So far this year, there have been multiple fatal plane crashes and near-misses in North America, leaving 87 dead. President Trump has blamed diversity initiatives, with no evidence. But experts point to a different problem, and have been ringing the alarm bells for years. 

This podcast was brought to you thanks to the support of readers of The Times and The Sunday Times. Subscribe today: http://thetimes.com/thestory

Guest: Charles Bremner, Foreign Correspondent, The Times. 

Host: Luke Jones.

Producer: Olivia Case.

Further reading: Toronto plane crash blamed on ‘new’ co-pilot amid recruitment crisis

Further listening:  Elon Musk's 'hostile takeover' of Washington

Clips: KSDK News, USA Today, Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport, Sky, ABC, Fox, CNN, BBC, The Guardian, The Daily / The New York Times, The White House / Sky, NBC, YouTube / blancolirio.

Photo: Getty Images.

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