Brave Ideas

Brave Ideas Season 15, Episode 5

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite:"Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

📺 Watch the full episode EXCLUSIVELY on BraveIdeas.media (incl. behind the scenes)

Should Offices Transact Like Hotels?

What if office space was sold like hotel rooms, priced by the hour, dynamically re-skinned for each occupant, and managed by tech that plays Tetris with demand?

Rogier Braakman believes that is the future.

In this episode, Brave Corp CEO Caleb Parker travelled to Amsterdam to tour Mr. Green and chat with their Chief Exec, Rogier Braakman, who breaks down Mr Green's "properator" strategy—owning and operating buildings—plus the NetOS platform that lets companies share the same SqFt on different days, boosting NOI while slashing wasted space.

🎧 To listen as a podcast FOR FREE,follow Brave Ideas on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen.

Episode Highlights

* 00:00 - Caleb & Sam episode intro

* 03:15 - Rogier's hospitality roots (Ritz-Carlton, Pillows Hotels) and the empty-office "aha" moment

* 10:45 - Why utilization, not rent roll, is the only truly green metric

* 18:20 - Pay-for-time pricing replaces SqFt leases — "No use, no pay"

* 25:40 - Defining a properator (prop-co + op-co under one roof)

* 32:10 - Inside NetOS: the tech stack that swaps brand identities and books space automatically

* 41:05 - Building a "super flex" lung floor landlords can lease to multiple corporates on alternating days

* 47:50 - How sharing drives a 2-3× revenue uplift even in down-cycles

Key Topics:

* Empty desks are the real carbon sin. A fully utilised office is the only sustainable one, so pricing must follow actual occupancy, not fixed leases.

* Time-based memberships beat long-term leases. Companies choose the exact days they need and pay only for the hours used.

* Properator power. By owning buildings and operating them through NetOS, Mr Green captures both real-estate upside and hospitality margin in one structure.

* Landlord win-win. Hand back under-used floors, let NetOS resell them on a super flex basis, and watch yield per SqFt rise.

* Super Flex DNA. Think electric-vehicle equivalent for offices: lower base cost, higher performance, and a lighter environmental footprint.

Why You Should Watch

Office vacancy is your biggest risk. Rogier Braakman reveals, with numbers and live examples, how time based pricing, owner operator alignment, and smart utilisation tech can turn dark desks into a revenue engine—essential viewing for anyone who signs, sells, or services office deals.

CONNECT

* Connect with Rogier Braakman

* Visit Mr. Green's website

* Inquire about Net OS

* Connect with Caleb Parker

* Learn about ReturnSuite

For behind the scenes, visit:https://www.braveideas.media/p/will-this-super-flex-model-make-empty?r=d1yie&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=false

💡 This episode is part of Brave Ideas Season 15, exploring brave ideas shaping the future of office real estate, Space-as-a-Service, and workplace experience.

Join the Conversation

What would super flex mean for your portfolio or team culture? Drop a comment below, share the audio with a landlord who still loves ten-year leases, and subscribe so you never miss a #PlusNotVersus insight.

📺 Watch the full episode EXCLUSIVELY on BraveIdeas.media

Featuring Melissa Ansley, Head of Flex Solutions & Partnerships EMEA

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite:"Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

Melissa Ansley has seen the flex office market evolve from every angle: Operator, Advisor, and now as Head of Flex Solutions & Partnerships for JLL across EMEA.

In this episode, Melissa joins Brave Corp CEO Caleb Parker and ReturnSuite Cofounder, Sam Gamble, in person from MIPIM in Cannes to discuss what today's customers really want from office space, why hospitality matters more than ever, and how flex is changing landlord strategies.

• Why more occupiers are shifting from traditional leases to managed solutions

• The growing demand for hospitality-infused, amenity-rich experiences

• How to match the right operator brand to the right building

• What landlords need to know about spec suites and short-form leases

• The role of flex in creating leasing velocity and tenant stickiness

Whether you're a landlord, operator, broker, or investor, this episode is full of practical insights and behind-the-scenes intel from one of the industry's most respected flex advisors.

• Connect with Melissa Ansley

• Visit JLL's website

• Connect with Sam Gamble

• Learn more about ReturnSuite

• Connect with Caleb Parker

For behind the scenes, visit:https://open.substack.com/pub/bravecorpideas/p/what-flex-office-customers-really?r=d1yie&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=true

💡 This episode is part of Brave Ideas Season 15, exploring brave ideas shaping the future of office real estate, coworking, and workplace experience.

👉 Don't forget to subscribe, like, and drop a comment with your take on Sam's ideas for modeling risk in operational real estate.

📺 Watch the full episode EXCLUSIVELY on BraveIdeas.media

Turning volatility into strategy in office real estate with Sam Gamble, CoFounder of Return Suite

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite:"Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

Maybe this was the only "Monte Carlo" chat at MIPIM...

How do you model risk when your revenue isn't fixed, and your building no longer fits traditional valuation models?

In this data-rich episode, Sam Gamble, CoFounder of ReturnSuite, joins Brave Corp CEO Caleb Parker live from Cannes, France to unpack why the future of office investing needs a whole new underwriting playbook.

As flexible workspace, hybrid leases, and service-led operations reshape how buildings generate income, the old ways of modeling risk just don't cut it. Sam explains how ReturnSuite's probabilistic forecasting tools — including Monte Carlo simulations — can help owners, investors, and operators make smarter decisions, even in uncertain markets.

They also reflect on what they heard (and didn't hear) at MIPIM, and how the capital stack needs to evolve to support operational real estate.

Key Topics:

• Modeling volatility in office with Monte Carlo simulations

• Why traditional underwriting no longer fits flex models

• Replacing static assumptions with dynamic forecasts

• Structuring leases to align incentives and reduce risk

• Building investor confidence in operational income

Who should watch: Landlords, developers, asset managers, investment analysts, brokers, flex operators, capital partners, and anyone rethinking how to underwrite, fund, or scale flexible office models.

CONNECT

• Connect with Sam Gamble
• Learn more about ReturnSuite
• Connect with Caleb Parker
• Subscribe to the Brave Ideas Newsletter

For behind the scenes, visit https://open.substack.com/pub/bravecorpideas/p/how-to-model-office-risk-when-income?r=d1yie&utm_campaign=post&utm_medium=web&showWelcomeOnShare=true

💡 This episode is part of Brave Ideas Season 15, exploring brave ideas shaping the future of office real estate, coworking, and workplace experience.

👉 Don't forget to subscribe, like, and drop a comment with your take on Sam's ideas for modeling risk in operational real estate.

📺 Watch the full episode EXCLUSIVELY on BraveIdeas.media

Featuring CoFounder & CIO, Joaquin Castellvi Lopez, on scaling OpRE strategies across Europe's office markets

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite: "Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

What happens when you apply a logistics-and-hospitality operating playbook to offices?

In this episode, Joaquin Castellvi Lopez, CoFounder & CIO of Stoneweg, Brave Corp CEO Caleb Parker and ReturnSuite Cofounder, Sam Gamble, live from MIPIM in Cannes to unpack Stoneweg's headline-making takeover of Cromwell's €3.9 B European platform and how an OpRE framework drives a £2B office portfolio buy.

Read the deal announcement before you press play.

• Platform Acceleration: How Stoneweg absorbed Cromwell's €3.9 billion European platform to reach ~€8 billion AUM overnight

• Office as Experience: Stoneweg believes offices should live in "urban mixed-use, highly amenitized districts," where workspace is "integrated into a full experience," not treated as an island

• Hospitality-Infused Offices: Leveraging hospitality and flex-living expertise—partnering with best-in-class operators and internal teams—to layer amenity-driven service bundles onto traditional leases

• Leasing Flexibility: They're layering mid-term leases, short-term flex and hospitality-inspired services on top of long-term covenants to create a hybrid income profile

• District-Level Strategy: Their underwrite starts at the micro-market or district level, ensuring each asset fits into a broader ecosystem of retail, residential and leisure

• Mixed-Use Districts: Focusing on how each office integrates into a 15–25 acre urban community—retail, residential and leisure synergies that attract the right customers

• Asset Prioritization Roadmap: Zeroing in over the next 18 months on which properties need "smart capex" today, before scouting new acquisitions

• Smart CapEx Discipline: Instead of "fancy lobbies or underutilized art pieces," capex is focused on targeted amenities—wellness rooms, collaborative spaces, food & beverage activations and community programming—with a disciplined ROI lens

• Long-Term Outperformance Thesis: Stoneweg's conviction that OpRE-driven, district-scale offices will outperform European markets over time

Landlords, institutional investors, operators, brokers and PropTech founders seeking to:

• Underwrite offices with both base-rent and service-stream revenue models

• Reposition assets using a proven OpRE playbook

• Leverage mixed-use masterplans for higher yield, footfall and customer stickiness

1. Connect with Joaquin on LinkedIn

2. Learn more about Stoneweg

3. Connect with Sam Gamble

4. Learn more about ReturnSuite

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite: "Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

The Future of Being Changes Everything

What if the office was designed like a city?

In this season-opening episode, Bedeir Rizk, CEO of Paragon Developments, joins Brave Corp CEO Caleb Parker and ReturnSuite Cofounder, Sam Gamble, live from MIPIM in Cannes to explore Paragon's $1.5B plan to redefine office real estate across Cairo, Riyadh, and beyond.

At the core of Bedeir's vision is the belief that the office should be a regenerative ecosystem—not just a floor plan. That means blending coworking, corporate HQs, wellness, culture, retail, and hospitality into a vertically integrated model that serves the future of being.

From AI and robotics to crowdfunding office assets and selling future space off-plan, Bedeir unpacks how Paragon is reimagining buildings around user experience, output, and community—not just square meters.

Could this be the blueprint for a more sustainable, profitable, and human future of work?

Key Topics:

* Designing buildings from the customer outward, not just for leasing

* Paragon's three-part real estate product: corporates, startups, and the "hub"

* Selling office space off-plan—like residential condos

* Smart capex and programming that boosts productivity

* Creating regenerative ecosystems with art, culture, and PropTech

* Expansion into Saudi Arabia: blending Riyadh's ambition with Berlin's creativity

* How hospitality-level service and flexibility boost NOI and brand equity

Who should watch:

Landlords, PropTech founders, flex operators, developers, institutional investors, and anyone passionate about redefining the purpose of the office.

* Connect with Bedeir on LinkedIn

* Learn more about Paragon

* Connect with Sam Gamble

* Learn more about ReturnSuite

For behind the scenes, visit https://www.braveideas.media/p/whats-behind-paragons-15b-vision

💡 This episode is part of Brave Ideas Season 15, exploring brave ideas shaping the future of office real estate, coworking, and workplace experience.

👉 Don't forget to subscribe, like, and drop a comment with your take on Bedeir's full-stack model.

And this time, we're going deeper into the operational future of office real estate.

Office real estate is changing. Are you evolving to keep up?

In this trailer episode, Host Caleb Parker previews what's coming this season: the people, the ideas, and the investment strategies reshaping how office assets are being repositioned, operated, and valued.

This episode is made possible by ReturnSuite: "Complex Cash Flow Modeling Simplified."

🎧 Brave Ideas Season 15 was recorded onsite in Cannes, France… London, England…and Amsterdam, Netherlands AND in the virtual studio to travel to Copenhagen, Denmark…as well as NYC & Boston, USA, and features special co-host, Sam Gamble.

• Hospitality-led repositioning strategies

• Utilization-based pricing and membership models

• How capital markets are adapting to operational real estate

• Flex space underwriting and financial modeling

• Landlord-operator partnership structures

1. Bedeir Rizk (Paragon Developments)

2. Joaquín Castellví López (Stoneweg)

3. Melissa Ansley (JLL)

4. Sam Gamble (ReturnSuite)

5. Amy Taylor (Cushman & Wakefield)

6. Jonathan Bevan (Techspace)

7. Rogier Braakman (Mr. Green Offices)

8. Andy Igoe (JLL)

9. Bryan Koop (BXP)

10. Carl-Johan Collet (Urban Land Institute)

If you're a landlord, fund manager, operator, investor, developer, or workplace strategist — this season is for you.

📺 Watch full episodes EXCLUSIVELY on BraveIdeas.media

A Brave Ideas Mini-Series at the Global Workspace Association Immersive Event

presented by ReturnSuite

(Watch the full length video on Youtube)

How can office landlords balance flex and stability?

In this episode of Brave Ideas, Brave Corp Founder, Caleb Parker talks with with Andrew Dunn, Vice President for the world's largest landlord, Brookfield Properties, to explore their innovative approach to flex space and hybrid leases. Brookfield has already grown a massive 1.8 million square feet of flex space across multiple global markets. Andrew discusses how their strategy is evolving and the importance of stability in an increasingly flexible office landscape.

💡 Key Topics Discussed:

✅ How Brookfield's hybrid lease model combines fixed rent with performance-based incentives, aligning landlord and operator interests.

✅ Why stability is crucial for growing Brookfield's flex space portfolio.

✅ Insights into the future of coworking and how corporate demand is influencing flex space growth.

✅ How Brookfield views hybrid leases as essential for scaling flex spaces in large office buildings.

Who should isten?

➡️ Landlords looking to innovate with hybrid leases and flex spaces ➡️ Co-working operators and tenants in the flex space market ➡️ Investors interested in the future of office real estate

If you enjoy the conversation, be sure to subscribe, like, and comment with your biggest takeaway!

Links:

• Connect with Andrew Dunn
• Learn about Brookfield Properties
• Follow Caleb on LinkedIn
• Subscribe to our Brave Ideas Newsletter

This mini-series is presented by ReturnSuite: Software that simplifies complex cash flow modeling for modern real estate companies.

A Brave Ideas Mini-Series at the Global Workspace Association Immersive Event

presented by ReturnSuite

(Watch the full length video on Youtube)

What does a successful operator-landlord partnership actually look like?Previously this season (Ep2), we explored how landlords and operators struggle to align on flexible office deals.

In this episode of Brave Ideas, Brave Corp Founder, Caleb Parker sits down with Kylie VanBuren, Director of Real Estate Transactions at Industrious, to explore how the best landlord-operator partnerships are structured, and why transparency, underwriting, and financial modeling are the keys to success.

💡 Key Topics Discussed:

✅ Why landlords are increasingly moving away from traditional lease models

✅ How revenue-sharing & management agreements create win-win partnerships

✅ The underwriting strategies that build trust between landlords & operators

✅ How valuation tools impact flex space deals

This episode explores what good looks like and what needs to happen for more partnerships to work.

If you're a landlord, operator, investor, or involved in the future of workspace, this episode is packed with fact-based insights and strategies you can't afford to miss.

If you enjoy the conversation, be sure to subscribe, like, and comment with your biggest takeaway!

Links:

• Connect with Kylie VanBuren
• Follow Caleb on LinkedIn
• Subscribe to our Brave Ideas Newsletter

This mini-series is presented by ReturnSuite: Software that simplifies complex cash flow modeling for modern real estate companies.

A Brave Ideas Mini-Series at the Global Workspace Association Immersive Event

presented by ReturnSuite

(Watch the full length video on Youtube)

Can office investments survive with outdated valuation models? Not anymore.

In this episode of Brave Ideas, Brave Corp Founder, Caleb Parker sits down with Ben Wright from The Instant Group (with insights from Sam Gamble) to discuss why offices are no longer bond-like investments and how operational data, dynamic pricing, technology, and demand for flexible workspace is reshaping the asset class.

💡 Key Topics Discussed:✅ Why dynamic pricing is the future ✅ How data-driven insights are transforming office valuations ✅ Instant Group's innovations in supporting dynamic, flexible office models

Offices are no longer just buildings—they're operational businesses.

If you're a landlord, operator, investor, or involved in the future of workspace, this episode is packed with fact-based insights and strategies you can't afford to miss.

If you enjoy the conversation, be sure to subscribe, like, and comment with your biggest takeaway!

Legal disclaimer: Nothing mentioned on this podcast should be considered official investment advice.

Links:

• Connect with Ben Wright
• Connect with Sam Gamble
• Follow Caleb on LinkedIn
• Subscribe to our Brave Ideas Newsletter

This mini-series is presented by ReturnSuite: Software that simplifies complex cash flow modeling for modern real estate companies.

Bonus Episode

The best coworking spaces today aren't just about desks—they're about data-driven decisions that enhance experience, service, and efficiency.

In this special DEEP DIVE of Brave Ideas, Brave Corp Founder, Caleb Parker is joined by Manuel Conti, Cofounder of PONT, to explore how data is transforming coworking operations, from boosting revenue and amplifying the human experience to building trust with landlords.

Here's what's changing:

• 🚀 Operators are using real-time data to tailor spaces and services to member needs.
• 💡 Landlords are demanding transparent data-sharing to strengthen partnerships.
• 🔄 AI and IoT are driving automation while enhancing human connections.
• 📊 Data ethics are crucial—balancing insights with privacy protection.

The BIG Question: Can operators afford to ignore the power of data? Some are leveraging data for growth; others risk falling behind.

🔥 Listen to this week's episode for insights on why data is coworking's secret weapon.

If you're a landlord or operator this episode is packed with insights and strategies you can't afford to miss.

If you enjoy the conversation, be sure to subscribe, like, and comment with your biggest takeaway!

Links:

• Connect with Manuel Conti
• Follow Caleb on LinkedIn
• Subscribe to our Brave Ideas Newsletter