Mistakes? We’ve made a few. In the spirit of IN RETROSPECT, Susie and Jess share some of their professional regrets—from Susie’s season working on the reality show “Wife Swap” to a sexual harassment story Jess still thinks about.

FOR MORE:

• Heidi Mae’s TikTok about appearing on "Wife Swap"

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Amy Fisher would go to prison for shooting Mary Jo Buttafuoco, the wife of her much older “boyfriend” Joey – but that wouldn’t be the end of the story. The media frenzy surrounding her would continue, and spawn three TV movies about her infamous crime. In this episode, Susie and Jess delve into Amy’s attempts to move on, where she is today, and dissect how that trope – the “lolita” – is used to paint girls as precocious and seductive.

Guests:

• Amy Pagnozzi, former and longtime New York Post columnist who covered the Amy Fisher trial

FOR MORE:

• Which of Those Three Amy Fisher TV Movies Was the Best—And Which Was the Trashiest? (Esquire, 2016)
• The troubling legacy of the Lolita story, 60 years on (BBC, 2022)

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In 1992, Amy Fisher, a teen girl from Long Island became a tabloid sensation almost overnight – when she shot Mary Jo Buttafuoco, the wife of her much older “boyfriend” Joey Buttafuoco. Within days, the New York Daily News would splash a picture of Amy across its front page with a headline that would follow her forever: The Long Island Lolita. In this episode, Susie and Jess interrogate the way Amy Fisher was covered and examine why her story gripped the nation.

Guests:

• Amy Pagnozzi, former and longtime New York Post columnist who covered the Amy Fisher trial

FOR MORE:

• Long Island Lolita (Daily News, 1992)
• Treachery in the Suburbs (People, 1992)
• Inside Edition Flashback: Amy Fisher Sentencing (YouTube)

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The princess of pop's much anticipated memoir, “The Woman In Me,” is finally out. This week, Jess and Susie speed-read it and share their thoughts on the woman whose life is perhaps the ultimate case of "in retrospect."

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Can you understand U.S. cultural history without understanding Axe Body Spray? Listener, you cannot. In this mini-episode, Jess and Susie trace the scent that infiltrated school hallways and telegraphed wannabe masculinity for a generation of Y2K kids. Featuring a special appearance by Jess’s husband.

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So Pacey lost his virginity to his high school English teacher. But what do we… call that? Was it a tryst? An affair? An assault? Jess & Susie dive into the linguistic acrobatics of how America talked about statutory rape in the 90s – and delve into the the true story that was playing out at the time, that of Seattle teacher (and convicted rapist) Mary Kay Letourneau.

Guests:

• Rosie Bancroft, Jess’s middle school pal and current middle school mental health counselor

FOR MORE:

• How the Media Turned Child Rape Into a ‘Tryst’ (Rolling Stone)
• America’s confused obsession with Mary Kay Letourneau (Washington Post)
• ‘In Retrospect’ – The Playlist (Aren’t you dying to hear the Dawson’s theme song?) (Spotify)

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It was 1998 and teenage Jessica was crammed onto the couch in the basement of a friend’s house in Seattle, swooning over the hot-and-heavy “love affair” between Pacey and Tamara on “Dawson’s Creek.” The only thing: Pacey was 15, and Tamara – aka Miss Jacobs – was his 38-year-old high school English teacher. Ew?

Guests:

• Rosie Bancroft, Jess’s middle school pal and current middle school mental health counselor

FOR MORE:

• ‘Dawson’s Creek’ at 20: Inside the Teen Drama’s Deepest Secrets (Hollywood Reporter)
• Dawson’s Creek and That Troubling Storyline (Medium)
• ‘In Retrospect’ – The Playlist (Aren’t you dying to hear the Dawson’s theme song?) (Spotify)

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It’s “problematic.” In this mini episode, Jess rants about her dislike of this overly simplistic label (used to describe everything from people to paint colors), and Susie asks her why, if that’s the case, she can’t seem to stop using it.

FOR MORE:

• If Everything Is ‘Trauma,’ Is Anything? (NY Times)
• I Was Wrong About Trigger Warnings (The Atlantic) 
• What If Calling People Out, We Called Them In? (NY Times)
• The Problem With the Word 'Problematic’ (The Atlantic)

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In 1988, Oprah Winfrey revealed on her hugely popular talk show that she’d shed 67 pounds, which she illustrated to her audience by wheeling out a little red wagon full of exactly that much animal fat. That show, the highest-rated of her 25-year run, would kickstart a cycle of speculation about this wildly successful woman’s body that would endure for decades. In this episode, Susie and Jess explore why Oprah’s weight struggles have been the subject of so much fascination, her recent special that touches on that scrutiny, the rise of Ozempic and the pressure women feel to be perfect.

FOR MORE:

• Oprah Daily’s The State of Weight Special (Oprah Daily)
• Making Oprah podcast (WBEZ)
• From the Archives: Oprah Winfrey Cover Story (Vogue)
• Losing It in the Anti-Dieting Age (New York Times Magazine)

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When lifeguard CJ Parker, played by Pamela Anderson, ran in slow-mo down a sandy California beach in her iconic cherry red swimsuit — you know the one, low in the front, hiiiiiigh on the sides — she didn’t just turn “Baywatch” into the number-one TV show in America, she became the enduring symbol of 90s sexuality. In this episode, Jess and Susie trace that swimsuit’s surprising history — and its ripple effects.

Guests:

• Pamela Anderson, actor, activist and author 
• Susan Douglas, professor of media studies at the University of Michigan and author of “Enlightened Sexism”

FOR MORE:

• Pamela Anderson Doesn’t Need Your Redemption. She’s Just Fine. (NY Times)
• How Baywatch Went from Early Belly Flop to the Big Screen (NY Times)
• Pamela: A Love Story (Netflix)

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