Igniting Imagination

What if ministry could be understood as a form of technology?

On the Season 17 premiere of the Igniting Imagination® podcast, Rev. Lisa Greenwood, Rev. Sue Phillips, and Rev. Dr. Blair Thompson explore this provocative question. This change in mindset could open the door to understanding how ancient spiritual practices can be renewed to meet the deep longings and challenges of our modern world.

They unpack what it means to approach ministry through this sense of curiosity, especially how it can help cultivate genuine connection and community. They also examine the dynamic relationship between tradition and innovation, highlighting spiritual practices that speak meaningfully to today’s social and cultural realities.

Host

Rev. Lisa Greenwood is the President & CEO of Wesleyan Impact Partners and Texas Methodist Foundation. She joined the staff of TMF in 2012 serving as Vice President for Leadership Ministry before taking her current role in 2022. She is an ordained elder in the North Texas (now Horizon Texas) Conference of the United Methodist Church, where she served congregations for twenty years. During the last five years of her local church ministry, Lisa served as a ministry strategist with Horizons Stewardship Company. She earned a Bachelor of Arts degree from the University of Texas at Austin and a Master of Divinity from Yale Divinity School.

Co-Host

Rev. Sue Phillips is on the founding team of the Workshop for Emotional and Spiritual Technology, a tech startup working to help people live more meaningful lives. After serving as a denominational executive for the Unitarian Universalist Association, she co-founded Sacred Design Lab, a nonprofit that interprets innovation to the religious world and ancient wisdom to the world of innovation. Clients and partners have included Pinterest, Google, Logitech, the Obama Foundation, and the Office of the U.S. Surgeon General.

Producer

Rev. Dr. Blair Thompson is chief learning and innovation officer at Texas Methodist Foundation and Wesleyan Impact Partners, where she and her team lead the organizations’ three Lilly Endowment-funded initiatives: Courageous Congregations Collaborative (C3), Courageous Leadership Imperative (CLI), and Phygital Preaching Fellows. She also leads Wesleyan Impact Partners’ Locke Innovative Leader Award process and cohorts of spiritual entrepreneurs. Blair is the creator and producer of the Igniting Imagination® podcast.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

This week on the Igniting Imagination® podcast, Rev. Lisa Greenwood steps into the fault lines shaping the future of faith with Anna Del Castillo, co-founder of Our Own Deep Wells, and Dr. Josh Packard, co-founder of Future of Faith. Together they interrogate the disruptive trends already redefining church life, inspired by Carey Nieuwhof’s 2026 forecasts. Why is Generation Z returning to church, and what does that say about hunger, belonging, and spiritual depth?

They confront the unsettling possibility that algorithms may be discipling us more effectively than pastors, and ask who is really shaping belief and practice. This conversation is an invitation to rethink how faith is being formed and what kind of church the future is already demanding.

Guests

Anna Del Castillo

Anna Del Castillo is a Peruvian-Bolivian American healer and activist who served as Deputy Director of DEIA in the Biden-Harris White House. A Harvard Divinity School Dean’s Fellow, she now champions healing and justice as Executive Director of Our Own Deep Wells, taking part in a collective that is providing resources for healing and revolutionary love.

Dr. Josh Packard

Dr. Josh Packard is the co-founder of Future of Faith and one of the foremost experts in the spiritual lives of American youth. He is an accomplished researcher in the sociology of religion and new forms of religious expression. He has authored numerous books and articles in both popular and academic outlets, including Church Refugees: Sociologists reveal why people are DONE with church but not their faith and Meaning Making: 8 Values That Drive America’s Newest Generations. His newest book is Faithful Futures: Sacred Tools for Engaging Younger Generations.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

In the season sixteen finale of the Igniting Imagination® podcast, Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle reflect on the cultural shifts that are reshaping the ways people search for meaning, community, and belonging. This season, Lisa, Gil, and guests have confronted a growing reality: the structures we inherited may no longer be capable of holding the spiritual longings of today, especially for younger generations.

Rather than clinging to old maps, they explored what it might look like to listen more deeply, to reimagine church not as an institution to preserve, but as a living, responsive space for growth, healing, and connection, and to consider what might emerge if we allow ourselves to keep asking what comes next.

Host

Rev. Lisa Greenwood is the President & CEO of Wesleyan Impact Partners and Texas Methodist Foundation. She joined the staff of TMF in 2012 serving as Vice President for Leadership Ministry before taking her current role in 2022. Rev. Greenwood is an ordained elder in the North Texas (now Horizon Texas) Conference of the United Methodist Church, where she served congregations for twenty years. During the last five years of her local church ministry, Lisa served as a ministry strategist with Horizons Stewardship Company. She earned a Bachelor of Arts degree from the University of Texas at Austin and a Master of Divinity from Yale Divinity School.

Co-Host

Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle

Gil Rendle is a retired Senior Vice President and part-time consultant with Texas Methodist Foundation in Austin, Texas, and also works independently on change and leadership in denominations. With deep expertise in organizational development, systems theory, and leadership, he has guided congregations and denominational bodies through planning and transformation. He is widely respected for his work with middle judicatory and national offices navigating complex change. Gil is the author of  numerous articles and monographs, along with twelve books, including: Doing the Math of Mission: Fruits, Faithfulness and Metrics (2014), Quietly Courageous: Leading the Church in a Changing World, (2018), and Countercultural: Subversive Resistance and the Neighborhood Congregation (2023). His latest monograph, Reimagining and Remapping the Religious Landscape: Chaos Before a New Ordering, is the foundation for this podcast season.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

In this episode of the Igniting Imagination® podcast, Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle explore the powerful intersection of faith, justice, and public life with the Rev. William "Bill" H. Lamar IV, Pastor of Metropolitan AME Church in Washington, D.C. The historic congregation recently gained national attention after winning a landmark lawsuit against the Proud Boys, a far-right extremist group.

Their conversation goes far beyond the courtroom. They dig into what this moment reveals about the rise of white Christian nationalism and why the church is called to demonstrate moral courage in turbulent times. Rev. Bill helps us trace the rich legacy of Metropolitan AME, a longstanding beacon for justice, dignity, and inclusion, and reflects on how the Christian community can continue to witness to God’s justice and human flourishing in the face of ongoing challenges.

Guests

Rev. William H. Lamar IV is the pastor of Metropolitan African Methodist Episcopal Church in Washington, D.C. He previously served Turner Memorial AME Church in Maryland and three churches in Florida. He is a former managing director at Leadership Education at Duke Divinity. Lamar is a graduate of Florida Agricultural and Mechanical University and Duke Divinity School. He is the co-host of "Can These Bones," a faith and leadership podcast.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

Faith is evolving, and so must the ways we understand and engage with it. 

In this episode of the Igniting Imagination® podcast, Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle sit down with Dr. Josh Packard, Co-Founder of Future of Faith, and Kris Jordan, Ministry Practitioner at Future of Faith. Together, they examine how younger generations navigate faith in a world where trust in institutions is fading, and traditional structures often feel distant.

Lisa, Gil, Josh, and Kris explore how faith communities can cultivate real connection, foster belonging, and nurture understanding amidst the challenges and opportunities of modern spirituality. 

Guests

Dr. Josh Packard is the co-founder of Future of Faith and one of the foremost experts in the spiritual lives of American youth. He is an accomplished researcher in the sociology of religion and new forms of religious expression. He has authored numerous books and articles in both popular and academic outlets, including Church Refugees: Sociologists reveal why people are DONE with church but not their faith and Meaning Making: 8 Values That Drive America’s Newest Generations. His newest book is Faithful Futures: Sacred Tools for Engaging Younger Generations.

Kris Jordan is a wife, mom of seven, and openly queer youth minister at House Church Tulsa and The Well. Kris enjoys consulting and writing curriculum through Center for Youth and Contemplation for faith organizations and working as a ministry practitioner for Future of Faith. Pursuing their MDiv at Phillips Theological Seminary, Kris hopes to continue to use their identity,  unique understanding, and life experiences alongside their education to impact the lives of youth and young adults in faith formation and exploration.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

What if the future of faith communities isn’t about holding on tighter, but about opening our hands?

In this episode, Rev. Tim Shapiro, President of Indianapolis Center for Congregations, joins Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle in exploring Gil’s recent monograph, Reimagining and Remapping the Religious Landscape. Together, they explore a gentle, brave question: How do we create congregations where people’s real lives and stories get to shape the tradition, rather than the other way around?

They talk about the quiet power that emerges when leaders trade control for curiosity, when agenda makes room for agency, and when the community becomes a place where everyone is invited.

Listen and imagine what might grow when we simply trust the Spirit to move through the people already in the room.

Guest

Tim Shapiro is the president of the Indianapolis Center for Congregations. He began serving the Center in 2003 after 18 years in pastoral ministry. For 14 years, Tim served Westminster Presbyterian Church in Xenia, Ohio. Tim’s interest in how congregations learn to do new things is represented in his book How Your Congregation Learns. After his extensive work on the Center’s Sacred Space initiative, Tim co-authored the book Holy Places: Matching Sacred Space with Mission and Message. He has also authored several articles, including Applying Positive Deviance and A Congregation of Theological Coherence.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

How do we rebuild deep belonging in an age of fragmentation?

In this episode of Igniting Imagination, Casper ter Kuile, Co-Founder and Principal of Sacred Design Lab, Rev. Lisa Greenwood, and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle invite us to rethink how meaning, connection, and spirituality take shape in modern life. Drawing from Gil’s monograph Reimagining and Remapping the Religious Landscape, Casper explores how spiritual practices are being “unbundled” from institutions and “rebundled” into new forms of community, in homes, workplaces, and online spaces.

Perhaps the work of spiritual leadership today is not to preserve what was, but to imagine what might yet become.

Guest

Casper ter Kuile is a speaker, author, and community innovator whose work explores how we make meaning, deepen relationships, and experience beauty in the 21st century. As the co-founder of Sacred Design Lab, Nearness, and the hit podcast Harry Potter and the Sacred Text, Casper brings together tradition and innovation to create projects that ennoble the everyday and foster joyful belonging.

Casper holds Masters of Divinity and Public Policy degrees from Harvard University, where he also served as a Ministry Innovation Fellow at Harvard Divinity School. His book, The Power of Ritual, invites readers to reimagine spiritual life through everyday practices.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

This episode of the Igniting Imagination podcast invites us to linger on a provocative question: What if religious leaders are, in essence, technologists? Our guest, Rev. Sue Phillips, co-founder of the Workshop for Emotional and Spiritual Technology, reframes leadership as a kind of sacred technology, a deliberate crafting of tools and practices that cultivate deeper human connection and meaning.

Together, Rev. Lisa Greenwood, Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle, and Sue wander the fertile ground where spirituality meets innovation, reconsidering the systems and languages that have long defined congregational life. They explore what could happen when we borrow the vocabulary of technology to describe the work of the spirit and how this shift can open new ways of understanding purpose, community, and transformation in an age of constant change. 

Guest

Rev. Sue Phillips is on the founding team of the Workshop for Emotional and Spiritual Technology, a tech startup working to help people live more meaningful lives. After serving as a denominational executive for the Unitarian Universalist Association, she co-founded Sacred Design Lab, a nonprofit that interprets innovation to the religious world and ancient wisdom to the world of innovation. Clients and partners have included Pinterest, Google, Logitech, the Obama Foundation, and the Office of the U.S. Surgeon General.

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

What does spiritual leadership look like in a world where meaning is no longer confined to church walls? 

In this episode, co-hosts Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle sit down with Rev. Jen Bailey, Executive Director of Maddox Fund, visionary pastor, and social entrepreneur. They examine how meaning is being sought, made, and shared beyond the walls of traditional congregations.

Their conversation uncovers the rise of “third spaces,” those unconventional realms where people gather, wrestle with questions of faith, and discover belonging in unexpected ways. We explore what it means to cultivate spiritual communities where authenticity is honored, beliefs are questioned, and sacred and secular life intermingle in fluid, transformative ways.

Guest

Rev. Jen Bailey is ordained in the African Methodist Episcopal Church, a public theologian and leader in the multi-faith movement for justice. She was the founding Executive Director of Faith Matters Network, an innovative Womanist-led organization accompanying spiritually grounded leaders on their journey to heal themselves and their communities. She has been an Ashoka Fellow, New Pluralist Field Builder, Aspen Ideas Scholar, On Being Fellow, and a Truman Scholar.

Jen has served on the boards of the Jessie Ball DuPont Fund, The Fetzer Institute, and was recently the chair of The Healing Trust board in Nashville.

Timestamps

00:00 - Intro

05:46 - Exploring Meaning and Community

18:48 - The People's Supper: A New Approach to Community Engagement

28:12 - The Nature of Sacred Spaces

34:20 - The Role of Play in Spiritual Imagination

43:19 - Foundations of Spiritual Formation

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.

In part two of our introduction to Season 16, Rev. Lisa Greenwood and Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle invite us to reimagine what it means to flourish as individuals, as communities, and as spiritual beings in a rapidly changing world. Together, they explore the shifting landscape of belonging and meaning, asking what today’s movements and social awakenings might be teaching the church about human connection.

In comparing traditional congregational life and modern movements like Black Lives Matter and other grassroots efforts, Gil offers a provocative insight: These movements seem to meet deep human needs in ways many congregations have forgotten how to do. Their openness, the freedom to enter, to leave, to question, creates space for people to discover who they are and where they belong.

Host

Rev. Lisa Greenwood is the President & CEO of Wesleyan Impact Partners and Texas Methodist Foundation. She joined the staff of TMF in 2012 serving as Vice President for Leadership Ministry before taking her current role in 2022. Rev. Greenwood is an ordained elder in the North Texas (now Horizon Texas) Conference of the United Methodist Church, where she served congregations for twenty years. During the last five years of her local church ministry, Lisa served as a ministry strategist with Horizons Stewardship Company. She earned a Bachelor of Arts degree from the University of Texas at Austin and a Master of Divinity from Yale Divinity School.

Co-Host

Rev. Dr. Gil Rendle

Gil Rendle is a retired Senior Vice President and part-time consultant with Texas Methodist Foundation in Austin, Texas, and also works independently on change and leadership in denominations. With deep expertise in organizational development, systems theory, and leadership, he has guided congregations and denominational bodies through planning and transformation. He is widely respected for his work with middle judicatory and national offices navigating complex change. Gil is the author of  numerous articles and monographs, along with twelve books, including: Doing the Math of Mission: Fruits, Faithfulness and Metrics (2014), Quietly Courageous: Leading the Church in a Changing World, (2018), and Countercultural: Subversive Resistance and the Neighborhood Congregation (2023). His latest monograph, Reimagining and Remapping the Religious Landscape: Chaos Before a New Ordering, is the foundation for this podcast season.

Timestamps

00:00 - Intro

05:30 - Understanding Movements and Their Impact on Congregational Identity

15:17 - Exploring Refugia in Contemporary Faith Practices

30:19 - Navigating Chaos: The Intersection of Physics and Faith

35:52 - Claiming Purpose in a Changing World

Links

Visit our show’s website at ignitingimagination.org.

To view videos of podcast episodes, please go to the Igniting Imagination YouTube.

To receive emails about the podcast, subscribe to our Learning and Innovation emails here. We know your inbox is inundated these days; we aim to send you content that is inspiring, innovative, and impactful for your life and ministry.