On April 20, 2021, Derek Chauvin was found guilty in the death of George Floyd. But despite the overwhelming evidence -- including the infamous video of him kneeling on George Floyd’s neck for more than 9 minutes -- that verdict was hardly a foregone conclusion.

On this episode Sarah talks with Nicole Gonzalez Van Cleve, associate professor of sociology at Brown, about why convicting police officers of crimes in the U.S. is so incredibly rare. Her 2016 book, “Crook County,” explores this question, and paints a picture of the overlapping forces that keep justice from being served when it’s directed at the police themselves.

You can learn more about and purchase Crook County here.

You can learn more about Watson’s other podcasts here.