Political scientist and author Hahrie Han joins Pastor Bryan to unpack her book Undivided: The Quest for Racial Solidarity in an American Church—a seven-year look inside Crossroads Church’s “Undivided” journey. We talk small groups over rows, why formation beats hot-takes, designing diverse tables, the real cost of ethnic unity, and how grace and vulnerability change people. Practical takeaways for pastors and group leaders.

Guest: Hahrie Han — Author of Undivided: The Quest for Racial Solidarity in an American Church; Professor of Political Science, Johns Hopkins University (pronounced “Hari,” rhymes with sorry).

Topics:

Why formation changes people more than headlines

The Undivided structure: 6-week small-group journey + “on-ramps” beyond the series

Designing intentionally diverse groups; facilitator training; practicing empathy

Culture lines: “We do hard things here,” “Belonging before belief”

Reaching the ready, reluctant, resistant—and why vulnerability is the hinge

Counting the cost: growth, loss, and staying in the struggle

Bryan on the gospel nucleus (grace, forgiveness, reconciliation, new identity)

Resources:

Undivided: The Quest for Racial Solidarity in an American Church — Hahrie Han

Undivided program (founded by Pastor Chuck Mingo)

Crossroads Church, Cincinnati

Takeaways for leaders: move people from rows to circles; train facilitators; mix groups by design; set expectations for risk; pair truth-telling with belonging; keep gospel identity at the center.

Pastor Bryan Loritts joins Ricky Phillips to unveil his new book, Grace to Overcome: 31 Devotions on God’s Work Through Black History, releasing August 19. Each devotion weaves together biblical truth and snapshots of Black history—from abolitionist Olaudah Equiano and Olympic trailblazer Wilma Rudolph to cultural icons like Maya Angelou and innovators in science and technology—inviting empathy, unity, and seeing your story in God’s grace-filled narrative.

Order his new book here:
Grace to Overcome: 31 Devotions on God's Work Through Black History

In this conversation, Pastor Bryan and Dr. Malcolm Foley talk about Dr. Foley's new book "The Anti-Greed Gospel" and explore the dynamics of multi-ethnic churches, emphasizing the importance of ethnic unity over mere diversity. They discuss the historical context of economic exploitation in America, its impact on racial dynamics, and the need for churches to address these issues. Dr. Foley highlights the role of historical figures in advocating for justice and the necessity of building communities of economic solidarity, creative anti-violence, and prophetic truth-telling as strategies to combat exploitation and promote unity within the church. We'll also explore the intersection of economics and faith, discussing the implications of capitalism and socialism within the church context. Emphasizing the importance of generosity and community support, while also addressing the church's role in economic justice. This dialogue highlights the need for Christian leaders to actively engage in these discussions and implement practical solutions to foster a more equitable society.

The Anti-Greed Gospel

In this inspiring and insightful episode, we sit down with Dr. Stephen Newby — award-winning composer, jazz musician, worship pastor, professor, and biographer — as he shares his remarkable journey from the National Baptist Church tradition in Detroit to winning Dissertation of the Year at the University of Michigan for his symphony on Dr. Martin Luther King Jr. Dr. Newby talks about his rich and diverse musical training in classical, jazz, and gospel music, and how God prepared him for ministry in a multi-ethnic church. He also discusses his upcoming biography on gospel music legend Andraé Crouch, exploring the impact of Crouch’s music and legacy on the church and beyond. Through personal stories and deep wisdom, Dr. Newby offers invaluable advice for aspiring worship leaders — from cultivating a life of prayer and studying Scripture to embracing mentorship and balancing artistry with pastoral care. This episode is a must-listen for anyone passionate about worship, music, and building a beloved community in the church.

Soon and Very Soon Biography

Dr. Stephen Newby

In this episode of the Kainos Podcast, host Pastor Bryan sits down with Pastor Teddy Johnson—a seasoned worship leader known for his transformative work at Hope Church in Las Vegas. With roots in Camden, New Jersey, Teddy shares his remarkable journey from a childhood steeped in church music to pioneering multi-ethnic worship ministry in one of the most diverse congregations he’s ever witnessed.

Listeners are treated to an in-depth conversation about ethnic unity in the church, exploring how a primarily white worship environment can evolve into a vibrant, multicultural community. Pastor Teddy recounts his early days in a “chocolate church” and the personal challenges he faced stepping into leadership roles where he was often the minority, all while nurturing a spirit of inclusion and authenticity. He emphasizes that true unity begins with intentional relationships and courageous leadership—a principle that resonates deeply as Summit Church grows increasingly diverse.

The discussion also spotlights the vital role of worship and music in bridging cultural divides and creating spaces where every language and nation is celebrated. This episode also highlights a few upcoming multi-ethnic Kainos cohorts hosted by Send Network, set to empower church leaders and congregations across Atlanta, St. Louis, and New York.

Whether you’re a church leader, worship pastor, or simply passionate about fostering unity in today’s diverse mission field, this episode offers inspiring insights and practical wisdom for cultivating a gospel-centered community that truly reflects the beauty of God’s love.

Pastor Bryan chats with Michael Bethany (awarding winning Christian singer/songwriter) about creating multicultural worship services and his love for the multiethnic church. We are going to spend our next several episodes diving into worship and what it looks like to lead a multiethnic church service. Worship is a major culture maker within the church of Jesus Christ and we are going to spend all of eternity worshipping our God and that worship will not be homogeneous.

Pastor Bryan speaks with Dr. Korie Edwards (University Distinguished Scholar and Professor of Sociology and leading scholar of race and religion in the United States) and Rebecca Kim (Professor of Sociology and the Director of the Ethnic Studies program at Pepperdine University) about their new book "Estranged Pioneers".

Estranged Pioneers reveals how pastors of color are leading the way towards a more united multiracial future.

Estranged Pioneers

Korie Little Edwards

Rebecca Kim

Pastor Bryan talks with Pastor Derwin Gray about how he came to Christ while playing in the NFL and where that journey has brought him. He gives insight into some of the ways he has crossed the racial and political divide in his ministry as lead pastor at Transformation Church, a multi-ethnic church in South Carolina. 

Resources:

Building a Multiethnic Church

How to Heal Our Racial Divide

Carlos Lollett, pastor of Reality Church in Miami, Florida, gives insight into reaching our Hispanic and Latino brothers and sisters who currently make up around 20% of the total US population today.

Resources:

Harvest of Empire

Being Latino in Christ

Manana

Pastor Bryan talks with Bobby Conway, lead pastor of Image Church, about his journey in coming to Christ, his struggles with addiction and doubting, his ministry on apologetics and why the Christian worldview still makes sense, and his church's passion for authentic multi-ethnic ministry.

Pre-Order

Does Christianity Still Make Sense

Out 4/23/24