a lot of this is me searching. But it's also done for you, to help you resonate with somebody else. And that's, that's why I have kind of tongue in cheek, you should be hearing I'm actually you would have heard one this last week, if you listen to David Sander cot. And you've heard the, if you've been listening to some of the interviews, the idea of spring spiritual dope as a speed dating spiritual speed dating game, where these people who come on if you were spiritually seeking, if you were, if you are seeking, and the guests that come on resonate with you, that's awesome. For me, that's awesome for me, because that means that I'm providing a service to you. That is in tune with who I am as well. So

that is, that's exciting, right. So that's what I'm trying to do that is, that is what I'm putting out there. That is what I'm sending out. And sometimes, man, I'd like it to grow faster. Sometimes, I'd like you Wow, just you want more people to listen in, to help you to get to where you want to be to help jog something in you. That shows you just how incredible you are to and it shows you, oh, here's somebody else who's similar to me, you right, someone who's similar to you, that's going on a path that started from where you started at that has had some of the same experiences as you that you are still on the road and he's alive was a groundhog.

Unknown Speaker 7:47 Somebody

Brandon Handley 7:49 who has gone through things that are similar to you and has come out to a place that you would like to get to. That's kind of what the resignation is. And so

Unknown Speaker 8:05 while

Brandon Handley 8:07 putting this together. And while I am fully aware of not being not seeking the vanity metrics, but liking them all the same, right, and looking for this external validation where I know that it's not necessary. Sorry, if I'm being long in the tooth here. I fell prey to it anyways, and let me tell you, the story is just kind of entertaining. Because, you know, somebody reached into my dm so like, Hey, we think that your you and your messaging would be a great fit for something that we we promote, we'll get you over 1000 engaged people. I was like, Whoa, or 1000 1000 new, at least 1000 new followers on Instagram. And it was like 30 bucks. They were rushing. And and I was like, fuck it, you know, why not? Can will this result in this messaging, this connection getting out to some people that can truly use it, too? will this help change? lives on the outside? will this help change? Will this will this connect with somebody resonate with somebody? I do this and you know the cost is 30 bucks. So I did it, pull the trigger. And first of all the guide you know person was like, hey, we'll post it at 5pm PST.

Unknown Speaker 9:56 It was six p

Brandon Handley 9:57 I was like yeah, that's fine. Go for it and Then it was like six, I was like, you know, starting to panic about 30 bucks, which is which in and of itself is like, Wow. It's a, you know, it's interesting to see that trigger right within yourself to understand that you're still panicked over 30 bucks for any known good reason. To me that was interesting. And then to not trust to understand that as trusting as I feel like I am and simply because it was a Russian, I have prejudice, that that I might be being taken. And don't

Unknown Speaker 10:41 get me wrong.

Brandon Handley 10:42 Everybody gets taken and you know, there's, there's whatever, I'm not suggesting that it was a good idea. However, I want to have with it. Five o'clock, I was like, Yo, what's up? where's where's my where's my shout out? where's where's where's my people? Where's my followers? You know? how's this gonna work? No response. I'm like, fuck it. 30 bucks. Let me make these pizzas and call tonight. And, you know, shame on me. Around 6:30pm I started getting a flood of likes, flood of new followers. And it was kind of, you know, this instant gratification. There was like the dopamine hit, I was like, Oh, yeah,

Unknown Speaker 11:25 check it out. It's working for come the fall word.

Brandon Handley 11:32 And I started checking, start checking who the likes are from and, and, you know, are these people that would really resonate with me? And, and, you know, just straight up looking at gift horse in the mouth, I guess is what that looks like. But are these are these genuine followers? Are these genuine people that will be engaged, and you're going to be checking these accounts. And they were Middle Eastern, they were,

you know, mostly a lot of a lot of Arabic. So when they speak the language, or, you know, the the account wouldn't have spoken away. It was like, okay, you know, it's kind of disappointing.

Unknown Speaker 12:14 But, you know,

Brandon Handley 12:16 there's always me, I'm the I'm the hopeless optimist. I gotta make maybe they may engage, I don't know, what

Unknown Speaker 12:24 do I know?

Brandon Handley 12:25 I don't know, shit. So continues. And you know, I'm checking out many of the other accounts and there's that are popping up and basically get 1000, maybe even 1400, I forget how many new followers from this, this disengagement for 30 bucks. And as I went through the

Unknown Speaker 12:51 evening,

Brandon Handley 12:52 again, I was like, Okay, and then I was like, these people, none of them. None of them are gonna engage. Right? They're not they're not engaging. And so that was kind of bombing, right? Like, bummed me out. Because, you know, the next day I go, and I put out like, a

Unknown Speaker 13:09 post?

Unknown Speaker 13:10 And I'm like, Well, you know, let's,

Brandon Handley 13:11 let's see, what happens is, am I gonna get a lot of it? Am I gonna? My is this gonna? Is there gonna be engagement? Right? Because the content is its its intent is to engage its intent is to inspire, make think. Or even provide answers again, you know, facilitate links, that lead to action, taking that lead to enthusiasm that lead to you taking action for yourself. I know it's a lot, and I don't give a shit. That's, that's what the intent is. And so I got caught up in I got caught up in the metrics, and somebody reached out that said, Hey, I saw that you use this person service, and that was an actual person. So I did end up engaging with one real person. And, and they're like, well, are they engaging? I said, none. And she was like, yeah, you know. That's a bone because, you know, if you've got bloated numbers and no engagement, then then you know that the algo doesn't work well there either. And I just realized that I've been caught up in and vanity metrics, I realized I've been caught up in something that I knew that I didn't believe in. So I was seeking engagement, but I got caught up in the optics of it. And, you know, so I found myself and I still I'm still still going through Instagram. So it's what's funny is the time that is But the money that I spent in

Unknown Speaker 15:01 you know,

Brandon Handley 15:02 trying to gain these followers get get this engagement has has made it so that you know I experienced this and go through it and now I'm spending time and Instagram deleting followers which is funny because it takes forever and I couldn't get some other app to work that made it like instantaneous or at least faster because there's no built in way to bulk delete followers why would you want to do that? right and then the answer is I don't I don't I don't want people who are in there that aren't engaged with fucking content I don't want to be I don't want to be speaking with people who don't want to be spoken to. If you've ever seen the energy bus read the read the book it's pretty good book. Energy man I don't want I don't want fucking leeches. I don't want energy vampires on there. I want people that the message resonates with and you know it that's five fucking people. That's great. If it's 10 people, that's great. If it's one person like every day that's like you know, the supportive I mean that's that's awesome. That means that there's there's somebody out there that is resonating and and what I found is that when I'm deleting these people and I'm going through it I'm deleting people

Unknown Speaker 16:22 is

Unknown Speaker 16:25 I'm getting

Brandon Handley 16:26 two or three new followers a day that I believe are engaged like that are genuine and that are that are plugged in and just you know made me think of this whole thing and I just wanted to share it with you because I'm a human right I'm fucking human I am I am a spiritual being having a human experience. And I'm not I'm not a saint. Right and and I don't ever want to portray myself as being other than exactly what you are outside of, you know, having different experiences and going through taking different courses and having you know, different sets of educate, we all have something to bring and I just thought I'd bring this experience to you though and just let you know that

Unknown Speaker 17:23 hey,

Brandon Handley 17:24 if you get and this is you know this is me trying to like me I guess not shame myself or be okay with it not I should be right. justify ship. But we are all human, we, you know, we're gonna we're gonna fall prey to some of these gimmicks we are going to we are going to have these perceived gaps that were that we want to close quickly, right? We look at it like almost like a wound or a gate a gaping wound, right. And that's literally like what I've been taught in some of the, in some of the sales tactics and marketing out there is like, what you want to do is find their pain point, right? Like, I'm looking for your pain point. Want to fucking rip it open, pour some salt in there, push it in and be like, ah, how you like that. So that like you are psychologically like, this shit needs to get fixed like now, right? Otherwise like panic, panic, panic, panic. So how do we release that? I don't have the answers there. But so that's, that's what's happening when you, when you have this perceived gap, this idea that you need, there's like this sense of urgency to, to make a purchase to make a change. And we all go through it. So don't feel guilty if you find yourself with a table full of, of anything that because when you purchased it and you made that purchase, you you you felt like it was going to make a it was going to make it was gonna change your life. I mean, you quite literally make a purchase because you feel like it's gonna change your life. You feel like there's going to be some personal gain where you feel like it's gonna change the lives of others, the gifts that you buy for people, because it's changed your life. Anywho marketing. We're all susceptible to it. And there's no there's no shame in it. And I just, you know, again, I'm human, share my human story talks.

Unknown Speaker 19:33 Anyways,

Unknown Speaker 19:34 well, you know, I'm

Brandon Handley 19:34 saying, talk to you later.

Transcribed by https://otter.ai

So much fun during this one, be sure to connect with David over at https://www.davidsandercott.com/

Insta: david_sandercott

Brandon Handley 0:00 4321 Hey there spiritual dope I'm on today with David Sandercott a big thanks goes out they were just talking he, he and I were on together probably was about a month ago David and something in the ether chewed up. It's like, you know my dog ate my homework type of thing happened. And so Dave is back here again for a second round. I really appreciate coming back. So Dave is the author of 21 day meditation journey connect with spirit every day in a new way, a life and business coach and speaker, David is also excited to announce it he is now working with small businesses and large corporations. In 1998, David decided to be the shortest high fashion model ever. He also decided that he was going to meditate himself there. In 2001. David was the shortest male model ever to appear in Vogue magazine and the six page spread shot by Helmut Newton alongside supermodel Kate Dillon. Ever since David has been inspired to help others to achieve their dreams, David, thanks for being on today. How are you? Hey, thanks.

David Sandercott 1:04 Happy to be your brand. You got the longer older bio there from the website? Is that right? Yeah,

Brandon Handley 1:11 I did. I mean, I thought that was actually pretty short one I was I was happy. I was like, wow, you know, you don't have your whole life story there. Thank you.

David Sandercott 1:17 Hey, good. I like I like short BIOS,

Brandon Handley 1:20 is a good one. I enjoyed it. I enjoyed it. So well, you know, we start us off with the idea. Let's see if you remember everything that we did last time because it was perfect. The we start us off with the whole idea that source speaks through us for like just kind of this moment and purpose. And right now, you know, sources speaking through you to an audience member, and only the way that it can through you What does that message to that audience member today?

David Sandercott 1:50 Wow, that's a great question. Brandon was gonna close my eyes and connect a little bit just to make sure I get it right. You know, I think that message is, you know, above anything is to believe in yourself, to love yourself. And to know that if you have the inspiration in your heart, if you have that reoccurring thought of this thing that you want to do, or that pool to do something, that you have everything you need within you to do that thing. And if you're using the excuse of I don't have the money, I promise you that's not what's stopping you from doing it. You know, you're most people think of capital is money. You know, Facebook, Steve Jobs, apple, they didn't have millions and millions of dollars to start, they started with the capital in their mind, which was an idea. And it's just like, just like them your idea is your true capital. Does that make sense? Does that sound like something they want to hear? I

Brandon Handley 2:52 love I love it, man. Absolutely, absolutely. I think I think you know, you're being pulled to do it. And I think that that's something How can somebody recognize that they're being pulled to do it? And it's not just ego telling them that that's the thing?

David Sandercott 3:04 Yeah, that's a great question. You know, that's part of the art of life of you know, how to be human is learning how to be a happy human is learning to decipher between that voice that speaks to you that, you know, let's say Bugs Bunny, right, Bugs Bunny used to have the angel pop up and like the devil on one side. And so you have to learn to differentiate between those. And what I can most to tell you is that fear is the is the devil. And, and when it feels good, and your heart opens, you know that that's God, that's the angel. You know, I don't think I can give you some sort of linear way to tell you how to decipher those voices. You have to do it through practice, through learning to love yourself and trust yourself and through meditation and contemplation. But usually it feels good and doesn't involve fear. And then what was the second part of the question? I don't remember I was so that's alright. It was a great question. But how do you decipher? And then the one thing you said that you're being led, you know, how do you know that you're being led? And it's, it's simple. So two things, like one exercise I did is I wrote down 10 goals every day for a year. And it was like, what those what goals of those were left at the end of the year. Those were the ones that were really important. They kept the ones that kept coming up over and over and over again. And again, it's like that in your heart and in your mind, what keeps coming up. What do you keep thinking about wanting to do what inspires you when you think about doing it? And that's, that's the poll that I'm speaking of, and, and to some degree, it's also easy it because it's not that there's not challenges or obstacles, but it's some it's easy, it's easy when it's right. It's easy.

Brandon Handley 4:51 So being invoke was right and easy for you. Let's talk about that.

David Sandercott 4:57 Yeah, you know, someone interviewed me for that reason. Recently are, you know, we're talking about manifestation, the art of manifestation. She's like, and I bet you that you had some some struggles or some challenges, you know, leading up to getting in vogue. I was like, No, it was so easy and effortless, you know, it was part of it. I think that I was I was so young, that I hadn't had much, you know, adversity in my life maybe. And I just decided to do something. And I decided to meditate. And I decided to visualize, I decided to read affirmations and I decided I was gonna do this thing. And it Honest to God was the most easy and effortless thing I've ever done in my life, I think because it was right, it was divine, it was it was to show me that you really can do anything you put your mind to, if you believe in yourself, and stick with it.

Brandon Handley 5:50 You've got a lot of, you know, a lot of good stuff in there, right? I think that everybody feels like it's supposed to be a challenge, right? If it's worth it, it's gonna take work. If it's worth it, you're gonna have to put in the work and it's gonna be hard. And you know, you got to put in, like, you got to grind it out, and this other stuff. But when you do it in that manner, then you know, it's kind of like what you put out, there's what you get back. That's exactly what it's going to take, it's gonna take a grind, and it's gonna be hard and all this other stuff. But it sounds to me like what you did was you said, but here, here's another piece of this, too, that that I think we don't hear a bunch of and like the law of attraction world. If you don't know how to do it, and you just start doing it, then it the patches kind of opens up for you. Is that kind of how it went for you?

David Sandercott 6:40 Absolutely. Because that's where I want to say action is the key to success. Now, there's all kinds of action involved, right? There is there absolutely was and yes, that is how it started. All I knew I needed to have pretty pictures of myself. You know, I knew I needed that. So that was that was the first step. I knew I needed to be in great shape. But that's what I loved doing anyway. So there was a lot of work in the gym. But you know what, I? There's nothing I would rather do in my life than that. And then yeah, there was x and you just had to talk to agents. You know, I mentioned I went to New York, and this guy is just Oh, looking. Cute. Haha, you want a bottle? And you that didn't faze me. I was just like, you know, oh, yeah, I'm gonna be a model.

Brandon Handley 7:34 So when you're saying that to it when you said action, right, and I forget what I was watching. I was like another, you know, law of attraction, spin off, or the secret spin off for a bunch of people that were in there. And one guy's like, by the way, the word action is at the end of attraction, right? is in attraction. And I thought that that was pretty cool. But what you're also talking about too, and I'm hearing you say is like, you kind of had clarity and purpose and an intention. And you got behind it, you believed in yourself and you just aligned to it. Right? You did. And thank you for the recommendation, right? The dorthea brand, you know, um, you know, acted as if it actually as if it was impossible to fail.

David Sandercott 8:21 That's right. That's right. It was it was Yeah, it's such a great book. And so anyways, I mentioned thinking Grow Rich before I read the book thinking grow rich. It told me I could do anything I wanted to do if I believed in myself made a decision to do it and I meditated. So those were the three things I did exactly what you said I made a decision and I think that is where so many people falter that's where so many people that the decision they make is not to make a decision or decision they make is to make an excuse on why they can't make the decision when it was I made a clear cut decision that was gonna be the world's shortest high fashion model. And now I Honest to God could probably get into the Guinness Book of World Records with with everything that I had for doing that you know, that didn't necessarily mean to me though get in the world Guinness Book of World Records You know, that's not it was just get something that only a six foot two you know, Blue Steel type model could do you know, and and that was it that's filled it but I made the decision to do it. So I had to succeed. And then I believed in myself and I followed up with action. So there's the non action action of the daily meditation and the daily visualization was was equally and probably more important than the other daily actions of going to castings meeting people, you know, always be doing something right. And not doing something for the sake of doing something like modeling jobs, photo shoots, you know, etc, etc.

Brandon Handley 10:00 Sure, I think there's a lot of sounds to me what you're talking about is there's a lot of people that do these actions from this busy stuff. But there's no there's nothing behind it, right? There's no there's no intent, there's no alignment. There's like, Alright, well, I'm supposed to do these things, this thing, this thing, this thing and this thing. But if it's not aligned to an intention, or purpose or direction, or like this grand vision, I mean, we can call, we call what you had a vision of what you thought was possible for yourself. Right? Like, yeah, I think that I think another thing too, is that people are afraid to have a vision people are afraid to be visionary, because they think it needs to be something greater than it is right? You can, you can have many visions you can write, you can have these visions that these practice visions, we'll call them. Right. But you know, I think what you're talking about, too, is the idea of making a decision. Did you pull that out of thinking grow rich? And sub question, Are you a Bob Proctor fan?

David Sandercott 10:59 I did pull it out of thinking Grow Rich, those were the three biggest takeaways make a decision, believe in yourself and meditate that that was the key in all my life that decision making has been key was a huge like Bob. Proctor was really inspiring to me like 15 years ago, I don't really I mean, walked around thinking Grow Rich, and you know, so he, I haven't really been cued into them for a long time.

Brandon Handley 11:26 Now, fair enough. And the reason I bring that up, because he brings up the word decision, and the root of the word is like this

David Sandercott 11:32 huge array cut off from thinking grow rich. So once I make the decision, there's no other option, you know, you have to pick yourself off from all other options.

Brandon Handley 11:46 Well, look, I'm super impressed that you got that out of thinking Grow Rich, like even immediately, because it's a tough read. And if you're trying to read that on your own, without some kind of, I don't know, I want to say guidance, because it's a tough one to read. Like I certainly. And for me, I never I never pulled meditate out of there. Where did you pull that out? I'm like, I'm like, where'd you pull the rabbit out of the hat, bro.

David Sandercott 12:08 You know, it's I read it sometimes. And I'm like, and it is in there. And I am convinced that the older of the edition of the book you can get, the better they've taken stuff out over the years. There's this beautiful poem in there. That's not in the original unabridged version anymore. I don't know why. And maybe I'm making it up. But it was just as loud and clear to me in that book was you've got to meditate if you want to be successful. That's just what I saw. And I remember asking Mr. Van Asch, who was sort of like a mentor of mine, and I said, Do you meditate? And he's like, Well, no, but I drive home silently. for like an hour, I do this drive. And that's sort of like my meditate. So he knew what I was talking about, when we're talking about the book, you know? And so I don't know, but I got it out of there. And it is in there. He does say the word meditate, you know,

Brandon Handley 13:01 no doubt, I believe you, man, I believe you. 100%. And then you threw out a couple of words earlier there when we're talking about easy and effortless, right? The the idea of more meditation, but you talked about like, you know, kind of divine intervention, right? Like, when do you feel like you really flipped the spirituality switch for yourself?

David Sandercott 13:26 Yeah, that's a great question. So I've honestly the effortless way. I said, I'm teaching June 19 is the effortless way. June 19. I'm having a prosper event. But anyways, so again, I the spiritual switch turned on for me. And when I was, Well, honestly, when I was in my teenage, or even preteen years, I remember thinking about wanting to find my higher self like that being my driving force I really wanted, I knew there was something more. And then when I read Think and Grow Rich at that time, that was it, man. I was, I mean, less than a year late after that, I moved to LA. I was meditating an hour a day I was visualizing, but it's, I mean, it was just as soon as I got sober from like, a four year you know, run of being drunk. 22 I just, I was immediately called the Spirit. And that doesn't mean I didn't like break up with it during certain times, or like, neglect it and forget about it. And to some degree, it's if I had a regret that would be there, Brett I had in my life. When my all of my good friends started moving out to LA, I sort of shifted back kind of into the role that I played more with them instead of just sticking to the celibate, spiritual, and just I was a machine I mean, I was I. Yeah, it happened very early on, and then again, in 2011

Brandon Handley 15:00 So I think that I think that it's interesting that you kind of found it you recalled toward such a young agent, I don't I don't think that I think that somewhere around 20 we get called to that, right? It's and it's kind of like, you know, a window of an opportunity, right? And we either heat it then where we don't, right? For those of us that don't, myself included, you kind of go about life in this default mode, right? And you just, you're like, Alright, well, let me go do all these other things everybody else is doing because that's what looks like I should be doing. And then to me again, and just just based off of personal experience, but the other window of opportunity kind of opens up round, you know, when you get close to 40. Right? There's like it still here. Still here, if you want to hang out, bro. Right? Like, I mean, and, and, and spiritualities like that. It's like I listen, I'm hope you had a good time. It's time to get serious again, right? Remember me like? word Have you been man? It's been crazy. So I think it's really cool that you know, you kind of took hold of it. And you talked about the breakups. And the other piece that you're talking about is when your friends show up. It's interesting, right? When you go home, you're like, well, this is who I was when I left. And so people are still expecting me to be that way. And that's probably what it was when your friends come out to visit you like, you're like, Oh, this is the Dave they know. Right. Let me like, let me remind you revert back to something that's acceptable for the people that you know that that kind of what happened?

David Sandercott 16:25 Yeah, I just say it was unconscious, you know, to a to a large degree. But looking back now, yeah, I would say what I really want to express is the way not to fall in that trap is to really have a great deal of love and respect for yourself and recognize how what you're doing is working. Now, it was a lot of fun to fall back into that role, because my friends were all kind of like rich or had more money than me and at a beach house and hermoza. And I've seen we had I still I never drink or you know, but I still have a lot of fun with them. But they were all getting master's degrees and establishing careers. And I fell back into the guy who was just along for the ride, you know, not realizing that they're eventually going to get kids and not be able to take care of me get married have kids

Unknown Speaker 17:19 out? Yeah,

Brandon Handley 17:22 I get it, I get it. But what's interesting, though, too, is that it doesn't sound like you succumb to their way of living though either by feeling like it. Maybe you did. And like

David Sandercott 17:35 No, I didn't. I mean, I gave him stuff for Well, a lot of a lot. Not really. But I mean, I'm definitely the guy that people talk to you they don't want to drink so much.

Brandon Handley 17:45 I mean, not even just the drinking but like the the you know, the workforce, right, going back into the workforce, getting the education and doing you know, kind of doing that what's the social socially expected norm? Yeah, that's what your friend said, right? They finished school, got degrees, got married, have kids and fell into fell in line.

David Sandercott 18:06 They absolutely did it. And it worked for them to the degree they're happy. I'll say this this is coming up for me is like sometimes I give teachers or education a bad rap. But I had a fifth grade teacher named miss a miss Afro carrion, she was, she was great. The rumor was that during lunch, she smelled doobies in her like 1970s docks, and in the in the dots in the corner of the parking lot. But anyways, at the beginning of class, every single day, we recited the road less traveled by Robert Frost. And I have no doubt that that completely impacted me in such a profound way. Because everything I've ever done in my life, was the road less traveled was taken the road less traveled.

Brandon Handley 18:49 That's awesome. You know, I'm in agreement with you there, right, like, definitely, probably not as kind as I could be to the education system, but they're certainly the teachers that had a profound impact are the ones that you remember

David Sandercott 19:04 that as MIT right, Mr. Ben, he just retired and I made him a video, you know, someone in and I just let him know that you inspired me to start reading angry reading changed my life, you know, I'm not the stuff they gave you in school.

Brandon Handley 19:23 What do you what do you think the impact of doing something like that is reaching out to a past teacher? Did he reply to you? What, what are your thoughts there?

David Sandercott 19:30 Well, it was sent in like a group thing, like someone put it together. And I don't know, but I know he saw it. And so I had a rubber band ball that was like this big and he took it away from me. And I had went back like five or six years later, and he still had it. And then I asked someone to ask so at his retirement, he still had the rubber band ball that I gave him. So I know he remembered me. And so I'm sure that he was grateful for that message, you know, is great. You know, I was happy to do it because teachers get, you know, they get pooped on a lot to

Brandon Handley 20:04 it. And it's the same, um, you know, somewhere, and but, you know, to the idea that some of their for a job and some of their really impact lives and it sounds like you had a few that were there to really impact your life. Yeah, that's right. And, and I think, you know, I'm gonna segue that into kind of what you're doing right? You know, you're you're right now you're teaching some of these practices and principles that you've been able to find success with in your life. One of those is, I think that you initially kind of did a lot of work in the space by helping others to get their first You know, one grand five grand, and now you're working to help them get their first 10 grand, and in their, in their own respective faces. Let's talk a bit about that. What's your, what's your about in that space?

David Sandercott 20:49 Yeah. So after I read, Think and Grow Rich for that first time, it was like, I knew that this is what I wanted to do, I didn't know there was a thing called a coach back then, you know, but I knew that that's what I want to do, and mentor people and, and I did it as a wrestling coach. And I had, I had athletes come back to me a decade later, say, you know, that thing that you said, or, or, you know, I read thinking Grow Rich, and it really made a big difference in my life, you know, so I got to start doing it back then. And then I was a fitness trainer, because really, that's something that I was really passionate about sharing. And, and then around mid 2000s 2007 2008, I got into direct sales, which was like building a sales team. And then, you know, network marketing, like you buy something, essentially, and then you teach other people, then you get someone else to buy it and teach them to sell it is essentially how that goes. And that was really where coaching started. And two big things happen there, I helped several people are in their first $1,000 as an entrepreneur, which was extremely rewarding, and maybe even more impactful. It was, I went to New Zealand, essentially, for a long weekend to bungee jump, because it was on my list of things to do, and to see a speaker. And you know, I was gone for five or six days, I came back with $5,000 more in my bank account than when I left, because the sale went through because you know, there was leverage in this business and the system I was in. And so it was like I was on vacation, and I made $5,000. And it was like, That's it, I'm hooked for the rest of my life. No matter what I have to work, it's just something they pay the bills until I figure this all out. You know, I was an entrepreneur for life after that. And so that's where I started. And then again, it took that that business eventually one of the partners joined Scientology, and unfortunately, that whole business went away. And I found myself depressed. I broke my foot in five places I gained 40 pounds. I didn't I didn't have the business identity. I didn't have the bodybuilder identity. I was lost. I literally just wanted to end my life fetal position for weeks.

Brandon Handley 22:56 Yeah, let's pause on that for a second. Let's pause on the idea that getting caught up in our identity being what it is that we do.

David Sandercott 23:06 Yeah. Well, that's a big mistake. I encourage nobody, I always say at the beginning of my medication classes, you are not your job, you are not your socio economic standings. You are not what you do for a living.

Brandon Handley 23:18 So I mean, I guess you're sitting on the couch or in a fetal position, and you've lost your kind of sense of identity is what it sounds like. How did you how did you recover from that?

David Sandercott 23:27 Yeah. Well, so I did two things. You know, I got on my knees I surrendered my life to God, I asked for guidance. And I listened and and that was my all means the number one thing and that's that that's what guided me, right. That's what pulled me. The second thing is equal importance that I stopped being a victim, I stopped blaming the outside world, you know, that was part about it is that I had so many opportunities in my life to be in such a better position than I was. And instead of taking responsibility for it, I was blaming it blaming society and blaming other people. I was like, if you notice, one of the biggest trophies in the world right now is who's the biggest victim? I assure you that that is not the game you want to play for happiness and success. You know, it was it was taking responsibility for my all of my, you know, mess ups and life situation current circumstances.

Brandon Handley 24:25 Yeah, I mean, that's huge, right? When you can kind of recognize and I'm just kind of taking a leap here. But you can kind of recognize that all of your success or failure is coming from within, and it has nothing to do with what's outside of you. And when you do that, there's so much ownership, right? There's so much empowerment that comes from that because now you can be like, Oh, yeah, that was me. It wasn't me over here too. And, you know, these failures were me. But some of these successes, right? So you know, everything you know, is both both sides of the coin. Um, that's that's fantastic. So You know, we don't have a whole lot of time here, unfortunately but what you know you've got a course coming up right? What is the course called? What are you going to be teaching? What's it called?

David Sandercott 25:10 Yet would you 19th is its prosper but prosper prosper virtual event I'll be teaching prosperity consciousness, helping spiritual entrepreneurs, coaches healer to create the mindset, the prosperity consciousness to have their first $10,000 month the first 10k month.

Brandon Handley 25:28 Nice. Nice. And we'll share the link to that but the link is what again?

David Sandercott 25:38 Ah. I actually bought a URL just for it. But it's like David Sandler comm forward slash brought I

Brandon Handley 25:45 think, yeah, well, yeah,

David Sandercott 25:47 that's right. You can if you go to david Sandler, God calm That's right. It's right there.

Brandon Handley 25:51 Yeah, Paul's Frodo calm? I'll be sure to share that out. Right. And then, you know, this I told you before, this is kinda like a spiritual speed dating court like, right? And and the deal is, is like, there's 30 minutes, right? That's all we've got this, you know, somebody's gonna come on, and they're gonna decide whether or not they spiritual want to date David J. Sandra. So it's not a lot of time. And so one of the questions I'll ask is, is this one of our speed dating questions be? What does? What does it mean to live in the present moment? bachelor number one? Yeah. What

David Sandercott 26:24 does it mean to live in the present moment? Well, it means that if you're living in the present moment, you're going to be happy, fulfilled, and at peace, you're going to be okay, with the way everything is, no matter what you're going to be living your life consciously. And that's what we're here to do is to evolve our consciousness and the best way to evolve your consciousness is to be more conscious. And if you're living in the moment, you're being conscious,

Brandon Handley 26:53 elaborate on what you mean by conscious.

David Sandercott 26:56 Well, being conscious of your consciousness, there's, there's that which can observe yourself think. And there's the brain that can think there's a subject and an object. So keep your attention on that part of yourself that can observe yourself thinking, and really go one step more and observe the observer observing. It's all a play of consciousness, we is all a field of consciousness and and we are that consciousness. So it's, it's coming to know yourself. It's being conscious of the consciousness, and of as yourself as the consciousness.

Brandon Handley 27:35 Dave took us on a level guys like this to another level. there's a there's a great feeling when you become the observer to absolutely yeah,

David Sandercott 27:45 I always go like this. You say, I want to go like, this is where you want to live life from like three feet three feet back, you know, above yourself.

Brandon Handley 27:52 Yeah. Yeah. Well, dude, thank you so much. Again, David, for popping on, always enjoyed the conversation, you both of them. And we'll be sure to share this out. Is there anything that maybe we didn't touch on that you want to share out with the audience today?

David Sandercott 28:07 One quick thing, the last question you asked me, I remember the first time we did got me a little bit and it was like, What do you wish for the world? And it was like, you know,

Unknown Speaker 28:15 I didn't like my answer. I

David Sandercott 28:16 thought about it a little bit and what I would world is the exact same thing that I wished for me, you know, happiness, peace, prosperity and abundance in all areas of your life.

Brandon Handley 28:27 Yeah, yeah. No, that's, that's, that's great. That's funny. You remember the question? And I think that this is the part where some people get a little confused in the love thy neighbor as thyself kind of thing. Right? This has gotten me I look at it in the very same way, you know, so what you wish upon your neighbor is really what you're wishing upon yourself. And just in the same token, you just said, hey, what I wish on the world, what I wish upon myself, and when you do that, we look at the universe is kind of this force multiplier. What we put out comes back to us, I mean, right, so yeah, great answer. Thanks. Thanks for thanks for thanks for sharing that. And I definitely appreciate you being on. Yeah, I

David Sandercott 29:09 love it. Thanks for having me, Brandon.

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