Encounter Culture

New Mexico State Historian Rob Martínez tells the story of the residents of Abiquiu who were accused of being witches and sorcerers in the 1700s and unpacks the complexity of power dynamics and differing cultural norms and beliefs.

In the 1760s, accusations of witchcraft and sorcery emerged in Abiquiu. This was not the first time such accusations were made—beginning in the 1600s, while the region was a distant territory under Spanish rule, Spanish settlers would sometimes call their neighbors witches. These accusations included reports of people flying through the air, being possessed by demons, and shape shifting. In the 1760s, the Spanish Inquisition got involved.

In looking back at this history, how do we make sense of it? Were real spells being cast or was there a mismatch between reality and perception? New Mexico State Historian has been digging into this history since he was in graduate school at the University of New Mexico. “There were people trying to get some power in systems where they had very little power at times,” says Martínez. “I mean, the governor had power. The priest had power. Uh, the, the Spanish settlers had power. And so the native people tended to find ways to intimidate those Spanish authorities and Spanish settlers, in a way weaponizing their own ideas against them.”

Featured Guest:

New Mexico State Historian Rob Martinez

Rob’s short histories YouTube channel

Recommended Encounter Culture Episodes:

What Have the Trees Seen? New Mexico Folklore at Los Luceros Historic Site

A History of Genízaro Identity in the Heart of New Mexico with Dr. Gregorio Gonzalez

Truth and Tragedy: The Timeless Mythology of La Llorona with Irene Vásquez at University of Mexico

Recommended El Palacio Articles:

El Palacio, Vol. 80, No. 2: An issue dedicated to “Southwest Witchcraft,” published 1974

Mentioned in this Episode

“Witch Tales of New Mexico,” by Rob Martinez, New Mexico Magazine

The Witches of Abiquiu (UNM Press), by Malcolm Ebright and Rick Hendricks

We’d love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. You can write a regular email or record a short voice memo and attach it for us to listen to.

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online!

If you love New Mexico, you’ll love El Palacio Magazine! Subscribe to El Palacio today.

Encounter Culture, a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, is produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio Magazine

Executive Producer: Daniel Zillmann

Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. Ruiz

Editor & Production Manager: Alex Riegler

Associate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota)

Theme Music: D’Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

In 1680, Po’pay of Ohkay Owingeh, sent messengers to the Pueblos across northern New Mexico to plan an organized attack on the Spanish colonizers. The plan worked, and together, people more than forty Pueblos, drove the Spanish out for twelve years.

For Virgil Ortiz, of the Pueblo of Cochiti, this true story of the Pueblo Revolt of 1680 has been at the center of his work as an artist across the decades. In sculpture, film, textiles, and more, Virgil has made it his mission to use his art to educate others about the history of the Pueblo Revolt, its significance, and its ongoing influence. As a part of this telling and retelling, Virgil blends the history with Star Wars-inspired Indigenous futurism storytelling, both as a way to draw many different audiences in, and to imagine an Indigenous future that pulls from the strength of its history.

In the latest chapter, Continuum: Blindfall, First Strike, on view at the Vladem Contemporary in Santa Fe until October 18, 2026, Virgil joins forces with friend and fellow artist Eric F. Garcia, to place Spanish conquistador history and symbolism in conversation with Po’pay and other Pueblo warriors, both past and present.

Featured Guests:

Virgil Ortiz

Eric F. Garcia

Continuum: Blindfall, First Strike exhibition at Vladem Contemporary

Recommended Encounter Culture Episodes:

Truth and Tragedy: The Timeless Mythology of La Llorona

Recommended El Palacio Articles:

The Fuel of Activism

Mentioned in this episode:

The Pueblo Revolt of 1680

Po’pay

Herman Agoyo, sculptor from Ohkay Owingeh

La Malinche (as discussed in Season 7 of Encounter Culture)

Pueblo of Cochiti

Art collector Robert Gallegos

New Mexico School for the Arts

We’d love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. You can write a regular email or record a short voice memo and attach it for us to listen to.

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online!

If you love New Mexico, you’ll love El Palacio Magazine! Subscribe to El Palacio today.

Encounter Culture, a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, is produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio Magazine

Executive Producer: Daniel Zillmann

Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. Ruiz

Editor & Production Manager: Alex Riegler

Associate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota)

Theme Music: D’Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

Some of New Mexico's most prominent artists are passing traditional Nuevo Mexicano art forms like colcha embroidery, retablos and bultos, tinwork, and straw applique down to the next generation. These artists include Jean Anaya Moya, Vanessa Zamora, Vincente Telles, Arthur Lopez, Eric Romero, Vanessa Alvarado, Rhonda Crispin, and Cleo Romero.

Elena Baca, education program manager at the National Hispanic Cultural Center (Albuquerque), and Jana Gottshalk, curator and director at the Nuevo Mexicano Heritage Arts Museum (Santa Fe), create spaces where these traditions stay alive and where kids can explore and express themselves freely.

Discover more:

National Hispanic Cultural Center Learning programming

National Hispanic Cultural Center Museum

Nuevo Mexicano Heritage Arts Museum ongoing programming

Nuevo Mexicano Heritage Arts Museum

Wonders on Wheels

Read more in El Palacio:

"Art and Activism at Highlands University," by Myrriah Gόmez, in Winter 2025 issue of El Palacio magazine

Learn more:

Traditional Spanish Market

Contemporary Hispanic Market

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. You can write a regular email or record a short voice memo and attach it for us to listen to.

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online!

If you love New Mexico, you'll love El Palacio Magazine! Subscribe to El Palacio today. Encounter Culture, a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, is produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio MagazineExecutive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. RuizRecording Engineer: Collin Ungerleider and Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa FeEditor & Production Manager: Alex RieglerAssociate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

Accordions are woven into New Mexico's soundscape—at fiestas, on plazas, and in the musical storytelling traditions that travel across generations. In this episode of Encounter Culture, host Emily Withnall talks with Tony Tomei and Antonio Maestas, a master-and-apprentice duo who completed the New Mexico Arts Folk Arts Apprenticeship Program in 2024, focusing on accordion restoration and traditional New Mexico tunings.

Tony and Antonio fell in love with the accordion in different decades and play different styles. Tony first encountered the accordion as a child in the 1950s, growing up in an ethnically diverse community where the instrument was central to social life. "And that was before the Beatles came in the sixties and basically wreaked havoc with the accordion and everybody switched over to the guitars," Tony laughs.

Discover more:

New Mexico Arts Folk Arts Apprenticeship Program

New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs on YouTube

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

The American Mystique of the Cowboy Boot with Deana McGuffin and Jes Márquez

Learn more:

Hohner

Albuquerque Accordion Club

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. You can write a regular email or record a short voice memo and attach it for us to listen to.

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online!

If you love New Mexico, you'll love El Palacio Magazine! Subscribe to El Palacio today. Encounter Culture, a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, is produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio MagazineExecutive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. RuizRecording Engineer: Collin Ungerleider and Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa FeEditor & Production Manager: Alex RieglerAssociate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

Photos can obscure as much as they reveal. When we encounter historic photographs, it can feel like we've entered the past through a portal. But like contemporary photographs, what is left out of the frame is as interesting and puzzling as what we can observe. Still, the donation of historic photos to any archive can only help to add to our knowledge and expand the questions we need to ask. This is certainly the case for the William Thomas Mullarky photo collection at the New Mexico History Museum's Palace of the Governors Photo Archive. The Mullarky collection has never been accessible until recently and they provide unusual and unexpected windows into 1930s Gallup, New Mexico.

For the Fall 2025 issue of El Palacio, University of New Mexico professor and labor historian, David Correia, wrote an article about the Gallup Coal Wars of 1933-35. Mullarky's photos of the events in Gallup at the time accompany Correia's words. For this episode of Encounter Culture, however, Correia talks about who Mullarky was and what makes his photos so out of the ordinary.

Discover more:

New Mexico History Museum Palace of the Governors Photo Archive

William Thomas Mullarky Photographs of the Gallup Coal War

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

A History of Genízaro Identity in the Heart of New Mexico with Dr. Gregorio Gonzales

The Promise of a Photo with Anthropologist Robert Quintana Hopkins and Archivist Hannah Abelbeck, New Mexico History Museum

Read more in El Palacio:

"Strike and Struggle: The Great Gallup Coal War, 1933-35," by David Correia Fall 2025 issue of El Palacio

Learn more:

An Enemy Such as This: Larry Casuse and the Fight for Native Liberation in One Family on Two Continents over Three Centuries, by David Correia

Edward Curtis photographs (as example of "frontier photography")

Simeon Schwemberger photo collection at The University of New Mexico

J.R. Willis

Gallup Inter-Tribal Indian Ceremonial

Center for Southwest Research at The University of New Mexico

The Myth of Santa Fe, by Chris Wilson (UNM Press)

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We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. You can write a regular email or record a short voice memo and attach it for us to listen to.

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online!

If you love New Mexico, you'll love El Palacio Magazine! Subscribe to El Palacio today. Encounter Culture, a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, is produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio MagazineExecutive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. RuizRecording Engineer: Collin Ungerleider and Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa FeEditor & Production Manager: Alex RieglerAssociate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

In this episode of Encounter Culture, community-led archaeology takes center stage as an alternative to extractive excavation practices of the past and a best practice rooted in respect and deeper historical understanding.

At the Cañón de Carnué land grant in New Mexico, New Mexico State University has partnered with land grant heirs, as Dr. Kelly Jenks, a historical archaeologist with NMSU, discusses efforts to uncover the layered history of a community first established in 1763, revealing how Indigenous, Genízaro, and colonial peoples together shaped the region's frontier past.

Discover more:

Archaeology in Cañón de Carnué, New Mexico State University

Cañón de Carnué land grant history

New Mexico land grant history

United States v. Sandoval Supreme Court decision stripping land grant rights

Present-day land grant actions

San Miguel del Vado land grant recovery efforts

Nación Genízara: Ethnogenesis, Place, and Identity in New Mexico, edited by Moises Gonzales and Enrique R. Lamadrid

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

A History of Genízaro Identity in the Heart of New Mexico with Dr. Gregorio Gonzales, Encounter Culture season 6

Don't miss the upcoming issues of El Palacio - SUBSCRIBE NOW!

***

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. OR leave us a review on Apple Podcasts!

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online! ***

Encounter Culture is a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio Magazine Executive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. Ruiz Recording Engineers: Collin Ungerleider & Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa Fe Editor & Production Manager: Alex Riegler Associate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

Are you feeling the pull to be connected this winter? We have some opportunities for you to be a part of New Mexican culture featuring art, history, science, poetry, and live conversations.

Plus find out who loves winter and who does not... Encounter Culture host Emily or producer Andrea?

Learn more about the Folk Art Apprenticeship Program & Apply: https://bit.ly/nmartsfolk

Get details about the reopening of the Museum of Natural History & Science: https://bit.ly/nmnathistory

Join Us For An El Palacio Reading:

January 11, 2026, 2pm @ FUSION, Albuquerque - https://bit.ly/elpaljan2026

February 22 at 2 pm in the Donnelly Library at New Mexico Highlands University - Details coming soon. Follow El Palacio on Instagram or Facebook for updates.

Read more in El Palacio:

Before the Famous Fossils: Ancient Life in the Paleozoic Era in New Mexico by Tamara Enz, Spring 2025

Winter 2025 issue!

Your Encounter Culture Playlist:

The American Mystique of the Cowboy Boot with Deana McGufin and Jes Márquez, Season 8

TIme Travel: From GIant Millipedes to Modern Landscapes with New Mexico Museum of Natural History & Science, Season 8

Ancient LIfe: There's No Shame in Extinction video on YouTube

Big, Toothy, and Conveniently Dead: Why We Are Obsessed with Dinosaurs Featuring Anthony Fiorillo, Season 5

An Underground Love Affair, The Palace Seen and Unseen with Archaeologists Cordelia Snow & Stephen Post, Season 1

Everyone Wants to be Included in the Story of New Mexico: The Wonders on Wheels Mobile Museum, Season 9

Good Heart Work: Poetry as Medicine with Manuel González, New Mexico Poet Laureate, Season 9

Don't miss the upcoming issues of El Palacio - SUBSCRIBE NOW!

***

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected]. OR leave us a review on Apple Podcasts!

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online! ***

Encounter Culture is a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio Magazine Executive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. Ruiz Recording Engineers: Collin Ungerleider & Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa Fe Editor & Production Manager: Alex Riegler Associate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

New Mexico has a new Poet Laureate! Although Manuel González is well known in the slam poetry circles in Albuquerque—where he also served as the city's poet laureate from 2016 to 2018—he is now stepping into a larger role with big visions about how to engage the entire state in the unique connection and expression inherent to poetry.

Throughout his career, González has made it his mission to reach the most marginalized people in New Mexico, and now he plans to leverage his role as Poet Laureate heal hearts in as many communities as possible.

Discover more:

Manuel González Xicanopoet

New Mexico Arts

Manny and the Casanovas

Al Hurricane

Native American Community Academy

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

From Goatheads to Grand Canyons: A Love Letter to the Landscape with New Mexico State Poet Laureate, Lauren Camp, Season 6

Curanderismo, Poetry, and How to Heal a Broken Heart with Tommy Archuleta, Santa Fe Poet Laureate, Season 7

Read more in El Palacio:

Art and Activism at Highlands University, by Myrriah Gόmez, Winter 2025

Don't miss the upcoming issues of El Palacio - SUBSCRIBE NOW!

***

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected].

OR leave us a review on Apple Podcasts!

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online! ***

Encounter Culture is a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio MagazineExecutive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. RuizRecording Engineers: Collin Ungerleider & Kabby at Kabby Sound StudiosEditor & Production Manager: Alex RieglerAssociate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

New Mexico is the fifth largest state, making access to art, history, and culture at museums or historic site difficult for many. The Wonder on Wheels mobile museum traverses the state to bring art and history directly to small towns, villages, and Pueblos, ensuring everyone can participate in the rich cultural conversations so central to New Mexican identity.

The exhibition inside the thirty-eight-foot RV changes annually and this year, the eight New Mexico State Historic Sites tell the state's story across centuries, from 1150 to the early twentieth century. The staff pack rich history into a small space, supported by oral narratives and dialogue.

Plan your visit:

Wonders on Wheels

Wonders on Wheels Facebook Group

New Mexico Historic Sites

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

Listen, and Speak the Truth: Collaborating Through Conversation on the Bosque Redondo Memorial with Manuelito Wheeler and Aaron Roth, Encounter Culture, Season 2

Listen to the Land: Art at Bosque Redondo with Dakota Mace, Daisy Trudell-Mills, and Kéyah Keenan Henry, Encounter Culture, Season 6

Everything Past is Present at Los Luceros Historic Site with Rebecca Ward and Carly Stewart, Encounter Culture, Season 3

The Land is Everything: Voting Rights vs Tribal Sovereignty with Dr. Maurice Crandall, Encounter Culture, Season 4

Read more in El Palacio:

"The Man in the Sala," El Palacio Summer 2023

"Cathay Williams: In Search of Liberation with the Buffalo Soldiers," El Palacio Summer 2025

Don't miss the upcoming issues of El Palacio - SUBSCRIBE NOW!

***

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected].

OR leave us a review on Apple Podcasts!

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online! ***

Encounter Culture is a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio MagazineExecutive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. RuizRecording Engineers: Collin Ungerleider & Kabby at Kabby Sound StudiosEditor & Production Manager: Alex RieglerAssociate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine

In anticipation of another rich season of New Mexico history, art, and culture, El Palacio editor and Encounter Culture host Emily Withnall and producer Andrea Klunder reflect on a year of award-winning storytelling.

From earning national recognition for both the podcast and the magazine to the art of curating New Mexico's most compelling voices, Andrea and Emily share what it takes to craft stories that resonate across time and place.

They also look ahead to a new season of conversations with artists, historians, and cultural stewards. Plus, tune in to hear about a few favorite winter traditions that make this time of year uniquely New Mexican! Join us for a window into the creative collaboration that continues to shape Encounter Culture.

Read more in El Palacio:

Father, I Hardly Knew Ye: A Nisei Daughter's Memories of Japanese American Incarceration

Strike and Struggle: The National Miners' Union and The Great Gallup Coal War, 1933-1935

Hear more on Encounter Culture:

From Goatheads to Grand Canyons: A Love Letter to the Landscape with New Mexico State Poet Laureate, Lauren Camp

Don't miss the upcoming winter & spring issues of El Palacio - SUBSCRIBE NOW!

***

We'd love to hear from you! Let us know what you loved about the episode, share a personal story it made you think of, or ask us a question at [email protected].

OR leave us a review on Apple Podcasts!

Visit newmexicoculture.org for info about our museums, historic sites, virtual tours, and more.

Our favorite way to fully experience everything they have to offer is with the New Mexico CulturePass. Reserve yours online! ***

Encounter Culture is a production of the New Mexico Department of Cultural Affairs, produced and edited by Andrea Klunder at The Creative Impostor Studios.

Hosted by Emily Withnall, editor at El Palacio Magazine Executive Producer: Daniel Zillmann Technical Director & Post-Production Audio: Edwin R. Ruiz Recording Engineers: Collin Ungerleider & Kabby at Kabby Sound Studios in Santa Fe Editor & Production Manager: Alex Riegler Associate Producer & Editor: Monica Braine (Assiniboine/Lakota) Theme Music: D'Santi Nava

Instagram: @newmexicanculture and @elpalaciomagazine