After the ABA’s 2016 study of mental health and substance use disorders among lawyers, it became well known that lawyers face particular challenges concerning addiction and wellbeing and that there were often barriers to recovery. Now, nearly 10 years later, where do we stand? Molly Ranns welcomes Patrick Krill, a lawyer, counselor, and researcher, to learn about his current research which will follow up on the 2016 ABA study. They discuss aspects of wellbeing that have improved in recent years and later dig into the areas where trends show continued struggle throughout the profession.  

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Patrick Krill is the founder of Krill Strategies, a behavioral health consulting firm exclusively for the legal profession.

With the explosion of AI products, apps, software integrations, and more., many attorneys have no small amount of nervousness about whether they should trust this technology and, if so, how to use it to their advantage. To discuss AI’s current place in legal work and its future potential, Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway welcome Sateesh Nori, legal innovation strategist and professor at NYU School of Law. They examine the many helpful uses for AI in everyday legal work, discuss AI in access to justice, and address the ethical and regulatory questions surrounding this technology. Later, Sateesh looks ahead to consider what legal professionals and law students should do to prepare themselves for a future with increasing AI use in the practice of law. 

Sateesh Nori is a lawyer, law professor, senior non-profit executive, legal strategist, and author of “Sheltered: Twenty Years in Housing Court”. 

The stresses and demands of a legal career take their toll on all attorneys, but women lawyers face the additional challenge of navigating menopause in the midst of their professional journey. After a difficult personal experience with menopause symptoms, attorney Mary Pate decided to leave legal practice to develop her expertise in health and wellness strategies for women facing similar struggles. JoAnn Hathaway and Molly Ranns talk with Mary to discuss common questions women have about menopause and practical tips for managing symptoms. And, for all you men out there, this topic is for you as well! Mary shares insights into how men can help women as they navigate this transitional time in their lives. 

Visit Mustard Seed Health Coaching to learn more about Mary and her personalized programs .

Mary Pate is a former attorney turned Certified Menopause Coaching Specialist dedicated to helping professional women manage disruptive menopause symptoms.

With TECHSHOW coming up on April 2-5, Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway welcome conference co-chairs Julie Bays and Stephen Embry to learn more about the offerings for 2025 attendees. TECHSHOW is unique amongst many legal tech conferences in that it is truly accessible for all legal professionals—from law students to solo attorneys to Big Law, and everything in between. Attendees with any level of technology expertise will find opportunities to gain fresh insights into leveraging tech to improve legal practice. They discuss the new location for the 2025 conference, share tips for new attendees, and preview notable topics, speakers, and events. 

Julie A. Bays is the practice management advisor of the Oklahoma Bar Association.

Stephen Embry is an attorney and publisher of TechLaw Crossroads, a blog devoted to the practical issues of law, innovation, and technology. 

Lawyers, amongst other “safety-sensitive” professionals like doctors, police officers, etc., aren’t allowed to have a bad day at work. If you aren’t doing your best, someone could get hurt, and the weight of that responsibility can lead to mental health or wellness issues when attorneys, judges, or law students don’t have the support they need. Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway welcome Tom Grden to the podcast to discuss the many resources available to legal professionals through Lawyers & Judges Assistance Programs. There is confidential help available for anxiety, depression, substance abuse, and more. Tom also shares a variety of simple coping skills for managing daily stressors. 

Learn more at: Michigan - Lawyers & Judges Assistance Program

Tom Grden is Clinical Case Manager for the State Bar of Michigan’s Lawyers & Judges Assistance Program.

Our country has become increasingly diverse, but the legal profession often does not reflect the diversity of the communities they serve. Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway welcome Gregory Conyers to learn about his efforts toward increased diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) in firms, law schools, and all aspects of the profession. Greg explains challenges that inhibit diversity, both past and present, and talks about resources and tools for increasing awareness and support for healthy workplace cultures that advance DEI goals. 

Gregory Conyers is Director of Diversity at the State Bar of Michigan.

Using positive psychology tailored to the unique needs of lawyers and law students, attorney Jordana Confino helps others in the profession improve their wellbeing and thrive in legal practice. JoAnn Hathaway and Molly Ranns talk with Jordana about her methods for cultivating a healthy self-care mindset amidst the pressures and stresses of legal work. They discuss the practice of identifying and prioritizing your core values, reining in perfectionism, and practicing self-compassion.

Mentioned in this Episode:

Chronicles of a Recovering Type A+ Perfectionist Blog — Jordana Confino

Jordana Confino is an attorney, professional coach, and founder of JC Coaching & Consulting.

What’s next for Rule 21? After a year of progress, JoAnn Hathaway and Molly Ranns welcome April Alleman back to the podcast to learn about the updates for important elements of Michigan’s succession planning requirements. Planning for the future of your legal practice is essential for all attorneys. April gives an overview of the processes pertaining to Rule 21 and the Interim Administrator Program and what attorneys should do to ensure compliance. 

For more detailed information on Rule 21, listen to previous SBM podcast episode: Rule 21: Law Practice Succession Planning on Legal Talk Network.

April Alleman is Succession Planning Program Counsel at the State Bar of Michigan.

Between forty and seventy percent of all malpractice claims and disciplinary proceedings are directly related to untreated mental health or substance abuse issues. Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway discuss the intersection of wellbeing and professionalism/civility rules with Joan Vestrand and Tim Lessing. Wellness is necessary to a lawyer’s ability to conduct themselves professionally, but things may break down if wellness is compromised. They discuss the inherently adversarial system lawyers work within and outline strategies for mindset shifts that allow attorneys to live and practice law in ways that positively support mental health and wellbeing.  

Joan Vestrand is Dean of Students and Professor of Law at Thomas M. Cooley Law School.

Tim Lessing is principle at Lessing Law, PLLC, where he specializes almost exclusively in trial/litigation practice in both civil and criminal law.

Is AI coming for your job as an attorney? Ben Schorr of Microsoft has the short answer—no! But, AI can come alongside you to help you do your work even better. Molly Ranns and JoAnn Hathaway talk with Ben about ways lawyers can implement Microsoft Copilot in legal practice. From first drafts of documents, to brainstorming, to research help, and more, Copilot has much to offer in the daily lives of legal professionals. Ben also outlines common mistakes lawyers make when employing AI tools and explains how to effectively and ethically integrate Copilot into your practice. 

Ben M. Schorr is a Senior Content Developer at Microsoft.