The Simple Heart w/ Wayne Hsiung

Wandering cows, illegal raids, and threats to democracy that may imperil the future of our nation.

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://simpleheart.org!

Thumbnail photo by Adair Luhr

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00 The greatest threat to democracy is on our dinner plates; how Tracy Murphy’s case shows why

Chapter 2) 08:32 Aren’t there greater threats to democracy, like insurrections?

Chapter 3) 11:55 Why democracy is a good system, but how a poorly functioning one fails us

Chapter 4) 19:02 “Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere,” and why Martin Luther King, Jr. was right

Chapter 5) 24:36 Imagine a different world where relatively powerless people and animals can go up against the powerful

Chapter 6) 27:10 What each of us can do to help us achieve a more democratic society

Chapter 7) 28:39 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

Justin Marceau was lead counsel in the People v. Tracy Murphy. I speak to him about the serious misconduct we revealed in the case – & what it tells us about the broader problem of criminal justice.

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Contact/follow Animal Activist Legal Defense Project:

https://www.law.du.edu/content/animal-activist-legal-defense-project 

https://www.instagram.com/aaldp_du/ 

https://x.com/AALDP_DU 

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-11:25 Intro, Tracy Murphy’s case & trial, Animal Activist Legal Defense Project, & the defense gets new information days before trial starts

Chapter 2) 11:26-20:56 At the dismissal: the judge reprimands defense while wrongly praising the prosecution, “poverty of low expectations” in the criminal justice system, constitutional violations against Tracy, compliments about the legal team working well together, & Tracy’s bravery to not take a plea deal

Chapter 3) 20:57-28:01 Would destruction of evidence have been enough to dismiss the case without familial relationship disclosure, & not a strong case for the prosecution in front of a jury

Chapter 4) 28:02- 36:34 Do people in the US really have presumption of innocence in the American legal system, & Tracy’s learning her legal rights to the cows

Chapter 5) 36:35-47:56 Tracy followed the law in this case, law students & lawyers should learn how to emotionally be there for their clients, intense animal agricultural opposition & disinformation against Tracy’s compassionate choices, & how Tracy has helped the authorities & community with animals abuse cases

Chapter 6) 47:57-56:24 Employees betraying Tracy, harassment against Tracy, how society & local communities are divided, & the power of the prosecution

Chapter 7) 56:25-1:13:54 Justin & Wayne working together & with the legal team for animal rights activists, & Justin’s advice to new lawyers & activists

Chapter 8) 1:13:55-1:27:14 How to make the legal system more accessible, the need for authenticity in personal & public interactions, Wayne’s proposed changes to the court, & lawyers empowering their activist clients

Chapter 9) 1:27:15-1:37:45 What Justin learned from the Asha Rescue Trial, Wayne’s arguments in court, getting to know local lawyers, final thoughts, & check out the website Animal Activist Legal Defense Project (link above)

Chapter 10) 1:37:46-1:38:02 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

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Follow Justin:

https://x.com/justin_marceau

https://www.facebook.com/justin.marceau.9

https://www.linkedin.com/in/marceau-justin-97b33015/

Support Asha's Farm Sanctuary & Tracy:

https://www.ashasfarmsanctuary.org

https://www.facebook.com/@ashasfarmsanctuary

https://www.instagram.com/ashasfarmsanctuary

https://twitter.com/AshasSanctuary

https://www.tiktok.com/@ashas_farm_sanctuary?lang=en

https://www.facebook.com/tracy.murphy.3572

https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracy-murphy-4b40b410/

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Books/Essays:

Beyond Cages: Animal Law & Criminal Punishment by Justin Marceau

Carceral Logics: Human Incarceration & Animal Captivity by (Editors) Lori Gruen & Justin Marceau

Truth & Transparency: Undercover Investigations in the Twenty-First Century by Alan K. Chen & Justin Marceau

Cases & Materials on the Death Penalty by Nina Rivkind, Steven Shatz, Sam Kamin, & Justin Marceau

“Federal Habeas Corpus: Cases & Materials” by Andrea Lyon, Emily Hughes, Mary Prosser, & Justin Marceau

Death Penalty in a Nutshell by Victor Streib, Sam Kamin, & Justin Marceau

Voluntary Prosecution & the Case of Animal Rescue by Justin Marceau, Wayne Hsiung, & Steffen Seitz (Harvard Law Review)

https://harvardlawreview.org/forum/vol-137/voluntary-prosecution-and-the-case-of-animal-rescue/

Books mentioned:

The Art of Choosing by Sheena Iyengar

The Paradox of Choice: Why More Is Less by Barry Schwartz

Movies mentioned:

The Joker (2019)

On July 16, 2022, Tracy Murphy saw two young stray cows wandering onto her property, adjacent to a busy road in upstate New York. She gave the cows food, water, and shelter and called the SPCA. What happened in the next few years is so bizarre and outrageous – from police raids to hidden cows sent to slaughter – that it's hard to believe.

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Follow Asha’s Farm Sanctuary and Tracy Murphy!

Website: https://www.ashasfarmsanctuary.org  

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/@ashasfarmsanctuary 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/ashasfarmsanctuary 

XTwitter: https://twitter.com/AshasSanctuary 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@ashas_farm_sanctuary?lang=en 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/tracy.murphy.3572 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/tracy-murphy-4b40b410/  

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-10:37 Intro, how Tracy Murphy found Little Willow and Ishmael at Asha’s Farm Sanctuary in July 2022, & how Asha’s Farm Sanctuary helps abused farm animals in the local community

Chapter 2) 10:38-22:27 How the case against Tracy started, getting to know Little Willow and Ishmael at Asha’s Farm Sanctuary & Tracy’s legal rights to Little Willow and Ishmael

Chapter 3) 23:28-44:00 Tracy’s interactions with Gregson (the alleged owner of the cows) and the authorities & the defense team learning new information just before the trial was supposed to start 

Chapter 4) 44:01-54:21 Forrest Lucas & “Protect the Harvest” publicly defame Tracy, no support from authorities when 100+ people harass/block Tracy at Asha’s Farm Sanctuary, the authorities raid, arrest, & shackle(!) Tracy, & Tracy is gagged by the court -  prohibited from posting on social media - while Gregson spreads lies 

Chapter 5) 54:22- 1:03:27 Finally learning what happened to Little Willow and Ishmael from the New York Times reporting on the case, not from the authorities/court, & violations of individuals’ constitutional rights, & violations of laws by those with power

Chapter 6) 1:03:28-1:10:15 Tracy’s legal team, the judge’s ruling, how Tracy won the case, & final thoughts

Chapter 7) 1:10:16-1:10:32 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

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Also mentioned:

Animal Activist Legal Defense Project

https://www.law.du.edu/content/animal-activist-legal-defense-project

As the next big right to rescue trial looms, we're republishing a blast from the past: a debate I had with a pig farmer just months after a mass open rescue at Sunrise Farms.

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-03:10 Intro: communicating with adversaries and on the Asha Trial starting on October 3rd with Tracy Murphy #CompassionIsNotACrime

Chapter 2) 3:11-1:17:58 Wayne Hsiung and Trent Loos: first debate from 2018

Chapter 3) 1:17:59-1:18:15 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

In one week, we face the next huge animal rights trial. Here’s what we can learn from my closing argument in one of the last ones.  #SmithfieldFoods #CompassionIsNotACrime

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at ⁠https://www.simpleheart.org⁠!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00 Intro, Context of revisiting this closing argument

Chapter 2) 04:06 Piglets, Purpose, Price; Wayne sighs before starting

Chapter 3) 08:22 End of a long Friday

Chapter 4) 11:35 Using a line from an unlikely ally

Chapter 5) 14:56 Piglets

Chapter 6) 17:15 Purpose

Chapter 7) 22:08 Price

Chapter 8) 31:14 More thoughts on the value of unexpected allies

Chapter 9) 33:08 The added pressure of representing other defendants at trial

Chapter 10) 36:15 Addressing the intent to steal piglets

Chapter 11) 39:12 The first controversial line: "I don't want you to acquit us..."

Chapter 12) 41:50 The second controversial line: Animals have "given us food..."

Chapter 13) 44:32 Closing thoughts: Don't hide the ball, dive deep, and have faith

Chapter 14) 54:33 Outro videos - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

David Ramms thinks veganism has an infighting problem. Is he right? And if so, what can be done?

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Follow David:

YouTube: www.youtube.com/@davidramms

Website: https://davidramms.com/

IG: https://www.instagram.com/davidramms/

FB: https://www.facebook.com/itsdavidramms

XTwitter: https://twitter.com/itsdavidramms

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/davidramms/

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-16:32 Intro, context for David’s speech causing controversy in the animal rights movement, going to animal rights conferences, starting DxE Barcelona, & inequality in the movement

Chapter 2) 16:33-26:05 More on David’s speech: communicating through disagreements & conflict

Chapter 3) 26:06-44:21 Racism inside & outside of the animal rights movement

Chapter 4) 44:22-57:08 Responding to racism inside & outside the animal rights movement, & David talking with people after his speech

Chapter 5) 57:09-1:09:57 Groups targeted as cults

Chapter 6) 1:09:58-1:23:27 Communicating based on facts with First Principles, David responding to questions about his speech, & David acknowledging prior behavior

Chapter 7) 1:23:28-1:38:21 David’s growth as an activist, on leaders & leadership in the movement, on Threat Inflation, & being on social media

Chapter 8) 1:38:22-1:46:21 Abolitionists & welfarist in the animal rights movement, how to be react responsibly on social media, & final thoughts

Chapter 9) 1:46:22-1:46:37 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

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Books Mentioned:

“How to Create a Vegan World: A Pragmatic Approach” by Tobias Leenaert

https://www.tobiasleenaert.be/p/boek.html

Movies mentioned:

“Accidental Courtesy: Daryl Davis, Race & America” (Documentary - 2016)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Accidental_Courtesy:_Daryl_Davis,_Race_%26_America

Tash Peterson was recently convicted and forbidden from leaving Western Australia after protesting a restaurant that banned vegans. She was sued for accusing a chef who posed with dead animals of “animal abuse.” And, while pretending to be a farmer, she listened as an angry stranger threatened to kill Tash Peterson – without realizing that the “farmer” he was talking to was, in fact, Tash Peterson in disguise.

But there’s one thing that’s stayed solid and stable through it all: Tash’s belief in pushing for change, even when it’s uncomfortable or even dangerous. And there are important lessons for us all in her story. Give this one a listen, and give Tash and Jack some support!

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Follow Tash:

IG: https://www.instagram.com/tash.peterson/ 

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@vganbooty

Facebook public figure page: https://www.facebook.com/vganbooty

Facebook profile: https://www.facebook.com/vganbooty69

XTwitter: https://x.com/vganbooty

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@tash.peterson

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@tash.peterson

Links: tashpeterson.bio

Email: [email protected]

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-20:50 Intro, Tash’s interactions with haters, insights on Tash’s legal cases & convictions, the demonstration after a restaurant banned all vegans, & tough decisions an activist makes when criminally charged

Chapter 2) 20:51-32:21 Public defenders in the US & the equivalent in Australia, Tash’s feelings on continuing to protest, online support compared to in-person support, & take action when you find your calling in the movement

Chapter 3) 32:22-43:05 Hardest thing for Tash in these legal cases, the Backlash Effect in social justice movements, & how Jack (Tash’s partner) is handling legal casesChapter 3) 43:06-49:41 Outrageous details of the defamation cases against Tash in Australia, & criminal cases compared to civil cases

Chapter 4) 49:42 -1:01:36 No freedom of speech in Australia, lawyers & the media making false statements about activists, & why people believe/spread false information

Chapter 5) 1:06:37-1:21:28 What next in Tash’s activism, unexpected outcome during a new kind of outreach video, how Tash handles negative comments & death threats, & meditation

Chapter 6) 1:21:29-1:30:15 Final thoughts: an ongoing legal mistake (a criminal conviction without pleading or trial) against Tash, problems with bureaucratic systems, & support/follow Tash on social media (links above)

Chapter 7) 1:30:16-1:30:31 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

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Books Mentioned:

“Letter from Birmingham Jail” by Martin Luther King Jr. (PDF)

https://billofrightsinstitute.org/primary-sources/letter-from-birmingham-jail

“The Path of Most Resistance: A Step-by-Step Guide to Planning Nonviolent Campaigns” by Ivan Marovic (PDF)

https://www.nonviolent-conflict.org/resource/path-resistance-step-step-guide-planning-nonviolent-campaigns/ 

“The Trial” by Franz Kafka
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Trial

Leah Garcés has convinced numerous factory farms to give up the business of killing animals and transition to plant-based agriculture. And shares the secrets to this remarkable work in this conversation. 

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More on Leah’s books:

“Transfarmation: The Movement to Free Us from Factory Farming”(new release on 9/17/2024):

https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/757628/transfarmation-by-leah-garces/ 

“GRILLED: Turning Adversaries into Allies to Change the Chicken Industry” (released on 9/3/2019): https://mercyforanimals.org/grilled/ 

Follow Leah, Transfarmation, and Mercy for Animals - links below.

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://www.simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-18:38 Intro, how Leah builds relationships with adversaries, meeting farmer Craig Watts & others in the industry, & communicating about the system

Chapter 2) 18:39-29:45 Meditation & self-care practices, Leah going on a silent meditation retreat, & finding perspective as an activist

Chapter 2) 29:46-36:00 Leah’s emotional journey as an activist & advice to other activists

Chapter 3) 36:01-51:52 Beginning The Transfarmation Project (link below) & farmers stuck in the system

Chapter 4) 51:53-1:01:56 Farmers finding The Transfarmation Project, communication with farmers, & activists’ self-judgment & judging other

Chapter 5) 1:01:57-1:14:26 Leah bearing witness to chickens on farms/warehouses, Leah meeting slaughterhouse workers, moral injuries of workers, & the public view of domesticated animals

Chapter 6) 1:14:27-1:18:24 Empathy for farmers trapped in the animal agriculture system

Chapter 7)  1:18:25-1:24:47 The Faaborg Family Transfarmation from pig farming to mushroom farming in Iowa (NYT article link below), Wayne’s last non-vegan meal, 

Chapter 8) 1:24:48-1:27:03 Final thoughts: Leah advice to activists, buy Leah’s book (links below), & follow The Transfarmation Project & Mercy for Animals (links below)

Chapter 9) 1:27:04-1:27:20 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis

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NYT article: “Life After Factory Farming: 'The Longer They're Out, the Happier They Are.’”

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/08/29/climate/factory-farming-transfarmation-project.html 

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Follow Leah: 

Website: https://leahgarces.com/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/leahgarces/ 

XTwitter: https://x.com/leah_garces 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/leah.garces 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/leahgarces/ 

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Follow The Transfarmation Project:

Website: https://thetransfarmationproject.org/ 

Links: https://linkin.bio/thetransfarmationproject/ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/thetransfarmationproject/ 

XTwitter: https://x.com/transfarmations 

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@TheTransfarmationProject

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/TheTransfarmationProject 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/thetransfarmationproject/ 

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Follow Mercy for Animals: 

Website: https://www.MercyForAnimals.org   

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/mercyforanimals 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/mercyforanimals/

XTwitter: https://x.com/MercyForAnimals 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@mercyforanimals_us 

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@mercyforanimals 

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@mercyforanimals 

LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/company/mercy-for-animals 

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Books Mentioned:

“The Body Keeps the Score” by Bessel van der Kolk

“Why We Sleep” by Matthew Walker

Trump is right. They’re eating the pets!

The path to victory in the Presidential debate is… animal rights?

I break down the opportunities and threats for the candidates – and animal advocates – with former NPR journalist Jeremy Loeb. 

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Follow Jeremy:

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@loebjeremy 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/loebjeremy/

XTwitter: https://x.com/LvLouMeng 

TikTok: https://www.tiktok.com/@loebjeremy 

Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/jeremy.loeb1 

Threads: https://www.threads.net/@loebjeremy 

Follow Wayne:

YouTube: https://www.youtube.com/@WayneHsiung_ 

Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/waynehhsiung/ 

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The Simple Heart on Substack - Subscribe to Wayne Hsiung's newsletter to learn more about the #RightToRescue at https://simpleheart.org!

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Chapters:

Chapter 1) 00:00-9:21 Intro, what may happen (& should happen) during the 9/10 Presidential Debate & details in the Democratic Party’s platform

Chapter 2) 9:22-18:44 On Wayne’s mayoral campaign in 2020, politicians need to authentically talk about animals, & Cory Booker’s response on veganism in 2019

Chapter 3) 18:45-28:21 Will the candidates talk about animal agriculture’s environmental impacts, mainstream media’s lack of animal rights coverage & how humanity is causing of the Sixth Mass Extinction

Chapter 4) 28:22-39:55 How the UN (& others) report environmental information about animal agriculture, showing courage: politicians compared to activists, & how the candidates will talk about violence against animals & how activists should respond to it 

Chapter 5) 39:56-48:54 On Trump & Biden’s debate, why Jeremy & Wayne will vote for Harris, & criticism of Harris as a prosecutor

Chapter 6) 48:55-57:08 Politicians’ catching up to public opinions, what Jeremy is looking for during the debate, more on Trump’s incoherent responses, & RFK wanting to be on the ballot only in swing states

Chapter 7) 57:09-1:06:11 What Wayne is looking for during the debate, a brief cameo of Oliver, on presidential companion animals, & publicly calling out the presidential candidates on animal cruelty

Chapter 8) 1:06:12-1:18:37 Publicly calling out politicians on animal cruelty after the election, school shooters connected to animal cruelty, & on having dog & cats as companion animals

Chapter 9) 1:18:38-1:21:53 Final thoughts: review of what to look for during the Presidential Debate, share this show, please vote, take action for animals, & subscribe to Jeremy’s YouTube channel & Wayne’s YouTube channel (links above)

Chapter 10) 1:21:54-1:22:10 Outro video - Thank you for watching! Please Subscribe. Acknowledgments to the Podcast Team: Joe Allman, Adam Durand, & Chloe Leffakis.