The Atlantic’s editor in chief Jeffrey Goldberg and staff writer Anne Applebaum traveled to Kyiv in April to meet Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky. Their wide-ranging conversation with Zelensky is a window into how he is living, what shapes his thinking, and what it looks like when an unlikely political figure like Zelensky goes from “Larry David to Winston Churchill overnight,” as Goldberg put it.

Also: The October 2022 issue of The Atlantic magazine focuses on Ukraine. Read Anne Applebaum's story here.

Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices