For the last few days, a set of pronouncements from the White House have filled the news regarding the war in Iran. President Donald Trump has gone from threatening to destroy an entire civilisation to negotiating a ceasefire between Washington and Tehran, led by Pakistan. 

This week, Mark Leonard is joined by Aslı Aydıntaşbaş, senior associate fellow at ECFR and research fellow at the Brookings Institution, to discuss the current state of play. What does the ceasefire mean for the future of the Middle East and for American foreign policy? How will it impact Europe, and global security more generally? And will Trump make good on his threat to withdraw from NATO? 

This podcast was recorded on April 9th, 2026.

Bookshelf:

Mother Mary Comes to Me by Arundhati Roy

The Loneliness of Sonia and Sunny by Kiran Desai

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