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Episode 254: In this episode I am joined by Adam Kohlbeck and Chris Passey to talk about the messy, human reality of deputy headship and the work they are doing and their forthcoming book. We dig into why the move from classroom teacher to senior leader can feel like a shock to the system, what it means to hold decency and high standards together, and how deputies can build cultures where staff and students actually thrive rather than simply survive policy changes and external pressures.

Across the conversation we explore:

The origin story of why Adam and Chris wanted a more nuanced, less binary space to talk about leadership The mindset shift from “my class, my room” to “our school, our culture”. How deputy heads can lead through relationships without becoming everyone’s fixer or emotional sponge. The role of vulnerability, boundaries and “being yourself” in leadership, rather than performing a caricature of a deputy head. Working with tricky dynamics, including resistant headteachers and complex teams, without losing your sense of purpose. What they hope readers will take from their book, including the idea of deputy headship as a long, evolving craft rather than a short stop on the way to headship

If you are a deputy head, assistant head, aspiring leader or simply someone who cares about the culture of schools, this is a wide ranging, honest conversation about leadership, relationships and staying decent in the middle of it all.