In this episode Jennifer welcomes Jay Van Bavel, an Associate Professor of Psychology and Neural Science at New York University. Together, they discuss the complex challenges facing the DEI field, exploring how extreme stances and political backlash have overshadowed much of the good work being done. Jennifer and Jay consider ways to rebrand and reinvent DEI by focusing on broader issues like organizational culture, psychological safety, and collective well-being. Through their candid dialogue, they highlight the importance of intergenerational conversations, social norms, and rewarding incremental progress in shaping inclusive cultures.