Not long ago, a dirty, sooty turnout coat and helmet was a badge of honor in the fire service—tangible proof that a firefighter was in the action. But as concern grew about the high levels of cancer in the fire service, that culture has totally flipped. Now, fire departments around the world are going to great lengths to ensure that their members never have to wear a uniform covered in carcinogens. But to do that, you need to know when it's actually clean. That isn't as easy as it sounds. For the past 10 years, PPE expert Jeff Stull has helped lead a Fire Protection Research Foundation project focused on answering those questions. Stull joins the podcast today to discuss the complexities of figuring out how clean is clean, the impacts the project has had on firefighter health, and what further research needs to be done as we move into the next generation of PPE. LINKS: Read Jeff Stull's NFPA Journal Feature story about the project and its impacts Read the project's scope, aims, and final reports Learn more about the new NFPA 1850