In the world of craft beer, it’s rare to see a regional brewery consistently post double-digit growth — especially as the craft beer category contracts. But that’s exactly what Iowa-based Big Grove Brewery has done, posting strong gains every year since 2018. The company is now on track to sell more than 500,000 cases in 2025 — with a full 90% of those sales coming from within Iowa.

In this episode, we sit down with Matt Swift, Big Grove’s co-founder and CEO, to find out how he’s building one of the most successful breweries in the country by doing things a little differently.

Matt shares how he:

• Built a best-selling product line in the Easy Eddy hazy IPA family 

• Created deep community ties through taprooms, university partnerships, and local philanthropy

• Took a deliberate “inch wide, mile deep” strategy — dominating in-state sales before expanding 

• Structured the portfolio into clearly defined product “families” that drive trial and loyalty at shelf

• Continued investing in draft sales, even as other craft brands pulled back

• Works with distributors as true partnerships, planning A&P budgets and activations 9 months out 

We also talk about the risks Matt wishes he’d taken earlier, how he approaches SKU rationalization, and why he believes lighter, lower-alc and non-alc beers will play a big part in the future of the category.

If you’re a beverage entrepreneur thinking about growth — whether via taprooms, retail, or distributor relationships — this episode is filled with battle-tested insights. Don’t miss it.

Last Call:

In this week’s sponsored Last Call, we talk with Alex Cherniavsky, Managing Partner at SWIG Partners, about how to turn new distributor relationships into long-term success.

SWIG is a supplier–distributor matchmaking service that’s placed dozens of brands — and Alex has seen what works (and what fails). In this episode, she shares the most common missteps and how to avoid them.

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on 8/13.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

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LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. Most recently, he was the Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. Prior to that, he was the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

Four years ago, Jamie Fay was hand-packing cases of beer, loading them into a pickup truck, and delivering them door to door across Southern California. Today, RationAle Brewing is one of the fastest-growing non-alcoholic craft beer brands in the country — tracking 150% year-over-year growth and on pace to sell over 100,000 cases this year.

In this episode, Jamie — RationAle’s co-founder and CEO — shares how he built the business by staying hyper-focused on product quality, consumer connection, and a smart go-to-market strategy that prioritized velocity over vanity metrics. With five core SKUs and a best-selling Mexican Lager that accounts for 40% of sales, RationAle is now in eight markets and is preparing to double that footprint in the next 12 months.

You’ll hear how Jamie broke into the system without a single VC check — closing $5 million from more than 90 individual investors. He also explains the critical role that an early partnership with a juice distributor played in unlocking retail access when traditional options weren’t available.

We also get into:

• Why going “a mile deep” in a few markets created the foundation for long-term growth

• How Jamie and his team built retail distribution through relentless in-store sampling and events

• The tactical playbook he uses to enter new markets with traction and credibility

• Lessons from raising capital in today’s environment — and how to survive thousands of rejections

• Why Jamie thinks founders need to be paranoid (in a good way) to succeed in this business

If you’re trying to build a beverage brand with purpose, hustle, and staying power — this episode is chock-full of insights.

Last Call:

Think you know who’s drinking THC beverages? Think again. In this week’s Last Call on we dig into a recent report from Sightlines — and the regional trends might surprise you. The big takeaway: This isn’t a coastal Gen Z trend. It’s a demographic mosaic across ages and earning levels — and brands need to localize their marketing strategies fast. Find out more.

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on Aug. 6.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

YouTube

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host:

Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host:

Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor:

Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR:

SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

What does it take to grow a wine brand to over 6 million cases a year — and keep it growing double digits in a declining category? In this episode, we sit down with Dan Kleinman, Chief Brand Officer at Deutsch Family Wine & Spirits, to unpack how Josh Cellars has become one of the most remarkable success stories in modern wine.

Under Dan’s leadership, the Josh team has expanded beyond its loyal Gen X base to capture the attention of younger Millennial and Gen Z drinkers — leveraging storytelling, savvy innovation, and even a viral social media moment that led to a double-digit sales spike and cultural relevance.

You’ll hear:

• How the team transformed a humble Napa Cabernet with a heartfelt backstory into a top-selling national brand
  

• The strategy behind Josh’s “twin engine” approach: Staying meaningful to Gen X while becoming playful and culturally relevant to younger audiences
  

• How a viral meme sparked a massive surge in engagement, with Instagram followers jumping 79% in just weeks — and how the team capitalized on it
  

• Why Josh invests 5x more on consumer-facing marketing than the category norm — and how they measure ROI
  

• Why new products like the light, crisp Seaswept are created for younger consumers
  

• How to use data and consumer insights to craft messaging for different audiences — and avoid the “one-size-fits-all” trap
  

Dan also shares what drinks founders can learn about channel strategy, emotional brand-building, and why staying curious — about consumers, culture, and the craft of marketing — is essential to success.

If you’re a drinks entrepreneur looking to build a brand that resonates across generations, connects emotionally, and drives real-world growth, this is an episode you don’t want to miss.

Last Call:

🍷 Will AI take jobs in the drinks industry? In this Last Call segment, we explore how AI is already cutting white-collar jobs — and what that might mean for hospitality, sales, and brand roles.

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on July 30.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

YouTube

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. Most recently, he was the Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. Prior to that, he was the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

Branca USA may steward some of the most iconic names in spirits — Fernet-Branca, Carpano Antica, Borghetti — but under Chris Watt’s leadership, this 180-year-old company is showing how heritage can be a springboard for modern growth.

Since taking the helm as CEO in 2022, Chris has built a lean, data-focused team of just 48 people to deliver outsized results: Selling more than 3 million bottles annually and growing faster than the overall spirits category — showing an 8% increase in both volume and value so far this year.

In this episode, Chris shares how his team is using sharp analytics, disciplined focus, and creative execution to transform Branca’s brands for today’s consumers — while staying true to the bartender culture that built them.

We discuss:

• The strategic shift that turned Borghetti into the fastest-growing coffee liqueur in the U.S., up 81% in volume in 2024

• Why Fernet-Branca’s biggest growth now comes from college towns and neighborhood bars, and how the brand has expanded beyond its trade-darling origins

• How Carpano Antica Formula became the gold standard for home and bar Manhattans — and why that traction was largely organic

• The “pilot fish” strategy: How Branca partners with the biggest brands in its distributors’ portfolios to drive sales, creating a “win-win” for the distributor

• How a Total Wine March Madness display and on-premise activations worked hand-in-hand to deliver a 40% sales spike in that month

• Why Chris believes data and focus — not massive budgets — are the keys to smart brand building today
  

Chris also opens up about the challenges of executing at speed with a small team, why he sets aside daily time for strategic planning, and the mindset he brings to building culture and growth simultaneously.

If you’re a drinks founder or operator looking to understand how to modernize a heritage brand — or grow in a tough market with limited resources — this episode offers practical, actionable insights you won’t want to miss.

Last Call: 

Caroline Lamb, Erica Duecy, and Scott Rosenbaum dig into surprising data from Brightfield Group and Sightlines about THC beverage consumption — and why higher dosage drinks are on the rise. Did you know: Some 60% of hemp-derived THC drinkers now reach for the 10mg dose, up ~18% in just two years?

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on July 23.

For the latest updates, follow us:

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Head of Search at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

If you’ve ever wondered what it takes to get your brand into a top distributor — and actually stay there — this episode is essential listening.

We sit down with Sara Harmelin, Vice President of Portfolio Development at Allied Beverage Group, one of the largest single-state alcohol distributors in the U.S. Operating exclusively in New Jersey, Allied works with virtually every major supplier — from Diageo and Bacardi to Heaven Hill and Pernod Ricard — and moves more than 15,000 SKUs across the state. Sara is the gatekeeper of innovation: every new brand, line extension, and emerging category goes through her team first.

In this episode, Sara pulls back the curtain on the realities of portfolio building in a high-volume, high-stakes environment. She shares what works, what doesn’t, and how brands can avoid being lost in the warehouse shuffle.

You’ll hear:

• Why Allied is betting big on hemp-derived THC — and what it means for the future of category expansion

• What founders need to know about timing, incentives, and sales buy-in to make a successful launch stick

• The portfolio committee process: how Sara brought in cross-functional decision-makers (including Gen Z) to vet brands from every angle

• How Allied uses reorder rates and “rep touches” to decide if a new brand is worth the shelf space

• Why 90-day launch plans — not splashy debuts — are the new industry standard for serious distributors

• The one thing Sara wants every founder to leave at the door — and what you should bring instead

This episode also hits on the deeper shifts shaping the future of drinks distribution — from how generational change is influencing category preferences, to why flexibility, empathy, and brand authenticity are more important than ever.

Whether you’re launching a brand or scaling one, Sara’s insights will help you position your product for long-term success inside the distributor system.

Link from the interview: WSWA Access Resource Library

Last Call:

🚨 What’s next in beverage? We went to BevNET Live 2025 to find out.

In this Last Call segment of Business of Drinks, co-host Erica Duecy breaks down her top takeaways from one of the industry’s most future-focused events:

🔸 Functional and low/no alcohol drinks? No longer niche. They’re the expectation.

🔸 Premiumization is alive and well — but only if you’ve got the product education and social proof to back it.

🔸 + More takeaways!

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on July 16.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Head of Search at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

Tablas Creek Vineyard isn’t just a winery — it’s a masterclass in how to lead with values and still grow. In this episode, we sit down with proprietor Jason Haas, one of the most respected voices in American wine, to explore how his team has scaled a brand that stands for integrity, innovation, and environmental stewardship.

Co-founded in 1989 by the Haas and Perrin families (of Château de Beaucastel fame), Tablas Creek pioneered Rhône varieties in Paso Robles and today remains at the forefront of sustainable winemaking. It was the first winery in the world to receive Regenerative Organic Certification. It’s also a powerful case study in direct-to-consumer success: Tablas Creek produces 30,000–35,000 cases annually, with 80% of its revenue coming from DTC sales.

In this episode, Jason shares:

• How they built Tablas Creek’s category leadership from an unsung region and grape portfolio

• The marketing shift that led to a 20% increase in DTC sales in 2024

• Why white wines are now driving growth

• How a single blog post led to a boxed rosé launch that sold out in four hours

• What it takes to maintain team culture and creative freedom in a growing 50-person organization

• His advice to founders on staying true to your brand—even when market trends tempt you to stray

Jason also explains why the $25–$40 price tier is outperforming other segments, and how Tablas Creek doubled its export business with just five well-timed market visits.

If you’re a founder or operator looking to build a brand that endures — while staying nimble and connected to your customer — this episode is packed with insights you won’t want to miss.

Last Call:

Co-hosts Erica Duecy and Scott Rosenbaum break down the most important takeaways from Bar Convent Brooklyn. A few highlights:

🍸 RNDC’s impending CA closure shook the room — and the distributors on stage didn’t sugarcoat what’s ahead.

🚨 New reality: Every initial sale is a liability — unless your product moves fast.

🧊 Coffee spirits everywhere. We’re still not done with espresso martinis, apparently.

💰 Launching a spirits brand in 2025? Hope you have $1M.

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on July 9.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

YouTube

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. Most recently, he was the Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. Prior to that, he was the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

On this episode of Business of Drinks, we sit down with Nick Papanicolaou, the founder and CEO of No Sleep Beverage, one of the most dynamic early-stage strategic investment platforms in the beverage alcohol space. Nick has deployed millions in capital across brands like Madre Mezcal, Barr Hill Gin, and Artet — and in this candid conversation, he outlines exactly what founders need to know to secure funding, navigate investor relationships, and build a beverage brand with staying power.

Before launching No Sleep, Nick built his expertise from both sides of the table — first as a founder of a brand, then as the architect of Pernod Ricard’s New Brand Ventures division. With No Sleep, he’s developed an investment and acceleration model that prioritizes deep engagement with just 8–10 brands at a time, helping them optimize everything from brand positioning to sales strategy to compliance and legal.

Nick doesn’t just hand out checks — he and his team roll up their sleeves and work side-by-side with founders to turn smart brand into scalable businesses. In today’s tight funding environment, that kind of partnership is increasingly rare — and invaluable.

We cover:

• The No Sleep criteria: What revenue thresholds, margin profiles, and market presence VCs are really looking for
  

• What founders get wrong when pitching for investment — and how to stand out
  

• The death of “growth for growth’s sake” and what sustainable scaling actually looks like
  

• Why No Sleep takes a “slow and steady wins the race” approach to expansion
  

• How founders should think about valuation and and share of equity as they bring on funding partners

Whether you’re just starting out or navigating a critical growth stage, this episode delivers a rare look behind the scenes of what top beverage VCs really want — and how to prepare your brand to succeed.

Last Call: 

Are celebrity spirits past their prime? In our latest Last Call segment, we dig into a new report from 3 Tier Beverages showing that only 16 of the top 50 celebrity-backed brands are still growing. It’s a candid convo for any drinks founder or marketer asking: Is celebrity still a smart strategy? Or has the novelty worn off?

Link to 3 Tier Beverages report recap. 

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on July 2.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Head of Search at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry. Thank you!

Welcome to a very special edition of Business of Drinks. In this episode, co-hosts Erica Duecy and Scott Rosenbaum team up with Rabobank’s Liquid Assets podcast hosts — VP of Beverage Research Bourcard Nesin and Senior Beverage Analyst Jim Watson — for the first-ever Bev-Alc Debate Club.

Today’s topic? The question that’s haunting boardrooms and bottling lines across the country: What’s wrong with the alcohol industry?

To unpack it, we went head-to-head in a spirited draft format. Each of us chose what we believe is the biggest force behind Bev-Alc’s current decline — and then we debated the heck out of it.

What followed was a lively, insightful, and at times contrarian conversation that spanned:

• 🚨 The Joe Rogan Effect: How anti-alcohol messages from influencers like Rogan and Andrew Huberman — and warnings from the WHO and Surgeon General — are changing perceptions of health and drinking.
  

• 🧠 The Culture Shift: 65% of 18–34-year-olds now say even a drink or two a day is bad for their health, according to Gallup. That’s more than double the rate in 2000.
  

• 🛒 Economic Drag: Is inflation the real culprit behind alcohol’s decline — or are consumers simply moving on?
  

• 🏪 The Distribution Bottleneck: Fewer distributors, more producers, and how small brands are being squeezed out of market access and innovation.
  

• 🥂 Post-Pandemic Hangover: How loneliness, digital substitution, and behavioral shifts may be eroding alcohol’s social role.
  

• 🌱 Rise of THC Drinks: Hemp-derived beverages are showing up in bars, liquor stores, and homes — with strong demand. Brands like BRĒZ hit $28 million in revenue and 8 million cans in just two years.
  

• 📉 Demographic Realities: Baby Boomers drank more and are aging out. Gen Z drinks less. What happens when your best customers are literally dying off?
  

• 📱 New Hits, Same High: Gambling, doomscrolling, and a million digital dopamine-stimulating sources are competing for the same brainspace alcohol once dominated.
  

This episode is a must-listen for anyone in the beverage business — whether you’re trying to understand the shifting terrain or figure out how to future-proof your brand.

🎧 Tune in for sharp insights, bold takes, and the kind of data-backed banter that only happens when Rabobank meets Business of Drinks. 

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on June 25.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

YouTube

LinkedIn

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

If you enjoyed today’s conversation, follow Business of Drinks wherever you’re listening, and don’t forget to rate and review us. Your support helps us reach new listeners passionate about the drinks industry.

Thank you!

Ben Branson is one of the most creative minds in beverages today. As the founder of Seedlip — the world’s first distilled non-alcoholic spirit — he didn’t just launch a product, he pioneered an entire category. That category, once niche and unproven, is now valued at more than $11 billion, and Seedlip was acquired by Diageo in 2019, just five years after its launch.

Now, Ben’s back with a new venture: Pollen Projects, a drinks innovation studio creating a range of unconventional non-alcoholic products. The two early standouts? Sylva — a non-alcoholic sipping spirit distilled and matured from trees (yes, trees!) — and Seasn, a duo of cocktail bitters designed to flavor everything from seltzer to cocktails.

In this conversation, Ben takes us inside his product development process — from cold-calling 500 top bars to obsessively studying 17th-century distillation texts — to assess white space for Seedlip. He also shares what’s next for Sylva, including a new distillery in upstate New York to make spirits from American trees. That operation will accompany Sylva’s existing UK distillery, which is already producing spirits made from British Hazel and African Padauk wood.

In this conversation, Ben shares the research, philosophy, and creative rigor behind his brands — and what he’s doing differently this time around. You’ll hear about the early days of Seedlip, how Sylva’s distillation and aging process borrows from perfumery and traditional spirits, and why simplicity — not trend-chasing — is the secret to building lasting brands.

We discuss:

• Why Ben isn’t just making non-alc alternatives, but rather inventing a new class of liquids

• His methodical, data-driven approach to product innovation

• The surprising reason he chose to launch Seedlip into high-end, on-premise accounts rather than DTC

• The innovative techniques used to produce Sylva’s non-alcoholic sipping spirits

• Why Ben emphasizes clarity above all — whether in product design or brand strategy

• What he learned from early product missteps — and how he’s applying those lessons to Sylva and Seasn

• Why Ben doesn’t build brands for himself — he builds them to meet real consumer needs with standout experiences
  

Last Call:

In this Last Call update, we reconnect with Issamu Kamide, co-founder of Wonderwerk, to hear what’s driving growth for one of the most innovative brands in wine.

We first featured Wonderwerk last fall in Ep. 36 Since that time, Wonderwerk has grown its revenue 30%. We discuss:

🔸 National Whole Foods rollout

🔸 Wildly successful flavors like Pink Lemonade and Yuzu

🔸 A “CPG-first” mindset that ditches tradition and centers the consumer

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on June 18.

For the latest updates, follow us:

Business of Drinks:

YouTube

Instagram @bizofdrinks

Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

LinkedIn

Instagram @ericaduecy

Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

LinkedIn

Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

While much of the wine industry is softening, Treasury Wine Estates — home to brands like DAOU, Penfolds, Frank Family, Matua, and 19 Crimes — is experiencing double-digit gains. In this episode, we speak with Ben Dollard, President of Treasury Americas, who shares “the how” behind one of the wine world’s most compelling growth stories.

Under Ben’s leadership, Treasury Americas grew net revenue more than 22% in 2024, scaling to 6 million cases annually across North and South America. That growth has been powered by a two-pronged strategy: One focused on culture-forward, accessible brands like 19 Crimes (with partnerships like Snoop Dogg and the UFC), and another dedicated to luxury, estate-driven wines like DAOU and Penfolds.

In this episode, Ben shares:

• Why DAOU has become the #1 U.S. luxury wine brand — and what makes it stand out in a sea of premium competitors
  

• How Treasury successfully integrates acquired brands without losing their magic
  

• Why the company is leaning into consumer experience at the tasting room level — not just as a sales tool, but as a source of insight
  

• How Treasury is using AI to tell brand stories and simplify wine discovery in a fragmented retail environment
  

• What other drinks entrepreneurs can learn from building brand pillars and maintaining authenticity at scale

Ben also talks about how he’s future-proofing the company through a focus on innovation and team culture. Treasury Americas was recently named a finalist in Fast Company’s “Best Workplaces for Innovators,” and Ben shares how that same creative energy is helping build a more connected, purpose-led portfolio.

If you’re looking to build a brand that can scale across channels, price points, and countries — without losing its soul — this episode is packed with insights that matter now.

Last Call:

In this Last Call segment, your Business of Drinks co-hosts spill on the most jaw-dropping drink they’ve had this year.

• Caroline found a tiny importer sourcing neoclassical French & Italian wines with pure electricity
• Scott discovered a Negroni remix in Denver that left him speechless
• Erica brought a rare Cretan wine to a collector dinner — and stole the show

Don’t miss our next episode, dropping on June 11.

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Erica Duecy, co-host: Erica Duecy is founder and co-host of Business of Drinks and one of the drinks industry’s most accomplished digital and content strategists. She runs the consultancy and advisory arm of Business of Drinks and has built publishing and marketing programs for Drizly, VinePair, SevenFifty, and other hospitality and drinks tech companies.

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Scott Rosenbaum, co-host: Scott Rosenbaum is co-host of Business of Drinks and a veteran strategist and analyst with deep experience building drinks portfolios. He currently serves as Portfolio Development Director at Distill Ventures. He was formerly the Vice President of T. Edward Wines & Spirits, a New York-based importer and distributor.

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Caroline Lamb, contributor: Caroline is a producer and on-air contributor at Business of Drinks and a key account sales and marketing specialist at AHD Vintners, a Michigan-based importer and distributor.

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Instagram @borkaline

SPONSOR: SWIG Partners is exclusively offering $100 off their supplier-distributor matchmaking fee when you mention the Business of Drinks podcast, or inquire via this link: ⁠https://www.swigpartners.com/businessofdrinks

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