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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Rich Carty from Remedy to dig into the realities of core technology contracts in banking and payments. Rich shares how financial institutions weigh tough choices when locked into long-term vendor agreements and why early planning is critical. He explains how most banks only revisit core contracts every few years, often finding themselves committed to outdated solutions for longer than they expect.

Rich points out that new technology and artificial intelligence are top of mind for many leaders. He sees demand for AI solutions rising fast, but notes that organizations remain cautious, balancing the urge to innovate with the need to avoid early missteps. Rich encourages institutions to seek advice, gather input from all departments, and focus on due diligence before making changes.

Throughout the conversation, Rich uses real stories to show the value of reviewing contracts and staying proactive. He highlights how the right approach can free up resources, improve vendor relationships, and help organizations adapt as the payments industry evolves.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Name: Rich Carty
What he does: Vice President, Business Development
Company: Remedy
Noteworthy: Rich helps banks and credit unions review, negotiate, and optimize technology vendor contracts, with a focus on core systems, renewals, and technology transitions.
Where to find him:https://www.linkedin.com/in/rich-carty-24918918

KEY INSIGHTS

Start Contract Planning Three Years Ahead

Long-term vendor contracts shape how banks operate, often locking in core systems for up to a decade. Early planning is the best way to avoid getting stuck with outdated technology or unfavorable terms. 

Financial institutions that want options—like switching vendors or just negotiating a better deal—need to start the process two to three years before their current contract expires. This timeline accounts for vendor schedules, internal reviews, and the complexity of core system transitions. 

By moving early, organizations protect themselves from last-minute decisions and keep leverage at the table. The approach also gives teams time to gather input across departments and align technology with business goals. In a fast-moving payments landscape, a proactive timeline is the difference between staying ahead and falling behind.

Due Diligence Uncovers Savings and Prevents Regret

A thorough review of technology contracts can reveal hidden costs and new opportunities. Even long-standing vendor relationships deserve a second look, as loyalty doesn’t always mean the best price or terms. 

With due diligence, organizations spot gaps, compare options, and often negotiate better deals. This process can free up resources for growth, support new projects, or make room for future upgrades. Relying on familiarity or letting contracts auto-renew leads to missed savings and limits flexibility. 

By treating every renewal or transition as a strategic decision, financial institutions protect their budgets and set themselves up for smarter, more agile operations.

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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Jordan Thaeler to explore how embedded payments lock merchants into costly, inflexible systems. Jordan explains why many software providers bundle payment services with their core products, leaving merchants with few choices and rising costs. He shares how this model drives up payment fees over time while reducing merchant leverage and support.

Jordan describes the risks of a market where software and payments are tied together. He uses examples like Toast and Shopify to show how merchants often pay much more than the market average, with little transparency or recourse. As more processing volume moves to embedded payments, Jordan argues that choice and competition are critical for a healthier payments ecosystem.

The conversation turns to dual pricing models and the global push for bank-to-bank payments. Jordan makes the case for more options and education, so merchants are no longer “hostages” to their software providers.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Name: Jordan Thaeler
What he does: Co-Founder
Company: POS+
Noteworthy: Known for exposing hidden payment practices and building tools that give merchants more choice in payment processing.
Where to find him: https://www.linkedin.com/in/jjthaeler/
Guest Company Website: https://www.posplus.org/

KEY INSIGHTS

Embedded Payments Can Trap Merchants in High-Cost Systems

When software providers bundle their own payment services into their platforms, merchants lose the ability to shop for better rates or support. Over time, these bundled arrangements drive up payment costs while locking businesses into a single provider, making it tough to switch even when fees rise or service drops. This lack of competition leads to higher margins for software companies, but often leaves merchants paying far above the market average. The friction of changing systems, along with limited transparency, means that many businesses end up stuck with unfavorable terms. The core insight is clear: without real choice and portability in payment workflows, merchants risk becoming hostages to their own software—paying more for less flexibility.

Choice and Transparency Lower Merchant Payment Costs

Giving merchants freedom to choose among payment providers can restore balance in the payments ecosystem. Integrating open payment workflows into popular software platforms allows businesses to negotiate better deals and demand improved service. When payment options are unbundled, outside experts and local providers can step in to educate merchants, offer support, and keep costs in check. This shift not only reduces the risk of inflated fees but also promotes honest pricing from software vendors, who must stand behind the true cost of their core products. In a landscape where margins are tight, especially for small businesses, having more transparency and options directly supports their bottom line.

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While domestic payments are faster than ever, international transactions remain stuck in the past. In this episode, Monex Chief Economist John Min explains why cross-border payments are often slow, costly, and unpredictable.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE
Name: John Min, Ph.D
What they do: Chief Economist
Company: Monex
Noteworthy: John specializes in global payments, macroeconomic trends, and helps financial institutions navigate the complexities of cross-border transactions and foreign exchange.
Where to find him: https://www.linkedin.com/in/john-min-4941634/

Most community banks and credit unions rely on a chain of large correspondent banks, creating delays and opaque fees that frustrate customers and hurt businesses. This outdated system puts smaller institutions at a major disadvantage, risking the loss of deposits to larger competitors with more advanced technology.

John breaks down how emerging solutions like stablecoins and plug-and-play platforms are set to revolutionize the industry. He argues that by partnering with specialized providers, community banks can level the playing field to offer fast, transparent international payments. Adopting this new technology is no longer just an option—it's essential for protecting their deposit base, improving customer satisfaction, and unlocking new revenue.

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AI is changing the world as we know it. I'm please to present a great conversation i had with Brian Keef of Nice Actimize who are a leader in many things, but AI in Banking. In this Wrestling Payments episode, host Joe Casali interviews Brian Keefe, Manager of Portfolio Pre-Sales at Nice Actimize, about AI's transformative role in fraud detection and compliance. Brian addresses critical NACHA rule changes requiring institutions to monitor both incoming and outgoing ACH transactions, expanding beyond traditional outgoing-only oversight.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE

• Name: Brian Keefe
•  What they do: Manager, Portfolio Pre-Sales
•  Company: Nice Actimize
•  Noteworthy: Brian specializes in AI-driven fraud prevention and compliance for financial institutions, with expertise in cross-channel risk, monitoring, and regulatory adaptation.
•  Where to find him:https://www.linkedin.com/in/brianekeefe

KEY INSIGHTS

The AI Arms Race in Fraud Fraudsters now leverage AI to create synthetic identities and execute sophisticated attacks across multiple channels. Brian explains how criminals use AI tools like ChatGPT to mine data and build complete fake profiles, including deepfake photos. These coordinated groups share knowledge online and adapt quickly to new defenses. Traditional single-channel monitoring fails against these threats—institutions need cross-channel risk assessment covering ACH, checks, wires, and digital banking to spot patterns that isolated systems miss.

Explainable AI and Human Oversight Brian emphasizes that AI must be transparent, not a "black box." Financial institutions need explainable AI that shows why it flagged transactions, building trust with compliance teams and regulators. The "human in the loop" approach is essential—AI assists but doesn't replace experienced staff. As Brian notes: "AI should never replace what a human does, especially from the risk and compliance perspective." This partnership reduces false positives while maintaining regulatory compliance.

Practical Implementation Cross-channel monitoring has become mandatory as fraudsters exploit weaknesses across payment methods. By combining data from all channels, institutions get a complete risk picture and sharper alerts. Brian stresses continuous education through white papers and industry resources, noting that even conservative institutions must adapt because "fraudsters are always adapting and using the latest technology."

The key takeaway: AI should function as an assistant that enhances human expertise, helping teams work efficiently while staying ahead of sophisticated threats in our rapidly evolving digital payments landscape.

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EPISODE SUMMARY
In this episode of Wrestling Payments, host Joe Casali sits down with Sarah Stapp, Chief Commercial Officer, and Geoff Scott, Head of Compliance, at Aeropay. Together, they dive into the ongoing push and pull between sales and compliance in the world of pay by bank, exploring how teams can move fast without leaving risk behind.

Sarah and Geoff discuss the growth of pay by bank in the United States, noting how new technologies and consumer demands are accelerating change. Sarah explains how sales teams must balance ambition with clear understanding of compliance boundaries, while Geoff shares his approach to building programs that enable innovation without putting the business at risk. They tackle challenges around third-party relationships, prohibited industries, and the tightening regulatory lens following high-profile industry failures.

The conversation highlights how the lines between banks and fintechs continue to blur. Both guests agree that effective payment operations depend on collaboration and a willingness to adapt. They close by reflecting on the importance of innovation, the evolving regulatory landscape, and how staying informed keeps both sales and compliance moving forward together.

GUESTS-AT-A-GLANCE

Name: Geoff Scott
What they do: Head of Compliance
Company: Aeropay
Noteworthy: Geoff brings deep experience in banking and risk management, guiding fintechs through compliance challenges as pay by bank and digital payments evolve.
here to find him: LinkedIn 

Name: Sarah Stapp
What they do: Chief Commercial Officer
Company: Aeropay
Noteworthy: Sarah helps financial institutions strengthen risk management, streamline compliance, and train teams to navigate ACH and payment operations with confidence.
Where to find her: LinkedIn

KEY INSIGHTS
Compliance Enables Growth—If You Build for “Yes”
Compliance doesn’t have to mean slowing down new ideas or blocking deals. The most effective compliance programs help operations move forward by focusing on how to reach a safe “yes” rather than defaulting to a hard “no.” This approach starts with clear frameworks, strong collaboration between sales and compliance teams, and early qualification of potential risks. When both sides understand the rules and communicate openly, teams avoid wasting resources on non-starters and instead build processes that let innovation flourish. By getting ahead of gray areas, documenting use cases, and educating everyone involved, organizations can streamline approvals and stay nimble in a changing payments landscape. Compliance, when structured proactively, becomes a business driver—not just a backstop.

Payments Innovation Is Driven by Consumer Demand
The payments industry constantly evolves because consumers want faster, easier ways to move money. Real-time money movement, instant payouts in gaming, and new payment methods like pay by bank all reflect this demand for speed and convenience. Merchants compete to keep users on their platforms, while financial institutions and fintechs race to roll out new options. This environment rewards those who listen to consumer behavior and adapt quickly. At the same time, teams must balance this pace with compliance and risk management. The firms that thrive are the ones that treat consumers as the starting point for innovation, shaping systems to meet user needs while maintaining clear operational guardrails.

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EPISODE SUMMARY

In this episode of Wrestling Payments, Jim Colassano, Senior Vice President at The Clearing House, joins host Joe Casali to discuss the transformative impact of the Real-Time Payments (RTP) network. He explains how RTP is revolutionizing how businesses manage payments, particularly on the send side. Jim highlights the shift from traditional batch processing to instant payments, emphasizing the network's ability to handle various transactions, from payroll and refunds to emergency funds and cash flow management.

Jim details how RTP's speed, finality, and 24/7 availability are key advantages over older systems. He addresses common misconceptions and objections, assuring listeners that RTP offers solutions for businesses of all sizes. Jim also dispels the myth of a single "killer app," demonstrating how RTP's versatility allows for diverse applications tailored to individual needs.

Finally, Jim discusses the network's growth and the increasing demand for real-time payment capabilities. He encourages businesses to explore the RTP network and its potential to solve their payment challenges. Jim emphasizes the importance of embracing new technologies to improve efficiency and customer experience.

GUEST-AT-A-GLANCE 

Name: Jim Colassano 

What he does: SVP, Product Development and Strategy 

Company: The Clearing House

Noteworthy: Payments expert with experience spanning from lockboxes to real-time innovations.

Where to find him: LinkedIn

KEY INSIGHTS

The Power of Real-Time Payments Extends Beyond Speed

While speed is a significant advantage of RTP, the benefits extend to transparency, finality, and 24/7 availability. These features address long-standing challenges with traditional payment systems, like clearing delays and revoked funds. This creates a more efficient and reliable payment experience for businesses, allowing for better cash flow management and improved customer satisfaction. The always-on nature of RTP also enables businesses to handle time-sensitive transactions and emergencies effectively, regardless of traditional banking hours. This shift towards real-time information and settlement creates a more robust and responsive payment ecosystem.

Moving Beyond the "Killer App" Mentality

The RTP network isn't about finding one perfect use case; it's about solving a multitude of payment problems. Its flexibility allows for customization across diverse industries and business sizes. This adaptability eliminates the need for a one-size-fits-all approach, allowing businesses to tailor solutions to their specific needs. Whether it's streamlining payroll, expediting refunds, or managing large-dollar transactions, RTP offers a versatile platform to address various pain points within the payment process. This approach focuses on solving practical problems rather than searching for a single, elusive "killer app."

Early Adoption and the Power of Experience

Getting started with RTP is key to unlocking its full potential. The network's value becomes clear with repeated use, as businesses discover new applications and efficiencies. Starting with internal processes, or "eating your own dog food," allows banks and organizations to gain firsthand experience and understand the benefits before offering services to clients. This approach not only improves internal operations but also provides valuable insights to tailor solutions and address client needs effectively. The high rate of repeat usage demonstrates the network's value and encourages wider adoption.

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Episode Summary Mid-market banks and credit unions are trapped between agile FinTechs and mega banks, held back by internal silos. On Wrestling Payments, host Elyssa Morgan explores how these institutions can break barriers and leverage their unique strengths.

Randy San Nicolas (Braid CEO) and Daryn Barney (Role FinTech Partners founder) reveal how to overcome self-imposed limitations. "To break through silos, you must step outside to see the world differently," Randy explains. They discuss Stripe's stablecoin move and its impact on traditional banking.

The conversation shows how mid-market size becomes an advantage, not a limitation. Guests share practical steps: inventory existing capabilities, foster innovation leadership, and recognize you already have the charter and foundation to compete.

Host-at-a-Glance

Elyssa Morgan - VP of Membership at NEACH  

Guides payment professionals through modernization challenges 

Find her on LinkedIn

Guests-at-a-Glance 

💡 Randy San Nicolas - Co-founder/CEO, Braid

💡 25 years in payments, empowering smaller institutions to compete 

💡 Find him on LinkedIn

💡 Daryn Barney - Founder, Role FinTech Partners
💡 25 years in payments/banking, builds FinTech strategies for mid-market banks 💡 Find him on LinkedIn

Key Insights

Self-Imposed Silos Are the Real Enemy Banks create barriers by over-depending on core vendors. Most obstacles are mental, not technical. Banks have the infrastructure—they need perspective shifts and smart risk-taking leadership.

Community Banks Hold Undervalued Advantages Mid-market institutions possess what FinTechs can't copy: banking charters, community trust, regulatory frameworks. Even Stripe needs this infrastructure. Decades of relationships position banks as essential infrastructure providers.

Innovation Is Closer Than Perceived Banks underestimate existing capabilities. ACH operators have technical knowledge matching startups—the difference is presentation. Small partnership steps, not complete overhauls, create momentum for bigger transformation.

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Episode Summary

Financial institutions struggle to identify and monetize revenue opportunities through FinTech partnerships while justifying upfront costs to leadership. Wrestling Payments host Elyssa Morgan speaks with Scott Goldthwaite from FinTech Futures, who breaks down where banks can find immediate revenue streams and build compelling business cases.

Scott explains that banks must develop strategies to enhance transaction fee income through sponsorship, acquiring, issuing, and faster payments like RTP. The key is understanding complete money movement needs—both inbound and outbound—rather than siloing into separate strategies.

Addressing cost concerns, Scott emphasizes plotting break-even points and understanding transaction thresholds. He explores emerging opportunities in cross-border payments, AI-powered solutions, and stable coins, providing actionable frameworks for banks ready to move beyond cost concerns and generate real revenue from FinTech relationships.

Guest-at-a-Glance

💡 Name: Scott Goldthwaite
💡 Role: Founder & Consultant
💡 Company: FinTech Futures
💡 Expertise: FinTech Operator and Payments Strategist with 24+ years experience, NEACH board member
💡 Connect: LinkedIn

Host-at-a-Glance

💡 Name: Elyssa Morgan
💡 Role: Vice President of Membership
💡 Company: NEACH
💡 Expertise: Payments strategist and growth leader driving member growth and advising financial institutions
💡 Connect: LinkedIn

Key Insights

Calculate Before You Partner
Banks must plot break-even points before entering FinTech partnerships. Understanding transaction economics upfront—implementation costs, staffing, compliance expenses—transforms uncertain investments into calculated revenue opportunities with measurable success metrics.

Think Holistic Money Movement
Successful partnerships require comprehensive infrastructure supporting funds flowing in multiple directions. Earned wage access needs both funding and disbursement; B2B solutions require receiving, holding, and sending capabilities. Banks understanding complete cycles monetize multiple touchpoints.

Prepare for AI-Driven Automation
Agent AI, stable coins, and automated payments will reshape partnership models within 18 months. AI agents will negotiate autonomously while stable coins execute complex payment logic automatically. Banks exploring these technologies now through manageable steps avoid future disruption.

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Episode Summary

Many financial institutions feel stuck, believing technology myths hold them back from innovation. In this Wrestling Payments episode, host Elyssa Morgan talks with Brian Anderson, VP of Banking Transformation at Finzly, about busting these myths and competing in today's payments ecosystem without waiting for core systems to catch up.

Brian explains how institutions can shift from core-reliant to core-complimentary thinking, transforming payments from cost centers into strategic revenue drivers. He details how API-driven platforms create flexibility and new customer opportunities, helping smaller institutions build stickier relationships and compete with larger banks and fintechs.

The conversation emphasizes that technology decisions are business strategy, not IT projects, requiring C-suite buy-in to reframe investments as essential for competitive advantage.

Guest-at-a-Glance

Name: Brian Anderson
Role: Vice President, Banking Transformation
Company: Finzly
Expertise: Helps institutions innovate through best-of-breed money movement strategies
Connect: LinkedIn

Key Insights

Core-Complimentary Revolution
Stop waiting for core providers. Build ecosystems using APIs to integrate specialized solutions, enabling rapid fintech capability deployment without system overhauls.

Payments as Profit Centers
Transform payments into revenue drivers. One bank generated 40% of income through payment services, creating sticky relationships and non-interest income streams.

Middleware Magic
Gain ultimate control with middleware solutions that prevent vendor lock-in while providing deeper money movement insights and switching flexibility.

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Episode Summary

Financial institutions face a critical challenge: modernizing payment operations through FinTech partnerships without compromising compliance. On Wrestling Payments, host Elyssa Morgan explores practical strategies for balancing innovation with regulatory requirements.

Mark Forbis (former Jack Henry CTO) and Stephen Coburn (Avalo Labs CEO) reveal what works when banks and FinTechs collaborate. Mark explains why most institutions approach partnerships wrong, while Stephen discusses cultural mismatches that doom relationships. Both have witnessed spectacular failures and quiet successes.

The conversation reveals hidden complexities of third-party risk management and why traditional due diligence overlooks critical warning signs. From fourth-party vendor oversight to recent industry shake-ups, this episode provides frameworks payment leaders won't find in regulatory guidance.

Guests: 

• Mark Forbis - Former CTO, Avalo Labs | 32 years at Jack Henry, multiple bank boards LinkedIn 
• Stephen Coburn - CEO, Avalo Labs | Built compliance-focused treasury platform LinkedIn 
• Mary Mumper-Morrison - Director of Education, NEACH | FinTech veteran specializing in risk management LinkedIn 

Key Insights:

1. Cultural alignment determines success more than technical capabilities
2. Fourth-party risks create hidden vulnerabilities requiring expanded due diligence
3. Early compliance integration prevents costly partnership failures
4. Contingency planning for FinTech failure requires clear data ownership protocols

Smart institutions prepare for scenarios most never consider, including partner failures and customer relationship transfers.