This piece starts with a discussion about indirect calorimetry and the challenges associated with it as well as recent improvements in the field. The penn state equation is discussed. Muscle wastage and the need for resistence training, as well as protein feeding is covered.   More widely; what does good ICU feeding look like? How can friends and relatives of patients be sure that a loved one is getting good nutritional care?   Desiree Chappell and Monty Mythen presenting with their guest Danielle Bear, ICU dietician at Guy's and St Thomas' NHS Foundation Trust.