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In this episode of the Definitely, Maybe Agile podcast, Dave and Peter have a special guest, Rob Hirschfeld, co-founder, and CEO of RackN, a collaborative platform for teams automating infrastructure as code. This time we'll have a slightly longer episode than normal as we dive into different aspects of complexity. This isn't one you'll want to miss. We had a lot of fun recording it and really liked the end result. We hope you do too.

This week takeaways:

• Stop trying to eliminate complexity and figure out how to manage it.
• Build systems focused on system effectiveness.
• Complexity problems are collaboration problems.

We love to hear feedback. If you have questions, want to propose a topic, or even join us for a conversation, contact us here: [email protected].