The Circuit of Success Podcast with Brett Gilliland

Helen Appleby is a British New York-based Women’s Leadership Expert who has helped hundreds of women step into their power and write their own rules for success while also helping hundreds of men understand how to best support those women. Having seen firsthand the experiences women disproportionately face in their careers, Helen created the “unwritten rules” to empower women with tools to write their own rules, navigate their versions of success and achieve their potential. She is a fantastic shopper, an average yogi, and a terrible cook.

Pete Holman is a man of many talents. With 5 inventions under his belt, and one more on the way, Holman’s entrepreneurial skills have served him for decades. As a founder, creator, coach, and now author, Holman has proven to be a successful pathmaker in the world of athleticism and invention. Selected as 2022 IDEA Fitness Leader of the Year, Holman’s career, life path, and passions are all explored on the newest episode of The Circuit of Success with Brett Gilliland.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION

Brett Gilliland  00:01

Welcome to the Circuit of Success. I am your host, Brett Gilliland and today I’ve got Pete Holman with me, Pete, what’s up, man? How you doing?

Pete Holman  00:08

Fantastic.

Brett Gilliland  00:09

Love it. We’re gonna have some good conversations today. Man, you’re coming to us from Aspen, Colorado. How is Aspen treating you today?

Pete Holman  00:17

It is one of those days. So it’s 74 degrees 10% humidity, like clouds. I just had lunch with a buddy that I hadn’t seen in a long time. We’re at the park and there’s ducks floating on the pond. I mean, it just, it’s magical up here. I’m kind of high right now. So you got me at a good time, buddy.

Brett Gilliland  00:36

That’s awesome. I love it. Kind of high right now. And in Colorado, that may mean different things to different people.

Pete Holman  00:43

I well, I’m high on life.

Brett Gilliland  00:47

That’s funny. Well, man, you are a I wrote down here entrepreneur, a founder, a creator, a coach and educator, an author now, man, you got a lot of good stuff going on. And we were connected by a little deal that you just created called Golf Forever. And I think before we started talking, I was telling you that I get this accountability group. And one of my goals with it is to golf well into my 90s. And golf on my 100th birthday. When you type in Golf Forever on Google, this thing shows up and then you guys do a great job and the ads show up on Instagram. And then I ended up buying it right. And so now we’re on a podcast together because I’m a believer.

Pete Holman  01:25

Hey, so my funnels are working is what you’re saying?

Brett Gilliland  01:28

That’s exactly what I’m saying, Man, because you literally I typed in golf forever like workouts thinking I would find like, Hey, do these 10 things. And then I didn’t know there was a product. And then once you click on it, and then your funnels work, and that’s something about business and sales that we could obviously talk about as well.

Pete Holman  01:43

Fantastic. Well, so the founder of the company is Dr. Jeremy James. He’s a chiropractor up in Aspen. And he worked with golfers for years. And he just kept finding out that they were broken down their back their low backs, their shoulders, their hips weren’t mobile, the thoracic spine wasn’t mobile. And he it almost pissed them off to the point he said, I’m creating a program for this. And he ended up getting some funding. And it came became known as back back forever, meaning healthy backs. But then he realized that golfers are in specific need of this. And they you know, they tend to have a higher disposable income than just your average folks. And so they’re going to be more apt to, and they love playing golf. So I came along and he said, “Can you provide some content because I’m a strength coach and physical therapist,” I started creating content, I created a product called the TRX Rip Trainer, which is an asymmetrical bar training device. It’s great for all sports. And TRX, you know, they did some good things with it. They also did not iterate it over a decade. And that upset me because products need to evolve and right. Dr. Dr. James said, “hey, could we get an affiliate membership with TRX for the RIP trainer because it’s great for golf.” And I said “we should make our own and do it better.” And I was joking. I was completely being facetious. And he just glommed on to that. And the next thing you know a year later, we’ve got the Golf Forever Swing Trainer. It’s the world’s first two in one training device for for overspeed training, there’s a weighted ball on one end that you can load up and almost like a donut on the end of the bat. If you’ve ever swung a baseball bat in the batter’s cage and you get that kind of that heavy load and you take the donut off and then when you go to swing, you move like you know, Barry Bonds or somebody. And then if you take the ball off, there’s an elastic resistance cord on one end, that creates a symmetrical load and balance challenges and activates your core and helps you with rotational power. So that’s the Golf Forever Swing Trainer and it’s got an app that takes you through all the workouts and you find folks like myself, top top notch strength coaches from around the world and top notch golf pros from around the world like Scottie Scheffler and Justin Leonard. And I’m really excited. We just got a review. We’ve got over 1000 reviews, we got to 4.9 stars out of five, which is kind of unheard of.

Brett Gilliland  04:11

Right. It’s incredible man because it’s certainly I wanted to get on here to learn about your story and all that stuff. And but I definitely want to talk about golf forever because just this week, I think before we started recording, I told you I’ve seen videos posted by Max Homa. He just won the tournament. And like the next day was using it and put it on social media. Scotty Scheffler got it on social media. There’s a picture of Jordan Spaeth carrying it in his hand while he’s going to the golf tournament and he’s shown his baby off to like Trevor immelman and some people and so you got it in the right hands, man. And so then you just say me and my buddies back here and you know in O’Fallon, Illinois are using I mean, what else do you need?

Pete Holman  04:48

It’s fantastic and you know, really what it’s designed it’s great that the pros are using it don’t get me wrong and that’s a real you know, ego biscuit, but the fact that just kind of your your weekend warriors in your everyday Joe’s, I’m not calling you an everyday Joe. But but you know, I’m saying like not professional golfers. Those are the folks that that they haven’t stretched out for three, four weeks, they haven’t done core exercises, and then they’re gonna go to the driving range and crack balls with their driver. And the next thing you know, their back goes out and they’re at the chiropractor for the next five weeks. So we’re trying to break this cycle, we’re trying to get people involved in their own health and wellness and vitality, not just so they can feel good about themselves and feel better in their own skin. But so they can golf forever.

Brett Gilliland  05:34

Yeah. And obviously, you can take a spin on that and call it just live better forever, right? I mean, this thing is going to like I was telling my kids or soccer players, I mean, like, even though you’re not, you know, swinging a golf club, you are swinging with your hips and your legs and all that stuff. And just if you want to be more flexible in life later, which is I know a lot of people listen to this show, they obviously care about their health, they care about their business, their family, all that stuff. And so this is important for them to know that it’s out there.

Pete Holman  05:59

100% our, you know, the last couple of years has proven categorically that if you don’t take care of your health, and if you don’t watch your your, your fitness levels, and your dietary intake and, and your mobility, just all the stuff that we need to do to be strong and face everyday challenges, you’re going to be in trouble. And, you know, we saw that, you know, the statistics don’t lie. I think it was like 80 some percent of folks that died of COVID were obese, were diabetic, had congestive heart failure, had some kind of multi faceted dysfunction, pathology that led to and I know there was some, you know, there’s outliers that just were totally healthy and had a rough time with COVID. But, you know, man, you got to prepare yourself.

Brett Gilliland  06:49

Yeah, absolutely. So let’s, let’s kind of go back to the beginning then and talk about what made you this entrepreneur and founder and creator and coach and because you don’t just wake up and start creating new products that are taking the world by storm. So what is it about you kind of your backstory that’s gotten you to do this type of stuff?

Pete Holman  07:06

Well, I mean, I got in the fitness industry, I was always very athletic. I mean, I wanted to be professional athlete. I just didn’t know what sports so I, you know, I was really good at soccer, and I played competitive soccer. And then I kind of had a weird growth spurt, and I was uncoordinated. And I played baseball, and I played football and basketball and lacrosse. I was out in Denver playing lacrosse, and I grew up skiing. I thought I was gonna be a professional ski racer. And long story short, it wasn’t until I was like 19 or 20 that I really developed. I was very late developing in high school. I graduated when I was 17. And so just my high school sporting career wasn’t that great. And then I fell in love with martial arts and I, I started training in Taekwondo. I was at health club, I was working maintenance at a health club. And they had a taekwondo class. And I was it was like a Chinese kung fu movie. I’m like mopping the the racquetball court across from weather training in the tech window. And one day, the coach finally just literally walked across the hall and said, “Why don’t you put the mop down and come train with us?” And that was the start of my taekwondo career. And five years later, I was on the US national team, I was the team captain, I was traveling all all over the world competing at a very high level in Taekwondo. And, and that led into my career, which I always wanted to be the fastest, most powerful, the most well conditioned athlete on the mats. And so I started training in personal training, I started wanting to understand the human body and exercise physiology and anatomy and kinesiology. And so I got a personal training certification. Then I was constantly injured, which led me into physical therapy, wanting to learn how to rehabilitate myself. And so I got my master’s degree in physical therapy. And I started to realize that if there’s a problem in your life, if you search hard enough, and you’re inquisitive and creative, there’s a solution. And so I got this chronic product bug in and when I was working in my first physical therapy clinic, and we had all these medicine balls and BOSU balls and elastic resistance cords that were strewn all over the room, and a segment there’s gotta be a rack or something that contains all this stuff. So it can be organized so you can find it efficiently and effectively. And I searched on Google, there’s nothing around. And so I said, I’m gonna make my own and I literally went down to a fabricator in Carbondale, which is a kind of a suburb of Aspen. And I had something machined up, and I brought it into the clinic and people were blown away, they’re like, oh, my gosh, I can find my Bosu ball, I can find the medicine balls and it was organized and, and so then I thought I would be an entrepreneur which I you know, I’ve got no business background at all. And I launched this thing in 2009, which was the worst possible time, you know, for folks that are old enough. You guys remember 2008-2009 economy collapsed real estate, you know, junk loans and everything collapsed steel prices went up, gas prices went up. And my product was so expensive to create that I kind of walked away with my tail between my legs. However, I got experience and I got knowledge about products. And I haven’t stopped since I’m now on my sixth product. I’ve done a loaded carry machine for grip Pippins core strength, I’ve done a hip thrust to plate loaded hip thrust machine called the Novice Glute Drive, which is for posterior chain glute strength. I’ve done a TRX rip trainer now the Golf Forever swing trainer for golf training. And, and I’m working on one that’s very exciting for in home and commercial glute training. The glutes are the powerhouse of the core if you haven’t gotten that theme. Yeah, got to train your glutes.

Brett Gilliland  10:52

We’ll have to get on that. So what let’s talk about that for a second by training your glutes, but just go for on anything anybody apart, but even just habits rituals, take the 40 something year old, rather the 35 year old, a 55 year old whatever it may be, let’s just pick on the 40 year olds, just because I’m 44 years old. So that’s what we’re gonna do. But what what is it that the weekend warrior, the average Joe that use your language from earlier? What is the things that we need to be doing that, you know, they don’t have the luxury, or the habit builds or the desire to go to a gym for you know, an hour to an hour and a half every single day five to seven days a week. But you know, they’re doing something three or four days a week? What should we be focused on as business leaders of our leaders of our family and leaders of our business? So we can be in peak performance? Or peak health?

Pete Holman  11:39

Yeah, I mean, first of all, if you’re not doing something to keep your physical vessel charged up, you’re missing the boat. Even the great you know, Tony Robbins, who’s kind of the CEO whisperer and an incredible if you’ve never, you know, some people think of Tony Robbins as this kind of, you know, flamboyant salesman and motivational speaker. And I know that he’s got a history. But if you look at his story and what he’s done and what he’s accomplished, he’s quite a remarkable guy. And what he does, before he even lectures and goes out to present, he gets on a committee tram that does lymphatic drainage and bounces up and down and he does push ups and sit ups. And he gets his body charged up. He’s a black belt in karate, I believe. So high end business leaders need to focus on number one their own physical health, if you don’t have the vitality and the energy of bring it every single day. How are you going to? How are you going to lead a team? How are you going to make seven figures? How are you going to expand and evolve and grow your business into something better if you don’t have that energy and that vitality, and that comes from daily physical exercise. I don’t care if you take a walk every day for half an hour, get out in nature, just get your heart rate up a little bit. Ideally, you’re doing something that’s geared towards Holistic Health, meaning Hey, you’re eating healthy, nutritious meals, you’re getting in some flexibility, mobility work, if you’re a golfer, I don’t need to tell you how important it is to have flexibility and mobility in the hips in the thoracic spine, you need to do some kind of core strengthening exercise, as I think 85% of people that are in their 40s have had one episode of serious low back pain that has caused them to go to the doctor, orthopedic doctor, chiropractor or physical therapist. So you got to do something for your core strength. You got to do something for your heart and lungs. Your vascular system is everything that delivers blood and oxygen to your muscles into your organs into your brain. So you got to do something that raises your heart rate. So whether it’s a bike or a rower, or a skier gunner, or maybe just calisthenics. And then finally, you want your you know, your lower and upper body to be strong. You don’t want low bone mineral density, you don’t want osteopenia or osteoporosis, which I’m dealing with a lot of seventy year olds and Aspen now that are they’re getting reports. They’re very much into their health when you got disposable income, and you got time on your hands all of a sudden, what do you focus on? Health. And the problem is they’re going to these, the Mayo Clinic or Santa Monica wherever they go to get these workups total body workups and they’re finding that they’re osteopenic or osteoporotic. Well, it’s some it’s not I’m not saying it’s too late, but you don’t want to be seven years years old and be told that you’re osteoporotic, you want to be 40 and start doing some strength training. When you do resistance training, it strengthens your bones and your connective tissue. So it sounds like a lot but really, it’s not that much, you know, 20-30 minutes a day, four or five times a week you’re gonna be in great shape. If you want to take it to the next level if you really want to be competitive on the golf course. Or if you want to play tennis at a high level if you want to ski the Alps or whatever it is you want to do. You might need to up your game and add some agility drills in there some balanced training as you age. So, I mean I look at, I train everybody like they’re an athlete. And Bilbao Roman said this best if you have a body you are an athlete, meaning everybody’s an athlete. So you need to train some mobility, some strength, some cardio respiratory system response, you need to have some balance and you need to have some overall conditioning. And again, it sounds like a lot but if you don’t take care of your body, where are you going to live?

Brett Gilliland  15:30

Yeah, so let’s break this down if we can, I think it’d be fun to do for people’s I’m a big fan of just the meat and potatoes right? There’s somebody can walk away from this this episode of The Circuit of Success and have a plan right? I mean, how cool would that be if Pete Holman and Brett Gilliland can give that person listening a plan? So let’s do this in a perfect week? It’s Monday. Okay, we’re gonna walk through Monday. So what are we doing Monday? What am I doing?

Pete Holman  15:54

I, now let’s assume that folks don’t have a lot of gear and a lot of equipment.

Brett Gilliland  15:59

Okay, perfect.

Pete Holman  16:00

Okay. Because I don’t know what folks have. I would love to see somebody do a five to 10 minute warm up of any kind of it could be jumping jacks, it could be a brisk walk around your block. It could be anything to get your heart rate, you know, jogging in place, anything to get your heart rate up that primes the central nervous system, it gets your body ready for more aggressive exercise. So there’s a warm up. The next thing I’d like to see, as people do a couple basic stretches, if you don’t know what the world’s greatest stretches, Google it is a stretch will come up which will stretch your hips, it will stretch your upper body, it will stretch your thoracic spine. It’s called “the world’s greatest stretch.” So you just in one stretch, well actually Can I can I add two? Let me give you one.

Brett Gilliland  16:04

This is our plan man.

Pete Holman  16:25

Okay you got the world’s greatest stretch, and you got the downward dog. That’s a yoga pose that everybody that’s done yoga has done the downward dog, especially for men, we tend to get very tight and what’s called the posterior chain, the calf’s the ankles, the hamstrings, and this downward dog addresses that and it starts to build some core strength. Alright, so we got to warm up, we got some core strength. Now, or I’m sorry, we got some flexibility. Now I would like to add a core strengthening exercise. And I would like to see some type of a side plank, maybe 30 seconds on each side, and some type of a front plank, maybe a minute, that’s going to help help activate your core, it’s going to strengthen your spine. Okay, so now we’re warmed up, we’re flexible, we’re mobile, we got the core activated. Now we got to do some exercise and work the body. I love three basic moves, a push a pole, and some kind of change in elevation. So we’ll start with the easy one the change in elevation, you can do a squat 20 squats. Simple, right, maybe you want to add a little balance challenge, you split your stance and do lunges, you know the left legs forward, the right legs back, you go up and down 10 times you switch sides 10 times, if you want to get stronger and build more condition you do you add multiple sets to this kind of given the basic basic basic, do some kind of squat or lunge in your workout, you should also do some kind of pushing exercise in your workout. So maybe it’s a push up or a modified push up. You know, if you’re not strong enough to do a full push up, you could go on your knees. If you’re still not strong enough, you could get up on a countertop. And so you’re kind of just at a slight angle, right, and you’re doing a pushup off your off your kitchen countertop, or off of a chair so it’s easier. So you’re strengthening the chest, the shoulders and the triceps. Those are important muscles, then you should do some kind of a pull. Now pulling is a little bit harder, because typically you need an elastic resistance cord, or a TRX Suspension Trainer strap or a pull up bar. Now most people aren’t strong enough to do pull ups, but there should be some kind of a pulling motion. One thing you could also do would be if you have dumbbells is a one arm dumbbell row, which is where you get horizontal and you’re dropping the weight towards the floor and then driving your elbow up towards the ceiling. So now and you know if you want to finish off with some kind of a balanced drill, which I think balance is very important in life, not just philosophically, but for our physiology. You stand on one leg and you lift the other knee up to 90 degrees, and you try to balance for 30 seconds to a minute. It’s a great exercise. I use it with all my clients.

Brett Gilliland  19:36

Yeah, I was gonna add to that we’ve been doing that and that Tuesday, Thursday, I’ve been having a group of guys over from an accountability standpoint, and it’s so simple but yet we’ve been doing that and then you stand there and then shut your eyes. Oh, we laugh man every morning. It’s like It’s like something just pushes you over. And so I think what I’ve read I don’t know if this is true or not. I’m not a doctor. But I mean that’s going to help the cognitive side too. Right? If I’m having to focus on multiple things standing there my oh arms out one leg up, my eyes are shut trying to keep my balance. It’s extremely difficult.

Pete Holman  20:05

Yeah, well, actually, so there’s three components to balance. One is your visual system. And that’s why if you ever watch a high level athlete and you look at their eyes, I mean, they’re locked in on on targets on a boxer, their eyes are wide open, they’re trying to respond and in milliseconds, so your eyes are very important to balance, your proprioception, which are sensory cells in your, in your muscles and in your joints. And you know, those get deteriorated with age and injury. And those are important. And then finally, your tympanic membrane, which is part of your inner ear. So if you have you’ve ever heard of vertigo, or suffered from vertigo, it’s a terrible in your ear dysfunction, where you feel almost like you’re really drunk and you can’t, the room won’t stop spinning. So when whenever you challenge different parts of those systems, you help improve your overall balance by closing your eyes. Now you’re honing in on the appropriate sectors and your inner ear. So that’s a great practice to do that. And then obviously, yeah, you cognitively up to kind of go take a deep breath and up your game because otherwise, you know, if you enter that drill nonchalantly, you’re gonna fail.

Brett Gilliland  21:13

Yeah, yeah. That’s awesome. All right. So we got our Monday done. Now, what are we doing Tuesday?

Pete Holman  21:20

Well, to be honest, so there’s variations of all these drills. So for instance, maybe Monday, you did squats, maybe on to Tuesday or Wednesday, let’s call it you want to do the split squat or the lunge. Maybe you did a push up with your bodyweight on Monday, maybe on Wednesday, let’s call it you want to do some dumbbell presses. You know, a lot of folks have free weight, dumbbells press. You know, maybe you did a normal plank on Monday, maybe on Tuesday, you want to do what’s called a shoulder tap plank, where you’re in a push up position, and one hand reaches across and taps the opposite shoulder, you pause for two or three seconds. So you’re on like a tripod, right two legs didn’t want to, and then you put the opposite arm down in touch with the opposite shoulder. And so now you’re you’re entering into some some rotational stresses in that plank position. So just varying these drills, but we only really have six or seven foundational movements, we can push, we can pull, we can squat, we can lunge, we can rotate, we can hinge which is if you’ve ever seen a deadlift, or let’s say you had a really heavy box, and you’re trying to lower it to the ground, you don’t want to round your back, right? You want to kind of hinge from your hips, like like the Australian drinking bird, you know if you’ve ever seen, yeah, everybody gets that reference. I love it. So, so you know, you want to do those basic movements in your workouts. And you can use free weights, you can use elastic resistance, you can use, you know, pneumatic resistance, there’s tons of different you can use stability balls, you can use yoga, Pilates reformers, you know, yoga machines, but it’s some point you’re doing all those basic moves.

Brett Gilliland  23:05

Yeah. So basically, what I’m hearing is a Monday through Friday plan is the five to 10 minute warm up, stretch, which if you just did two, it’s the world’s greatest stretch and the downward dog planks on each side, and then a normal one, variances there. And then the push, pull, and then change in elevation. I did that every day, right? 20, 30, 40 minutes a day, I’m in peak performance.

Pete Holman  23:27

Yeah. And basically, the way you want to look at it is if you did a mild workout, you could do it every day, if you really went gung ho to the point, let’s say, instead of doing one set of 20 squats, you did four or five sets of 20 squats, and the next day, you’re gonna be sore, and you’re gonna be fatigued. And you might be a little cranky, your body might be a little cranky, you might say, You know what, today, I’m going to take a late swim, or I’m going to do just a brisk walk, or I’m going to ride on the bike and just spin because your bodies do need recovery. And, you know, I don’t want to get too deep into the philosophy of strength and conditioning. But there’s an ebb and flow. And if you’re not letting your body recover after vigorous exercise bouts, you’re actually doing yourself more harm than good.

Brett Gilliland  24:12

Yeah.

Pete Holman  24:12

You see that sometimes people some of these ultra endurance athletes, they you know, they’re running 20 miles every other day. I mean, you can’t recover from that. And so I’m not saying that’s not healthy, but it’s not something I’d recommend to my clients, you want that recovery time. And by the way, recovery can be active, it could be a light swim, it could be a walk, it could be you know, rolling on the foam roller, or using a Thera gun, you know, a percussive massage tool, getting a massage or getting a stretch. You know, there’s the stretch zones and stretch labs now, where you can go in and somebody will actually manually stretch you it’s, it’s magic, I mean, for your body.

Brett Gilliland  24:54

I walk out there like I’m six foot four, you know, I’m six foot tall, but I feel like I’m about six, four when I walk out of those places.  You go to the stretch labs? I do. Yeah, we’ve got a guy, a couple guys here in town where I go and do that. It’s amazing. Absolutely amazing.

Pete Holman  25:09

It is. And what happens is, when you’re stretching on your own, there’s a component of exertion, where you’re in an uncomfortable position, you’re having to kind of pull yourself down into position to stretch your hamstring, for instance. Yeah, well, that’s not allowing, that’s not facilitating a nice calm, relaxed, breathing method. And, and, and just cognitive state of relaxation. When you’re lying down and somebody else is doing the work for you. You just let go, and you kind of melt into the table. And that’s where you can get the most benefits out of stretching.

Brett Gilliland  25:42

I couldn’t agree more, man. So talk to us on the business side. I mean, for you personally. But then also, I mean, just let’s just pick on Scottie Scheffler a year round. You know, the number of world’s number one golfer guy won the Masters this year, like, what do you see is the difference between you know, the world’s number one golfer versus again, use that word average Joe I mean, what do you what can you learn from that guy to share with us?

Pete Holman  26:05

Well, a couple of things. I mean, number one is passion. Like I, passion should really drive your life. Sometimes you got to search for what you’re really passionate about. But when you’re doing something you’re passionate about, it’s an organic, authentic thing, and you’re going to be able to show up with much more ferocity and excitement and exuberance towards what you’re doing. Scott is extremely passionate about golf, he’s been that way his whole life. That’s kind of a gift. I was very passionate about martial arts, I’m now passionate about innovation and progression in my business career, and that helps me so you got to be passionate. The second thing you got to do is you got to immerse yourself, and whatever it is you’re trying to achieve or accomplish. I liked this guy, he’s passed away, but Dr. Wayne Dyer, I don’t know if you’ve ever seen some stuff or watched PBS special, he’s just a really amazing guy. He’s been able to kind of bridge all these different religions, he talks about spirituality, but he does it in a way that’s kind of non exclusive to any one religion. But anyhow, one of the things he talks about is the power of intention. And I’ll never forget he I watched this PBS special of his, which was brilliant. This was years ago, and he was talking about, I forget what his example was, but in my head, it was I was trying to purchase a house, I had a condo, I wanted to have like a real house. And he said, surround yourself with people and things and images and whatever it is paraphernalia that will remind you of your goal that you want to achieve. I mean, put it out there, tell other people that, “hey, I’m really looking to buying a house, put a picture of a house that your dream house, on their fridge,” you know, have a morning meditation, where part of it is, you know, I’m really excited about this day, and the ability to to earn and grow and evolve and eventually get my house for my family. And that power of intention. It works. It’s I mean, this isn’t Wayne Dyer, by the way. This is Psychology 101 It’s self fulfilling prophecy, if you think, you know, you’re gonna be a failure, whatever it is you’re doing, you’re right. You know,

Brett Gilliland  28:23

We talk about all the time and even at work in my personal life, you know, it’s called the expectancy, the Expectancy Theory, right? Well, that what you focus on expands. And so, I mean, I’ve lived for the last 20 something years of my life thinking about that, I mean, I could go out this door right here and show you 15 years of stuff that I’ve written down and read, you know, maybe not twice a day, every single day, but damn near right where I’m reading it every single day and, and you look back on those things from 20 years ago. And it’s kind of like, it’s funny that that used to be a goal, you know, but then as you as you grow, those things are still scary. What might have been scary back then. And the things that I want to do and focus on today are scary. But I’m a believer that you go public with it. Right? You tell yourself that you can do it every single day you write it down every single day, literally every single day, I write down my goals of what I want to accomplish. And then I read it and then I believe it. And then those things happen. It’s not by accident.

Pete Holman  29:23

It’s not it and what’s funny is it doesn’t cost you anything. It’s not rocket science.

Brett Gilliland  29:28

No.

Pete Holman  29:28

I remember watching. I forget which Olympics this was but if you’re old enough, you remember this Olympic diver Greg Louganis. Louganis was kind of a breakout us diver back in the day. And he was competing. He was a high level diver. I mean, he people thought he had the ability to be on the podium. And so he’s on the 10 meter platform. He does a dive and and he hits his head. On the actually maybe it was a springboard he hits regardless on the springboard. I mean, as a diver that is like the worst possible case scenario on a dive. Not only are you scratch that dive, but you’re concussed, you’re bleeding, it’s traumatic. So he’s got like one dive left. And he’s standing up on this Springboard again, he’s got to nail his dive, it’s either podium or not, and what’s going through his mind, I mean, 99% of the population would be, oh my gosh, if I hit my head again, if I embarrass myself in front of my country, my family and my friends and my my partners, and, and if I’m gonna lose scholarships, I’m gonna lose sponsorships, I’m gonna, it’s all gonna go down. I mean, that’s what most people think. Greg Louganis, think, you know what, I screwed up that first time, but I’m not screwing up this time. I’m gonna go out there. I’m gonna do what I practiced for my entire life. And I’m going to execute, and I’m gonna be standing on that gold medal podium. And what’s he do? He goes out and he gets a gold medal. I mean, that’s, that’s a different mindset. But you want to, you want to be a winner. You want to look at winners, when you gotta be your best when your best is needed. And you got to have that constant belief that you can do it even if you screwed up 20 minutes earlier.

Brett Gilliland  31:09

Yeah. So one of the things for you, I would like to call them anymore. I call them unwritten rules, right? They may not be written down. You can’t Google “what are Pete Homan’s rules of life?” What are those unwritten rules that if I followed you around, I had a camera system I hired for a week, what am I seeing every single day in your life?

Pete Holman  31:27

Well, one of my favorite quotes of all time was made by a famous clergyman by the name of Henry Ward Beecher. And he said, “Hold yourself to a higher standard than anyone else expects of you. Hold yourself to a higher standard than anybody else expects of you, if you can do that.” Now, granted, it’s hard because you put a lot of pressure on yourself, right? And I think high achievers, they, they they put a lot of pressure on themselves. And when if you fail, there’s a huge burden to bear. But I’d much rather be that guy or gal that puts pressure on myself and aims high aims for the stars and fails now and again, then somebody that’s just, you know, resigned to mediocrity. So that’s one thing I hold myself to a higher standard, by the way that comes in my, my personal life, my interpersonal relationships, my relationship with my daughter, my my relationship with coworkers friends, and obviously comes in business. I’m trying to excel at business and and be the best you know, product and vendor I can be the best representative of health and fitness that comes when I when I look at my own personal physical well being and spiritual well being, I’m holding myself to a high standard and it sucks because there’s days that I don’t want to work out or days that I don’t want to eat a salad or days that I don’t want to stretch and all that stuff. So you know, execute on that. And, you know, when I grew up in I think I mentioned my martial arts background. One of my favorite martial artists was Bruce Lee. And Bruce Lee has this famous quote, you can Google this. And he says, “empty your mind. Be formless, shapeless, like water. You can put water into a cup, it becomes the cup, you put into a bottle, it becomes the bottle you put into a teapot, it becomes that teapot, water can flow or water can crash, be water, my friend.”

Brett Gilliland  33:25

Love that.

Pete Holman  33:26

And I know he was talking about athleticism and athletics, but he was also talking about, you know, in his time, when he was coming up, there was a huge conflict between the East and the West. You know, he was coming from China. And he you know, he spoke Cantonese and Mandarin. And he was trying to assimilate into San Francisco. And he got it coming and going from you know, your basic white Caucasian people. And then even his own community gave him a hard time because he was teaching kung fu to the gweilo to the white people. So everybody hated him. And what did he do? He flowed like water, that ability to adjust and adapt and adapt in life, I think is critical. It doesn’t matter what you’re doing. You know, it’s like the old you know, the big willow tree and a massive storm, right? If it’s brittle and rigid and holds position, it’s just gonna snap in half. What’s it do? It just flows in the wind, and it can get through 100 mile an hour gusts. So, you know, that’s one thing I tried to do to the best of my ability every day is you’re gonna hit hurdles, you’re gonna have adversity, you’re gonna have heartbreak and loss. But you got to be that willow tree and just bounce back and be resilient.

Brett Gilliland  34:41

I love that. I call that the bounce back theory. I mean, the most successful people I’ve seen in their lives, they bounce back quickly from rejection, right? I mean, we all get kicked in the shorts every single day, you know, maybe not every day but you get kicked in the shorts and I think the more you expect of yourself, the more you are going to get kicked around a lot. Have it and the faster we bounce back, the faster you’re gonna be successful versus going home and having a pity party and laying in the fetal position and cried about it and feel sorry for yourself. It’s like, okay, have the pity party for a couple minutes. But then let’s get out a piece of paper and an ink pen. And let’s write down how the hell you’re gonna get out of this problem.

Pete Holman  35:18

Well, you bring up two good points. And the first is that, I think, you know, we’re really extreme in our society right now. And people take very hard lines, and I get it. But there’s, there’s an in between, right? There’s someplace in the middle. There’s a famous book by the called Tuesdays with maurey by Mitch album, great. And it’s a great book. And there’s the I don’t remember a lot of the book to be honest with you. But I remember one part. And Mitch album is this journalist. He’s he’s come back to reunite with his mentor who has a journalistic professor at his college and the journalistic professor who is Maury is dying of ALS. He’s he’s got a terminal diagnosis, and he’s dying. And Mitch comes over. And he says more you got to tell me something. I don’t understand. Every time I come over every Tuesday. You’re upbeat. You’re cheery, you’re bright. You bring you know, you bring light into my life. And here you are. You’re dying. I don’t understand how you do this. And he looks to Mitch and he says Mitch, you should have seen me 10 minutes ago. And Mitch, his ears perked up. He says, What do you mean, he’s like, I was crying, sobbing buckets. He said, I woke up, I was having a rough day, every joint hurt, I couldn’t my motor system wasn’t functioning. And I just I started crying. I thought I’m dying, like my life is over. And then after five or seven minutes of crying his eyes out, he kind of recovered a little bit, he opened up the blinds, he saw some birds flying in the horizon, the wind was blowing gently, the clouds hovered beautifully, the sun was rising. And he took some deep breaths. And he said, I’m going to make the most of this day. And I just like that kind of attitude. I mean, it makes me want to cry right now. Like, you’re, it’s okay to embrace that pain. And, and, and give it some time and give us some energy because it’s a real human emotion that we go through when we have a failure or success or loss. But at some point, you got to open up the blinds and you got to look outside for a sign from I don’t know, if you’re religious from the heavens, if you’re whatever naturalist from, you know, I was riding my bike the other day, it was kind of starting to rain, I was tired, my joints hurt. I didn’t really want to be out there. And all of a sudden, this this eagle, I never see eagles and Aspen. They’re here, but I never see him. I see red tail hawks all the time. I see bears. I see deer I see Fox, I see. I see all this wildlife. I never see an eagle. And this thing comes out of a tree like I must have spooked it as I rode by. And I could tell like that’s not a hawk. I mean, it had this massive wingspan, and it had like a barrel kind of chest. And you could tell it was really working to get loft. And I’m like is that an eagle and my cadence on my bike started picked up and it was kind of flying right in front of me. So for I don’t know, 15 seconds, I can’t following this evil. And I thought, Man, I don’t know what that is. But that’s a sign from above that I’m meant to be here. I’m meant to enjoy this life. I’m meant to take take this life and and experience it and look for things every day. That make me understand that there’s something greater out there. And that there’s a purpose for me being here.

Brett Gilliland  38:40

But I think the key right there, and I’m sure you know this, or I know you know this, but I think I want to draw people’s attention to it is you got to be willing and open to look at that eagle up there and see something good from it, right? Because you could easily just write and then just put your head back down and start pedaling your bikes, but I think it’s embracing that eagle. Seeing that ego and knowing that there’s a reason that damn thing is there.

Pete Holman  39:06

Oh, man. I mean, I what I’m not a big–– I love movies. I’m not a big old time movie fan. But there’s this movie. And I can’t even tell you the name of it. It’s like Fred Astaire, you know, back in the day, and there’s a scene where it starts dumping rain, right?

Brett Gilliland  39:23

Yeah.

Pete Holman  39:24

And everybody’s downtrodden and melancholy. It’s raining. Goo his dark sky. And here comes this is a Ginger Rogers. I don’t know somebody’s gonna crack. But they go out in the street and they’re dancing in the rain and they’re having the time of their life. I mean, you want to talk about living life. Like it’s it changed your perspective. If you change the way you look at things, the things you look at change. That’s another Wayne Dyer thing, quote, and it’s couldn’t be, you know, more true on a daily basis. Another thing I wanted to mention about my daily ritual and habits, and this is probably the hardest thing Is professionalism. I always whenever I do a project or submitting a proposal or typing out an email, and you know, you got to take this with a grain of salt I mean not every single one but the important ones. I mean, I reread that thing three or four times I changed the verbiage I proofread it. I want to come across as a professional and everything I do. And I never forget the story a client told me I’m up in Aspen so I trained like these Uber wealthy, you know, Gulfstream owning clients who of the world and one of them lives has a house and mystique. Mystique is an island in the Caribbean. And it’s where like all the rock stars and actors have places and and Mick Jagger has a place on Mystique island of the Rolling Stones, at least circle the Rolling Stones. So now there’s a bar called Basil. It’s on the silent and everybody it’s there’s only one bar restaurant. It’s called Basil. So everybody goes there, and you hang out like even people that are just super wealthy hanging out with all these rock stars and actors. And Mick Jagger is in this bar. And my clients very friendly with the house band at the bar. And they talk to them all the time. And so my client goes up to the drummer during a set break and says, Why don’t you ask Mick Jagger to come on stage? Songs? Right. So so the drummer is like “Hunter No,” and she kind of goats him and she says, “Come on, you know, you can eat. You guys are so good. They love you.” And so the drummer kind of gets his nerve up and he goes up to Mick Jagger. And he says, Hey, would you ever want to play with us? And Mick Jagger says, “yes, I’d love to play with you.” So the drummer said, “Great, we know all your songs.” And and he expects Mick Jagger to step up on stage, Mick Jagger never shows up. So at the end of the night, the band’s kind of wrapping up and the drummer kind of goes up to Mick Jagger and says, “Hey, is everything okay? Did I do something to offend you?” And he’s like, “no, no, I just want to rehearse before we play.” And drummer looks at him like, rehearse? I mean, your Mick Jagger dude your Mick Jagger. And he says, “Well, no, let’s let’s get a couple of rehearsals.” And so they rehearsed two times, maybe three, I forget what the story was. They went through like a three song set. Keep in mind, Basil’s bar. There’s nobody there. There’s like 120 people maybe in any given night. So 120 People in the middle of nowhere. This is Mick Jagger, the best rock star ever. He wants to rehearse with the band to do a couple covers of his songs. And of course, he comes back later in the next week. And he plays and my clients got pictures of her dancing and Mick Jagger is like right there, you know, three feet away from her. And that story resonated with me. There’s a reason Mick Jagger everybody knows who Mick is. And it’s that reason right there. He is the most professional rock star you’ll receive. He eats well, he trains and conditions himself, he takes care of his throat. And he rehearses and rehearses and rehearses. Steve Jobs did the same thing before a keynote address. I mean, there’s a reason these people are high performers. So if you want to get to the next level, be professional.

Brett Gilliland  43:18

I love it. I love it, man. So what keeps you up at night right now in your life?

Pete Holman  43:23

Well, I’ve got this new product, it’s called the Glute Slide. And you know, I’ve kind of been geeked out on the glutes. As a physical therapist and strength coach, I always know that the glutes are important and you know, kind of yada yada, but I’ve really honed in on this. And if you look at the gluteal muscles, there’s some basic muscles on the top, the gluteus maximus on the side, there’s something called the gluteus medius. But then deep inside there, there’s seven rotators, that rotate the hip externally, there’s internal rotators. I mean, there’s a dozen muscles in that, in that gluteal area. And it’s the powerhouse of the core. And not only for sports and athletics, but everybody that kind of wants to look good on the beach, you know, you want to get your wedding dress or you want to look good in your jeans. You want to have a nice toned firmstrong glued. Well, fast forward to if you’re 70 or 80 years old, which is a lot of my clients right now, guess where they’re weakest in their glutes. Guess why they fall down the stairs because their cool glutes aren’t able to decelerate their next step. Or if they miss a step, the glutes can fire and have enough strength to hold them in position. So I thought there’s got to be a machine I could create for the in home and commercially that would train specifically train the glues. And that’s what I’m working on right now. I’m on my third prototype, and it’s going to happen so keep your eyes and ears open for the Glutes Slide sometime in 2023.

Brett Gilliland  44:47

Well, we’ll buy it. We’ll buy that as well, man. Why not? We’ll just keep it going guys stay to peak performance. So where can our listeners find more of Pete Holman?

Pete Holman  44:57

I am at on Instagram @PeteHolman1, the number one, h o l m a n. Pete Holman 1. I’m also at Twitter @PeteHolman1. I’m on Facebook at Pete Holman. I have a couple of different accounts. I’m not as good at Facebook I, you know, Zuckerberg, the guy’s brilliant, but he changes stuff everym every two or three weeks, there’s some new algorithm or some new formula, some new interface and it’s very hard to keep up with this. Plus, I’m not 17 years old, like my daughter, she she has to coach me up and upskill me on this.

Brett Gilliland  45:28

Look when you were 17 you wouldn’t be on Facebook. Anyway, my son told me that my 16, 17 year old son the other day told me he goes, you know, “Daddy’s I don’t mean to be mean, but Facebook’s for old people.”

Pete Holman  45:38

Yeah. And all that. But which, by the way, if you’re in business, and you’re in you’re wanting to capture younger audiences, by the way, even 30 year olds are still on Tik Tok and Snapchat, if you’re wanting to hit that marketplace in that niche, you better figure out that that stuff, you know, don’t don’t be so entrenched in your old ways. And I see that in business now especial, especially with digital marketing, right now you’ve got to execute on all cylinders. To capture that audience. By the way, I also have a website called PH1performance.com. PH for P. Holman one the number, just the number 1 performance.com, PH1performance.com. And there’s, you know, there’s all my contact information on there, I think my emails even on there, if you want to reach out to questions or anything I can do to help you out. I’m all about like, my whole mission in life is to help other people execute and, and reach their human potential. As far as their health, wellness and vitality goes, I think if you can do that, you’re much better husband, wife, father, daughter, son, business partner, etc. But it all starts with you and your own internal physiological health, and your spiritual wellness and mental wellbeing.

Brett Gilliland  47:05

We’ll put all that stuff in the show notes. But I think you agree with us with what you just said right there struck a chord in me is, I think that’s why I’m so focused now at 44 on fitness and health, and what we’re doing to stay vibrant is, you know, I own a wealth management firm. So all day long, I’m talking about people’s monies, their dreams, their goals, their aspirations. But look, you got to start when you’re in your 20s, start saving some money, and then save a little bit more in your 30s. And a little bit more in your 40s. Right? For the time when you’re 55 and 65, and 75 and 85. And you want to go live the life you want to live and go the islands and do all these things, right. But it took 20 and 30 years for you to get there. Well, now at 44. I’ve got to invest my time today that’s going to help me when I’m 64, 74 and 84. When I’m out there playing golf, still taking my buddy’s money, I hope, right? I gotta put that that investment, if you will, in today, for the future. Because who knows how long we’re gonna live man with modern technology.

Pete Holman  48:02

What you said is probably the most profound thing of this entire podcast. And that is you better invest in your health savings account. Because it is just like your financial savings account. If you get into retirement and you haven’t done your job on the front end is too late folks. And I sick all the time, because I’m working with 60,  70, 80 year old folks. It’s when I say too late, I’m being a little dramatic, but you know what I’m saying?

Brett Gilliland  48:29

Absolutely.

Pete Holman  48:29

And you’re late 60s And you’ve got congestive heart failure, and you’ve got diabetes and your diet is terrible. And, and also the doctor says you need to change. You need to stop smoking, whatever it is. It could be too late. And like you said, people were like I’ve got a client that’s 94 years old. Wow. And he’s a billionaire. Like, especially if you’re doing well in life. I’m not saying everybody wants to live long but especially if you’ve worked so hard to this wealth. And now what you can’t play with your grandkids on the beach, you can’t take a trip because you’re too tired and weak. Come on.

Brett Gilliland  49:04

Yeah, that would not be good. Not be good. Well, this has been an awesome conversation man on a Friday afternoon. Love the time together with you, Pete and thanks for being on The Circuit of Success.

Pete Holman  49:13

Appreciate it so much, keep the dream alive everybody.

Travis Thomas has experience in a wide spectrum of careers from improv comedy, to writing, to coaching professional athletes on the U.S. Men’s National Team. As a driven performance and culture coach, Thomas published his first book “3 Words for Getting Unstuck: Live Yes, And!” in 2016. He is passionate about inspiring others, and believes that anyone can discover their brilliance by committing to purpose, authenticity, and life-transforming collaboration.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION

Brett Gilliland  00:00

Welcome to the Circuit of Success. I’m your host, Brett Gilliland, and today I’m fired up, man, I’ve got Travis Thomas with me, Travis, how you doing?

Travis Thomas  00:06

I’m doing well. Thanks for having me.

Brett Gilliland  00:07

It’s good to have you.

Travis Thomas  00:07

Yeah, let’s let’s let’s jump in the for those of you who can’t see if you’re listening, right, we’re in an amazing office slash studio so, so I’m super impressed.

Brett Gilliland  00:08

Yeah. Well, thanks so excited to have you over here in our O’Fallon, Illinois Visionary Wealth Advisors office and but Travis is a performance coach. He’s the creator of Live Yes And

Travis Thomas  00:28

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  00:28

Which I can’t wait to talk about, Live Yes And. You’re, you’re also a comedian. So hopefully you make me laugh today.

Travis Thomas  00:34

Doubtful, doubtful.

Brett Gilliland  00:36

But also comedian, you’re an author, man, you’ve you’ve worked with the, I’m going to say this word? I don’t normally say it. But the Chicago Cubs.

Travis Thomas  00:42

Yeah. You know, you know, we’re here in St. Louis country.

Brett Gilliland  00:45

Yeah.

Travis Thomas  00:46

So I’m, I’m a mercenary. So Chicago paid me.

Brett Gilliland  00:50

Exactly. You got a show? Well, yeah, we’ll get the guys over there and see if they can get you but the Chicago Cubs, Boston Red Sox, Toronto Blue Jays, Georgia football, do a lot of personal coaching workshops, online programs, man and but the biggest role you kind of have right now is to the United States men’s national team for World Cup coming up?

Travis Thomas  01:10

Yeah, really exciting. So I’ve been on staff with them since January 2020, the head coach brought me and Greg Burkhalter. And so I’m a contracted worker, but on staff, I’m the Leadership and Team Dynamics coach. So that’s kind of the title we came up with which which carries a lot of, a lot of things but working with the team from leadership skills to mental skills. The way I like to think of it Brett, is I’m the guy that does, is always thinking about the culture. Right? So kind of the torch carrier for the culture or so many staff members are doing so many important things. I’m always thinking about all right, how are we continuing to, to make sure we’re in alignment with with our overall culture as a team.

Brett Gilliland  01:52

And that’s huge, which we’ll talk about in a little bit. But but if you can, Travis, give us a little lay of the land on what’s made you the man you are today. It’s a question I asked on every episode. And I think there’s there’s always a backstory that maybe I don’t know, through my research, and maybe some people that we want to give credit to too but what what has made you the man that you are today?

Travis Thomas  02:09

Are we working with a company doing that, are you on your own the whole time? Yeah, well, it’s, it’s been quite a, it’s been a quite an interesting journey. I would love to say that I’ve had a plan. And when when I talk about purpose, right, I talk about, you know, purpose is not a it’s not a it’s not a map. It’s it’s a compass. And so if I, if I were to look back and connect the dots in reverse to how I got to doin the work that I’m that I’m doing today it, it was scary. It’s been terrifying. It’s been uncertain, but it’s always been purpose forward, purpose driven. And so you know, the skinny of it is I, you know, I’m from Flint, Michigan, for those of you who know Flint, Michigan, most people don’t tend to know Flint, Michigan in a positive light, they tend to think of the water or they think of “Roger and Me” and the documentary and General Motors pulling out, but I come from Flint with pride, you know, hard working town, we had a family business there. And so I definitely have those kinds of those Midwestern roots. But I loved sports growing up, I played soccer in college, the Division Three level, got out of college, got married right away, my wife and I we’re celebrating year 26 next month, we got married young and I figured it was time to kind of get into the professional world, whatever that meant. And so we moved to Boston and I was working in marketing, she was working in publishing. First weekend in town, we went to an improv theater that had just opened a few months previous saw an improv comedy show, and for anyone who’s never seen an improv comedy show, it’s a lot like “Whose Line Is It Anyway”, on TV. Second City is a big improv theater that a lot of people have heard of, went to a show five or six people on stage, creating stories out of nothing out of audience suggestions. And I saw that show and I was blown away. I was like, how do they do that? You know, that’s magic. How did they do that? So they have a lot of courage takes a lot of courage and a lot of just I’m like, what’s the what’s the formula there? And so I signed up at a training center. So I took a level one class, level one turned into six levels of training. And a year and a half later, I was graduating from the training center. And then I was auditioning for their touring company and I made their touring company and then I made their development cast. And then I finally after a couple of years, made it to the mainstage cast and so kind of felt like a superhero. I had a real day job, you know, Clark Kent, you know, with a suit during the day and at night, I was on stage, hopefully making people laugh and, and I did the improv comedy thing for a few years moved to Florida, started a group of two guys down there in 2003-2004. We still perform together when we can it’s more of a glorified hobby. But then, you know, I was working for a website, a spirituality website that came to an end it was the big question kind of around 2005, which what do I really want to do with my life? And I wanted to do coaching and I wanted to do speaking, and I really, I love working with groups and teams and people on and the corporate level and sports and but that started to do Deep Dive into personal development for myself and then to get certified in personal development, which led into organizational development, which led led into corporate training and executive coaching–– I was on my own, which, which meant, I didn’t have a lot of work. You know, we had our third child, and I’m like, you know, family of five, and I’m not making any money, and we go into debt, and we go into a lot of debt. And then it was scary. And it was this idea of sort of following your purpose. Like, man, I really felt like I had a sense of what I wanted to do. But it was tough, and not really knowing what that path was going to look like. And so just kind of in survival mode, I would say, you know, survival mode for about 10 years of just trying to make ends meet and, and being really scary, but always having a clear sense of who I was and what I wanted to do.

Brett Gilliland  05:55

Let’s dissect that if we can. So I mean, I’m, that is fascinating to me. So for one, you had a very patient and understanding and supportive wife at home.

Travis Thomas  06:03

Hard stop there, right? Yes, yeah. Yes.

Brett Gilliland  06:05

Yeah. Shout out to Hollister.

Travis Thomas  06:08

Shout to Hollister. My wife, because in lots of different, you know, and I’ve seen it, we’ve seen it in other marriages where financial hardship comes and there’s not enough there to hold the relationship together. So God bless her.

Brett Gilliland  06:20

Yeah. So so that 10 years. So now you’re you’re fighting through odd jobs, and you get this gig. That’s exciting. You get this gig. That’s exciting. Yeah, make it a little bit here. How does a guy from Flint, Michigan go to Boston, we go on stage, we’re making people laugh. We go down here and we decide I want to be a coach. Because, in my opinion, what I struggle with sometimes as coaches out there, just in full transparency, is there a “coach,” but they haven’t had the grind.

Travis Thomas  06:46

No.

Brett Gilliland  06:46

Right? And now you did the grind. But how did you do the grind and end up on the United States men’s national team for soccer? I mean, that’s mind blowing.

Travis Thomas  06:54

Well, there were, and that’s the thing like that, that 10, 10 plus years, really, you know, it’s all the steps in between. And so, you know, I, you know, I ended up moving up to St. Louis 2007. And I took a job with my alma mater as an assistant soccer coach, just to stop the bleeding.

Brett Gilliland  07:13

Which was SLU.

Travis Thomas  07:13

Which was not SLU, was actually Principia College.

Brett Gilliland  07:14

Okay, for sure.

Travis Thomas  07:14

And even though I’m working at SLU, now, it wasn’t my alma mater, and took a job there thinking that there was going to be a job on the other end, either as a resident counselor at the college or, well, that turned into being a resident counselor at the high school at the boarding school. So for three years, Brett, with my children, seven, four, and one, were living in a boy’s dormitory in an apartment in the boys dormitory, making nothing. But but just it was stopping the debt. And but here I was, but you look back, and like what what was the work that I was doing on a day to day basis, right? I was mentoring young high school men from around the world. And then when I wasn’t doing that I was coaching sports at the same time. And so I was doing the work that was allowing, it was laying the groundwork, it was planting the seeds. And then after doing that for three years, we put the kids into a minivan. We started driving around the country, like, alright what’s the next step? Yeah, we had no plan. And after driving around the country for six months, sleeping in a tent, hotel rooms and friends and family who would ever take us we ended up back in Florida again. And it was like, Oh, this is I’m going to be a coach or consultant. We’re back in our house. And I thought that was the plan. And then I get an email after being home for a month that IMG Sports Academy in Florida was looking for an improvisation and leadership coach. Like how in the world do those two exist together?

Brett Gilliland  08:39

Right.

Travis Thomas  08:40

So I didn’t really want to leave our home and go the other side of the state. But I’m like, I can’t not explore this opportunity.

Brett Gilliland  08:45

The IMG, it’s the best.

Travis Thomas  08:47

The IMG right, and working at the premier sports academy in the world. And so I went in and interviewed with a sense of freedom of I don’t really want this job, because I want to stay home. But and so that, you know, little lesson for those––

Brett Gilliland  08:59

You have nothing to lose, right?

Travis Thomas  09:00

Nothing to lose, because I can be totally transparent and honest. Well, then they decided they wanted me and so I’m like this is too good of an opportunity to pass up. So I then did that for about two and a half years at IMG Academy. Again, you know, as a coach day in and day out on your feet coaching everyone from Korean golfers to NFL Combine football players to pre MBA basketball players to soccer players, from South America to tennis players from Russia, and having to deliver that message and work with those athletes on a day to day basis. And so when I left there in 2015, and just started decided to start this my own consulting company called Live Yes And. I felt like Alright, I’ve got my reps in.

Brett Gilliland  09:41

Yeah.

Travis Thomas  09:41

And then it’s really been from 2015 that I’ve been on my own. I wrote my own book in 2016 called three words for getting unstuck, which is Live Yes And, which we’ll about that. And then I you know you do what you do you send your book out kind of as a glorified business card, I sent it to the head coach of the US Men’s national soccer team in 2019 cold with no intent of ever hearing anything, a) that he would get it, b) that he would read it, and c) that you’d want to do anything right? And so what happens, he got it, b) he read it and c) like, all right, he goes, “Are you interested in coming and helping, help me with the team? Here’s the culture. Do you want to come in and help me?” You know––

Brett Gilliland  10:20

And that’s purely a cold cold call, if you will called Zero? No connection?

Travis Thomas  10:25

No connection, Yeah, yeah. And so that that so since January 2020 I’ve been, you know, with the national team whenever we’re together. And then when I’m not with the national team, I’m doing corporate consulting, corporate speaking, as well as working with other sports teams on the on the culture and mindset piece.

Brett Gilliland  10:41

So many places to go right there, Travis.

Travis Thomas  10:44

So that’s that’s the path. Yeah. So how does he end up on the national team? It’s like, a whole lot of I have no idea what I’m doing. But I’m just going to take the next step based on purpose.

Brett Gilliland  10:55

So that makes me think of so the Circuits of Success, hence, the name of the podcasts are your attitude, your belief system, and the actions that you take?

Travis Thomas  11:03

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  11:03

Get the results.

Travis Thomas  11:04

Absolutely.

Brett Gilliland  11:05

And so without one, it’s like the light bulb. That’s a circuit side, the light bulb doesn’t shut. Right. And so when I hear there is action, I hear getting my ass kicked, basically.

Travis Thomas  11:16

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  11:16

Pardon my French, right for a number of years.

Travis Thomas  11:18

Absolutely.

Brett Gilliland  11:19

And still doing it. Still having support no plan, which I want to talk about, because I’m a big planner.

Travis Thomas  11:25

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  11:26

But then yet, the action part is I don’t know where this is gonna go. It costs money to buy my own book to label the book to find the guy’s information, send it to him.

Travis Thomas  11:35

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  11:36

And then have faith. Right. So belief into action is faith is what I was talking about. And so when you hear me say it like that, I mean, how does that come to mind into your story?

Travis Thomas  11:45

Yeah, no, I think you nailed it. And I think I can remember, I can remember because I’ve sent my book to tons of coaches.

Brett Gilliland  11:53

Sure.

Travis Thomas  11:53

Right? And maybe I get a thank you card back. And there’s really no expectation when you know, when you send the book cold, I was talking to our buddy, John Oleary, when he’s like, “How’d you end up on the national team of like?” “John, you’re not going to believe this. I sent a cold copy.” And he’s like “Travis. The cold send never works!” I was like, “I know, I worked this one time.”

Brett Gilliland  12:11

All it needs to do is work one time, right?

Travis Thomas  12:13

And so I remember, I remember being in the family room and being like, I should send Greg a book. And then the voice in my head says, “Don’t waste your time.” Right. And then the other voice in my head says, “but it only takes five minutes.” And the other voice says, “You’re wasting your time, you’re wasting the three bucks, or whatever it’s going to send” and I just remember the other voice going just sit down and do it. It takes five minutes. And I wrote the Thank you. I wrote the note, put it in the book, Senate. And, and I’m just so grateful that that one voice was louder than the other voice that was saying don’t send the book. And so if I were to write my next book, I think the next book is going to be called “Just Send the Book,” just send the book, just––

Brett Gilliland  12:54

Incredible. That’s like, you know, it’s what is it the Wayne Gretzky, quote, “you miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.” And so… It makes me think when I was when I turned 40. So this is four years ago, most gosh, almost five years ago, I wrote down the 40 things I had learned in my life. And one of them was I said, “just take the lunch.”

Travis Thomas  13:13

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  13:13

And I can’t tell you how many people you know, you’ve met them, I’ve met them, “say I’m not going to do that.” They don’t want to pay me or they’re not going to do this, I’m not going to take the time to go do it. And my philosophy for 20 plus years now in the business world is take the lunch, I don’t know, right, you start to get fewer and fewer lunches that you take. But when you’re building your career, you’ve got to take the lunch, you’ve got to send the book wouldn’t you agree?

Travis Thomas  13:33

Absolutely. And I’m still in that space, right? I’m still in that space where, where I will go in I told you, I don’t need to say who but I went in last week and did a workshop for a team. I didn’t get paid, right. But I went in with the intent of this is an opportunity for me to, to get a foot in the door to share with with what I’m about and if this is a good fit, it’s going to turn into another opportunity. And my advice always to young speakers or young coaches or young consultants and again, because I still do the same thing is I offer my services for free all the time. Because you know how this this world works. It’s it’s relationship building, you are always relationship building, and very seldom have I done something for free that didn’t turn into something further down the road. And again, it’s going back to intent, right? Like what is my purpose? Right? So my, my purpose in life is to inspire myself and others to live their authentic brilliance. So whenever someone gives me the opportunity to to provide that right anytime I get a chance to do a workshop with someone I have the opportunity to live my purpose, right? I get my chance to inspire someone else to live their authentic brilliance. And that doesn’t always come with a paycheck on the other end, but it comes with me fulfilling my purpose. And again it since that is my compass, right. If I’m always moving in the direction of my compass, sometimes there’s going to be a paycheck On the other end of it, but there’s always going to be fulfillment on the other end of it. And, and at the end of the day, that’s, that’s always going to be the feeling that that keeps me happy and keeps me going and happy from the standpoint not of frivolous happiness, but of fulfillment. And that’s why I think it’s so important, you know, to have a clearer sense of, of what our purpose is, and to be able to keep moving in that direction.

Brett Gilliland  15:26

So, when I go with that, there’s two thoughts that came from that part right there, there’s one when I talked about beliefs again, in the actions, but that belief is the belief in yourself, yeah, right. And so I think it takes a massive amount of belief in ourselves to go to that team. Yeah, for free. Because again, you’re not looking for the best, now you have the long term perspective. But to go there, and know that you’re gonna hit a homerun, and you’re gonna deliver, and, you know, there’s no guarantees in life, but I have a pretty self confident thing to say about you that I think they’re gonna call you back, right? So belief in itself is massive.

Travis Thomas  15:59

Yeah belief, it’s so interesting. Brett, you say that because I, it’s funny, I go in, if someone said, “Hey, will you come and do a workshop?” I have tremendous, I have tremendous belief that when I go, when I go, when I’m going to provide like a quality session, there’s also there’s also a voice inside of my head that that is always making me doubt my ability, imposter syndrome, whatever you want to call it. And so and it’s those two, the analogy of the two wolves inside your head, right? You know, it’s whichever one you feed is the one that wins. And so I always have a healthy dose of doubt. But, but there is whatever it is. And I think that’s why purpose is so important, because it’s connected to my purpose. It almost gives me permission to go like, I might go in and stink. Yeah, but I’m still living my purpose. And so just go do it. Anyway.

Brett Gilliland  16:51

Yeah, I think we all have those two people. I was the way I always talk to you about him as you get this, this man or woman on your shoulder here saying, “Don’t do it, Brett. That’s a terrible idea.” This guy’s saying, “Let’s go youk know, like we’re gonna make it happen.” And you’re right, though, whichever one I listened to the most and feed the most is the one that we do. I call it comfort zone callous.

Travis Thomas  17:08

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  17:09

And so I think that that self doubt is healthy for some of us, because that does drive us but I think the more you do something I always say the comfort zone is this big.

Travis Thomas  17:17

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  17:18

And then if you try to break through it, it’s you know, I play golf. So I’ve calluses a man, right. And so, for me to go around that and get out of my comfort zone, I have to go around the callus, right. And so then my comfort zone gets a little bit bigger.

Travis Thomas  17:28

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  17:28

And a little bit bigger. And you’ve done it enough now and the 10 years where you weren’t making a dime, and you’re going in debt, right? That was you busting through that comfort zone to now you can walk in a room and deliver.

Travis Thomas  17:39

Right, right. It’s finding your edge I talk about finding your edge of your comfort zone? Yeah. Right. And it’s like, you know, working with athletes all the time, even with my own kids. You know, I dropped my son off for training the other night. And the last thing I said to him was like, you know, “hey, what do you focus on today?” Right? I’m trying to––

Brett Gilliland  17:54

How old is her?

Travis Thomas  17:54

He’s 15. Okay, just turn 15 I’m trying to avoid asking, you know, asking players, how do you feel? I’m avoiding that, right? Because Because feelings are not an indicator of performance. Right? Think about that for a second, right? Yeah, feelings are not an indicator of performance, you can feel super confident and still play lousy. You can feel nervous and afraid and still perform at a high level. Right.

Brett Gilliland  18:16

Say that again, again, feelings are––

Travis Thomas  18:18

Feelings are not an indicator of performance. You know, I was raised. I think I’m just a few years older than you despite the gray. I’m a few years older than you. And I was right generationally I was raised as an athlete. It was this whole be fearless, no fear generation, right. So as an athlete, I felt and I was I was a player that carried a lot of nerves. So I always felt that I was less of a man. Because I was afraid, not knowing that probably most of us had his head a sense of has his head a sense of fear. But if you’re if you’re made to believe that you’re not supposed to be afraid, and you are afraid, well, that now I feel that something’s wrong with me from the get go. So, you know, I work with athletes.

Brett Gilliland  19:02

God can interrupt. I’m sorry. So I heard you say that I was a kid that played sports all grown up. And I would throw up before every game, right? I was so nervous. I was so and it does mean it messes with your head mentally. Which then kind of makes you come back and maybe not be as aggressive. I joke now that I’m a better golfer today than I was when I was actually competing and playing golf.

Travis Thomas  19:22

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  19:22

Because it’s less in my head. Yeah, than it was back then.

Travis Thomas  19:25

And imagine, imagine a coach coming to you at that age and, and you’re nervous and you’re afraid and they’re basically saying, “Hey, it’s totally fine. Totally fine, man. Awesome. You care. Right?” So we’re not going to try to change that in you. Right instead. “Hey, Brad, listen, what do you focus on before you go on this round?” Right? Be nervous, Hey, be nervous, right? But what are you focused on? And so you know, I’m always asking my kids and then asking players that I coach as they’re going out there. Hey, what are you focused on today? Give me the two or three top behaviors that you’re focused on actions, right because I can be afraid and focus on actions, actions get me moving. When I focus on my feelings, it’s like I’m feeling good or feeling bad doesn’t mean anything. What am I actually doing and focusing on behaviors and actions and so but the other thing I said to my son is i, “what are you focused on?” He tells me, “Alright dad, I’m focused on these,” I’m like, “awesome, go find your edge today, go find your edge,” right? Get get to that edge, because like you talked about the comfort zone, just get one step on the other side of your edge today. And then you’ve just expanded your comfort zone.

Brett Gilliland  20:29

So how do you do that, though? How do you how do you find that edge, walk to the edge and then actually jump over?

Travis Thomas  20:35

Right? It’s, we’re almost, it’s great in the book, Born to Run, which is a fantastic I highly recommend it to anybody. Can’t can’t think of the author’s name real quick, but it’ll come to me, Born to Run. And the book is all about, you know, these ultra runners and just the history of running and just all these I call them crazy people, right? My good friend is an ultra runner, he’s a crazy person, shout out to Brian. And he’s talking these ultra runners in the book, and they’re talking about that edge. Right? And this one female runner. She says I see it as a playful pet, when she’s running. And she’s like, I try to find it as quickly as possible, right. So think about that. Imagine as an athlete, if you tried to go out and finding that edge is basically kind of getting to that point of, I don’t know if I can make another run. I don’t know if I can make another tackle because I feel spent. And what do we really know is what happens if I make another run or make another tackle? When I find myself at that edge? Go one step further. Or can I go two steps further now you’ve just what where does confidence come from confidence comes from finding that edge and just pushing that edge and tomorrow, it’s gonna be a little bit bigger, and the next day is gonna be a little bit bigger. So our goal is, so the discomfort we feel is actually that we embrace that as “Oh, I’m finding my edge.” It’s not a bad thing. It’s like, “oh, I’m feeling uncomfortable. Yeah, I’m finding my edge. Awesome. So just push through it just a little bit.”

Brett Gilliland  22:01

It doesn’t. I’ve heard this before. I’m no doctor. But nerves or anxiety is no different feeling the body and the brain doesn’t know the difference between anxiety and excitement, right?

Travis Thomas  22:11

Yep. So the only difference? Yes, physiologically, what’s going on inside of my body when I’m nervous and I’m excited is the same thing. So the way I like to think about that brain is so the only difference

Brett Gilliland  22:22

Man that would’ve been nice to know when I was a kid.

Travis Thomas  22:24

Right? So the thing that usually determines whether my feeling is nervous, or whether my feeling is excitement is because we’re thinking about a possible outcome. And when I’m nervous or afraid, I’m probably focused on a possible negative outcome. And when I’m excited, I’m thinking about a possible positive outcome. So it’s like, oh, my gosh, I get to go take a penalty shot, or I’ve got a five foot putt, right to win this tournament. If I’m nervous, I’m thinking about missing it. If I’m excited, I’m thinking about making it. Regardless, all that says to us is when I think about the outcome, it’s a distraction. Instead of just thinking about I’ve got a five foot putt, what do I need to focus on in order to make a good putt? Right, so, so letting letting go of outcome and focusing on the action which is always in the present moment? Right? And so what improv what improv taught me, which I needed as an athlete, improv, all of a sudden exercise this muscle, which is you have to stay fully engaged in the moment. Right life is happening in the present moment sports are happening in the present moment, I talked to soccer players. And like, whenever you feel like you’re distracted in the past, or you’re thinking about the future, if you focus on the ball, the ball is always in the present moment. Right? So ask yourself, where’s the ball? Where do I need to be?

Brett Gilliland  23:45

So to dissect that even so then I’m a guy I’m playing I’m the whatever the the forward.  And the ball is across the field. And I’m thinking about man, last week I did this one thing or, or stuff like that is what you’re saying, I’m––

Travis Thomas  23:51

Yep.  I can’t believe I just missed that shot 30 seconds ago, and I’m still thinking about I’m still thinking about, we’re probably going to lose the game now because I missed that opportunity. Now, now we’re, our thought is can’t believe that it happened in the past. Now I’m thinking about the possible future. And then you want to catch yourself you want to catch yourself, oh my gosh, I’m distracted to how do I get back to the present moment.

Brett Gilliland  24:20

And this is business for we’re talking about sports, obviously. But there’s lesson, right this is life. This is home with your kids.

Travis Thomas  24:27

You know, talking to I talk to salespeople all the time, I’m like, Alright, you’re in a sales call. Right? Here’s on a sales call. Are you thinking about “I can’t believe I just said that. I totally flipped that or why I really need to close the sale. I don’t know am I going to close the sale?” You’re you’re thinking about the win or you’re thinking about the then right thinking about the past few years thinking about the future? Where do you need to be fully engaged in the moment in the moment is if you’re fully engaged on on the on the client or the person that you’re talking to? There’s so much information that’s being shared in the present moment, but if I’m thinking this again, what improv taught me was as soon as my thoughts starts to go, past or future I’m no longer engaged in so I’m missing key information, education.

Brett Gilliland  25:07

And that’s huge.

Travis Thomas  25:08

And so for a player, right, it’s like, oh, shoot, I’m distracted. How do I get back to the present moment? Well, there’s lots of different tools. But I given the mantra, just just tell yourself, where’s the ball? Where do I need to be? Because now I go, where’s the ball? The ball is there. “Where do I need to be?” is action based, oh I need to push up or I need to make a run? Or I need to go win a tackle or I need all of a sudden now you’re you’re you’re thinking about what do I need to do instead of what happened? Or is what what is going to happen?

Brett Gilliland  25:35

That’s incredible, you know, I’m I go to soccer games now, all the time. I got four boys. So pretty much if I’m not here at the office, I’m at a soccer field. Right? Okay. So that’s where I go. And I’ll be there tonight. But you’re right. And it’s like, even as fans, we can do that. But let’s let’s pivot from the soccer field and go into the home life.

Travis Thomas  25:52

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  25:53

And so with four kids, it’s crazy, right? It’s can be nuts. You’ve got I think you said three kids. Right, good. So how, what advice would you have for the parent to take what you just talked about for the soccer player, and apply that to the home right to the kitchen to the upstairs, where maybe you’re putting the kids to bed, it’s chaos, all that kind of stuff. And as your kids get older, that gets a little bit easier, right? But it’s still crazy.

Travis Thomas  26:15

Yeah. So what we’re, what we’re always striving for, is to be present, right is to be present with whatever we’re doing. And so, so again, your your home life, there’s tons of going on, tons going on, you got young kids, you got trying to make dinner, trying to bedtime you got maybe you’re still trying to do stuff from work, you had all these different moving parts going on. And the only thing that allows you to be successful is by focusing on what’s happening right now. So, so again, so how do we do that? So, again, I’m not a sports psychologist, but I teach mental skills. And I like to break it down and make it really, really simple because I’m not a complex guy. So I want to make things as simple as possible. And to me, the when we talk about mental skills or mental toughness, all we’re really talking about is the ability to bring our full attention to whatever activity we’re doing in the present moment. That is it. So when someone says, oh, my gosh, that play are you so mentally tougher, she’s so mentally tough. What they’re saying is, if they’re a soccer player, when they’re playing soccer, they’re fully engaged in what they’re doing. They’re not being distracted by the noise that’s going on around them. So optimal performance to me is when you bring your peak ability with wherever you are today, with your peak attention, you combine those combining skill and attention is your optimal performance. Well, so at home, right, there’s lots of distractions going on all this stuff that needs to be done. But all we can really do is one thing at a time. And so it’s, it’s it’s making, that the world is too big. We need to make it small. And so it’s our ability to always ask ourselves what’s you know, there’s a there’s an acronym, a great sports acronym W I N, what’s important now? asking ourselves, what’s the more most important thing I need to be focusing on right now? All right, well, we got dishes. We got laundry, we got us. Yeah, but what’s happening right now? Okay, well, I’m putting my five year old to bed. All right. So can I just put my five year old to bed? Right. So I’m putting my five year old to bed all our five year old wants is full attention. Dads listening to me. Alright, Dad’s gonna read me a story. All right, can I be fully engaged while I’m reading the story? Right? All that other stuff is waiting for me. But can I be engaged with what I’m doing? Put the five year old down, great, boom, all right, what’s the next? What’s the next thing that I do? And we bring our full focus to that. But we’re humans. And so we’re constantly going to be distracted. So the, the goal––

Brett Gilliland  28:44

but isn’t it I keep interrupting? I’m sorry. But I think it’s amazing is when you say that I’m just you know, putting a lot of the boys to bed and do storytime and all that stuff over the years. And it’s funny when you say it, because you’re right when I am in the moment, right? Yeah, I’m using air quotes. And I’m not really in the moment. And I’m thinking about maybe I need to read this book. But you know, you just want to get to that next thing, I gotta do this, you gotta do that. It actually takes longer to put them to bed. It is right. To stay in the moment with them though, and actually do the storytime and do all that stuff. It’s actually a more efficient process too.

Travis Thomas  29:17

it’s more efficient, and it’s more peaceful.

Brett Gilliland  29:19

Yeah.  Yeah. A lot more peaceful.

Travis Thomas  29:19

Right. Because we’re not because we’re not thinking about the distractions, right. The reason distractions are distractions, because it’s getting us to think about lots of different things instead of the one thing that we’re doing. And so when we actually focus on the one thing that we’re doing, the stress and the anxiety and all the other things don’t really impact us because we’re just thinking about what we’re doing. Right? We’re just like, we’re turning the volume down on all the distractions, they’re still there, right? We’re just turning the volume down. The only reason what we, what we focus on we amplify. Yeah, right? Whatever we focus on, we amplify. So if I focus on what I’m doing, I’m amplifying what I’m doing. And if I’m if I’m, whatever I’m thinking about is what I was what I am amplifying that as well. And now I’m thinking about that. Well, I mean, that’s a distraction. So, so when we think about the distractions, we just amplify the distractions, it’s not, our goal is not to get rid of them. It’s just to turn the volume down on them. And it’s it’s addition by subtraction, right? I bring more to what I’m doing by just focusing on one thing at a time, by letting the rest go, so all I’m ever trying to help athletes or people do with mental skills, is simplification, right? Make it simple. Don’t become the person who thinks you’re an awesome multitasker, you’re not. So think about just just just turn it into bite sized chunks. If I’m a salesman who’s getting ready to make a sales call before that call, take take a minute and say, “Okay, what are the two or three most important things for me to focus on in order to have an effective sales call?” Alright, so you can think through, okay, like, I want to make sure that I’m asking good questions, or I’m going to ask good questions, I want to make sure that I’m listening to them fully, not cutting them off listening to them fully, I’m really going to seek to understand how they’re feeling. Alright, good. I’ve got a game plan, I’m gonna focus on these two or three things. Now, there are lots of other things going on around, yes. But if I focus on these two or three things, my experience has taught me that these are important. And if I focus on these three things, I’m going to be I’m going to have an effective sales goal. And so we’re always we’re just simplifying, whatever we’re doing, and we live at a pace right now in society, where it’s one thing to the next one thing to the next. And if we don’t create the space in between each activity, even if that space, I was just doing a coaching call with a corporate group the other day, and in this zoom world we’re living in right now a lot of times people are like, “Travis, I’m going from one zoom to the next.” And I was like, “Yeah, can you even can you pause 60 seconds in between each zoom? As you finish one zoom? Give yourself a little debrief. All right. What’s the most important thing I need to take out of that call?” Capture it. And then before you start the next zoom call, can you do a reboot and say, “Okay, what are the two or three most important things for me to focus on this next call in order for it to be a good call it turning the page?” Yeah. And just build those breaks in between everything that we do athletes is the same thing, right? From school to sport, to homework, right? School? Can we give ourselves a break? Sport? Can we give ourselves a break moving on? And the analogy I heard, which was great, which is music without the pauses in between notes is just noise. Right?

Brett Gilliland  32:44

That’s true.

Travis Thomas  32:44

What makes music beautiful is the space in between the notes. And so if there’s no space, if it’s just note, note, note, note, note, note, note, it’s just noise. And our life is the same way to create the pause in the gaps, which allow us to process what has happened and also be intentional about the next thing that we’re doing.

Brett Gilliland  33:03

It makes, it makes me think about something I’ve done and probably see these journals if you’re watching back over here. And so is I say, slow down to speed up and use this teaching think time. And I think it’s so important for that pause between the notes is, is I’ve never heard it like that. And that’s so true. And so I think, when you think about the world class, business people, the world class athletes that you get to connect with and help and study really even as well, what are you finding for them from either a breathing standpoint, a slowing down to speed up think time? You know, like, I use my other journal all the time, like, what do you see in there? That’s, that’s a game changer for those folks.

Travis Thomas  33:40

Yeah, I think to go back to just what we were talking about is a real, a real clear sense of, of priority. Right? Always, you know, keeping the main thing, the main thing. So even though, right, the, the higher you sort of rise and importance, whatever that means you have a lot more that you’re responsible for. So the temptation would be that you’re just being constantly pulled in so many different directions. And what I’ve seen, you know, from great leaders, whether it’s, you know, the national team coaches that get to work with or are really high level CEOs is the ability to make sure that they’re really clear on what the top priorities are. And, and the next step is their ability to be really, really present in whatever they’re doing. And knowing that it’s nonstop, but knowing that the only way to be effective is by bringing their full presence to what they’re doing right now. And again, I see this with the national team coach, it’s like I can’t fathom the amount of responsibility that’s on his plate, but when you’re with him, you feel like he is completely present with whatever we’re doing right now. And so the only the only way that you can maintain that is by actually being really clear on what the top priorities are, and making sure that those guiding values, principles priorities are sort of guiding everything, right. And so again, when I, when I work with an organization, I just had a call today with a potential team I might be working with in the future. And we’re talking about culture and creating an identity, that clarity of being really clear on who we are and what we’re about, right? And make that as super simple as possible. What are those three core values? What is the main identity of who we are and what we’re about? And now how do we take those values and turn those into behaviors? And then how do we consistently replicate that behavior day in and day out day in and day out, making sure that everything that we’re doing is tied into those core values. And we can do that in our own personal life as well. Again, the reason I have a purpose statement is so that I have that Northstar, so that I have that compass. So when I do feel overwhelmed, I can ask myself, how is this connected to my purpose? And if there’s not a strong connection to my purpose, this might be something that on itself is a fine activity. But for me, maybe it’s just more of a distraction right now. So maybe I need to say “no” to it.

Brett Gilliland  36:17

Yeah. And you say that now because you had this experience. And so for that person that’s in that grind, and then what I’d call the crap work that we both have had to do in our careers. I think, you know, for me, yours is authentic brilliance, right is kind of the end of your tagline. And, and that’s what this year is that future greater than your past is we are firm mission, my mission is to help people achieve a future greater than your past.

Travis Thomas  36:39

Yep.

Brett Gilliland  36:39

It doesn’t just come to you. But I think working on yourself, in that 10 year journey, right? Oh, that is how you figure that out?

Travis Thomas  36:48

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  36:48

And so to the people, like, how do you find your mission? Your mission is found by rolling up your sleeves, putting on your work boots, and going out and making things happen, but also studying being a student in the game reading, doing different things like that? Would you agree?

Travis Thomas  37:00

Absolutely. And, you know, it’s whenever I try not to give advice, as a coach, right? You try not to be an advice giver, you try to you try to be you try to listen and, and help, you know, create clarity through questions and through understanding and but you know, I definitely have young people come to me all the time and say, “Hey, Travis, what do you think I should do? I’ve got this option, or I got this option.” And really, the question I always go back to is of these possibilities or opportunities, which one excites you the most? On a personal level? Which one excites you the most? Because, because, again, I go back to if we follow if we follow our curiosity, right? That’s a good indicator that we’re probably following some authentic purpose that we have, right? And, and even if even if things aren’t going well, if, if we’re interested in curious, there’s probably a certain sense of fulfillment to it. And maybe that curiosity leads to another cure. And again, if I just look at my own journey, it was, I was constantly, even at the most desperate of times, I was still following curiosity that I felt resonated with, with my purpose. And so you know, as as a as a freelance worker, I wake up more days, during the, during the year unemployed than employed.

Brett Gilliland  38:30

Where’s that next check.

Travis Thomas  38:33

But when when I’m doing work on a day to day basis, that that is intrinsically purpose driven. I’m still fulfilled even on the days when I’m not making money. And so that fulfillment is, is the constant because because it’s deeply rooted and ingrained with who I am. And so the money will come and go, and hopefully this success will will incrementally continue to increase and the financial successful, will incrementally continue to increase all along this journey. And as terrifying as this journey has been even at its worst, I still had a sense of, you know, this is who I am. And this is what I’m supposed to be doing. And that’s passing that pillow test. You know, go to bed at night.

Brett Gilliland  39:22

Yeah. Yeah, that’s huge. And so. So when you think about fears, I asked a lot of people this question is we put a lot of fears up our minds in false evidence appearing real. It’s what it stands for. A lot of people say, right, and so how do you how many of the fears you’ve put in your mind have actually blown up to the magnitude you put them in your mind to be?

Travis Thomas  39:44

Very few of them? Right. Very few. I think the fears this is a this was a Tim Ferriss exercise that he had talked about in one of his books a long time ago and he is talking about fear and he would, you know, a lot of times when we have these these scary fears, we try to avoid them. We don’t want I don’t want to think about him. And he’s like, actually, you know, when you notice these be these big fears that pop up. He’s like, basically follow that path. Go with it. All right? Ask yourself, okay, if this were to happen, what would happen? He’s like, you know, he’s like, “alright, I start a company, and it doesn’t work out as being I go bankrupt.” He goes, then what would I do? And he’s like, “alright, I would be broke. So I might have to ask a friend or family member if I can sleep on their couch.” And he’s like, “Would I be able to do that?” And he’s like, “Yeah, I’d be able to do that. Would it stink? Yeah, it would stink.” He’s like, well, “then what would I do?” And he’s like, “I would, I would probably start, you know, working on the next opportunity.” And so he kind of does, like, “alright, if the worst case scenario were to happen, what would happen? How would I respond to it?” Right. And, and that’s when you can sort of look, sort of some of these fearful things, you know, you know, in the face and go, okay, yeah, if that worst thing happened to would I still be okay. And I think like, I feel like I’ve been able to do that over the years, because then then it forces you, Brett, to get really, really clear on what is the most important things in my life. And I remember my wife and I, having some of these difficult conversations over the years, especially early on, you know, we we couldn’t afford to live in our house anymore in Florida, and which is why we had to come back up to St. Louis was like 2008, which was egoicly, just very humbling, you know, and for me, you know, as a father of three, to feel like a big failure, I had to really grapple with, you know, my identity and a sense of failure. And I just remember having a conversation with her feeling gutted for having to take our family out of our home, which we loved. And it’s remember, you know, we were talking I said, you know, you all are the most important thing, and I know that we’re going to be okay, or we’re going to the three, the five of us, we’re going to be okay. So regardless of what happens, what we have to do, as long as we’re okay, we’re okay. And it just, it forces you to get really granular to like, okay, at the end of the day, what’s most important?

Brett Gilliland  42:16

How do you get through that though? So so you’re there? You’re on a, I call them a dark day?

Travis Thomas  42:21

Yeah super.

Brett Gilliland  42:21

How did you, yes, super dark, like pitch black dark?

Travis Thomas  42:24

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  42:24

How do you? How do you get through that, though? Because there’s somebody listening this right now? Probably, that’s in a dark day. Yeah. And so how do you get through that on days you don’t even want to do it? I don’t want to get up. I don’t want to go work in my purpose. You know, screw you this, yeah. What do you do?

Travis Thomas  42:40

Yeah, yeah. Yeah, there will be days where you don’t do anything.

Brett Gilliland  42:47

Which you have to learn to be okay with.

Travis Thomas  42:48

That to be learned to be okay, with and, you know, it was Einstein, I think it was Einstein said that, that the only time a person makes a real change is when the fear of doing nothing is greater than the fear of change. Right? Right.

Brett Gilliland  43:05

Yep.

Travis Thomas  43:06

And so I think all of us experienced that. And so there will be days from someone who’s listening to this, they’re like, I can’t right, I, I don’t know what to do today so I’m going to do nothing. And so there will become a moment where it’s like, what the fear of doing nothing is now greater than the fear of actually taking that scary step. And moving forward. And so, you know, in those in those darkest times, for me, you know, I, you know, had gone through a lot of courses on personal development, I had a coach and I had a mentor. And I remember him just saying to me, when I was doing no work making zero money, you know, living with our in laws, and he was like, “Alright,” he’s like, “Travis, what would it look like, if you got up every day? And spent two hours in your office doing your work?” I was like, but “I don’t have any work.” He’s a “no, no, I’m not talking about that work,” you know, he’s like, “I’m talking about your purpose work.” Or you spend two hours being really intentional, about, you know, focusing on who you are, and the work that you want to do, and doing whatever that looks like today, the personal work and internal work. And, and though those were, those were the times those were the years where, you know, I was probably doing two and a half to three hours a day of of commitments of micro commitments of things that I knew was allowing me to grow personally and individually so that when, you know, the work opportunities come along, I’m ready for them. I’m ready for themm because we can’t control when it’s like the fireman’s mentality. You don’t know when the fire is coming, but it’s coming. So what are you doing in the time before the fire comes to prepare you to handle the fire when it actually happens? And that’s that sort of that the uncertain discipline that you have to take advantage of those times. So when the call does come have you, are you prepared to handle it?

Brett Gilliland  44:59

And I would call it street cred to right because it’s like, if you’re gonna be here with these world class soccer players, these world class business people, I gotta know that you went and did it. I want to know that I don’t want you to just say “oh I read this in the book last week, and it sounded cool in here, try this one,” like, I want you to know. And so for me, I call it focus 90. And so every 90 days, I have a different set of goals of things I need to work about, right. So, you know, come October 1, I will have my new set for October, November, December. But I will, I will review what just happened in the last three months and say, “okay, they may be different, they may be the same, but here’s what I need to work on to be better,” right. And then I have my first 90 minutes of every single day working on those things. And I find that when I can, when my mornings,

Travis Thomas  45:46

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  45:46

I can win the day. But I can also help more people win their day, and help myself and others live a future greater than their past. And so

Travis Thomas  45:54

Absolutely.

Brett Gilliland  45:55

That’s for me, what works. So what is it for you now for that type of stuff?

Travis Thomas  45:59

Yeah, I mean, you know, what you’re talking about is, is is walking the walk, and you know, you know, and you know, this as a parent, right? It’s, am I, am I modeling the behavior that I’m trying to parent? Right? It’s less important, what I say to my kids, what’s more important is how I actually how I actually behave and perform so. So someone who teaches mental skills, how often do my kids see me getting frustrated? And in displaying a victim mindset, right? They see plenty, right? So, so Wow, why why would I expect anyone to listen to me? Why would I expect my kids if so, there’s a there’s a clear sense of accountability every single day, with with my work. And so when I’m, when I’m, when I’m coaching, you know, world class athletes, when I’m working with a coaching staff, it’s like, okay, are we are we mentoring, the behaviors? Are we modeling the behaviors that we expect our players, our kids, our coworkers to model? And so like you said, you’re always you’re always focusing on the internal work, because it’s the internal work that allows us to do the external work. And if we’re not doing the internal work, we can’t expect the external work and having to grow at all.

Brett Gilliland  47:15

Yeah.

Travis Thomas  47:15

And so I love I love the 90 right? that it’s every 90 days, and then you’re giving yourself 90 minutes to do it every day, is just a great way and it keeps it fresh. And it keeps it you know, it keeps it always moving.

Brett Gilliland  47:29

Well, you gotta like it. 90, 90 minute soccer game, right?

Travis Thomas  47:31

Absolutely.

Brett Gilliland  47:33

Let’s talk a little bit about your company. What you’ve created is Live Yes And. Yeah, I love that. Tell me more about it.

Travis Thomas  47:40

So Yes And is the basis of improvisation, right. So I didn’t create Yes And but anyone who’s taken an acting class, anyone who’s done any improvisation, the first thing you learn is the Yes and the And so, I can teach anyone that I can teach you to improvise right now. Brett, right. So so you and I are going to we’ll tell the story.

Brett Gilliland  48:00

Okay.

Travis Thomas  48:01

Right? We’re going to pretend that we’re going on like some road trip this weekend. So whatever I say to you, the first thing you’re gonna say is yes. And you’re going to build off of whatever idea I gave you. And therefore you’re going to give me an idea back? And I’m going to say “yes and” and build off of whatever idea you give me. So we’re just––

Brett Gilliland  48:20

Getting the creative juices flowing here.

Travis Thomas  48:21

We’re just creating the story one “yes and” at a time, right. And we’re only ever focusing on the new information that was given to us. Make sense?

Brett Gilliland  48:30

Yes.

Travis Thomas  48:30

Awesome. All right. Here we go. So Brett, man I’m so excited about the road trip we’re taking this weekend.

Brett Gilliland  48:35

Yes. And I am too and I can’t wait because I’ve never been to this place before where we’ve played golf.

Travis Thomas  48:41

Yes, you are going to take me on the best golf courses in the southeast.

Brett Gilliland  48:46

In the southeast. I love the southeast. So yes, and and and so we’re going to go down to Florida and we’re going to play this place called the Floridian, which is a great golf course a lot of PGA members come to.

Travis Thomas  48:56

Yes. And I heard that you’ve invited one of your professional friends that are going to join us.

Brett Gilliland  49:01

I have and that friend is an amazing athlete and his name, he played for the St. Louis Cardinals, and he’s a great golfer, and we’re gonna have a lot of fun with him.

Travis Thomas  49:10

Yes, and I am a huge Cardinals fan, as well. And while we’re down there, he’s gonna take us to some spring training games.

Brett Gilliland  49:17

I love that. And so yes, let’s do that. And let’s also talk to him about getting back up to the end of the year. And we’ll see [] 800 home run or 700 home run. How’s that sound?

Travis Thomas  49:27

Yes. And I heard he’s gonna put some tickets aside for us for all of St. Louis’s last home game so we can hopefully see 700.

Brett Gilliland  49:34

Yes, and it’s going to be the actual tickets stub, but not this thing on your phone that you don’t get to keep for the rest of your life. And we’re going to sit in the green seats. We’re gonna have a lot of fun.

Travis Thomas  49:42

Yes. And I know the the head concession guy in Busch Stadium and he’s going to hook us up with any concessions we want during the game.

Brett Gilliland  49:49

I love that Yes. And I know the guy. Yes. Okay, so you just, you just keep going.

Travis Thomas  49:53

There we go. So yes, and what does yes and mean from an improvisational standpoint? So you and I, you can improvise now because you can “yes and” that’s it. Right? So two or more performers get up on stage, we’re creating something. We have no idea where the story is gonna go. We can’t because I don’t know what you’re thinking you don’t know what I’m thinking. But as long as we adhere to “Yes, and” we’re gonna figure it out, we’re gonna go there together. So yes, is acceptance. Whatever I say to you, whatever you say to me the yes is yes, I accept that idea as reality. But we don’t stop there. The and is, and I’m going to build off of your idea with another idea. And then yes, and and then yes. And and yes. And so the story can absolutely go anywhere. Because we’re adhering to there is no wrong answer. There’s no wrong answer, right? We’re creating it on the spot, right? Hey, it’s never been done before. All right, as long as we “yes, and” we’re going to be on the same page. And we’re going to create it together. Right? So that’s improvisation and then any other performance that comes in, they’re going to “Yes, and” their ideas, and we’re going to get saying their ideas. And so from an improvisational standpoint, the reason like I go back to like, how did they do that? How did they create that magic on stage? Well, they were operating from a mindset of, we’re here to make each other look good. It’s actually an improv improviser’s mantra is my goal is to make my other performers look good. Yeah. What’s their goal? To make me look good? And so yes, and is is the rule, or the principle that allows that allows that to happen.

Brett Gilliland  51:30

So makes me think about I’m having an off site retreat with our executive team and some of our other teammates tomorrow. And so, you know, I’ve got my black drawing here a bunch of questions, right to think about the future, I think what was the stat I wrote down this morning that in 1955, in 1955 435, of the Fortune 500 companies are gone. So 87% of the Fortune 500 companies are gone.

Travis Thomas  51:56

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  51:56

From there. So so how are we staying relevant? Yeah, what are we doing to evolve? Because our industry will change? You look at Blockbuster versus Netflix, how do you how do you evolve or not evolve? And so when I hear this, “yes, and” being tomorrow, is an improv with our team. “Yes, yes, we can do that, and.”

Travis Thomas  52:14

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  52:15

And yes, and then it’s almost going around the room, and seeing what we can create, inside our firm for our clients and for our advisors.

Travis Thomas  52:23

Absolutely. So what you’re gonna do is you’re going to tap into the collective genius of the group. Yeah, “yes, and” allows you to tap into the collective genius of your team. But we only do that, Brett, if we are actually genuinely interested in the perspectives of the people that we work with, whether that’s our kids, whether that’s our coworkers, whether that’s our sports team. So “yes, and” allows us to say, “yes, I want I care about your perspective, your perspective is different than mine.” What do we tend to do when we run into someone who has a different perspective than us? Yeah, we tend to want to convince them that our perspective is better.

Brett Gilliland  52:57

And you can’t stop. So tomorrow, there’s six people sitting around the table. Yeah, we can have the six people talking about it, and just go around the room. Again, a circle keeps going.

Travis Thomas  53:05

And you can set parameters around this. So when I when I when I consult this from a, from a from a team or a corporate standpoint, people are like, “well, Travis, I mean, can’t say yes, and everything” as “I know you can’t, of course, this is not a literal, everyone’s idea is a good idea. Everyone’s idea is not a good idea. But the way you get to the good ideas is by getting through the bad ideas.” And actually, someone collaborating with a bad idea and turn it into a good idea because they’re bringing their perspective to it.

Brett Gilliland  53:29

The creative side to right? The creative side, you maybe didn’t even think about it, but it’s not a formal deal. You wouldn’t even have thought about this.

Travis Thomas  53:36

you know, growing up, right? Well, this is a Reese’s commercial. And we’re kids. Hey, you put your chocolate in my peanut butter. No, you put your peanut butter in my chocolate. Oh, wait, we put them together? We got a great even better product. It’s a yes, and right? Reese’s was “yes, and.’ Chocolate and peanut butter, put together we have a better thing. And so yes, and just allows what we’re talking about is we’re creating an atmosphere for collaboration. And “yes, and” creates an atmosphere for collaboration. Most of us are used to environments where everything is “no, but.” “Ah no, we’ve tried that before. And ah that’s going to be too expensive. I don’t think we can.” So all you’re doing is you’re creating a space to allow the freedom of ideas and information and creativity to happen from that space, you can then move into a critical, okay, well, based on the parameters that we do have, how do we take that? Okay, 90% of these ideas we can’t use but we’ve just mined 10% of gold that can actually we can take to move forward with and turn into really practical solutions.

Brett Gilliland  54:38

I wrote that down to is the “yes, and” versus the living. Most people live in “no, but” cause you’re right!

Travis Thomas  54:44

Yeah, it’s it’s, I’m uncomfortable when someone has a different perspective than me. That’s human nature. It’s survival. Right? If I go outside of the cave, and I hear a noise, I don’t know what that noise is. I go into fear I go into protection. I go into survival mode. So we’re we’re kind of conditioned to do, to be uncomfortable with someone else’s different ideas, anything different than us is uncomfortable. But if I’ve, if I can create a safe environment where I’m curious when I hear a different perspective, and because I care about you, as a teammate, or a coworker, I go “oh Brett, actually, I don’t know if I agree with that, or if I understand you helped me understand where you’re coming from.” And now we’re in now, in essence, where we’re actually building that trust and respect as a team. Because I actually care about your perspective that’s different than mine, and in the process of us getting into that we’re actually protecting ourselves from the blind spots that we have, when we sometimes accidentally create cultures of everyone who thinks the same way.

Brett Gilliland  55:42

And my mind is blown on this, I’m already going on picture myself in the room, we’re going to be in tomorrow, and you can’t stop and nobody can challenge the idea.

Travis Thomas  55:51

You can set that primary goal, “okay, for the next 15 minutes. Let’s get out as many ideas as possible.” One rule is, when someone has an idea, no one is allowed to say, “Whoa, no, no, no, this isn’t the space for that.” And then you can say after this, let’s look at the ideas and then we can start to look at it more critically. So you can create parameters around that.

Brett Gilliland  56:11

Yeah, yeah.

Travis Thomas  56:12

And this is go back to the “yes, and,” the “yes, and” from a, from a collaborative storytelling standpoint, that’s how it works. Right? We’re, we’re in agreement that we’re going to create this together. Well, the reason I called my consulting Live, Yes, And is because if you look back, if you look back to my journey, kind of from 2005, to be starting Live, Yes, And the Yes, And is, became my mantra for life. Right, which is whatever is happening I have to Yes, And it right. You’re in debt Travis? Yes, I’m in debt. And I guess I have to I guess we have to leave our home and go take this job in St. Louis, because this is the best possible response to the situation. So yes, it’s acceptance. Again, it’s acceptance of what is happening, hey––

Brett Gilliland  56:59

Good or bad.

Travis Thomas  57:00

Good or bad? Good. Or it doesn’t matter. Right? Good or bad doesn’t matter. Yes, it’s acceptance. The so I tell people, we cannot control 100% of what happens to us, none of it, none of it. I can do everything right. And still get a pandemic dropped on my lap. I can do everything right. And still have someone come con me out of whatever, right I can, I can do everything right and eat everything right and still get diagnosed with a sickness. So I cannot control 100% of what happens to me. And I get to control 100% of how I respond to it. That’s the and. The and is where we have power. And so I, I go through life. Yes. And yes. And yes. And this is happening. Yes. And how would I respond to it if, I if I were on purpose is so if we go back to purpose being our compass, if we’re always making every next right step, neutral thinking I’ve worked for limitless minds as well. We talked about neutral thinking and then taking the next right step. If I accept everything that’s happening, well, now I’m, I’m in collaboration with reality, so I call living Yes, And being in radical collaboration with reality. Right? Because it’s what’s happening, right? So I can, I can complain about it. Blame, complain, make excuses, the longer I stay there, I’m just stuck. Totally valid. Yep. Yep, I’m a human. This shouldn’t have happened. Why did it happened? This is unfair. This is painful. This is tragic. This is cruel. Yeah, all that stuff. And the longer I stay there, I’m just stuck. And as soon as I accept my circumstance, and have my response be from that position of purpose, I’m now taking that next step towards problem solving. So the reason my book is called “Three Words for Getting Unstuck,” is is to live that Yes, And getting stuck makes you human. Staying stuck, makes you a victim.

Brett Gilliland  59:05

And I love the fact that you put live in it. It’s not just “Yes, and” because you got to live it.

Travis Thomas  59:10

I gotta live it right. And so yeah, you know, the gift, the gift and everything is, to your point earlier, what is my street cred is? Yeah, Travis tell me about being like, you know, 30, 40, $50,000 in debt with a family of five and, and having no godly idea of how things were going to work out. How to do that. Oh, yeah, that’s a good question. How did I do that? I don’t know. But it was like, What can I do today? What can I do today, trust to action. Take the next step. Trust, faith, take the next step.

Brett Gilliland  59:46

So  where do our listeners find more of Travis Thomas? Man, this has been phenomenal and got tons of takeaways from this but where are we find more of you?

Travis Thomas  59:54

You can go to by my outdated website, which is liveyesand.com You can find me on most social media @liveyesand this is a fun thing. My son my 15 year old son, I’ve got a 17 year old son 20 year old daughter. They’ve been trying to get me on Tik Tok forever. I’ve been I’m like, I can’t learn another social media. I’m on Instagram all the time. I don’t want to learn another social media. My son’s like, “Dad, look at this guy. You should be on Tik Tok.” I said, “Alright, listen.” His name’s Shepherd. “I was like Shepherd, if you manage the Tik Tok, you’ll be my intern. You manage tick tock and I’ll do it.” So I’ve been on tick tock for a week. Apparently some of the videos do a really well. So he’s like, “Alright, give me a video on this.” He films me. He takes it so I’m gonna I’m on Tik Tok now.

Brett Gilliland  1:00:35

You’re a Tik Toker.

Travis Thomas  1:00:38

And then my book that I’ve referenced a few times, “Three Words for Getting Unstuck: Live Yes And” is on Amazon.

Brett Gilliland  1:00:43

Well, Travis Thomas it’s been awesome having you man. We’ll put all this in the show notes where people can find it and just love the conversation. We’ll have to do this again.

Travis Thomas  1:00:50

Hey, thanks for having me. I’ll come back to the studio any time Brett.

Brett Gilliland  1:00:52

Let’s do it.

Joining The Circuit of Success for a second time since October of 2021, Marty Strong is back again to continue sharing his wisdom behind perfecting business processes and embracing the dreamer within. Marty is a retired Navy SEAL officer and combat veteran, as well as a novelist, practicing CEO, and Chief Strategy Officer. He authored Be Nimble: How the Creative Navy SEAL Mindset Wins on the Battlefield and in Business. His second book, Be Visionary: Strategic Leadership in the Age of Optimization is set for release in January 2023. Marty’s newest book applies his life experiences, formal education, and hands-on knowledge to demonstrate how proactive thinking and the application of thoughtful vision is the essence of exceptional leadership.

EPISODE TRANSCRIPTION

Brett Gilliland  00:02

Welcome to the Circle of Success. I’m your host, Brett Gilliland, and today I’ve got a repeat guest. So we don’t, we don’t do that too often, Marty. So that was a lot of fun last time back in, aired October 4, 2021. We have Marty Strong with us. Marty, how’re you doing today?

Marty Strong  00:19

Doing pretty good, Brett.

Brett Gilliland  00:20

Good, well it’s good to be with you and you know what I’m fired up about today is we’re going to talk about this new book you got coming out here. It’s called “Be Visionary,” and so when you gotta name Visionary Wealth Advisors of your company, and you got a guy with a book called “Be Visionary,” it’s just made as a recipe for success today isn’t it?

Marty Strong  00:39

Yeah, it’s like a marriage. Think of matchmaking, matchmaking in heaven!

Brett Gilliland  00:43

That’s right, right here today on The Circuit of Success. Well, those people that did not get to dial in in October of 2021, last time we spoke, Marty is a retired Navy SEAL officer and combat veteran. He’s a novelist, a practicing CEO, a chief strategy officer, you’ve got your other book “Be Nimble,” how the creative Navy SEAL mindset wins on the battlefield and in business. And in this book, as we just mentioned, “Be Visionary: Strategic Leadership in the Age of Optimization” is coming out January of 2023. I know you’re a thought leader, and you’re talking all over the world and doing things and helping tons of people. So thanks for being with us. But if you could maybe just give us again, a little background who Marty Strong is, and what continues to make you the man you are today.

Marty Strong  01:31

Okay, well, I’m from the humble state of Nebraska. My parents were, I guess, farm kids, for the most part, my dad was definitely a depression era farm, farm kid, large family, etc. So they had a, they both had a very, very strong work ethic, a real blue collar approach, even though my dad ended up getting a degree later on, and eventually spending 30 years working for the government thing, he was the deputy director of Walter Reed, when he retired, he never, you know, he never left that early part of his life. And that’s what he imparted to me, my brothers and sisters, this kind of, you know, return the tool in better condition than you borrowed it, you know, be polite, a lot of the Golden Rule kind of application, but very strictly applied, and take care of things that you’ve been given and appreciate the people that are helping you and the people around you. So that essentially was my value system. And that’s what I walked into the Navy in the mid 70s with and kind of stumbled into the SEAL team selection process, and ended up spending 20 years in that business, so that, in that role.

Brett Gilliland  02:44

Traveled the world chasing bad guys in that role, man, and appreciate and thankful for your service, you guys are amazing at what you do. So we can talk about a lot of stuff today, but one of the things I want to talk about when we spoke, you know, almost a year ago, the world was still, you know, somewhat shut down, obviously was kind of opening back up. But what have you seen now and all the leaders that you’re helping, but also the companies that you’re running? What have you been seeing as the biggest difference today, now that the world, you know, basically is back up and running and making things happen?

Marty Strong  03:18

Well, I think there’s, there’s two kinds of disruption that occurred with a pandemic and by all definitions, the pandemic was a black swan, nobody, there are people paid to anticipate epidemics and pandemics, but nobody really anticipated this particular one. And it’s not so much that it was because of the virus, the way a virus was spread, or the medical aspects of it. It was the political and governmental aspects of it.

Brett Gilliland  03:43

Yeah.

Marty Strong  03:43

We’ve never really had a either an epidemic or a pandemic, where our governments both state, local and federal, just started shutting things down and shutting people down and shutting movement in commerce down. And then it wasn’t consistent because of the way the states are laid out, politically, it wasn’t consistent across the whole country. So if you’re a CEO, like I am, and I’ve got one country, one company that’s in 21 different states, and Japan and other companies in seven states, you had this kind of topsy turvy, you know, reaction to COVID. And to each state’s rules, whether they’re very stringent or very, very loose. And we thought we were pretty stable, we were still growing in both companies through ’21, which we kind of pat ourselves on the back a bit, able to hold it all together and still grow a little bit. But then the vax mandate came out September 16 of ’21, and the mandate applied to all government employees, all military, all government contracting employees and companies, and all health care workers. Well, I manage a government contracting company and a health care company. So we were a little bit too soon on that patting of have our backs because suddenly I found out that about half of my entire, about 1000 people population were not vaccinated. And about 40% basically told us when we’re not gonna get vaccinated.

Brett Gilliland  05:13

Yeah.

Marty Strong  05:14

So and so that was, that was my real kind of black swan event inside of the bigger black swan event because everything up to that point we had figured out we’d managed we’d retooled, reshaped, restructure, re-envisioned the companies we were doing business, I sent everybody home in March of 2020, and I’ve only got about 16 people out of 58 that were in the main office managing these companies now, I shrunk down from 21,000 square feet of office space, and a couple locations down to 6,800. Embraced all that, right, change, move, do all those things I write about, and then all of a sudden, there’s this decision that everybody has to have a vaccine or else they can’t work. And so that really created a crisis for us there in in September. So, and again, every state, and a lot of our government, and government agencies and the department of defense, they all kind of reacted either very aggressively about the new rule, or said, “Don’t worry about it.” So it was it was all over the place. And in the healthcare side, there wasn’t actually a deadline expressed. So the whole healthcare market was going well, “do we have to everybody backed by tomorrow, by next week, 10 days, 20 days next year?” Yeah, it was, it was a mess. And that was the biggest, so far, the biggest impact to COVID the pandemic on the business, because everything else that’s happened, it really has either been a positive or neutral to the two businesses.

Brett Gilliland  06:39

You know, it’s pretty hard to go out and replace 40% of your workforce, isn’t it? I mean, my gosh.

Marty Strong  06:46

It is and they had security clearances, so that’s difficult to find those people and they had some very unique skills that the government wanted, you know, and certain credentials are going to be trainers certified by this agency, or that agency or particular program. So yeah, you couldn’t just go out there and find them all on the street. You know, the second part, which I think is hitting everybody, and this is kind of the 2022 impact is the staffing crisis. In that we always had good retention in both companies, and I talked about this with my board members, I talk about this with other business owners all the time. You know, the, the everybody’s kind of pointed the great resignation, alright, that’s the reason for it. And everybody’s still trying to get a handle on exactly what’s going on, I’ve heard that the baby boomers all started retiring around the same time as the pandemic and, and there was an accelerated advancement of the next generation, which left a big hole in the middle, and nobody’s qualified for those jobs and all kinds of crazy theories. But in reality, our, our experience has been, if you’re looking for good people, you’re gonna have to pay them what they’re worth and their worth is based on the market availability now. So those dynamics have changed because of the second kind of parallel event next to the pandemic. And I’m not sure it’s directly associated with just with the pandemic, I think the pandemic is one of those things like, like a revolution, where revolution changes the entire social fabric of the nation and just changes everything, suddenly everybody can own something where before only the king could own something, those kinds of really, you know, huge sea changes, right? I think the pandemic changed the way labor is going to be utilized in this country, and maybe around the world, depending on what, how countries address it. But so we’re still trying to get our hands on that.

Brett Gilliland  08:39

Yeah. And so I mean, what what do you see? I mean, as a leader of organizations, and you know, as an author, you’re writing great books. I mean, what, what do you see for us, other leaders and the people listening this podcast? I mean, what do you see? What do you forecast 1, 2, 3 years from now you see any big changes out there?

Marty Strong  08:54

Well I think you’re gonna end up with three different ways to, to do work. You’re gonna have traditional labor structures, like we’ve had for the last, say, 75 years, most of that is going to be related to the way the job has to be executed. So, if you have factory jobs, it’s very hard to do that from home. You can’t do that through a Cloud Function. Right? If you need like, say medicine, sure, there’s some remote medicine capabilities. I had a DaVinci surgery for kidney cancer and the doctor was in some other room, there’s just some robot working on me. But for the most part, you have to have people hands on patients, right. So that’s an area. The second category is a complete detachment untethering from a place of work, that’s virtual work and 100% of its definition, where not only is the work itself, modulated and, and self directed, but the pace of that work and the use of that day is up to the individual. If they want to work from two o’clock in the morning until six o’clock in the morning, take the rest of day off, they can do it as long as they check the boxes and execute. And then the third one’s a hybrid, something where you see a little bit of a mix of the virtual and a little bit of mix of the traditional. It’s all this has been enabled by the technology that provided these cloud based platforms for just about everything, I mean, you can, you can 3D design things now you don’t really need to have, you know, the factory sitting there for a lot of things and that’s, that’s only going to get more and more dramatic as the technology advances. Accounting, you know, we’re before we had to try to push all the accounting files, payroll files, through a, an internet server well now through cloud based things, you can go into the cloud and manipulate it and move it around up there and then move it from one cloud location to the other without worrying about the size of your, of your IT pipe in the building, etc. or at your house. Yeah, so those are those all kind of came in, in parallel with the pandemic. And also in parallel with this. The shock is this impact, the tonic shift in the way people looked at their work, and the way they looked at working for somebody else.

Brett Gilliland  09:11

So um, a different kind of question is the positive impact. You talked about flexibility, creativity, and decisiveness to achieve results, you know, in this book, and so, so talk to us about that. Let’s start with flexibility first. What is the positive impact of applying flexibility?

Marty Strong  11:23

Well, you know, the opposite of being rigid. So, there are high speed, supersonic reconnaissance aircraft, and we’ve had these since the early 1960s, that go up into the atmosphere and move it in incredible rates of speed, they actually have materials and they have the capability to expand and contract because of the different atmospheres they are going into. If you’ve had a rigid aircraft, they basically shake themselves apart and destroy themselves. With coop, because of the stresses that are under, they’re going under, at the same thing with almost anything you look at, it could be an individual, it could be the organization, it could be a particular team to a particular. So if you don’t have flexibility, you’re not going to be open to any insight, you’re not going to be open to anything new. If you’re, if you’re doing the same process and using the same systems that you used last year, you know, you could do an exercise here. Just ask, well, when when was that system put in place? And when was that process put in place? And it’s almost like a time travel thing. You go back and go, “Well, what was happening in my market, what was happening to our company?” What kind of people did we have at that time, and you’ll find them in most cases, the process and systems unless they’re dramatically challenged, stay for a long time. And they they go from being habits to traditions. And when you have a tradition, in a room of people that have been living that tradition, it’s very, very difficult to think a different way. It’s very difficult to be flexible.

Brett Gilliland  12:54

Yeah, that’s a good point, too. We do we get stuck in our little rut don’t we?

Marty Strong  12:58

Well, we yeah. First, first we either dig the rut ourselves and lay down in it, or somebody else dug it for us and we lay down on it, because we’re told to and then we just stay in it. You know, we don’t look up over the edge of the road. We don’t, we don’t do anything, but just follow rules and follow directions.

Brett Gilliland  13:14

Yeah.

Marty Strong  13:14

So flexibility is very important component to the vision and nimble leadership.

Brett Gilliland  13:20

Yeah, I think too, like we’re going, I think it’s in two weeks, I can’t remember the exact date, but I’m taking, you know, our executive leadership team, we’re all going out to an off site retreat. And you know, we’ll spend the whole day going through processes platform, you know, what the vision looks like, whether that’s 90 days from now, or three years from now, or 10 years from now. And I think that’s a really, really critical step for a leader, don’t you think? To get off, out of the office with the team slow down, so you can speed up and be flexible and learn from the things that are going really well, and the things that maybe are not going as well, that you want to improve or add to.

Marty Strong 13:58

It’s a great idea, and you’re probably in the top half of 1% of companies that do something like that. For some reason, you see it movies and TV, and you just think, well, they’re all taking these big retreats, and they’re all having these big, you know, strategic sessions and all that but very few companies do it, very few organizations of any kind, profit or nonprofit do such a thing. And I even go a step further. I, I tell everybody, I write about it. Take 20 minutes every day, every morning. And just clear your mind and envision, you know, the horizon? What do I want to be personally and professionally in two years kind of vision. What, take a moment and envision what will I look like? How much money will I make? What house will I live in? All those kinds of things, and then shift to the organization if you’re responsible as a leader in your organization, where you want the organization to look like? What do you want the alliances to look like? What do you want them to be making or doing as a service or product? If you do that every morning for about 20 minutes, it doesn’t take a lot, you don’t have to meditate to do it. You’re just gonna sit there and you think. What you’re basically doing is you’re taking the short, the short range, very short range in some people’s cases, optimizing checklist or KPI checklist, and which is a to-do list of sorts. And you’re getting it out of your head for a moment to think beyond that. Because if you don’t do something like that, and you’re not in one of the organizations like yours that does this type of retreat, what you end up doing is you end up running down this railroad track, incrementally taking little tiny steps, looking at the tips of your toes, until you get hit by the train that you didn’t see coming, because you never looked up. So yeah, I think it’s a very important thing to do.

Brett Gilliland  15:38

Yeah, it’s shocking to me that you say that half of 1%, or whatever the number you said, and it just it is shocking to hear it. But also, it’s shocking to know that a lot of people don’t do that. So somebody’s listening right now, you’re a leader of a big company, a little company, your house, I don’t care what it is, have an off site retreat, you know? I used to do them, I need to do it more often. But we do it quarterly as a firm, but I used to do one, then also personally, I would go off by myself and just think about what are the things that we need to do or I want to do, right? And then have those conversations with my wife about that stuff. And I think that’s again, that’s really really important, no matter what you’re leading, to sit down, just you a journal and in a, in an ink pen and think and strategize and dream, right?

Marty Strong  16:23

Yeah, I think the first two chapters of “Be Visionary” focus on this is more of a, your personal attention to the art of the possible, to dreaming. How often do you dream, I mean, I’m talking waking dreaming, often do you dream about a potential future? And when you start thinking about those things, you start to structure a little bit. You say alright, what I’m looking for is I’m looking for threats on the horizon, competitive threats or any other kind of threat can be a supply chain threat or something, and you’re also looking for opportunities. And it’s, it’s part of human nature, that it’s easier to see or conceive of the threat side of the equation. It’s very difficult, if I talked to people it’s very difficult for them to envision the opportunity, yet, the opportunities are critical and some of them you have to deviate or pivot from where you are now, over the course of the time between now and when you need to do this or see that opportunity. Which means you have to have a 24-month action plan––

Brett Gilliland  17:23

Right.

Marty Strong  17:23

––right to shift or whether it’s a new service line, subsidiary company an acquisition, whatever it is that you want to do to get there and, and then you have to, it’s a little bit of a leap of faith, there’s not much of a leap of faith in recognizing a threat. And there’s not much of a difficulty in telling your peers or your subordinate leadership team, you bring them in a room and say, “Hey, there’s a train coming down the track it’s going to hit us in 20 minutes.” Nobody in the room is going to argue with you about getting off the tracks. They all get it right, right? Instinctively “Oh, yeah. Well, that’s bad, what’s, what’s our plan?” You know, but if you come in and say, “Hey, I think we should buy a company that provides this special titanium part two trains.” And then you just get, you’re gonna get a bunch of blank stares, because they can’t wrap their hands around the value of it. And “why are we talking about titanium parts for trains, we don’t do trains?” Well, we do parts and other in other ways we do Dd printing, and guess what we could maybe 3D print something and take the place of a titanic composite type part, replacing it anyway, you get the point. Very, very difficult. One, for a person or a leader to go through that exercise and see both the positive and the and the negative of the future. Very, very difficult for anybody to sell the positive for the future, because people tend to lean towards risk mitigation.

Brett Gilliland  18:39

So we talked about the flexibility side of that now talking about the creativity side, to achieve results. Why is that so important?

Marty Strong  18:45

So I believe in basically three phases. And I think this is something you have to do as a lifestyle as a leadership style, and you have to do it long enough and frequently enough to make it a habit not just when there’s an emergency or, or something out of the out of the ordinary happening. So the first step is, you have to be humble, you have to achieve intellectual humility. And what that means is you have to basically forget all the victories and all the defeats that are clouding your mind, clouding your judgment, which includes all the formulas that you’ve used in the past all the things you’ve leaned on in the past, because if you don’t do that, you can’t have the second phase, the second phase won’t open up. That’s intellectual curiosity. So intellectual curiosity is the willingness with an open mind to seek information, insights, ideas, recommendations, not only from your own people, but maybe from people that don’t agree with you people outside of your organization, and, and contemplate all of that, bring all that in. To get into third phase, which is intellectual creativity. I don’t think you can truly be creative unless you’ve gone through the first two phases. What you’re basically doing is you’re saying, I’m going to apply what I know from what I’ve done in the past, or what I’ve learned in the past and college or what some guy taught me four years ago. Was it mentor, and I’m gonna say that’s the way we solve all problems. You know, it’s like the world’s a nail. And I know how to swing a hammer kind of hammer. Yeah, but But you have to do that as a regular way, as a leader, a regular way, a regular way of addressing challenges large and small. And like the 20 minute a day thing, it starts to become a habit, it starts to become a part of the way you think. And between those two, I think you’ll end up finding that you’ll be a lot more curious. Almost all the time, you’ll be seeking information and insights from a lot of different sources all the time. And that’s so you’re already kind of preset for the creativity phase.

Brett Gilliland  20:38

And then when, the last one we talked about was decisiveness. So decisiveness I mean, clearly we know we got to be able to make decisions as a leader. But when you talk about in that realm of choosing that word, decisiveness, why’d you choose that?

Marty Strong  20:53

Well, there’s two reasons. One, I come from my pedigree as a seal, the SEAL teams in the SEAL teams, and I just had a conversation on the day about this, the perception is that anybody in the military is doing whatever you saw in a World War II movie with your, with your parents or something, they’re following orders, they’re being ordered to do things they don’t want to do, their grumbling, and they contribute when they have to, but they’d rather be sleeping someplace else, you know, so you, nobody’s really making decisions below the officer level, because that’s all they’re supposed to do is follow orders. And the SEAL teams is not like that. And the SEAL teams, it’s much more like, like a band trying to put together music and lyrics, it’s so much more like a group of creatives trying to come up with a, an ad campaign related to an artistic approach to expressing something that needs to be expressed in the ad. So what you do, is you come into a room and you have all these experts, maybe anywhere from 16 to 20 guys, all experts in their little niche areas, all experienced seals, and ranging from people that have been in for two years, to people who might have been in for 20 years. So huge, huge repository of, and wealth of experience. The way you go in there to solve a problem say it’s mission planning, is you don’t go in there and say we’ve been asked to to go to this town, find this guy, and capture this guy, and bring him back for, you know, intelligence collection purposes. And this is how we’re going to do it, you lay it out and everybody goes, roger that sir. And they just walk out of the room and everyone’s gonna follow the Marty Plan.

Brett Gilliland  22:26

Yeah.

Marty Strong  22:27

It doesn’t work that way, you go in there, and you kind of set the stage for what the requirements are. And then there is a planning process as far as phases, but what’s going to happen in those phases, how are you going to get in how you’re going to get out how we’re going to move from phase one to phase two, as a wildcard brainstorming session, and it goes on for as much time as you’re allowed, based on the mission timeline. But at some point, as the officer facilitating all this input, and kind of galvanizing all these ideas and thoughts into actual planning points, you either run out of time, or you get to a point, were you just have to say pencils down. This is it, this is what we’re gonna go do. We’re gonna rehearse this, we’re gonna brief this, and then we’re gonna go execute this. So at some point, you have to make a decision, you can’t just analyze it to death, and you can’t, you know, the other, the other enemy of that which we never had in the SEAL teams, which is you don’t compromise. If one guy says we should run fast, and the other person says we should crawl slow, you don’t go, what we’re going to do is we’re going to walk at a moderate pace. None of that splitting the difference stuff makes any sense when you’re trying to get to an actual excellent outcome. So in business, you end up especially in the way, leadership and management, not so much leadership, ;eadership isn’t really taught in schools anymore, or if it ever was, but in management in the management business schools, what they teach is consensus building, compromise, crowdsourcing decisions, and you get this whole crowd coming off of this now for the last 10 years. And essentially, what it really is, it’s a way to diversify accountability so that nobody’s accountable if everybody’s accountable. That’s one kind of outcome of it. And the second thing is, when you end up with this kind of compromise, you end up with something that’s less than excellent. And if you look at anything that’s considered excellent in history, you’ll find somebody like Steve Jobs or somebody that said, “this is what we’re going after. I don’t care how you get there, your job’s to build it, this is what we’re going after.” He didn’t say, “Okay, I don’t want I don’t want a phone. You’re right. The phone’s not gonna be this big. Let’s make the phone as big as a, you know, a basketball shoe. Because you’ve gotten because you four guys disagree with me. I’m gonna go with that to make everybody feel comfortable and happy and feel like they had input.” That’s not the way excellence is achieved. So at some point, somebody’s got to be accountable, and that accountable person has to make a decision, which is decisiveness. You don’t have to be a brute. You don’t have to be a tyrant or dictator. There’s a way to do the process like I described in the SEAL teams, and you can do that in business and you’ll get better results.

Brett Gilliland  25:12

Yeah, I think too, is, you know, you mentioned Steve Jobs. I mean, so there’s a guy that right that has created so many different industries, whether it’s phone, it’s movies, it’s, you know, how we listen to music, I mean, all sorts of stuff, right? Incredible. And I don’t know if it’s in your book, or if it was a different book I was reading this morning, but it talks about if he asked the people in the early 1900s, like what they wanted, they wanted, you know, a faster horse. Right? But the Model T Ford, right? Henry Ford wanted cars, he was talking about things that people didn’t even know they wanted, they wouldn’t even of articulated “I want an automobile” because they wouldn’t do it, so how do we do that, as leaders of organizations? Now, I’m not thinking about going and creating a new car, whatever the new automobile was or with at that time, but how do we get creative enough to start to think about how do I change my industry? How do I change this thing that I’ve been doing for so long, in the same way.

Marty Strong  26:09

So I think you don’t have to take a leap of faith. You don’t have to leapfrog current reality completely. And there’s a reason for that. I mean, it took the phonograph, the TV, the automobile, decades to be adapted in a massive way, right and become an industry and all that. Now, technology moves at a much faster speed, shelf life is much shorter nowadays. But still, if you invent something that nobody needs, the second part of this is trying to get people to realize they need it.

Brett Gilliland  26:39

That’s hard to do.

Marty Strong  26:39

So that’s, yeah, that’s marketing, right? Create, create an awareness of something you have as a shortfall that this thing fills. And if you do that, you better be someplace in a well funded research center or something, because you’re not gonna be able to run a business for very long on just an idea and a sketch so. So I think you have to do it in in increments, in baby steps, but those baby steps could be 12 months out, mostly, as you know, in the entrepreneurial world, it’s innovation and not invention. Invention is something that’s completely new. And I would say the car was completely different than having an animal pulling, you know, a box with some wheels on it. But innovation happens every day. Innovation is something every company can do. And you can do it in, in services, you can do it in the way you design your organization, the way you communicate with customers or clients, the way you analyze your competition, there’s there’s an opportunity 360 degrees, seven days a week, to look for where ways that you can innovate and look for adjacent openings and opportunities to what you’re doing currently. Yeah, and so what, I’m always fascinated by this with people and leaders and you know, you’re a busy guy, you’re chasing your was it four companies that you run and all the stuff you’re doing so what is it that if I followed you around with a camera every single day that I would see no-miss items, for you Marty Strong for you, personally? You saying what am I falling short on?

Brett Gilliland  28:20

No, no, I mean like, the no-miss items that would be like, “hey, this helps me be successful.” Yeah, just if I should, if I run around to work, you gotta, you know, respond to some emails, you gotta have some meetings. Those are the things that like, what are the things that you’re just your habits man, your, your traditions, your daily disciplines are that I will see time and time again with Marty.

Marty Strong  28:39

The first thing is, like, get up at five in the morning.

Brett Gilliland  28:42

Okay.

Marty Strong  28:43

This isn’t, this isn’t, you know, ground a groundbreaking or shake, shaking kind of an idea. Lots of people do. It turns out a lot of successful people do it. I didn’t know that, I saw an article not too long ago, and they were listing all these different successful CEOs, a lot of athletes, a lot of people get up at five in the morning. One of the reasons is I can do that 20 minute exercise I told you about. And I do that 20 minute exercise and I’ve got to cover all these different companies, I have to cover my own consulting and my own books. And today, I got to look at what are we going to do next? But I want to write a third business book. Do I want to write a 10th novel? Do I not want to do any of those things? Do I want to write treatments and turn some of the novels into pitches for, for movies or for streaming content? Or do I not want to do that? These are, this is what I do early in the morning. I’m usually sitting right where I am right now, by about 5:20 with a cup of coffee. And I think through all those things and as ideas and and, and insights and and points pop into my head, I write them down. And I have a dry erase board over my shoulder. You can’t see and it’s covered with ideas. One sides got a one idea exploded out and pretty big in a kind of a big aspect, but I do that every morning and sometimes I’m reviewing what I did the day before, and some of these dreams kind of fall apart when I start throwing some real reality checks against them. So I’m pretty much––

Brett Gilliland  30:07

Can I interrupt you real quick there? So we can dive into that process. So you’re sitting in that chair right there. And you’re literally just kind of sitting there and like, whatever comes to your mind, or do you have like a journal that you’ve gone through? Or is it like, literally just kind of comes out, whatever comes out, you write it down, and then you?

Marty Strong  30:21

I change channels. So I start off with my responsibilities as a CEO and the board, the board relationship communications. And I spend probably about four or five minutes thinking through that, what can I do proactively, what can I, what can I do that will improve things? How do I want this to be better, and two months or six months, and then I shipped the channel to the government contracting company, kind of do the same thing. And then to do the same thing with a healthcare company, and then I then I shipped them, the last thing I do is I shifted my own my own business. And depending on where we are on the two operating businesses, I may spend more than five minutes on one or the other, because we may be in a moment of crisis or opportunity. And so that’s what I do. And that’s just I write the thoughts down, I don’t try to flesh them all out. Sometimes I just write a word because it’ll trigger it later. And then I get into, once I’ve done all that, so now it’s about a quarter to six. And then I spend about 30, to 40 minutes doing marketing things related to the books, things related to social media, and then I get a second cup of coffee and I open up all the emails related to my day job. And I started going through all of them, make sure that I responded to the ones that were supposed to respond to, make sure I read all the content that I’m supposed to read files attached, etc. And that kind of takes me to about 7:15 ish. And then I take a break, and I sit down with my wife, and we just talk and sometimes we watch something we record on TV for about 45 minutes, then I shower and I’m in the office by 830. So once I get in the office, and anybody that’s leading a company, who’s not actually doing the work of the company themselves, and you’re actually the salesperson or the service provider, and deliver, I found that if you can do get all your stuff ahead, you get ahead of yourself there in the morning, you walk in there, because somebody’s gonna walk up and crush your great idea what your day was gonna look like, they’re gonna come up and say, “Hey, so and so just quit,” or “hey, so and so just, you know, fell and hurt their ankle out here, do we have medical insurance?” Something’s gonna happen.

Brett Gilliland  32:34

Yep.

Marty Strong  32:35

And sometimes they just want to tell me and I have people that have the authority to do something about it, and we have processes for them to follow. But sometimes they’ll come up and say something that I have, I’m the only one that has the authority to do anything about it. And I might spend that entire day from the point that I have this put on my lap, focusing on fixing that, that challenge. And eventually the day ends, and it may or may not be completed, and the next day, when I walked in the office at 8:30, I have to keep attacking that plus, be free to hear any other things that pop up. So it’s pretty much because we have people in in Japan, we have people that do training down in central South America, because of time zones and everything else, you’re pretty much 24/7, days a week, 365 days, but you’re the way I’ve done it, I’m in more of a casual, comfortable, reactionary mode, in general. And if I have one or two things I want to do proactively, I’ll work on them. But I always know, Murphy or something is going to drop in and disrupt me. And I’m okay with that now.

Brett Gilliland  33:41

I talked about that with your attitude. We wake up, we choose it every single day, if we have a great attitude, then your belief system comes in, but between those two things, there’s a thing called rejection, right? It’s just what you talked about. Something happened with this employee or that client or whatever it may be that, that rejection is really trying to drive you away. And have you ever been in a bad attitude, which then in my opinion, that’s where your belief systems come in, right? And our history tells us that if I believe in these things, then I can deal with the rejection. And so now it’s how fast I call it bounce back theory, how fast can I bounce back from that rejection? And I’m sure you’d agree with me on this is that the people that bounce back the quickest, are the most successful people in the world. The ones that want to go home and pout about it and you know, sit in the fetal position in the corner office and cry. It’s going to take them longer to rebound and they’re gonna wonder why, right?

Marty Strong  34:33

You have to, you have to create your own resilience. And you also you know, the habits and the behaviors kind of converge to become a discipline system. So just like you don’t want to have something derail you emotionally, or intellectually and emotionally during the day. You want to get get back on your get back on your game. The other thing is, you don’t want to have a crisis or a problem. Suck you down into a rabbit hole, bbecause what will happen is if you allow yourself to get sucked in and stay in there, you completely forget about the future. You’ve, I mean, next week, even as a future, you start getting into this really hyper problem-solving mode. And anybody is in charge, or anybody owns a company, or anybody is a leader of a division or anything like that. You, you are there because you’re good at solving problems. But sometimes you you get to a point where you’re really not supposed to be the person solving the problems, not all the problems, there’s like four problems a year, you’re supposed to really be the one to solve. The way you solve problems is you make sure that the people that you’ve hired, the people that are being trained, the systems, the processes and everything are in place, that problem solving is happening all the time. And the other 96% of the stuff you’re not touching is on track. That’s what you have to do as a leader. That’s what you have to set up as a leader. And I right in in, I think be nimble about, you don’t want to be the arsonist that sets, sets the fire through all if they’re not doing any of those things, that then when the panic happens, you jump in, like a firefighter, you know, and you save the day, because you’re so talented, you’ve got 10 years of doing this kind of thing, even though you’re up here not supposed to be doing this kind of thing. And you’re giving orders you’re running around every goes “ooh, ah, he was so good. He was so poised. She was incredible. What a great leader, she’s so sweet. She’s so special.” You know, and then you walk out doing the hand wave. But I’ve been around organizations, and I’ve had people working for me that I’ve sat them down, you don’t have to third, fourth time I’ve heard this heroic, this heroic saga from somebody and I will, “tell me what happened.” And then eventually I get into this whole six sigma, causal analysis, it turns out their lack of the fact they didn’t build structure, improve the quality of their team, continued and sustained training, testing and make sure that they’re validate their systems or processes for, for stress, a stress test of those things, is automatically generating a crisis every so often that he jumps in and takes powers for, or she does. So. Yeah, there’s a lot of things you got to do and maintain the discipline. You wanted to get sucked in you gotta pull, a military that’s a general rule of junior officers, a junior officer feel like, “well, I gotta get in there. The wheel just kind of came off the truck, I’m gonna go over there and help pull the wheel off the truck,” not your job.

Brett Gilliland  37:21

Yeah. So I’m gonna, I’ll ask you a question. I’ll lead with what I’m asking this for and what my word is, because it may be a difficult question to answer. But if I said you had to pick one word, like, there’s this one word that means something to you, what would that be for you because for me, the word is choice. Like I’m a huge believer, in the word choice, that we have so much choice in what we do, right? The choice of our attitude, choice of doing things, even when you don’t want to do it, you still got to show up and do it. Right, the choice of who we spend our time with the choice or the actions that we take every single day. I think we choose our results. And I could go on and on and on about these choices and all the things that we do. So what’s that word for you? And why?

Marty Strong  38:09

Commitment. I think commitment is a good word that wraps in a lot of what we’ve already been talking about. If you are a committed person, and you’re exercising commitment, and all that you do, you have a disciplined system, you’ve got good habits, you’ve got behaviors that are there are creative and positive and appropriate. You are probably like, like a person trying to swim against the tide. You’re running into resistance, you’re running into friction. Everybody does. But you don’t complain about it, you don’t stop because of it. Because if you’re a committed person, if you’re if you have commitment, you basically say, “Well, I’m just not gonna get to where I’m going as fast as I thought I was because of this current.” And, and that, to me is an incredibly important approach to life. If you’re gonna be a parent, if you’re going to be a husband or a wife, if you’re going to be a coworker, if you’re going to be a volunteer, I think those people that are truly committed are those people that change the world.

Brett Gilliland  39:18

Yeah, that’s a huge that is a great word. And I think I’m gonna butcher this quote, but I read it somewhere is, commitment is when it’s still a commitment, even though the feelings you had when you made it a commitment are gone, you still go out and do it. Right, if that makes any sense. I’m paraphrasing there, but it’s true, right? Because we can be all fired up in the moment and I’m going to commit to this and then you’re the battle cry for it and then, you know, a day later you’re like, “oh, man, that’s tougher than I thought, but I was so fired up.” Yeah. But when it stays a commitment, that’s when it’s truly we’re gonna go out and make an impact and to your point, change the world.

Marty Strong  39:52

It’s kind of like that, the quote about character, you know, character is what you do when nobody’s looking.

Brett Gilliland  39:58

Yeah.

Marty Strong  39:59

I think commitments that way too.

Brett Gilliland  40:01

Yep.

Marty Strong  40:02

It happens between your ears. It was something I witnessed in, in SEAL training. A little bit, don’t remember much of it when I was actually a student, but when I went back as an instructor and ran hell weeks in the selection process, you could see, you can physically, physically see a difference in somebody’s eyes, the committed versus the not committed. And then once they went from not committed to, “I just don’t want to be here at all,” there was a whole different look. And sometimes they’d be in the middle and they’d get back to committed but yeah, the ones that ended up going to the “I don’t want to be here.” And their eyes looked kind of dull, it just, you could tell they weren’t, weren’t happy or excited anymore, you know, they were gone. Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  40:02

Yeah, that makes me think of a friend of mine and author Matthew Kelly talks about the QS, the quit and stayed, you know, and so when you said that it’s, they may stay working where they’re at, but they’ve physically have quit, so therefore, they’re gone. But they quit and stayed. And I think that’s when it’s us, as a leader to have that tough conversation with somebody and talk to him about that quit and stay mentality.

Marty Strong  41:06

Yeah, the military version of that is retired on active duty.

Brett Gilliland  41:10

Oh, yeah.

Marty Strong  41:11

People that aren’t being challenged aren’t being pushed, they’ve achieved a certain rank, and they’re sitting at a desk, and they’re, they don’t, they’re not gonna take risks. They’re not gonna, you know, anything more than just the regular day and, and then if you’re, if you’re younger, and a military organization, and you’re, you’re trying to solve a problem, you’re trying to get something done, and you run into this immovable object, which is this, this, this thing, this person that’s decided, I have four years ago before I hit 20 years, but I decided I retired now, psychologically, mentally, and everything. It’s really frustrating, but it’s a real thing. You run into those people. And you see the same thing in, in, obviously, in government in general. And in business, too. It’s you can’t survive as a small business with somebody like that because there’s not enough people, you know, the single point of failures, it magnified, right?

Brett Gilliland  42:04

Yeah.

Marty Strong  42:04

But, but it’s frustrating, especially if you’re, you’re committed and you’re you’ve got other people that are committed, you start hearing from lots of different sources that there’s a problem on the second floor.

Brett Gilliland  42:16

Yeah. So let’s talk about, one of the final questions here as you know, we talked about success and all the things that we do, right, and, but what’s something that you struggle with, and I’ll be transparent and share that mine, mine is more of like a fitness side, like, I don’t love working out, you know, and I love the concept of it. I enjoy it when I’m done with it. But I’m not this like seven day a week guy and all this stuff showing up and just doing it even when I don’t want to do it. If I don’t want to do it, I just don’t freakin do it. Right? And so that’s what I struggle with, but when you think of sleep, or your diet or exercise or something I’m not even thinking of right now, is there something that you struggle with and what have you done, and I can share my accountability to the exercise later, but that you’ve done to overcome that, and now it’s become a habit for you?

Marty Strong  43:05

Well, it’s not fitness. Since we’re done here, I’m going right on to the peloton bike so I work out six––

Brett Gilliland  43:10

Mine’s right there.

Marty Strong  43:11

––six days a week. And yeah, I’ve, I’ve always, I’ve always liked working out I’ve always liked sports. So you know, I stay I stay in good shape that way. I have no problem sleeping, I go to sleep at night, wake up the next morning, boom, you know, I’m good. My, my problem is taking actual time off, quality time off. My kids are all grown, I got five kids, five grandkids. So we don’t have anybody in the house running around that we have to worry about paying attention to.

Brett Gilliland  43:40

Yeah.

Marty Strong  43:41

Except for a little yorkiepoo. The, so in 2020, before COVID I sat down my wife and said, “Okay, we gotta I gotta solve this, I gotta fix this, because I’m, I’m committed.” So if you’re, if you’re committed to all those channels I read rattled off earlier, you know, there’s going to be a channel called, you know, you and your, your family. So, as much as I have intermittent contact all day long, and when I work from home, I’m here. I’m not really engaging. I’m not really involved. So, in 2020, we sat down and we we set up a whole bunch of trips, and we set up two comedy concerts, these like destination concerts, and I think three or four music concerts, and we had the whole year stacked.

Brett Gilliland  44:28

That’s coo.

Marty Strong  44:28

We sat out there, we light it up. So now I got a commitment. Right, I got a schedule. We’re gonna get out of town. We’re gonna go have fun. Every one them got canceled. And actually they were canceled, they were canceled again and ’21 and postponed I think we got to see one. Got to see the Doobie Brothers–-

Brett Gilliland  44:46

Oh there you go!

Marty Strong  44:47

––finally go almost three years later. So we just went through this again. And we just came back from from four days in Long Beach Island, New Jersey, which, she set that up a while back, we’ve got like four trips set up between now and January, where I set up a ski trip in February. So that’s how I’m trying to cope with my weak area, my, my failing, I need to take that as seriously and commit to that as completely as I commit to all the other things.

Brett Gilliland  45:19

Yeah. And when I hear there too, is that we got to pre plan it, right? I mean, if they’re on the calendar, then you’re going to take your weakness, and you’re going to turn it into an opportunity, because now it’s there. And now you just got to go do it, right, you just gotta get on the plane or the car, or whatever it is, and you’ll make it happen. And for me, the last few weeks, you’ve probably heard me talking about this in the podcast is that my accountability was I’m tired of this, I need to at least need twice a week. So Tuesdays and Thursday mornings, 6am I’ve got anywhere from five to eight guys that come to my backyard, I walk outside, usually around 5:42 or 5:52 and I’m ready, you got the weights out there, and there’s usually at least one or two guys already out there doing stuff, right? They’re exercising, but for me, like I know, I just I wouldn’t wake up then and go do it. And so I had to create this environment that I know a bunch of my buddy’s gonna be in my own damn backyard guess who’s showing up this guy, right? And so it’s been it’s been phenomenal. So again, to our listeners, I would say find that buddy group, find that system, book it on your calendar, whatever it is––

Marty Strong  46:25

Yeah.

Brett Gilliland  46:25

–– do something about it and make it happen.

Marty Strong  46:28

Yeah, figuring out what works for me is telling somebody, I’m going to do something because then I then I’m gonna have to be committed to it right, so?

Brett Gilliland  46:35

Well, because I’m gonna go check your beer a peloton name out and see if you actually rode the bike after this.

Marty Strong  46:40

Yeah, so if it’s Time Warrior.

Brett Gilliland  46:44

There you go.

Marty Strong  46:45

So if, if I would run a half marathon or me my wife ran marathons, half marathons, adventure races, things like that. As soon as we signed up, like the next day, you’re like, “What the hell did I just do?”

Brett Gilliland  46:56

Yeah.

Marty Strong 46:56

Now you’re committed to the whole training program, buying all the cool gear stuff, and so one of the first things I would do is I tell people at the office, I tell my friends, because I could never live down not doing it once I––

Brett Gilliland  47:09

Absolutely.

Marty Strong  47:10

That’s what kept me, that’s what kept me on track. If we didn’t tell anybody, we could just go “hey, yeah, I’m good if you’re good. Let’s cancel this.”

Brett Gilliland  47:20

Yeah, well they say go public. You know, if you got a goal, you got a big goal work personally, whatever it is go public with it. And I’ve spent my whole career doing that you just because if you’re right, if you tell enough people, it’s like, “Oh, crap, man, I gotta do that.” You know? So.

Marty Strong  47:34

Well it works, it works for me anyway. I don’t like to say one thing and then not do it.

Brett Gilliland  47:39

Yeah.

Marty Strong  47:40

You definitely can’t do it when you’re writing books and talking about in interviews all the time.

Brett Gilliland  47:43

Exactly. Exactly. So “Be Visionary: Strategic Leadership in the Age of Optimization,” it’s gonna be an awesome book coming out in January of 2023. What’s your number one goal you hope somebody gets from it?

Marty Strong  47:58

That they lift their head up and look at the horizon and learn how to dream again.

Brett Gilliland  48:03

Powerful, isn’t it dreaming?

Marty Strong 48:05

I think so.

Brett Gilliland  48:06

I love it. I just love the word dream. You know, it’s it is amazing. And that’s for me what I do in strategic thing time every week, you know, just me, my journal, an ink pen, no technology and just dream. And we got to do more of it. And I’m sure you’d agree with that as the some of my best ideas, my best decisions have come from that time alone. But but at the beginning, it was really tough, because you’d feel like as a hard charging guy, I’d be like, well, this is, I’m weak. Why am I being a loser sitting over here, the ink pen and a piece of paper man? I should be doing this. But then I found as I’ve done it now since July of 2005, that it’s by far the best time I spend all week.

Marty Strong  48:45

Yeah, and there’s this there’s a sequence, you know? You don’t just dream. It sounds kind of goofy, but you dream, the dream turns into vision, the vision turns into a concept, usually somewhat fleshed out on paper, the concept is converted into a strategy, and the strategy then drives an operational gameplan, milestones, etc., to achieve the strategy. That’s how you go back into the reality of business. You start with the dream and you work your way structurally backwards.

Brett Gilliland  49:12

Love it, love it. Where do we find more of Marty Strong, that we can put in the show notes for our listeners to find more of you?

Marty Strong 49:19

Just go to Martystrongbenimble.com, and there’s links to all my books and articles, all kinds of stuff there.

Brett Gilliland  49:25

Awesome, man. Well, we’ll put it on social media, or on our show notes for sure and thanks for joining me again, man on the Circuit of Success. This is a great time and always enjoy the conversation.

Marty Strong  49:34

Yeah, thanks for having me. Good to see you again.

Brett Gilliland  49:36

Good to see you. Enjoy.