Mythical and magical creatures are a staple of the fantasy genre, sometimes as obstacles for heroes to face, sometimes as healers and dispensers of wisdom, sometimes fulfilling roles both stranger and more mundane. If you decide to include such beasties in your world, what are they doing there? And how deep you delve into the biology and ecology of these creatures? Do you need to make them make some sort of scientific sense, or can everything be covered by "it's magic"?

We also recap our Seattle WorldCon experience! So listen to hear about our panels, our amazing outfits, and losing a Hugo Award, again.

[Transcript for Episode 163 -- With thanks to our scribes!]

Fantasy religions often feel like reskins either of ancient Greek or Norse pantheons or of the medieval Catholic church. But what more interesting choices can we make when we're building faith within an invented world? Deva Fagan joins us to explore some of the options! How your people envision deities, the afterlife, and the very bones of the universe can illuminate a lot about their overall values and how they self-mythologize their place in the world.

It's not all just cosmology, either: religion can touch so many other parts of a world, from government and power structures to idiomatic language and metaphors. Religions are also things that live and change: How can cults, schisms, and syncretism not only help you create a world that feels more diverse and lived-in, but also maybe give you some plot and character hooks?

[Transcript for Episode 162 -- Thank you, scribes!]

Our Guest: Deva Fagan writes fantasy and science fiction for all ages. When she’s not writing, she spends her time reading, doing geometry, playing video games, hiking, and drinking copious amounts of tea. She is the author of several books, including Rival Magic, Nightingale, The Mirrorwood, A Game of Noctis, and The Delta Codex. She lives in Maine with her husband and their dog. You can find her online at DevaFagan.com.

Deva's List of Cool Fantasy Religions!

Dragon Age

In this episode, we're taking a closer look at something we refer to a lot when we're talking craft: the on-ramp. Which is to say, at the beginning of your book, as you're introducing your world, how much stuff can you throw at your reader how quickly to get them up to speed? And how much is too much and might cause a reader to get bounced right out of the story?

Your readers come in with a lot of assumptions and expectations. Your job as the writer is to adjust those expectations, particularly with your ideal reader in mind. Sometimes, that means choosing which battles you're going to fight when it comes to how much worldbuilding you actually include on the page and how you introduce vocabulary and concepts.

[Transcript for Episode 161 -- Thank you, scribes!]

What makes a story -- and a world -- "cozy"? What are the conflicts, challenges, and obstacles like when, instead of taking the Ring to Mordor, you heroes are trying to keep a coffee shop afloat or open a pet shop? Sarah Beth Durst joins us to discuss not just what cozy fantasy is, but how its radical joy can be a powerful act of subversion when the real world tells us to be cynical or defeatist.

We also explore how cozy fantasy expands what the fantasy genre gets to be when it refocuses the lens on different kinds of protagonists and places. Often, it centers and lifts up different kinds of protagonists, ordinary people rather than Chosen Ones. The world itself might be one where things are relatively calm -- or there could be a full-on Battle for the Powers of Good happening somewhere, just not in the story's imminent proximity. A smaller story can still be important, complex, and deeply satisfying.

[Transcript for Episode 160]

Our Guest: Sarah Beth Durst is the New York Times and USA Today bestselling author of over twenty-five books for adults, teens, and kids, including cozy fantasy The Spellshop. She's been awarded the American Library Association's Alex Award, the Libby Book Award for Best Fantasy, and the Mythopoeic Fantasy Award. Several of her books have been optioned for film/television, including Drink Slay Love, which was made into a TV movie and was a question on Jeopardy! She lives in Stony Brook, New York, with her husband, her children, and her ill-mannered cat. Visit her at sarahbethdurst.com.

What is the measure of a true hero? What a society consideres heroic can say a lot about their values, needs, and ethos -- but it's also something that can shift a lot over time and from location to location. Is heroism about physical strength? Strength of faith? Strength of heart? Or is it about cunning and cleverness? Guest John Wiswell joins us to discuss the worldbuilding implications of hero-building.

Classical heroes, folk heroes, superheroes -- all of these stories reflect something about the cultures that tell the tales. What actions does the hero take that makes them heroic? Is it defeating monsters -- or is it tweaking the nose of authority? How important is the quest itself to defining the hero, and how much is down to a society's concepts of morals and ethics? And in an age where mythological retellings are having a real moment, also look at what recontextualization of famous heroic stories can open up about the original tales and reveal about what we value now.

[Transcript for Episode 159]

Our Guest: John Wiswell is a Nebula-winning and Locus-winning author who lives in the middle of the woods. His debut novel, SOMEONE YOU CAN BUILD A NEST IN, was released from DAW Books in the U.S. and Arcadia Books in the U.K. in April 2024. John's work has appeared in Uncanny Magazine, Tor.com, LeVar Burton Reads, Nature Magazine, The Magazine of Fantasy & Science Fiction, Weird Tales, the No Sleep podcast, Nightmare Magazine, Cast of Wonders, Podcastle, Escape Pod, Pseudopod, and other fine venues. He has been a finalist for the Hugo, World Fantasy, and British Fantasy Awards. His fiction has been translated into ten languages.

He graduated Bennington College in 2005, and attended the Viable Paradise 17 workshop in 2013. He has multiple disabilities including a neuromuscular syndrome, and thinks healthy people's capacity to complain is very funny. He finds a lot of things very funny and would like to keep it that way.

He is frequently available for interview and for talks at conferences. He has done panels at places such as Worldcon, the Nebula Awards Conference, and the World Fantasy Convention.

In one way or another, economy touches almost everything in a world. Even without currency or capitalism in the sense that we currently know it, the idea of obligations and repayment exert pressure on society. So how can we make interesting worldbuilding choices when it comes to money, debt, gain, and other aspects of economy? Guest Elizabeth Bear joins us to explore the options!

Where does money intersect with other kinds of power and privilege? What’s the income equality or inequality like -- what conflict is there between the haves and have-nots? How much opportunity is there for mobility between classes? Even issues as simple as currency are worth interrogation: What is your currency made from? There's a reason many societies have always used copper, silver, and gold -- but others use things like shells or polished stones. Then, of course, there are things like faery markets and the stock market, both of which operate on the trade of abstract nouns. So how can you make these choices for the world you're building in a way that serves the story you're telling?

[Transcript for Episode 158]

Our Guest: Elizabeth Bear was born on the same day as Frodo and Bilbo Baggins, but in a different year.

She is the Hugo, Sturgeon, Locus, and Astounding Award winning author of dozens of novels; over a hundred short stories; and a number of essays, nonfiction, and opinion pieces for markets as diverse as Popular Mechanics and The Washington Post.

She lives in the Pioneer Valley of Massachusetts with her spouse, writer Scott Lynch. 

It's the start of SEASON SEVEN! And original co-host Rowenna Miller is back to join us in a reflection of how multiple years of doing this podcast has affected how each of us thinks about worldbuilding. What have we learned from our many amazing guests, and how have they inspired us to think about worldbuilding in new ways? Have our worldbuilding interests and focuses shifted? And since the real world we live in has been... um... interesting over the past several years, how has that -- and the changes in our own lives and careers -- influenced our work?

(Transcript for Episode 157 -- Thank you, scribes!)

Our Guest: Rowenna Miller is the author of the Unraveled Kingdom trilogy, The Fairy Bargains of Prospect Hill, and The Palace of Illusions, as well as short fiction. She is also a prior cohost of this podcast! And also an English professor, and a fairly handy seamstress. She lives in Indiana with her husband, two daughters, four cats, and an ever-growing flock of chickens.

It's one of the first choices you'll make when writing a story, consciously or not: what point of view are you writing from? First person singular? Third person limited? Omniscient? Something else? The POV can affect a reader's experience of the narrative and the worldbuilding, either subtly or dramatically -- so how do you decide what's right for this story? Kate Elliott joins us to explore the possibilities!

In this episode, we look at how the point of view can shape both what you communciate about a world and how you communicate it. The POV shows the rhythms of life and can be a good way to feed worldbuilding to the reader -- but it can also expose a character's gaps in knowledge or their biases and prejudices! After all, a commoner and a noble living in same location will interact with different pieces of the world and in very different ways. That, in turn, can affect how the author thinks of the world: what we spotlight, where we might have gaps, and prompting a need to check our own biases. And on top of all of that, POV is also something with its own trends within genres and over time! So we dig into those influences as well.

Transcript for Episode 156

Our Guest: Kate Elliott has been publishing science fiction and fantasy for over thirty years with a particular focus in immersive world building and epic stories of adventure & transformative cultural change. She’s written epic fantasy, space opera, science fiction, Young Adult fantasy, and the Afro-Celtic post-Roman alternate-history fantasy with lawyer dinosaurs, Cold Magic, as well as two novellas set in the Magic: The Gathering multiverse. Her work has been nominated for the Nebula, World Fantasy, Norton, and Locus Awards. Her novel Black Wolves won the RT Reviewers’ Choice Award for Best Epic Fantasy 2015. She lives in Hawaii, where she paddles outrigger canoes and spoils her schnauzer.

We often think about "making things make sense" in worldbuilding and building internal consistency, scientific realism, and other logic-based considerations into our fiction -- But what happens when your worldbuilding principle is “What would be awesome?" Jim C. Hines, who embraced this principle for a forthcoming book, joins us to explore the possibilities!

The Rule of Cool, credit to, is defined thusly: "The limit of the Willing Suspension of Disbelief for a given element is directly proportional to its awesomeness." In other words, if it's cool enough, you can get away with it. This often applies to sci-fi tech and fantasy magic. Let's be real, things like faster-than-light travel, lightsabers, and starfighters will always be "rule of cool", in one way or another (so far as we currently understand physics), and magic doesn't have to be something you break down and quantify and explain perfectly. So what can we play with? And where do those decisions intersect with narrative tone, genre standards, and reader expectations?

[Transcript TK]

Our Guest: Jim C. Hines is the author of the Magic ex Libris series, the Princess series of fairy tale retellings, the humorous Goblin Quest trilogy, and the Fable Legends tie-in Blood of Heroes. He also won the 2012 Hugo Award for Best Fan Writer. His latest novel is Terminal Peace, book three in the humorous science fiction Janitors of the Post-Apocalypse trilogy. He lives in mid-Michigan with his family.

We often think of worldbuilding happening on a grand scale, with huge maps and the sweeping narratives of nations and world-changing events. But that's not really the stuff that makes a world feel lived-in. The granular choices are what show day-to-day life, and day-to-day life illustrates so much about how a world has developed, how a culture has grown, and how people negotiate the circumstances of their lives. These are the things that, out of genre, creators might not think of as “worldbuilding” but as "just" character work or setting details. All of it helps to tell the story of your world and how people live in it.

So in this episode, we start at the mid-sized level of worldbuilding and then narrow our way down, from cities to neighborhoods to individual buildings to distinct rooms. How can the smallest choices have a significant impact, giving your stories more life and verisimilitude? What defines public and private space, and how do people perceive the differences? What are the uses of buildings and the rooms within them, and what does that tell you about who occupies the space? And how can you craft all of this in a way that feels genuine and goes beyond the surface level?

[Transcript for Episode 154 -- Thank you, scribes!]