Elfi Martinez, Vice President of Inclusive Organizations at Changeforce.ai, returns to the program for a conversation with Jennifer about the current crossroads facing the DEI field.  Jennifer and Elfi's discussion ranges from a discussion about cultural backlash and the erosion of shared language to the urgent need for clear standards and behavior-based accountability. This conversation examines how we got here, what we’ve learned, and what it will take to evolve the work in ways that are sustainable, inclusive, and resilient in the face of resistance.