This episode wraps up (for now) the two episode arc discussing how changing conditions can change motivation with Wouter Stellaard, Behavior 360 and the Kuzo Group. Before listening to this episode, please take the time to listen to Part 1 of this topic which is episode 68 of the podcast.  This episode is a direct continuation of Episode 68 in which Wouter discusses a multitude of ways in which we can change conditions to change motivation without utilizing diet/weight management.  Wouter discusses strategies if you have come to “the last stop” and determined that the best decision is using food to change motivation. Topics covered include considerations on safety, non-food reinforcers, using all available resources, timing, specific situations, and the importance of record keeping and observations.  The episode ends on a reminder that behavior and learning itself is reinforcing and how we should be adding things, not removing them from animals’ lives and behavioral repitoires. Stay tuned in for Wouter’s inspiring “Training Tale” about training the next generation of animal care givers.    For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Wouter email [email protected] or [email protected] 

For more information and to register for the 2025 ABMA virtual conference visit this link: https://www.theabma.org/virtual-conference

To complete the podcast feedback survey visit this link: ⁠⁠https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sv/Rspt0Bk/abcpodcast2025⁠⁠

Let's talk some training and banter about behavior!

1:40 New ABMA Virtual Conference + Behavior Month Information

3:50 Short recap of Episode 68 - Part 1 

10:25 Shifting from Diet/Weight Management to Behavior Management 

14:05 Non-Food Reinforcers 

17:50 The Last Stop: Using Food to Change Motivation 

19:50 Timing of Sessions 

21:20 Considerations for Using Food to Change Motivation

24:35 Importance of Record Keeping and Observations 

26:15 Considerations About Safety 

28:50 Using All the Resources Available to Make the Most Informed Decisions 

33:50 Signs that Using Food is Detrimental 

39:45 Can the Animal Physically Accomplish the Behavior

41:35 Definition of Depreciation and its Practical Application  

44:50 Behavior and Learning are Reinforcing 

52:30 “Training Tale” 

This episode begins a two episode arc discussing how changing conditions can change motivation with Wouter Stellaard, Behavior 360 and the Kuzo Group. In this episode Wouter discusses the many, and not exclusive, ways in which we can change conditions to change motivation that do not involve diet management.  The episode begins by discussing motivation as a construct and a label and then breaking down motivating operations and setting events. Wouter educates on the many ways in which we can alter antecedents and the environment in order to effect motivation.  Additionally, Wouter encourages listeners to evaluate ourselves and our shaping plans.  Stay tuned in for Wouter’s “Training Tale” about getting into the weeds of training Calm Attentive Behaviors (CAB) with wolves at Bearizona.   For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Wouter email [email protected] or [email protected] 

For more information and to register for the ABMA virtual courses visit this link: ⁠⁠https://www.theabma.org/behavior-management-courses⁠⁠

To complete the podcast feedback survey visit this link: ⁠⁠https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sv/Rspt0Bk/abcpodcast2025⁠⁠

Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

3:50 Introduction to Wouter Stellaard 

9:40 A jumping off point for a discussion 

11:35 Change from weight management mindset to behavior management mindset

15:10 Definition of Motivation

18:50 Motivation as a label 

22:55 Motivation and the Study of One in One Moment

26:20 Definition of Motivating Operations and Setting Events 

29:20 Relationship and Trust 

30:40 Variety of reinforcers 

31:10 Variety of asked behaviors, rate of reinforcement 

33:20 Shifting the mindset to what we can do and away from the animal isn’t motivated

37:10 Antecedents and changing the environment 

43:50 Evaluating ourselves 

49:55 Differential Outcome Effect

52:00 Competing Reinforcers 

56:30 Reevaluating our shaping plan

59:40 Low Motivation vs Reinforced Behavior 

1:03:50 Social Structure and Hierarchy 

1:13:50 “Training Tales” 

This episode Ari Bailey, Natural Encounters, Inc., discusses a topic that she will be presenting on at the IAATE Symposium titled “Get Out of the Way and Let Behavior Happen.”  The episode is a great conversation that focuses on recognizing when to fade out and when to implement specific tools such as baiting, prompts, target, etc.  Ari also gives advice on how to approach others with ideas on changing or trying something new in the training process.  The discussion finishes with Ari discussing how getting out of the way of the animal’s behavior can create more consistent and resilient behaviors and learners.   Stay tuned in for Ari’s very unique "Training Tale" about the origin story of a terminology for different sizes of peanuts.  For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Ari email [email protected] ⁠

For more information and to register for the ABMA virtual courses visit this link: ⁠https://www.theabma.org/behavior-management-courses⁠

To complete the podcast feedback survey visit this link: ⁠https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sv/Rspt0Bk/abcpodcast2025⁠

Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

• 4:30 Introduction to Ari Bailey 

• 12:55 “Get Out of the Way and Let the Behavior Happen” 

• 21:10 How to recognize that it’s time to move on from an approximation 

• 30:30 Using baiting, targets, prompts in the shaping process 

• 42:00 Advice on how to approach teammates with moving to the next approximation 

• 46:10 How to approach teammates about “testing” something new 

• 53:00 How does this correlate to consistent and resilient behaviors? 

• 1:02:05 “Training Tales” 

This episode Dr. Susan Friedman, Behavior Works, provides some great learning and insights into a multitude of current topics surrounding the science of behavior change.  Dr. Friedman starts with discussing the Hierarchy of Behavior Change Procedures; what it is, how we can view it to provide optimal welfare to animals, and also the importance of antecedent arrangement and the environment to behavior change.  She also breaks down what it means and looks like in practice when we strive for most positive, least intrusive, effective intervention.  Dr. Friedman then gives a summary on the free operant approach to enrichment.  She finishes the discussion by diving into the concept of control by honoring the no and shaping the yes.   Stay tuned in for Dr. Friedman’s very unique "Training Tale" about plant learning.  For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Dr. Friedman email ⁠ [email protected] 

For more information and to register for the ABMA virtual courses visit this link: https://www.theabma.org/behavior-management-courses

To complete the podcast feedback survey visit this link: https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sv/Rspt0Bk/abcpodcast2025

Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

• 5:10 Introduction to Dr. Susan Friedman and Behavior Works

• 19:25 Hierarchy of Behavior Change Procedures

• 27:00 Most Positive, Least Intrusive, Effective Intervention 

• 36:20 The importance of antecedent arrangement and the environment on behavior 

• 48:05 Free Operant approach to enrichment 

• 1:07:00 Honor the No, Shape the Yes

This episode, through daily live recordings, features a recap of the 2025 ABMA Annual Conference (April 27 - May 2 2025) hosted by Moody Gardens in Galveston, Texas, United States. Each day of the conference, one of the presenters for the day discusses their presentation and other learning that impacted them. 

Day 1: Marie Filipek, Zoo Tampa at Lowry Park

Day 2: Heidi Moomaw, Charles River Labs

Day 3: Benjamin Fainsod, Jerusalem Zoo

Day 4: Matthew Nguyen & Li Shan Tan, Resorts World Sentosa

If you are an ABMA member be sure to log in to Animalprofessional.com to watch most of the presentations and panels from the 2025 conference. For questions or suggestions about the podcast email [email protected]. Let's talk some training and banter about behavior!

Here is the link to the podcast survey.  We really appreciate your feedback! https://lp.constantcontactpages.com/sv/Rspt0Bk/abcpodcast2025 

Let's talk some training and banter about behavior!

• 5:10 Discussion of Conference Day 1 with Marie Filipek, Zoo Tampa at Lowry Park.  

• 12:15 Discussion of Conference Day 2 with Heidi Moomaw, Charles River Labs

• 35:10 Discussion of Conference Day 3 with Benjamin Fainsod, Jerusalem Zoo

• 53:15 Discussion of Conference Day 4 with Matthew Nguyen & Li Shan Tan, Resorts World Sentosa

This episode was a live panel recording at the 2025 ABMA annual conference in Galveston Texas hosted by Moody Gardens.  The expert panel consisted of Tim Sullivan - Brookfield Zoo, Elly Neumann - Jerusalem Zoo, Nicki Boyd- San Diego Zoo, Anaka Nazareth - National Aquarium, and Chris Jenkins - Natural Encounters Inc.  The panel’s theme was “The Importance of Behavior in Modern Animal Care” with questions submitted in real time from the conference attendees. The panel discussed a wide range of topics ranging from the growth of the role behavior plays in welfare to the evolution and next steps in enrichment, to advice on getting buy-in for change. In the absence of a “Training Tale” for this episode, each of the panelists utilize their years of experience to provide their “Animal Behavior Advice”. For questions or suggestions about the podcast or to get in contact with the panelists email ⁠[email protected]⁠. Let's talk some training and banter about behavior!

This episode Steve Martin, President and CEO of Natural Encounters, Inc., discusses training on a continuum by moving away from coercion and towards genuine choice. Steve starts the episode by giving a review of the concepts of choice and… control with some practical examples.  The discussion then turns to breaking down behavioral degrees of freedom, genuine choice, and coercion with many more great practical examples. The episode ends with Steve outlining that real-world animal training requires us to train on the continuum but always striving towards providing genuine choice in order to enhance an animal’s welfare.  Stay tuned in for Steve’s motivation and emotional "Training Tale" about a trainer from a show at the Singapore Zoo.  For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Steve email [email protected]⁠ Let's talk some training and banter about behavior!

• 3:45 Introduction to Steve Martin 

• 9:25 Review of Choice and… Control 

• 18:55 Degrees of Behavioral Freedom

• 28:20 Free Choice

• 30:35 Genuine Choice

• 44:05 Coercion 

• 56:15 Training on the Continuum

• 1:04:15 “Training Tales”

This episode Mel Paynter and Alyse Stitt, Georgia Aquarium, discuss motivation in the context of animal behavior and training.  In part 1 of this two episode discussion Mel and Alyse discuss what motivation is, what it looks like in practice, and give some o-fish-ally great examples from the many aquatic species that they work with in the Ocean Voyager habitat at the Georgia Aquarium.  They both dive deeper into breaking down and discussing some of the numerous stimuli and events that can affect motivation.   The discussion finishes with their advice on how to productively and effectively use motivation as a tool in our training toolbox and not as a label.  Stay tuned in for Mel and Alyse’s “Training Tales” that focus on how the fish they have worked with have taught them and changed their perspective. You can also learn more information about the 2025 ABMA annual conference by visiting www.abma.org For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Mel and Alyse email [email protected] or [email protected] Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

3:25 Introduction to Mel Paynter and Alyse Stitt

8:15 Overview of Ocean Voyager habitat at Georgia Aquarium 

10:15 Definition of Motivation 

13:45 Definition of Motivating Operations 

Affects on Motivation: 

17:10 Food and Enrichment 

24:00 Breeding/Courtship 

34:00 Social Structure/Situations 

39:50 Environment

43:35 Weather/Seasonality

45:00 Learning History 

47:50 Animal’s physical ability to do something

48:50 Previous access to resources

50:35 Differences in motivation among individuals 

59:25 Advice for using motivation productively and effectively, not as a label

1:05:35 “Training Tales”

This episode Shane Gorbett, Philadelphia Zoo and host of the podcast, discusses and breaks down fading. Shane first discusses examples of what fading looks like in practice and how we can apply the artful application of the science of behavior change in order to know when and how to fade.  Shane also discusses the challenges of fading too quickly, too slowly, or not at all.  Stay tuned in for Shane’s "Training Tale" about Nile crocodile crate training and the importance of paying attention to the communication that we provide to animals.  Visit www.theabma.org for more information and for questions or suggestions about the podcast or to contact Shane, email ⁠[email protected]⁠ Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

5:35 Introduction to Shane Gorbett 

14:10 Definition of Fading and Examples 

25:10 Fading to change a behavior’s cue. 

28:00 How do we know when to fade? 

31:50 What happens if we fade too quickly? 

37:35 What happens if we fade too slowly? 

39:05 What happens if we never fade at all? 

42:55 “Training Tale”

This episode Tricia Dees, the second vice president of the ABMA, continues on with the discussion from Episode 59 and goes deeper into primary/unconditioned and secondary/conditioned reinforcers.  Tricia gives some common examples of primary/unconditioned and secondary/conditioned reinforcers but also talks about how individual preference plays a role in determining what is actually a reinforcer for each individual.  The discussion then turns to why and how we can condition a reinforcer and the importance of watching the animal’s behavior to ensure that a conditioned reinforcer maintains its effectiveness. Stay tuned in for Tricia’s “Training Tale” about how she used learning from a presentation at an ABMA conference about zebra training with an otter. You can also learn more information about the 2025 ABMA annual conference by visiting www.abma.org For questions or suggestions about the podcast email ⁠[email protected]⁠ and to contact Tricia email [email protected] Let's talk some training and banter about behavior! 

4:05 Introduction to Tricia Dees 

6:10 Definition of a Primary/Unconditioned Reinforcer 

8:50 Definition of a Secondary/Conditioned Reinforcer 

11:50 Are primary and secondary reinforcers the same for every individual in a species? 

19:25 Why would we condition a reinforcer? 

22:00 Example of how to condition a reinforcer and how to tell if it is an effective reinforcer

30:45 How to tell if a conditioned reinforcer has lost its effectiveness as a reinforcer 

36:30 “Training Tales”