Modern Musician Podcast

AI music is getting licensed. Now the harder question begins.

Suno says its new model was trained on licensed music. Universal is building AI-powered fan remixes. Distributors are introducing new AI and fraud checks. The fight is moving beyond whether AI belongs in music toward who controls it, who gets paid, and what artists should actually consent to.

Meanwhile, Ella Langley proves that release calendars don't matter when audiences keep listening—and somehow that conversation led us to create an AI surf anthem about cows.

Along the way, we ask:

• What is your music actually worth as AI training data?
• Would you license your voice for fans to remix?
• Should artists own their own AI models?
• Are release calendars putting artists on a hamster wheel?
• Where's the line between using AI creatively and deceiving an audience?

In this episode, we dive into AI’s impact on music, from Suno’s licensed models and AI voices to new industry rules, artist strategies, superfans, Spotify’s music video push, and featured artist Tyler Herwig’s “Romcom Gone Wrong.”

Key Takeaways

• AI isn’t going away, but artists don’t have to accept the first deal they’re offered.
• Permission, compensation, and ownership are three different things.
• Listen to your audience and test songs with your real fans to see what truly connects.
• Don’t rush to your next release—keep building new contexts around a song that’s working.
• Ride the wave: your next hit doesn’t always need to be your next release. Sometimes, you just need to ride the wave till the cows come home.

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→ Build your fanbase and music career with Modern Musician.

→ Ready to build your audience? Book Your Breakthrough Session.

→ Want your music featured on The Artist Economy? Submit your Music Moment.

Robina Ritchie-Barker is the co-founder of TrackStage, a music management platform built to help independent music creators organize their catalogs, manage the business behind their music, and get their tracks opportunity-ready. As a composer and music creator herself, Robina experienced firsthand the growing administrative burden of managing files, versions, metadata, collaborators, and pitches. That experience inspired TrackStage, which helps creators reduce the “Administrative Tax” of making music so they can spend less time managing their catalogs and more time creating, pursuing opportunities, and getting their work heard.

In this episode, Robina Ritchie-Barker shares her journey from music creator to co-founder of TrackStage, exploring how the platform helps indie artists organize their catalogs, streamline metadata and administrative tasks, prepare music for sync opportunities, and navigate the evolving role of AI in music creation and licensing.

Key Takeaways

• Reduce the administrative burden: Learn how TrackStage helps indie artists organize their music, files, metadata, and catalog information in one streamlined workflow.
• Make your music easier to pitch: Discover why complete metadata and organized catalogs matter to music supervisors and how better preparation can help artists capitalize on opportunities.
• Understand AI’s role in music: Explore how AI can enhance music-management workflows while creating important copyright considerations, particularly in sync licensing.

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→ Learn more about Robina and her work at: trackstagepro.com

Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: 

https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

What happens when music becomes infinite?

TuneCore artists can now opt in to let Suno train on their music. Suno is limiting downloads. CDs are somehow booming again. And a Katy Perry song from 2011 just became TikTok’s biggest song of the summer.

This week, we’re asking what actually becomes valuable when music itself is abundant: ownership, scarcity, physical artifacts, fan relationships—or simply giving a great song enough chances to be discovered.

Along the way, we ask:

• Would you let AI train on your music—and for how much?
• Do download limits reduce AI slop or just put creativity behind a paywall?
• Would 50 paying fans change your career more than 50,000 streams?
• Why are CDs coming back in a streaming world?
• Are artists abandoning great songs way too quickly?

In this episode, we explore AI and music, Suno and TuneCore’s evolving relationship, the resurgence of CDs and physical music, the value of direct fan connections, the power of catalog rediscovery, and how Jason Dmore’s “Breeze” is inspiring a new wave of connection through music and dance.

Key Takeaways

• Don’t treat releases as having an expiration date.
• Give your catalog multiple chances to be discovered—a song can find its audience years later.
• Build systems that keep your best work discoverable instead of focusing only on creating more.
• As digital music becomes infinite, scarcity shifts toward physical products, access, identity, community, and direct fan relationships.
• Your next breakthrough might already exist—sometimes, you just need to find a new context for an older song.

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→ Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

Jesse Cannon is a music marketing expert, producer, author, and educator who helps independent artists navigate the modern music industry. He hosts Musformation and is the author of Get More Fans: The DIY Guide to the New Music Business and Processing Creativity. Jesse has worked with artists including The Cure, Animal Collective, Laufey, and Weird Al Yankovic, while also building expertise in music production, artist development, podcasting, and education. Through his work, he shares practical insights on audience growth, creative careers, music marketing, and building a sustainable path forward for independent artists.

In this episode, Michael Walker and Jesse Cannon explore how independent artists can build sustainable careers in a rapidly changing music industry, from growing a loyal fan base and fighting for fair compensation to navigating AI, music rights, and the future of human creativity.

Key Takeaways

• Build a stronger fan base: Learn why audience growth and direct relationships with fans are increasingly important for independent artists.
• Understand your rights and compensation: Discover the challenges artists face around streaming, rights management, and fair compensation—and why awareness matters.
• Protect the human side of creativity: Explore where AI can support the creative process while understanding why emotional authenticity and human connection remain essential to music.

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→ Learn more about Jesse and his work at: musicmarketingtrends.beehiiv.com

Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: 

https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

The technology changed. The strategy didn’t.

Dolly Parton spent her career protecting ownership. This week, the rest of the music industry showed exactly why that matters.

Sony and Warner sued Anthropic. Universal built an AI patent portfolio. All three majors bought equity in Stability AI. And session musicians went to court arguing that the AI economy is being built on work they were never compensated for.

Meanwhile, one DIY artist showed another path entirely: let the audience take your music, mutate it, and help distribute it.

Along the way, we ask:

• What would you be willing to give up for the opportunity of a lifetime?
• If AI learns from your work, what do you actually deserve?
• What happens when labels own the music and the machinery?
• Can contracts written before AI still protect musicians from AI?
• Should artists protect their music—or make it easier for fans to transform?

In this episode, we explore Dolly Parton’s $150M lesson in ownership, the music industry’s legal battle with AI, major labels investing in AI, musicians fighting for compensation, the philosophy of AI and creativity, and why making art “forkable” could be the future of music.

Key Takeaways

• Protect future opportunities: The most valuable rights may be tied to uses that haven’t been invented yet.
• Learn from Dolly Parton: You can’t predict how your music may be used or transformed in the future.
• Think beyond today’s technology: Session musicians couldn’t anticipate AI training, and today’s artists can’t predict what their catalogs might power years from now.
• Own what you can: Understand what rights you’re keeping, licensing, or giving away.
• Make your art forkable: When it comes to your audience, giving people room to remix and build on your work can create new possibilities.

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→ Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

Josh Simons is the CEO of Vinyl Group and founder of Vampr, a professional network for musicians and creatives with 1.6 million users across 190 countries. A former musician, songwriter, and producer, Josh has built companies across music, technology, media, and culture, raising over $50 million across his ventures. He has worked with artists including Travis Scott, Troye Sivan, and Kanye West, and has helped grow Vinyl Group through acquisitions spanning media, music technology, e-commerce, and culture.

In this episode, Josh Simons shares what it takes to build a successful career in music and technology while navigating constant industry change, from the rise of digital platforms to the coming revolution in AI.

Key Takeaways

• Turn industry expertise into opportunity: Learn why deep domain knowledge can give entrepreneurs an edge when building products and businesses for the music industry.
• Adapt to constant technological change: Discover how artists can stay relevant as new platforms, technologies, and expectations continue reshaping the music business.
• Use AI without losing creativity: Explore how AI can become another creative tool, helping artists bridge the gap between their ideas and what they’re able to create.

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→ Learn more about Josh Simons and his work at: vampr.me

Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: 

https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

The AI debate just became policy.

For years, the music industry argued about whether AI music was “real music.” Now platforms, charts, publishers, and courts are starting to draw actual lines.

Australia introduced a “substantially human-made” requirement for chart eligibility. Apple, Spotify, and Tidal are taking three different approaches to identifying AI music. Meanwhile, publishers are fighting Suno and Anthropic over what the music that trained these systems is actually worth.

Along the way, we ask:

• What does “substantially human-made” actually mean?
• Should AI music compete on the same charts as human artists?
• Is creative agency more important than which tools were used?
• Are songwriters settling before anyone knows what AI training is really worth?
• What happens when machines become technically better than humans?

In this episode, we explore the evolving rules around AI music, artist and songwriter rights, fan-powered remixing, new release models, and what AI and robotics mean for the future of human creativity.

Key Takeaways

• Don’t bet your career on AI staying bad: The technology will only keep improving.
• Use AI without giving up your creative agency: Keep what makes your work uniquely yours.
• Protect your identity and relationships: Your story, voice, and connections still matter.
• Build real community and human connection: As music becomes easier to generate, genuine connection may become more valuable.
• Bet on humans continuing to care about humans: Machines will get better, but human connection is what makes art meaningful.

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→ Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

Eli Atkins is the co-founder of Solo.to, a leading link-in-bio platform helping creators, entrepreneurs, and brands bring their digital presence together in one customizable page. Since launching Solo.to in 2020, Eli has taken a hands-on role across product design, user experience, marketing, and day-to-day operations. With a significant portion of Solo.to’s users coming from the music community, he has developed a close understanding of the needs of independent artists and music creators. Eli brings firsthand insight into building creator-focused technology, growing a lean startup, and balancing simplicity, innovation, and user trust.

In this episode, Eli Atkins reveals how Solo.to is evolving the link-in-bio experience for music creators while sharing lessons on product design, AI, and building technology users can trust.

Key Takeaways

• Build a stronger digital presence: Learn how thoughtful design, customization, and simplicity can help creators turn a link-in-bio page into a more effective fan connection point.
• Let users drive your product: Discover how Solo.to uses feedback and user behavior to shape features, integrations, and platform improvements.
• Adapt to AI without losing creativity: Explore how creators can use AI for music and marketing while continuing to develop their own skills, judgment, and creative voice.

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→ Learn more about Eli and his work at: solo.to

Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: 

https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

This is the week consent got delegated.

This week on The Artist Economy, Michael Walker, Chris Saunders, Sol Gold, and Jared Christianson break down what happens when labels, publishers, platforms, lawmakers, and AI companies start making decisions on behalf of artists.

BMG licensed more than three million songs into Suno while settling the platform's prior use. Suno launched a more powerful AI-first studio. Kobalt became the third catalog to join Spotify's coming AI remix ecosystem. And two different fights against ticket resale showed just how difficult it is for independent artists and venues to challenge the platforms between them and their fans.

Along the way, we ask:

• Who actually gets to negotiate on behalf of artists?
• Is Suno evolving from an AI toy into a legitimate instrument?
• What happens when songs become worlds fans can remix and play inside?
• Who deserves the extra value when a $50 concert ticket resells for $300?
• What happens when AI assistants—not search engines—decide which concerts fans discover?

In this episode, we break down BMG’s Suno deal, the shift from AI slop to AI musicianship, Spotify’s AI remix ecosystem, the evolving role of artists and fans, and the latest battles over ticket resale, deceptive pricing, and AI-powered concert discovery.

Key Takeaways

• Own your audience: Build a direct relationship with your fans.
• Know your fans: Understand who they are and what they respond to.
• Build direct channels: Don’t rely entirely on platforms to reach your audience.
• Protect your leverage: Platforms, labels, and publishers can control parts of your career.
• Control the relationship: The more direct your connection with fans, the more independence you have.

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→ Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: https://streetteam.fm/masterclass

Aurelie Couble is a Canadian music producer and online educator who built a six-figure business teaching self-taught music creators how to turn their skills into real income without relying on streaming royalties or a record label. With 44K YouTube subscribers and 43K Instagram followers, both grown organically, she helps music creators land high-paying clients and build sustainable businesses through content creation, audience growth, personal branding, and organic marketing.

In this episode, Michael sits down with Aurelie to explore how music creators can build profitable businesses beyond streaming through organic content, audience engagement, personal branding, and strategic client acquisition.

Key Takeaways

• Build income beyond streaming by turning your music skills into a client-based business that attracts high-paying customers.
• Create content that converts by remixing proven ideas, sharing authentically, and consistently communicating your offer.
• Grow without chasing follower counts by building trust, engaging your community, and turning a small, loyal audience into sustainable income.

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→ Want to take your music business to the next level?

Follow @musicbyplv on Instagram and DM “READY MM” to connect with Aurelie.

Book an Artist Breakthrough Session with the Modern Musician team: 

https://streetteam.fm/masterclass