"If it were not for the black church, there would be no church in America." - Dietrich Bonhoeffer (1931)

In this eye-opening conversation, Dr. Walter Strickland II—professor, author, and teaching pastor—reveals why Dietrich Bonhoeffer said there would be no church in America without the African-American church, and what that means for leaders today.

Dr. Walter Strickland II unpacks the biblical foundation for kingdom diversity, explains why lament is the missing spiritual muscle in American Christianity, and shares forgotten stories of African-American church leaders.

Discover how bearing each other's burdens and learning from the past can transform your church into the multicultural witness God intended.

Key Insights:

04:46 - Bonhoeffer's Bold Statement About the Black Church

08:35 - Spirit-Led Innovation Means Proclamation + Justice

14:10 - Kingdom Diversity vs. DEI: What's the Difference?

17:34 - Individualistic vs. Collectivistic: Why We Misunderstand Grief

19:32 - Why We Debate Details Instead of Mourning Together

21:24 - Daniel 9: Repenting on Behalf of Your Nation

22:30 - Notable Leaders in Black Church History

Resources Mentioned:

Website: https://walterstrickland.wordpress.com

Swing Low: A Life of Lifting Jesus Higher (Volumes 1 & 2) by Walter R. Strickland II

Plain Theology for Plain People by Charles Octavius Booth (republished by Strickland)

Removing the Stain of Racism from the Southern Baptist Convention (contributor)

God So Loved the World: A Blueprint for Kingdom Diversity by Walter R. Strickland II

Juneteenth Documentary featuring Rasool Berry - https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YmjuDxKTzzg

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Eric Bryant:

Website: https://ericbryant.org/

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Pastoral Cohort with N.T. Wright: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/cohort/

Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn

Kingdom diversity isn't optional—it's biblical. Learn how to lead a church that reflects Revelation 7:9. Sign up for practical tools at https://innovativechurchleaders.org/join-us.

#ChurchLeadership #KingdomDiversity #Lament #BlackChurch #CulturalDiscernment #MultiEthnicChurch #SpiritLed #BiblicalJustice #ChurchHistory #BlackHistoryMonth

What does it look like when the church truly sees and mourns with those who mourn?

In this powerful conversation, Latasha Morrison—founder of Be The Bridge and bestselling author—shares why lament is essential for healing, how the church can practice true reconciliation, and what it means to create spaces where brown faces feel seen in predominantly white spaces.

Tasha unpacks the biblical practice of lament, shares the story of a transformative Starbucks meeting that changed everything, and reveals why reconciliation work isn't political—it's deeply scriptural.

Discover how multi-ethnic dinners, honest conversations, and embodying God's justice can help your church reflect the kingdom Jesus came to build.

Key Insights:

01:00 - The Power of Lament: A Biblical Practice We've Forgotten

04:21 - Lament Helps Us Heal Forward

06:15 - The Starbucks Meeting That Changed Everything

11:00 - The Collectivistic Nature of the African-American Community

16:11 - Being Seen as a Woman Leader

20:17 - Justice Is God's Inherent Character
23:22 - Bad Exegesis Created Our Current Reality
25:16 - Jesus vs. Consumeristic Christianity

Resources Mentioned:

• Brown Faces, White Spaces by Latasha Morrison (NEW)
• Be The Bridge by Latasha Morrison
• https://bethebridge.org/
• https://www.instagram.com/bethebridge
• https://www.instagram.com/latashamorrison

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Eric Bryant:Website: https://ericbryant.org/

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ericmichaelbryant/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericbryant/

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/

X: https://x.com/ericbryant

Pastoral Cohort with N.T. Wright: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/cohort/

Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn

The church should be known for compassion, empathy, and mercy. Get practical tools for reconciliation + weekly encouragement at innovativechurchleaders.org

#ChurchLeadership #Reconciliation #Lament #BeTheBridge #CulturalDiscernment #FaithfulPresence #Juneteenth #BiblicalJustice #MultiEthnicChurch #innovativechurchleaders

Feeling burned out? You're not alone. In this hope-filled conversation, leadership coach J.R. Briggs reveals why the quality of your life is determined by the quality of questions you ask—and how changing one question can transform your ministry.

J.R. unpacks the art of asking better questions, shares why Jesus asked over 300 questions but only answered 5, and offers practical rhythms for pastors on the edge of burnout. Discover the action-reflection balance, what a "fully supported you" looks like, and why you don't have to make it happen.

The 3 Questions Pastors Need This Year include:

1. Where did God work this past year?

2. What do I long for God to do this year?

3. What does a fully supported me look like?

Key Insights:

00:50 - The Power of Better Questions

03:23 - Questions for the New Year: Looking Back & Forward

04:35 - Action-Reflection: The Rhythm of Healthy Leaders

06:39 - Hope for Burned-Out Pastors

09:10 - Life-Giving Lists & Support Systems

10:04 - Stories of Pastoral Renewal

12:00 - Redefining Success: Faithfulness Over Numbers

14:11 - Living in the Sacred Overlap

15:58 - Questions for Your Board & Staff

18:29 - Words of Hope: The Pressure's Off

Resources Mentioned:

The Art of Asking Better Questions by J.R. Briggs

Fail by J.R. Briggs (InterVarsity Press)

The Sacred Overlap by J.R. Briggs

Kairos Partnerships: https://kairospartnerships.org/

Resilient Leaders Podcast

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Eric Bryant: https://ericbryant.org/

Pastoral Cohort with N.T. Wright: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/cohort/

Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn

Leading in a skeptical world is hard. Get practical tools + spiritual encouragement weekly. Sign up at https://innovativechurchleaders.org/join-us/

#ChurchLeadership #PastorLife #SpiritLed #PastorEncouragement #BurnoutRecovery #LeadershipQuestions #FaithfulPresence

If you've been wondering whether young people still care about faith, this conversation will challenge your assumptions. 

Thai Lam shares firsthand accounts of what's happening on college campuses: 5,000 students gathering for worship, 200 baptisms in one night, and Bible sales up 50% in five years.

After decades of church decline in the West, something shifted. Young people are asking questions about God, buying Bibles, and showing up for prayer gatherings in numbers that surprised even the ministry leaders mobilizing them.

Thai walks through the 200-year history of Collegiate Day of Prayer and explains how churches can adopt local campuses, create intergenerational prayer movements, and practically support what God is doing among Gen Z. Whether you're in a college town or simply wondering how to reach younger generations, this episode offers both hope and practical next steps.

Find resources and prayer guides at collegiatedayofprayer.org. 

Looking for practical leadership resources? Join our newsletter at innovativechurchleaders.org. 

Links:

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Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/catalyzingcommunity/ 

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TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@innovativechurchleaders 

Eric Bryant Website: https://ericbryant.org/ 

Eric Bryant Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ericmichaelbryant/ 

Eric Bryant Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericbryant/ 

Eric Bryant LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/ 

Eric Bryant X: https://x.com/ericbryant 

Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  

Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

What if the way you've been taught to connect with God isn't the only way—or even the best way for you?

In this liberating conversation with Filipe Santos of Echo Church as our host, international speaker and bestselling author Hosanna Wong reveals why your relationship with God doesn't have to look like anyone else's—and why that's actually by design.

Hosanna shares insights from her newest book Uncomplicate It: Permission to Enjoy God in Your Unique Way, including findings from 1,000 conversations with people across the world about what stands in the way of connecting with God.

Discover the 6 most common roadblocks (busyness, distraction, grief, shame, silence, and expectations), the 7 "praise-onalities" that reveal how you're uniquely wired to connect with God.

Key Insights:

01:45 - Why Faith Feels Too Complicated

03:50 - The 1,000-Person Journey Across the World

07:18 - What Pastors Unintentionally Do That Creates Roadblocks

10:04 - One Size Fits All Faith Raises Fakers

13:47 - The Six Roadblocks to Connecting with God

18:23 - Jesus Is the Ultimate Shortcut to God

20:01 - The Seven Praise-onalities: How You're Wired to Worship

38:26 - Structure Serves the Unholy (Not the Holy)

43:39 - For the Curious: How Can This Be Real for Me?

49:55 - The Pressure to Be Perfect (and What Jesus Actually Meant)

Guest: Hosanna Wong

Website: https://www.hosannawong.com/

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/hosanna.wong

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@hosannawong

Host: Filipe Santos of Echo Church

Website: https://echo.church/

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@EchoChurch

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/filipesantos

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Pastoral Cohort with N.T. Wright: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/cohort/

Apple Podcasts: https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357

Spotify: https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn

Sign up for practical tools + spiritual encouragement at innovativechurchleaders.org

#ChurchLeadership #PastorLife #SpiritLed #FaithfulPresence #DiscipleMaking #ReachNewPeople #SpiritualFormation #GenerationalMinistry

Frank Bealer, CEO of Generis with over 25 years of ministry and leadership experience, served on the executive team at Elevation Church during its explosive growth from volunteer setup crews to leading multi-campus expansion. In this conversation, he challenges common leadership assumptions with practical wisdom for navigating growth, developing teams, and building a healthy culture of generosity.Discover insights on leading through transitions, coaching your team to reach their potential, and why confidence in your calling matters more than confidence in your skills.Connect with Generis at https://generis.com.

Frank is the author of The Myth of Balance and Developing Discernment.Ready for renewal? Get practical resources and encouragement at innovativechurchleaders.org Join us!Website: https://www.innovativechurchleaders.org/join-us/ YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InnovativeChurchLeaders Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/InnovativeChurchLeaders/ Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/catalyzingcommunity/ Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/innovativechurchleaders LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/innovative-church-leaders/ TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@innovativechurchleaders Eric Bryant Website: https://ericbryant.org/ Eric Bryant YouTube: https://www.YouTube.com/@ericbryant777

Eric Bryant TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ericbryant777Eric Bryant LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/ Eric Bryant X: https://x.com/ericbryant

David Bennett's story starts in a Sydney pub where a supernatural encounter transformed a gay atheist activist into one of today's most thoughtful voices on faith and sexuality. Now an Oxford-trained theologian, David helps church leaders navigate what might be the most challenging pastoral question we face—without defaulting to culture war scripts that leave everyone exhausted.

What makes this conversation different is David's refusal to choose sides. He introduces a framework of "solidarity and holy fellowship" that holds radical inclusion and biblical holiness together, creating space for people to wrestle authentically with hard questions. If you've felt trapped between being dismissed as either too affirming or too exclusionary, David offers language for a third way forward, one that doesn't sacrifice either welcome or conviction.

This is pastoral theology from someone who lives the tension daily, offering church leaders practical wisdom for walking with people through messy, beautiful journeys toward Jesus.

David Bennett is author of "A War of Loves" and holds a PhD in Christian ethics from Oxford University.

Want more resources for your leadership journey? Get our newsletter at innovativechurchleaders.org 

Links:

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Eric Bryant Website: https://ericbryant.org/ 

Eric Bryant Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ericmichaelbryant/ 

Eric Bryant Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericbryant/ 

Eric Bryant LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/ 

Eric Bryant X: https://x.com/ericbryant 

Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  

Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

David Bennett (Guest)

Website: https://www.dacbennett.com/ 

Facebook Page: https://www.facebook.com/davidacbennett/?ref=_xav_ig_profile_page_web# 

Facebook Profile: https://www.facebook.com/dacbennett/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/davidacbennett/ 

(This interview originally aired on the Post-Christian Podcast in January 2025).

The challenge with generosity isn't the concept itself, it's the fear surrounding it. And most church leaders recognize this tension.

Boyd Bailey, founder of Wisdom Hunters and author of "The Power of Generosity," joins Felipe and Mandy to explore why conversations about generosity feel so complex, and how we can move past the anxiety to help our people discover genuine freedom.

You'll hear Boyd's grandmother's story and how her generosity extended far beyond financial giving. We explore practical discipleship environments, the double blessing of giving, and how to cultivate a culture where generosity flows naturally, not from pressure, but from encountering the abundant life Jesus offers.

This conversation will reshape how you approach this critical topic in your church.

Want more resources for your leadership journey? Get our newsletter at innovativechurchleaders.org 

Links:

Website: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/ 

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@InnovativeChurchLeaders 

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Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/catalyzingcommunity/ 

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LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/innovative-church-leaders/ 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@innovativechurchleaders 

Echo Church Website: https://echo.church/staff

Filipe Santos Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/filipesantos/

Mandy Santos Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mandysantos/

Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  
Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠

What does it take to lead a thriving church in one of America's most unchurched cities? 

Brenden Brown, pastor of Heirs Church in San Francisco, shares his journey of 29 venues in 8 years, navigating a gracious transition from Hillsong, and learning that our identity as sons and daughters transforms how we do ministry.

Brenden's stories—from giving away his jacket to a stranger in Trader Joe's to divine Uber conversations—reveal what happens when leaders tune into the Holy Spirit and see people with God's eyes. He discusses the challenges of post-Christian contexts, the mobilizing power of personal story, and why leading from identity rather than duty changes everything.

Whether you're in a hard place or a thriving season, this conversation will remind you why knowing who you are shapes how you lead and serve.

Ready for more encouragement in your leadership? Get our newsletter at innovativechurchleaders.org 

Links:

Website: https://innovativechurchleaders.org/ 

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Facebook Group: https://www.facebook.com/groups/catalyzingcommunity/ 

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LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/innovative-church-leaders/ 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@innovativechurchleaders 

Eric Bryant Website: https://ericbryant.org/ 

Eric Bryant Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ericmichaelbryant/ 

Eric Bryant Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericbryant/ 

Eric Bryant LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/ 

Eric Bryant X: https://x.com/ericbryant 

Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  

Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ 

What's the difference between church growth and real discipleship? Pastor Bob Reed found out the hard way—even as his Florida church was thriving numerically, he realized something was missing. That realization led him on a journey that would reshape his entire approach to ministry.

Now leading CyLife Church in Texas, Bob shares how he moved from stage-focused ministry to relational discipleship, why he had to confess to his congregation that his relationship with Jesus had become "professional," and what it actually takes to create a culture of disciple-making.

This is a conversation about getting honest with yourself, your calling, and what success really means in ministry.

Get a chance to win a free copy of 'Real Life Discipleship' by Jim Putman by signing up for our newsletter at innovativechurchleaders.org!  

Links:

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LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/innovative-church-leaders/ 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@innovativechurchleaders 

Eric Bryant Website: https://ericbryant.org/ 

Eric Bryant Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/ericmichaelbryant/ 

Eric Bryant Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ericbryant/ 

Eric Bryant LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/eric-bryant-397003172/ 

Eric Bryant X: https://x.com/ericbryant 

Apple Podcasts: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/the-post-christian-podcast/id1509588357 ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠  

Spotify: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠https://open.spotify.com/show/6ZeQIrzr2tCMyq1VdwxGNn ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠