Volunteer Guru Mary Ann Sibley joins me for our first ever LIVE show! She is amazing. When I asked the question: "who should I talk to about volunteer burnout?" several people pointed me toward Mary Ann... and she did not disappoint.

Not growing up in the church, she has been willing to ask the questions and try the things that "churches don't do". Mary Ann also has led a toxic volunteer culture herself, so much of her wisdom is hard-won through blood, sweat and tears. I am thankful for her humility and insight. Whether you're a volunteer yourself, a church leader or someone who has been chewed up and spit out by the church machine Mary Ann brings tremendous truth, care and wisdom that will help you. She unpacks what makes toxic cultures toxic and what makes healthy cultures places people LOVE to serve.

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*We have some technical difficulties at the beginning of this episode that distract me for a moment, so please bear with us