The Black List Podcast

Happy Independence Day. Spike Lee joined Franklin and Kate to talk about narrative filmmaking, his longtime collaborators, and the movement for Black lives. From Do the Right Thing, to Malcolm X, to Bamboozled, to his ilm for Netflix, Da 5 Bloods, the trio talks about how culture talks to movies, and how movies talk back to the culture.

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This episode first aired in mid-2020. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Mentions: 

+Do The Right Thing: rottentomatoes.com/m/do_the_right_thing

+Malcom X: rottentomatoes.com/m/1042135-malcolm_x

+Bamboozled: rottentomatoes.com/m/bamboozled

+Da 5 Bloods: netflix.com/title/81045635

Emmy winner and two-time Oscar nominee Kirby Dick joins Kate and Franklin for a riveting conversation about the role of investigative journalism in film and the responsibility of storytellers to speak truth to power. The acclaimed director, known for his groundbreaking work exposing abuse and institutional cover-ups, discusses the #MeToo movement, his HBO Max documentary On the Record (co-directed by Amy Ziering), and why he “doesn’t love movies”—at least not in the conventional sense. From navigating social issues to challenging powerful institutions, Kirby unpacks the ethics, impact, and urgency behind his change-making work.

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation took place in 2021. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Maybe you love Adaptation, or Synechdoche, or Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind.The prolific screenwriter Charlie Kaufman discusses some of the diverse and notable projects of his career, starting with his early days as a staff writer for shows like Get A Life, and The Dana Carvey Show. He also recounts the unbelievable, and ultimately life-changing story of his screenplay for Being John Malkovich, a film that nobody initially wanted to make. Franklin and Kate dive with Charlie into the continued fan love for Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind (for which Kaufman won a writing Oscar), the reactions they all have to Adaptation, and wrap up with a discussion of the Jessie Buckley/Jesse Plemons film I'm Thinking of Ending Things, and so much more. 

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation took place during 2020. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Mentions: 

• I’m Thinking of Ending Things: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/im_thinking_of_ending_things 
• Get A Life: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/get_a_life  
• Being John Malkovich: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/being_john_malkovich 
• Eternal Sunshine of the Spotless Mind: https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/eternal_sunshine_of_the_spotless_mind 
• Antkind: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/546823/antkind-by-charlie-kaufman/ 

When cultural tastemakers get stuck inside what do they watch, read, or play? In this throwback episode that has since become a classic, Franklin and Kate talk to each other about the things they discovered or rediscovered during lockdown. From Animal Crossing and Sarah Cooper, to Ted Lasso and Michaela Coel's I May Destroy You, you'll have some new gems to add to your list. See the show notes for more details! 

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This convo took place in 2020. Learn more about The Black List, visit ⁠www.blcklst.com.⁠

Mentions: 

• Animal Crossing: ⁠https://animal-crossing.com⁠ 
• 40-Year-Old Version: ⁠https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/the_forty_year_old_version⁠ 
• Radha Blank on The Black List Podcast: ⁠https://luminarypodcasts.com/listen/ninth-planet-audio-&-the-black-list/the-black-list-podcast/radha-blank/d6c5b3d7-5e87-4aa1-92d1-aabacbe918b8⁠ 
• Inside Out by Demi Moore: ⁠https://www.harpercollins.com/products/inside-out-demi-moore?variant=32131129442338⁠ 
• It by Stephen King: ⁠https://www.goodreads.com/book/show/830502.It⁠ 
• Caste by Isabel Wilkerson: ⁠https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/653196/caste-oprahs-book-club-by-isabel-wilkerson/⁠ 
• Sarah Cooper: ⁠https://sarahcpr.com⁠ 
• Ted Lasso: ⁠https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/ted_lasso⁠ 
• I May Destroy You: ⁠https://www.rottentomatoes.com/tv/i_may_destroy_you⁠ 
• You Must Remember This Podcast: ⁠http://www.youmustrememberthispodcast.com⁠
• Karina Longworth on The Black List Podcast: ⁠https://luminarypodcasts.com/listen/ninth-planet-audio-&-the-black-list/the-black-list-podcast/karina-longworth/ccc9d152-7947-48dc-bab8-871300e0c72a⁠ .

Actor and director Jay Ellis joins Kate and Franklin for some real talk. Jay opens up about starring in Top Gun: Maverick and how becoming a father has shifted his perspective on life and work. He also reflects on his iconic role as Lawrence in Insecure—including some truly wild fan encounters—and takes us behind the scenes of his directorial debut on the show. The trio covers career milestones, Mel Brooks, and the magic of storytelling. Plus, in one of the most unexpected turns, Jay shares how Spaceballs (yes, Spaceballs) first made him fall in love with acting.

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This episode was originally published in 2020, behind a paywall. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com. 

Mentions:

+Insecure: https://www.hbo.com/insecure 

+Top Gun: https://shadowandact.com/new-top-gun-maverick-trailer-shows-at-jay-ellis-in-tom-cruise-sequel 

Jeremy O. Harris joins Kate and Franklin to talk about eliciting polarized audience reactions to Slave Play, describes his co-writing process with Janicza Bravo on Zola and talks about accessing the fascinating intersections of high and low culture, and so much more. 

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation took place in 2020. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Mentions: 

+Slave Play: http://slaveplaybroadway.com

+Zola: http://rottentomatoes.com/m/zola

Academy award winning writer and director Lee Isaac Chung joins Kate and Franklin to talk about the trip to Rwanda that changed his filmmaking trajectory, his deep admiration for Charlie Chaplin and Wong Kar-wai, the making of his irresisitable Minari, and so much more. 

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation took place in 2020 To learn more about The Black List, visit ⁠www.blcklst.com.⁠

Mentions: 

• Minari: ⁠https://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/minari⁠ 

A very special encore. Kate talks to Barbara Crampton, BJ Colangelo, and Gigi Saul Gurerro about their lives in the horror community, what they're working on, what types of stories they'd like to see told about women in horror, and so much more.

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation is from 2020. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Mentions: 

• Barbara Crampton: https://twitter.com/barbaracrampton 
• BJ Colangelo: https://twitter.com/bjcolangelo 
• Gigi Saul Gurerro: https://twitter.com/HorrorGuerrero 

Introducing Vanessa Van Edwards: Stop Overthinking Every Social Interaction! (Use THESE Cues to Be Liked, Respected, and Build Confidence in Every Conversation) from On Purpose with Jay Shetty.

Follow the show: On Purpose with Jay Shetty

What usually holds you back from starting a conversation?

Can you remember a time you avoided someone out of fear of saying the wrong thing?

Jay sits down with behavioral researcher and bestselling author Vanessa Van Edwards for a powerful conversation that blends science, honesty, and so many surprising moments. Vanessa, who refers to herself as a “recovering awkward person,” shares how her biggest social struggles became the driving force behind her mission to crack the code on human connection.

Together, Jay and Vanessa dive into the fascinating world of charisma, exploring the 97 cues, from eye contact to tone of voice, that quietly shape how we’re seen and understood. Vanessa breaks down why so many of us feel overlooked or underestimated—and introduces “signal amplification bias,” a concept that explains why the signals you think you’re sending might not be landing the way you expect. Vanessa shows us how confidence isn’t always something you’re born with but something you can build, with intention and awareness.

The conversation goes even deeper as they unpack the tricky balance between warmth and competence, especially for women in the workplace, and how vulnerability isn’t a weakness, but often your greatest strength. They explore how to create those magic “me too” moments that form instant connections, spot the hidden red flags in communication, and let go of the need to be liked by everyone in order to be truly seen by the right people.

In this interview, you'll learn:

How to Make a Great First Impression Without Saying a Word

How to Break the Ice with a Simple “Hey”

How to Balance Warmth and Competence in Any Conversation

How to Create Connection Using “Me Too” Moments

How to Exit a Conversation Gracefully (Without Offending Anyone)

How to Spot a Liar Using Body Language and Micro-Expressions

How to Ask Better Questions That Spark Real Conversations

How to Recognize the Difference Between Charisma and Manipulation

Whether you struggle with social anxiety, want to level up your leadership presence, or are just tired of surface-level small talk, this episode is packed with practical tools and uplifting wisdom to help you connect with more authenticity and power.

With Love and Gratitude,

Jay Shetty

Join over 750,000 people to receive my most transformative wisdom directly in your inbox every single week with my free newsletter. Subscribe here.  

Join Jay for his first ever, On Purpose Live Tour! Tickets are on sale now. Hope to see you there!  

What We Discuss:

00:00 Intro

00:51 From Awkward to Empowered: Overcoming Social Anxiety

02:43 How Do You Really Want People to See You?

06:44 Why Aren’t Your First Impressions Landing?

10:01 Why They’re Not Getting Your Signals (And What to Do About It)

13:33 Want to Be More Attractive? Try Being More Available

15:40 One Simple “Hey” That Can Spark a New Connection

19:16 Your Vibe Teaches People How to Treat You

22:06 Speak with Power: Unlock Your Full Vocal Power

23:47 3 Conversation Starters That Actually Work

29:49 Making Friends Doesn’t Have to Be Hard

31:17 Why Compliments Alone Don’t Build Connection

33:30 Break the Ice Without Sounding Like Everyone Else

38:36 Stop Trying to Be Interesting, Do This Instead

40:48 The Art of a Smooth and Respectful Exit

44:32 Use These Nonverbal Cues to Steer the Conversation

47:41 Spot Inauthentic Behavior Before It Costs You

54:28 Why People-Pleasing Feels Safer But Actually Holds You Back

57:48 How to Tell If Someone’s Lying (Without Saying a Word)

01:00:04 When Narcissists Feel Like the Most Charismatic People

01:03:46 Want to Really Get to Know Someone? Take a Road Trip

01:04:45 How Dopamine Makes You More Memorable

01:08:23 Every Answer Can Be a Gateway to Connection

01:10:51 How Asking Better Questions Inspires Growth

01:13:10 Discover Your Social Battery: Introvert, Extrovert, or Ambivert?

01:15:10 You Might Be an Ambivert and That’s a Superpower

01:19:07 The Two Ways Friendships Evolve Over Time

01:22:30 Choose Friends Who Inspire Awe

01:25:20 The Double Standard Faced by Highly Competent Women

01:33:09 Before You Make That Connection, Ask Yourself This 

01:34:34 Life’s Too Short for Shallow Connections, Find Your People

01:36:29 Vanessa on Final Five

Episode Resources:

Vanessa Van Edwards | Website

Vanessa Van Edwards | Instagram

Vanessa Van Edwards | X

Vanessa Van Edwards | YouTube

Vanessa Van Edwards | TikTok

Vanessa Van Edwards | Facebook

Vanessa Van Edwards | LinkedIn

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

DISCLAIMER: Please note, this is an independent podcast episode not affiliated with, endorsed by, or produced in conjunction with the host podcast feed or any of its media entities. The views and opinions expressed in this episode are solely those of the creators and guests. For any concerns, please reach out to [email protected].

Encore episode with award-winning journalist Soledad O'Brien. She joins Franklin for a conversation about growing up Black, her approach to documentary filmmaking, the state of journalism in the Trump era, and so much more.

Questions? Comments? Criticism? Hit us up on social media at @theblcklst.

This conversation was recorded in 2020. To learn more about The Black List, visit www.blcklst.com.

Mentions:

+New York Times, Soledad O'Brien: A Me Too Movement for Journalists of Color, www.nytimes.com/2020/07/04/opinion/soledad-obrien-racism-journalism.html

+Black in America: http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/in.america/black.in.america/

+Latino in America: http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2009/latino.in.america/